What are some things that bother you as a gamer?

Also the fact that Microsoft seem to be stabbing gamers in the back for the second time..

The first time.. forgetting about the original Xbox when many many gamers were still getting many hours of enjoyment out of it.

The second time.. E3 2011

Call Of Duty

Hardcore PC Gamers (that like to talk about how PC is superior at any chance they get)

Xbox360 Fanboys

Halo

Overpriced Remakes

When a game series is supposed to be done/finished with a particular game, than prequels are later thrown into the mix, that supposedly tell untold parts of the story.

People that rely to much on video game reviews, especially the fanboys that use Metacritic and Gameranking scores as a means to say that one console has more high rated games or exclusives than the other, it does not get any dumber than that.

Hmm... the things I hate are...

Some gamers crap all over stuff like Uncharted claiming it's a movie and hardly a game, apparently we don't have room for these types of games. And it's clearly not a movie, it's a fun game with fantastic gameplay regardless of what those poor fools would like to think.

Multiplayer being the focus point in many games these days.

Fanboys/console warriorsjust make me sick... sometimes I just want to quit gaming due to them. They are some of the most pathetic people in existance. They just want to hate on this company or that company or this console or that console or this exclusive or that exclusive. Just absolutely pathetic.

Gamers do not game anymore... they have become critics. Hating on every story in gaming, every gameplay element, they just complain about everything.

I hate the fact that games will eventually go digital only, no discs, no covers, no cases... basically no more collecting. Just pure digital distribution.

Gamers look too much into scores, anything below a 9 is basically a flop or junk. I'd say a 7 and up is clearly worth a purchase... even brand new.

Double standards in video game reviews, case in point... Tom Mcshea complaining about the screen going black and white while near death in InFamous 2, yet he never complained about it in other games that had this feature.

That's all I can think of at the moment.

My biggest pet peeve are the attentionw***e gamer girls. You're nothing special, girls playing video games aren't a minority anymore, get over it. Plus you're probably an insecure ugly c**t so STFU already.

Next pet peeve would be people who call themselves gamers yet they stick to only 1 console or 1 genre. You're not a gamer if you can't appreciate other consoles / genres. Quit being an obnoxious fanboy/fangirl cause you look stupid and nobody likes you. Also the fact that these so called gamers complain and nit-pick EVERY SINGLE LITTLE THING. Did i mention that they haven't even played the game. I also hate it when people dis a game due to rumours or stuff they have heard others complain about. An example of this would be Dungeon Siege 3... That games was super fun for what IT was, but people dissed it cause it didn't control like the first 2 (which weren't that great to be honest, so quit praising them). Whatever though, their loss.

Pet peeve that follows is the fact that games are getting release in (sometimes) very bad states... especially on PC. Price wise as well, lots of current games keep charging 60$, I'm looking at you Rage.

Another one would be when playing with others online, they act like they know what they are doing, but they just don't and try so hard to prove that they do but the only thing they achieve is humiliating themselves. (This has occurred many times in WoW and other MMOs).

People who go against the grain for the sake of it/trying to be cool. (This applies to all mediums)

Online passes. **** you EA

DLC

The A.I. companions. They are always bad a** on the opponent's side but suck on your side. I always find myself screaming at them "WTF are you doing????!!!!!"

The gaming community as a whole sometimes, specifically the people of that other board here on GameSpot.

So whiny, so focused on supporting a piece of plastic and brand loyalty. I don't understand it and it's infuriating at times to think that people can be that stubborn and narrow minded.

1) Gaming community - System Wars and GameFAQS prime example. In the gaming community, there are way too many douches, way too many overused memes is overused, incredible ignorance (my pet peeve against the whole frigggin' human race. Really, opinions sucks).

2) JRPG cliches from this current generation. Can we please start producing rpgs equal to the past PS2 and less era please?

3) Themepark MMORPGS - STOP PRODUCING THEM PLEASE, JUST ONCE CAN'T A MAJOR COMPANY GIVE US A ****** PROPER SANDBOX MMORPG? GOD...

4) Military Shooters....... RIP Originality

5) Mario games. It's 2011 get on with the time and start producing a proper story please.

5b) I felt like Mario Galaxy was aimed for toddlers with all that crap. Not to mention the non existant story. PS: I still love the gameplay. :)

1) WW2 games always being set behind the Allied Force's perspective. Movies like Letters from Iwo Jima proved that WW2 stories about the other side can work, so why haven't games done so yet?

