I Need To Debunk A Common Myth, Casuals This Casuals That

I can't count one day that goes by where someone doesn't post either a whole thread or just a reply that says the following in some way...

"Casuals mostly buy the Wii"

This is completely wrong and people have just been parroting this line over and over and over.

In reality over 90% of Wii buyers are gamers. What do I mean when I say gamers? I mean they're people who owned at least one console last gen. Nintendo's press conferences in Japan and the US showed that it's more like 92 and 93 respectively. (sorry UK never got the feed from yours)

Gamers are buying the Wii. Gamers are the ones that are calling stores until they get theirs. You really think there's a mass wave of grandmothers sitting outside stores all night for a Wii? Sure, I bet there's some grandmothers doing it but I bet they're outnumbered by a margin of 50 to 1 or better by people talking about the latest level editor they love (hold that purse tight Nana!)

Some novice users are buying the Wii but they don't make up any significant sales right now. They just being introduced to gaming and that's fine, we were all novice players once.

Novice users are playing the Wii so much because the gamer comes home with his or her Wii and all of a sudden people who never were interested in gaming want to try it. In some cases the novice user goes out and buys their own.

How many stories have we seen in this forum alone about someone's Mom or Dad or grandmother (even the Queen of England) playing and enjoying the Wii. They're not the ones who bought the Wii and they're not even the main player on the system. They're someone who Nintendo is trying to cultivate to see that gaming is an acceptable form of entertainment.

So to settle it once and for all gamers are buying the vast majority of the Wii's sold and they're buying the vast majority of the titles, the myth that novice users have made a significant part in the Wii's sales is just that.

A Myth.

Well said. I'm not a novice gamer, I've been playing for 20 some odd years, and I think the Wii is brilliant. It brings back that feeling I had playing those games all those years ago, something that's been missing for a long time, probably not since the SNES.ozzsoad

This is exactly how I feel about the Wii! Cheers!

and you're basing this off of what exactly?

if 90% are gamers, why the hell did zack and wik and no more heroes flop in sales? No more heroes is unstandable because suda's games are niche. but why zack? it was made by capcom, a generally well known third party company.

why is wii fit selling? why is mario party 8 selling?

generally, gamers don't buy casuals junk so they're usually informed, regardless of ads.

suda has already said the wii had a non gaming corwd and i agree with him.

thankfully, reports have shown wii software beat 360 software in december, which is good. but if things continue, main franchises won't come to wii if the fanbase won't get off their butts and buy hardcore games

and you're basing this off of what exactly?

if 90% are gamers, why the hell did zack and wiky and no more heroes flop in sales? why is wii fit selling?

generally, gamers don't buy casuals junk so they're usually informed, regardless of ads.

Sonick54

Numbers, I'm basing it off numbers.

like I said above 92 and 93 percent of Wii's are sold to gamers who had a system last gen and went right out and got a Wii this gen.

Why do games not sell? No idea. I do know that they don't come much more "hardcore" then me and I passed over Zack and Wiki and No More Heroes but I'm getting Wii Fit day one.

So I guess why did Zack and Wiki and No More heroes sell poorly?

Gamers don't want them lol

and you're basing this off of what exactly?

if 90% are gamers, why the hell did zack and wiky and no more heroes flop in sales? why is wii fit selling?

generally, gamers don't buy casuals junk so they're usually informed, regardless of ads.

Sonick54

suda has already said the wii had a non gaming corwd and i agree with him.

Sonick54

Suda is misinformed

Ok, I'd just like to say this one thing and read carefully because I will mock you for a long time if you fall into this crowd so you were warned ahead of time lol

If you really do think that the Wii is bought mainly by "novice" users you must also accept that by saying that you think that people who never played or rarely played games stay out in 0 degree temps waiting for stores to open getting in line up to 10 hours early, signing onto websites to find out who had a Wii shipment when, calls stores nonstop daily to find out who has the Wii in stock, and reserved it from a myriad of different places online and off.

So "novice" users are taking a large chunk of their lives tracking down the console

Because to have one you have to have the other.

I think the data needs to be split into something like active gamers, passive gamers, and non-gamers. That would be very statistical because probably a majority of Wii-Owners are passive gamers.WolfWatch

[QUOTE="WolfWatch"]I think the data needs to be split into something like active gamers, passive gamers, and non-gamers. That would be very statistical because probably a majority of Wii-Owners are passive gamers.raahsnavj

You are right. There is no real definition of it so we have to make our own, or all agree on a similar one.

My idea of a Active-Gamer is someone who comes home, plays for 3-5 hours a day, has around 3-7 games, and beats a game within a month.

My idea of a Passive-Gamer is someone who plays maybe 2 hours in month, never mo more likely to do so when guests visit, has 1-4 games, doesn't beat a game or in a 6 month period.

Hardcore is a branch of active. Retirement home is a branch of passive.

My guestimates for the Wii are 70% active gamer, 30% passive, 5% non-gamers, 30% hardcore. This is just a guestimate by my part and serves as no factual data.

[QUOTE="raahsnavj"][QUOTE="WolfWatch"]I think the data needs to be split into something like active gamers, passive gamers, and non-gamers. That would be very statistical because probably a majority of Wii-Owners are passive gamers.WolfWatch

You are right. There is no real definition of it so we have to make our own, or all agree on a similar one.

My idea of a Active-Gamer is someone who comes home, plays for 3-5 hours a day, has around 3-7 games, and beats a game within a month.

My idea of a Passive-Gamer is someone who plays maybe 2 hours in month, never mo more likely to do so when guests visit, has 1-4 games, doesn't beat a game or in a 6 month period.

Hardcore is a branch of active. Retirement home is a branch of passive.

My guestimates for the Wii are 70% active gamer, 30% passive, 5% non-gamers, 30% hardcore. This is just a guestimate by my part and serves as no factual data.

In reality over 90% of Wii buyers are gamers. What do I mean when I say gamers? I mean they're people who owned at least one console last gen. Nintendo's press conferences in Japan and the US showed that it's more like 92 and 93 respectively.Jaysonguy

Can we see a link for that? The only similar statistics I've seen were from Nintendo's E3 conference, but I skimmed through it again and didn't see this exact statistic anywhere.

[QUOTE="WolfWatch"]

[QUOTE="raahsnavj"][QUOTE="WolfWatch"]I think the data needs to be split into something like active gamers, passive gamers, and non-gamers. That would be very statistical because probably a majority of Wii-Owners are passive gamers.raahsnavj

You are right. There is no real definition of it so we have to make our own, or all agree on a similar one.

My idea of a Active-Gamer is someone who comes home, plays for 3-5 hours a day, has around 3-7 games, and beats a game within a month.

My idea of a Passive-Gamer is someone who plays maybe 2 hours in month, never mo more likely to do so when guests visit, has 1-4 games, doesn't beat a game or in a 6 month period.

Hardcore is a branch of active. Retirement home is a branch of passive.

My guestimates for the Wii are 70% active gamer, 30% passive