2) $15 CoD Map Packs

3) Valve fanboys.

4) Nintendo of America's total inability to localize.

5) Capcom

6) Online Passes

Games that arent backwards compatible. I'm looking at you MGS II, X men Legends, X men Legends II, The Godfather etc etc

Fanboys

IGN

Graphics whores

Downloadable content (what ever happen to just playing the game as you go a long and unlock stuff. now they want us to pay to unlock things? i miss the days of genesis and snes)

Sony (you guys were my best friends growing up. PS1 and PS2 have 2 of the best gaming libraries to date. But PS3 was such a huge dissapointment and a hug chunk out of my wallet)

I miss buying a magazine with all the gaming news, but now there is internet and those magazines are getting off my mind

I can't stand people that call themselves gamers and only play one or two games

I can't stand people that keep arguing about which system is better

I miss buying a magazine with all the gaming news, but now there is internet and those magazines are getting off my mind

I can't stand people that call themselves gamers and only play one or two games

I can't stand people that keep arguing about which system is better

tjricardo089

More things that bother me as a gamer over the years

- gaming magazines end up being wimps and calling it quits so they can work on their new website and them canceling their main magazine.

-Games that always have to have that annoying level or area where you have a short amount of air time before you run out of air such as being underwater to find the exit or such as the zero gravity stuff outside the ship in Dead Space

-frustrating bonus scenarios in games such as James Bond Everything or Nothing where they're called Bond moments to gain Platinum awards or whatever.

- bonus weapons, etc in games like Everything or Nothing where you have to play on Normal or Hard mode to survive and win the bonuses

-Gamefaqs.com is full of elitists and moderators banning or suspending people for no reason while they let elitists or people like Brain Hammer and JBirdman get away with it.

Military FPSs

DLC and digital distribution

I have many but I don't feel like listing them, but I do want more SP games and less multiplayer games. Deus EX HR, Skyrim, and The Witcher 2 were fantastic. I want more engrossing SP games.

The gaming community as a whole sometimes, specifically the people of that other board here on GameSpot.

So whiny, so focused on supporting a piece of plastic and brand loyalty. I don't understand it and it's infuriating at times to think that people can be that stubborn and narrow minded.

Haziqonfire

I don't know about one-console loyalty, though. That's a bit odd and reminds me of nationalism.

The thought of having to buy a new console in two or three years even though my console is doing great.

All the new sports games that come out every year.

All the crappy COD games that come out every year.

The pressure from other "gamers" that any game except for Call of Duty is gay.

The blank expressions I get from other people when I say that my favorite games are Skyrim, Grand Theft Auto, Mass Effect, and Red Dead Redemption.

The fact that consoles have exclusives.

The way that publishers charge so much for DLC and the way that some publishers are now charging extra to play multiplayer (EA, cough, Ubisoft, cough)

Casuals. It was so nice when gaming was still niche, when gamers were thought as nerds...at least we could be happy with our own little culture and small communities. Now, it all went mainstream, and all went to hell. Same thing happening to the internet culture, that subculture that spawned off that specific imageboard. With sites like 9candy-ass and reddit, that subculture is also going mainstream, making me a very sad nerd...

The lack of respect society has for us....

The lack of respect society has for us....

GreekGameManiac

[QUOTE="GreekGameManiac"]

The lack of respect society has for us....

GC_MA

Gaming is becoming more mainstream now so you might see a lot less of that though hopefully.

Well I don't know what he is referring to when he said that, but it is true that gamers do get a lot of slack from everyone else. Just look up any video from a news station involving video games for proof.

Gaming is becoming more mainstream now so you might see a lot less of that though hopefully.

ZenesisX

it bothers me that MP is getting put into almost every game now days

Some gamers crap all over stuff like Uncharted claiming it's a movie and hardly a game, apparently we don't have room for these types of games. And it's clearly not a movie, it's a fun game with fantastic gameplay regardless of what those poor fools would like to think.

Gamers do not game anymore... they have become critics. Hating on every story in gaming, every gameplay element, they just complain about everything.

contracts420

These two stood out for me. I'll touch on the second point first briefly: gamers these days nitpick. I don't mean taking a couple flaws, slapping a 7.5 score on the game and saying "its a good game but--." No, what I'm saying is people playing a game and blowing a couple of flaws out of proportion and hating the game because of that. The industry is large enough to be picky but if all you are going to do is criticize the industry and barely have fun with any game you play today then what is the point of gaming?

I'll move back to the first point now which correlates with the biggest problem I have as a gamer today. Stories in the video game industry aren't too good. They usually lack a lot of things that help create great stories for books or film. Because stories in video games aren't as good as those other mediums, there are gamers out there that say the industry shouldn't even bother with having a strong narrative, that games should not be criticized for having a poor story, and, like contracts420 said, people claiming that its a movie and hardly a game.

Looking at fairly new artistic mediums, let's compare musical theatre to video games. Crazy, I know, and let me clarify I am talking specifically about musical theatre. Both of these mediums are fairly young, the American musical getting its big start around the 1880s and the game industry getting its big start in the late '70s. In the first thirty years of the musical, the industry had been filled with shows like The "Ziegfield Follies" that were mostly variety shows akin to Saturday Night Live, a show that had musical numbers and little acts but no semblance of a strong story. The music and the dancing were the focal points. It wasn't until 1927 that Jerome Kern and Oscar Hammerstein had created the Broadway hit "Showboat" that the industry began to take a strong narrative within a musical seriously.

"Showboat" appeared in 1927, around 40-45 years after the American musical really got its start. That's 40-45 years for an industry that was so strongly supported by its singing and dancing to finally realize that strong stories can create and enrich an experience like no other, which is odd, because when you look at a musical theatre production and then you look at a play, you wonder why it took so long to have a strong story within a musical.

Now look at the video game industry. The video game industry really became a thing around the late 1970s. It is nearly 2012. The industry is nearing 40 years of its life and is trying to shape its storytelling. You have great games like Planescape: Torment, Uncharted, NIER, Final Fantasy, etc, all games that have been getting praise over the years for their stories. But one could argue that we have yet to see a game that pushes the envelope with its story and narrative. And that is because the industry is stil young. We are an interactive medium much like musical theatre is, even moreso in specific aspects, so it will take time to figure out the best ways to tell a story without limiting control of the audience.

So when I see gamers saying that the industry shouldn't even bother with stories or that a game like Uncharted shouldn't be praised, I see it as a sign of ignorance. A game like Uncharted is a stepping stone to greater things. If you look back at the last generation you can not find a game that allows the freedom that Uncharted does within its cinematic moments. Last gen, huge moments were done either entirely in a cutscene or had were all part of a quick-time event. Today, we see protagonist Nathan Drake in a fist fight on a large plane, falling out of the plane over a desert and having to climb back up into the plane. The amount of freedom we have in that entire scene is astounding when you look at the big picture. And as developers see what Naughty Dog did with a scene like that, they will think of even more ways to stop limiting control of characters in large, cinematic moments.

It is a stepping stone, one that video game enthusiasts should be happy to support even if they don't like the game, not criticize and say there isn't any room for it in the industry. It will take time for video games to have a story that is told through a narrative strong enough that it doesn't hinder players, but we will get there. I have a feeling that in the next ten years we will start to see stories with stronger tales woven and more heartfelt and dynamic characters presented. It is an exciting time to be a gamer.

I'll end by saying this because I feel it can summarize what I said above and it can also encompass other problems I have with the industry: when you start thinking about what shouldn't belong in video games, that is when you are limiting and hurting the video game industry.

Not enough time to play all the games ever made that I'd love. Maybe one day...

These two stood out for me. I'll touch on the second point first briefly: gamers these days nitpick. I don't...WHAT THE HECK, SOMEONE WROTE THIS ALREADY ABOVE?!!!!

[QUOTE="contracts420"]

Some gamers crap all over stuff like Uncharted claiming it's a movie and hardly a game, apparently we don't have room for these types of games. And it's clearly not a movie, it's a fun game with fantastic gameplay regardless of what those poor fools would like to think.

Gamers do not game anymore... they have become critics. Hating on every story in gaming, every gameplay element, they just complain about everything.

Zassimick

These two stood out for me. I'll touch on the second point first briefly: gamers these days nitpick. I don't mean taking a couple flaws, slapping a 7.5 score on the game and saying "its a good game but--." No, what I'm saying is people playing a game and blowing a couple of flaws out of proportion and hating the game because of that. The industry is large enough to be picky but if all you are going to do is criticize the industry and barely have fun with any game you play today then what is the point of gaming?

I'll move back to the first point now which correlates with the biggest problem I have as a gamer today. Stories in the video game industry aren't too good. They usually lack a lot of things that help create great stories for books or film. Because stories in video games aren't as good as those other mediums, there are gamers out there that say the industry shouldn't even bother with having a strong narrative, that games should not be criticized for having a poor story, and, like contracts420 said, people claiming that its a movie and hardly a game.

Looking at fairly new artistic mediums, let's compare musical theatre to video games. Crazy, I know, and let me clarify I am talking specifically about musical theatre. Both of these mediums are fairly young, the American musical getting its big start around the 1880s and the game industry getting its big start in the late '70s. In the first thirty years of the musical, the industry had been filled with shows like The "Ziegfield Follies" that were mostly variety shows akin to Saturday Night Live, a show that had musical numbers and little acts but no semblance of a strong story. The music and the dancing were the focal points. It wasn't until 1927 that Jerome Kern and Oscar Hammerstein had created the Broadway hit "Showboat" that the industry began to take a strong narrative within a musical seriously.

"Showboat" appeared in 1927, around 40-45 years after the American musical really got its start. That's 40-45 years for an industry that was so strongly supported by its singing and dancing to finally realize that strong stories can create and enrich an experience like no other, which is odd, because when you look at a musical theatre production and then you look at a play, you wonder why it took so long to have a strong story within a musical.

Now look at the video game industry. The video game industry really became a thing around the late 1970s. It is nearly 2012. The industry is nearing 40 years of its life and is trying to shape its storytelling. You have great games like Planescape: Torment, Uncharted, NIER, Final Fantasy, etc, all games that have been getting praise over the years for their stories. But one could argue that we have yet to see a game that pushes the envelope with its story and narrative. And that is because the industry is stil young. We are an interactive medium much like musical theatre is, even moreso in specific aspects, so it will take time to figure out the best ways to tell a story without limiting control of the audience.

So when I see gamers saying that the industry shouldn't even bother with stories or that a game like Uncharted shouldn't be praised, I see it as a sign of ignorance. A game like Uncharted is a stepping stone to greater things. If you look back at the last generation you can not find a game that allows the freedom that Uncharted does within its cinematic moments. Last gen, huge moments were done either entirely in a cutscene or had were all part of a quick-time event. Today, we see protagonist Nathan Drake in a fist fight on a large plane, falling out of the plane over a desert and having to climb back up into the plane. The amount of freedom we have in that entire scene is astounding when you look at the big picture. And as developers see what Naughty Dog did with a scene like that, they will think of even more ways to stop limiting control of characters in large, cinematic moments.

It is a stepping stone, one that video game enthusiasts should be happy to support even if they don't like the game, not criticize and say there isn't any room for it in the industry. It will take time for video games to have a story that is told through a narrative strong enough that it doesn't hinder players, but we will get there. I have a feeling that in the next ten years we will start to see stories with stronger tales woven and more heartfelt and dynamic characters presented. It is an exciting time to be a gamer.

I'll end by saying this because I feel it can summarize what I said above and it can also encompass other problems I have with the industry: when you start thinking about what shouldn't belong in video games, that is when you are limiting and hurting the video game industry.

I was about to type all that exactly, but you took the words out of my post...:shock:

Dat Zass! Shake it, wiggle it, and deliver it! :o I always thought I was a breast man, but it turns out I'm a Zass man! :twisted: :P

[QUOTE="contracts420"]

Some gamers crap all over stuff like Uncharted claiming it's a movie and hardly a game, apparently we don't have room for these types of games. And it's clearly not a movie, it's a fun game with fantastic gameplay regardless of what those poor fools would like to think.

Gamers do not game anymore... they have become critics. Hating on every story in gaming, every gameplay element, they just complain about everything.

Zassimick

These two stood out for me. I'll touch on the second point first briefly: gamers these days nitpick. I don't mean taking a couple flaws, slapping a 7.5 score on the game and saying "its a good game but--." No, what I'm saying is people playing a game and blowing a couple of flaws out of proportion and hating the game because of that. The industry is large enough to be picky but if all you are going to do is criticize the industry and barely have fun with any game you play today then what is the point of gaming?

I'll move back to the first point now which correlates with the biggest problem I have as a gamer today. Stories in the video game industry aren't too good. They usually lack a lot of things that help create great stories for books or film. Because stories in video games aren't as good as those other mediums, there are gamers out there that say the industry shouldn't even bother with having a strong narrative, that games should not be criticized for having a poor story, and, like contracts420 said, people claiming that its a movie and hardly a game.

Looking at fairly new artistic mediums, let's compare musical theatre to video games. Crazy, I know, and let me clarify I am talking specifically about musical theatre. Both of these mediums are fairly young, the American musical getting its big start around the 1880s and the game industry getting its big start in the late '70s. In the first thirty years of the musical, the industry had been filled with shows like The "Ziegfield Follies" that were mostly variety shows akin to Saturday Night Live, a show that had musical numbers and little acts but no semblance of a strong story. The music and the dancing were the focal points. It wasn't until 1927 that Jerome Kern and Oscar Hammerstein had created the Broadway hit "Showboat" that the industry began to take a strong narrative within a musical seriously.

"Showboat" appeared in 1927, around 40-45 years after the American musical really got its start. That's 40-45 years for an industry that was so strongly supported by its singing and dancing to finally realize that strong stories can create and enrich an experience like no other, which is odd, because when you look at a musical theatre production and then you look at a play, you wonder why it took so long to have a strong story within a musical.

Now look at the video game industry. The video game industry really became a thing around the late 1970s. It is nearly 2012. The industry is nearing 40 years of its life and is trying to shape its storytelling. You have great games like Planescape: Torment, Uncharted, NIER, Final Fantasy, etc, all games that have been getting praise over the years for their stories. But one could argue that we have yet to see a game that pushes the envelope with its story and narrative. And that is because the industry is stil young. We are an interactive medium much like musical theatre is, even moreso in specific aspects, so it will take time to figure out the best ways to tell a story without limiting control of the audience.

So when I see gamers saying that the industry shouldn't even bother with stories or that a game like Uncharted shouldn't be praised, I see it as a sign of ignorance. A game like Uncharted is a stepping stone to greater things. If you look back at the last generation you can not find a game that allows the freedom that Uncharted does within its cinematic moments. Last gen, huge moments were done either entirely in a cutscene or had were all part of a quick-time event. Today, we see protagonist Nathan Drake in a fist fight on a large plane, falling out of the plane over a desert and having to climb back up into the plane. The amount of freedom we have in that entire scene is astounding when you look at the big picture. And as developers see what Naughty Dog did with a scene like that, they will think of even more ways to stop limiting control of characters in large, cinematic moments.

It is a stepping stone, one that video game enthusiasts should be happy to support even if they don't like the game, not criticize and say there isn't any room for it in the industry. It will take time for video games to have a story that is told through a narrative strong enough that it doesn't hinder players, but we will get there. I have a feeling that in the next ten years we will start to see stories with stronger tales woven and more heartfelt and dynamic characters presented. It is an exciting time to be a gamer.

I'll end by saying this because I feel it can summarize what I said above and it can also encompass other problems I have with the industry: when you start thinking about what shouldn't belong in video games, that is when you are limiting and hurting the video game industry.

This!

Well I don't know what he is referring to when he said that, but it is true that gamers do get a lot of slack from everyone else. Just look up any video from a news station involving video games for proof.

Gaming is becoming more mainstream now so you might see a lot less of that though hopefully.

ZenesisX

What he said.

People that judge games without playing them, or not even finishing the learning process of the game which can sometimes be the first 20 minutes and saying they suck. You didn't play the game, how could you possibly know that without even trying a few "quests, missions, etc"

And of course people who think they are good at a game when they really aren't. Don't understand there is winning or even a kill death ratio to rate you(Such as pretty much everyone that plays CoD, Halo, etc) All these people I meet always said they were good at CoD back before I got tired of it or in the process. Then I see their rating or play them and they are horrible. They think because they get one cool kill every once in awhile after they die a million times that it took skill or something. Actually quite funny because it isn't just that game people brag about when they are bad at it.

The major one is the sense of self-entitlement gamers have, though I suspect this is mostly an internet thing - which leads directly to my second point (really just an extension of the first):

the way "fanboys" (i.e. zealots) feel so personally about their favourite things. I mean, hell, I LOVE games, I have my favourite games and I have my favourite systems but I don't take things so personally if someone doesn't like what I like or a company does something I don't like, though they can sometimes elicit emotion from me (sadness, anger) it doesn't mean I take it "personally".

I'm sure you've all seen it before, especially on System Wars, where people seem to defend stuff they like with irrational arguments and just take it so personally that you can feel their very soul being ripped from their body because someone thinks something different to them. But mostly the entitlement thing. Gamers seem to think they deserve... and are owed perfection in video games. Gaming is 30-40 years old now. Games have never been perfect and they've only become more compelx and yet the internet age has sparked this mentality that the user is owed.

The third one is something I dislike a great deal. It's the PC mentality that "mods will fix it". That sort of mentality is the opposite of what people should be saying. Mods shouldn't be fixing anything, they should only be modifying things to a more personal taste, not fixing bugs or cleaning up GUI's or enhancing other certain aspects. Gamers should be pushing for companies to release better games and making this statement with thier wallets not their indifference because mods can/might fix some things.

Most gamers.

Look the thing is that I love videogames. Period. It doesnt matter if I prefer only the Gamecube, GBA SP, regular Playstation/PSOne and SNES and NES. I'm just not fond of the new crap such as the Xboxes and PS3 and Wii. Biggest problem I have with all of the games for the Xbox and PS3 is that they force you to download the DLC content.

Whatever happened to the good old fashioned of playing the game the normal way unlocking stuff while you go through the levels etc. Then whatever bonus stuff you get from beating the game.

Look at Metroid Prime 1 and 2 for Gamecube. Simple stuff to unlock by scanning and beating the game. Nowadays you have to download a bunch of crap for PS3 games. That's why Idont have a PS3.

And I wish the elitiststhat love the PS3s and Xbox 360s they need to stop acting all high and mighty.

Not having a lot of time for gaming and having a lot of good games to play is really annoying me these days, on the multiplayer front, I'm playing battlefield, and I'm playing DE:HR alongside of it, but there are so many other good games waiting and I don't have time for them, like Skyrim, Dark Souls, DA2, rayman origins, it's really frustrating.

[QUOTE="contracts420"]

Some gamers crap all over stuff like Uncharted claiming it's a movie and hardly a game, apparently we don't have room for these types of games. And it's clearly not a movie, it's a fun game with fantastic gameplay regardless of what those poor fools would like to think.

Gamers do not game anymore... they have become critics. Hating on every story in gaming, every gameplay element, they just complain about everything.

Zassimick

These two stood out for me. I'll touch on the second point first briefly: gamers these days nitpick. I don't mean taking a couple flaws, slapping a 7.5 score on the game and saying "its a good game but--." No, what I'm saying is people playing a game and blowing a couple of flaws out of proportion and hating the game because of that. The industry is large enough to be picky but if all you are going to do is criticize the industry and barely have fun with any game you play today then what is the point of gaming?

I'll move back to the first point now which correlates with the biggest problem I have as a gamer today. Stories in the video game industry aren't too good. They usually lack a lot of things that help create great stories for books or film. Because stories in video games aren't as good as those other mediums, there are gamers out there that say the industry shouldn't even bother with having a strong narrative, that games should not be criticized for having a poor story, and, like contracts420 said, people claiming that its a movie and hardly a game.

Looking at fairly new artistic mediums, let's compare musical theatre to video games. Crazy, I know, and let me clarify I am talking specifically about musical theatre. Both of these mediums are fairly young, the American musical getting its big start around the 1880s and the game industry getting its big start in the late '70s. In the first thirty years of the musical, the industry had been filled with shows like The "Ziegfield Follies" that were mostly variety shows akin to Saturday Night Live, a show that had musical numbers and little acts but no semblance of a strong story. The music and the dancing were the focal points. It wasn't until 1927 that Jerome Kern and Oscar Hammerstein had created the Broadway hit "Showboat" that the industry began to take a strong narrative within a musical seriously.

"Showboat" appeared in 1927, around 40-45 years after the American musical really got its start. That's 40-45 years for an industry that was so strongly supported by its singing and dancing to finally realize that strong stories can create and enrich an experience like no other, which is odd, because when you look at a musical theatre production and then you look at a play, you wonder why it took so long to have a strong story within a musical.

Now look at the video game industry. The video game industry really became a thing around the late 1970s. It is nearly 2012. The industry is nearing 40 years of its life and is trying to shape its storytelling. You have great games like Planescape: Torment, Uncharted, NIER, Final Fantasy, etc, all games that have been getting praise over the years for their stories. But one could argue that we have yet to see a game that pushes the envelope with its story and narrative. And that is because the industry is stil young. We are an interactive medium much like musical theatre is, even moreso in specific aspects, so it will take time to figure out the best ways to tell a story without limiting control of the audience.

So when I see gamers saying that the industry shouldn't even bother with stories or that a game like Uncharted shouldn't be praised, I see it as a sign of ignorance. A game like Uncharted is a stepping stone to greater things. If you look back at the last generation you can not find a game that allows the freedom that Uncharted does within its cinematic moments. Last gen, huge moments were done either entirely in a cutscene or had were all part of a quick-time event. Today, we see protagonist Nathan Drake in a fist fight on a large plane, falling out of the plane over a desert and having to climb back up into the plane. The amount of freedom we have in that entire scene is astounding when you look at the big picture. And as developers see what Naughty Dog did with a scene like that, they will think of even more ways to stop limiting control of characters in large, cinematic moments.

It is a stepping stone, one that video game enthusiasts should be happy to support even if they don't like the game, not criticize and say there isn't any room for it in the industry. It will take time for video games to have a story that is told through a narrative strong enough that it doesn't hinder players, but we will get there. I have a feeling that in the next ten years we will start to see stories with stronger tales woven and more heartfelt and dynamic characters presented. It is an exciting time to be a gamer.

I'll end by saying this because I feel it can summarize what I said above and it can also encompass other problems I have with the industry: when you start thinking about what shouldn't belong in video games, that is when you are limiting and hurting the video game industry.

Although I agree to most of you said, I would like to say we do have already some great story telling in gaming apart from uncharted franchise Like Lost Odyssey, mass effect, Braid, Red Deadn Black ops, I mean we don't have to wait for another decade to see good story telling in games. anyway good story telling in games can be difficult because story may be the most important part of books and movies, but for games I think it comes after gameplay, and may be even after graphics, consequently investing in the story in games can be fatal for studios without having a great gameplay and graphics, so if you realy want to tell a great narrative in a video game, the game should be almost perfect so that the good story can shrine, other wise a great plot without at least "good" gameplay and graphics means nothing.

Not having a lot of time for gaming and having a lot of good games to play is really annoying me these days, on the multiplayer front, I'm playing battlefield, and I'm playing DE:HR alongside of it, but there are so many other good games waiting and I don't have time for them, like Skyrim, Dark Souls, DA2, rayman origins, it's really frustrating.

TangoGamer

[QUOTE="TangoGamer"]

Not having a lot of time for gaming and having a lot of good games to play is really annoying me these days, on the multiplayer front, I'm playing battlefield, and I'm playing DE:HR alongside of it, but there are so many other good games waiting and I don't have time for them, like Skyrim, Dark Souls, DA2, rayman origins, it's really frustrating.

chilly-chill

• Lag
• Input lag
• Day one patches
• PC driver updates
• The RRoD
• Disc read error!
• QTEs
• The Atari 5200 controller
• The Wii
• Tripping
• "Casuals"
• Farmville
• Facebook
• Gaming
• Life

Yadda yadda yadda......:P

[QUOTE="chilly-chill"][QUOTE="TangoGamer"]

Not having a lot of time for gaming and having a lot of good games to play is really annoying me these days, on the multiplayer front, I'm playing battlefield, and I'm playing DE:HR alongside of it, but there are so many other good games waiting and I don't have time for them, like Skyrim, Dark Souls, DA2, rayman origins, it's really frustrating.

TangoGamer

Some things that others probably already pointed out that I dislike about gaming:

• an overabundance of sequels
• DLC coming in really small packages rather than full expansion packs (or using that time for a more polished sequel or new IP instead)
• not enough innovative ideas for multiplayer (i.e. mostly the same old variations of deathmatches for shooters and action games, like CTF, King of the Hill, etc.)
• weak narrative
• poor AI
• little usage of more than just controllers (voice recognition and text parsers are incredibly underused, as such examples)
• not enough time every day to play a game
• rare likelihood of being able to play through every single RPG or strategy game (particularly 4X ones), when the amount of hours that have to be put in is so huge (300 hours for Skyrim, hundreds of hours for a game like Civ IV/V, etc.)
• still too much censorship in most mature-rated titles
• hardware failure or poor hardware design
• software limitations (lag still being pretty prominent in multiplayer and/or in cloud gaming)
• all the politicians and other non-gaming folks that try to do everything they can to put gaming into its own coffin
• seeing every Nintendo console (not handheld) lacking in enough quality third-party titles
• how expensive games have become (ranging anywhere from $60 to over $100, depending on whether you buy the collector's edition or not)

Some things that others probably already pointed out that I dislike about gaming:

• an overabundance of sequels
• DLC coming in really small packages rather than full expansion packs (or using that time for a more polished sequel or new IP instead)
• not enough innovative ideas for multiplayer (i.e. mostly the same old variations of deathmatches for shooters and action games, like CTF, King of the Hill, etc.)
• weak narrative
• poor AI
• little usage of more than just controllers (voice recognition and text parsers are incredibly underused, as such examples)
• not enough time every day to play a game
• rare likelihood of being able to play through every single RPG or strategy game (particularly 4X ones), when the amount of hours that have to be put in is so huge (300 hours for Skyrim, hundreds of hours for a game like Civ IV/V, etc.)
• still too much censorship in most mature-rated titles
• hardware failure or poor hardware design
• software limitations (lag still being pretty prominent in multiplayer and/or in cloud gaming)
• all the politicians and other non-gaming folks that try to do everything they can to put gaming into its own coffin
• seeing every Nintendo console (not handheld) lacking in enough quality third-party titles
• how expensive games have become (ranging anywhere from $60 to over $100, depending on whether you buy the collector's edition or not)

Mawy_Golomb

Why do you even bother gaming when you pretty much moan about everything?

There's not really much in gaming itself that really bothers me. Basically it's mostly just the attitudes of some gamers themselves that bother. Some seem much too jaded for their own good and some 'core' gamers feel that the entire industry should cater just to them with no room for 'casual' gamers.Archangel3371

^^

[QUOTE="Zassimick"]

These two stood out for me...

...

I'll end by saying this because I feel it can summarize what I said above and it can also encompass other problems I have with the industry: when you start thinking about what shouldn't belong in video games, that is when you are limiting and hurting the video game industry.

TangoGamer

Although I agree to most of you said, I would like to say we do have already some great story telling in gaming apart from uncharted franchise Like Lost Odyssey, mass effect, Braid, Red Deadn Black ops, I mean we don't have to wait for another decade to see good story telling in games.

My post was aimed towards the people who have said that games cannot have great stories, shouldn't be bothered to focus on them, and that storytelling in games cannot be great. And we have do have great storytelling in games, I agree; you can see it just by looking at Uncharted. I would argue that it isn't masterpiece storytelling though. Not all stories or narratives have to be masterpieces but I don't believe we have seen one yet.

Many of the games you posted, with the exception of Braid, the story is mainly told though cutscenes and/or taking away control of the player. That is the argument other gamers are making; there are these games that are supposed to have terrific narratives but yet here I am not playing the game. To them, we have servicable storytelling and to a degree I honestly agree. Things aren't perfect for the gaming industry currently; we are trying to get our footing and find what we can do differently from film to tell a story.

anyway good story telling in games can be difficult because story may be the most important part of books and movies, but for games I think it comes after gameplay, and may be even after graphics, consequently investing in the story in games can be fatal for studios without having a great gameplay and graphics, so if you realy want to tell a great narrative in a video game, the game should be almost perfect so that the good story can shrine, other wise a great plot without at least "good" gameplay and graphics means nothing.

TangoGamer

Video games is a medium in which a specific development studio can invoke an emotion within their audience, most often it is the feeling of enjoyment. Video games are also an interactive medium so if the interactivity is a mess and is not fun to use, then the emotion that the developer may have tried to incite within the audience could potentially be ruined. In that aspect of your debate, I agree with you.

What I disagree with is the idea that the story and the narrative must take a backseat to the gameplay or even graphics. That is exactly the idea that I was trying to debate against in my previous post. We should not be looking at any specific area of gaming and saying that that does not deserve as much attention as another. Story will take a backseat in some games, like Mario or racing games, but if a developer is going to have a story as a focus within their game they should never be willing to say "we can not focus as much on the story as we are on the graphics and the gameplay." That line of thinking is what is holding the industry back from good storytelling. Gamers aren't asking for it because they believe that focusing on a good story means that the other aspects of the game will suffer. That just isn't true.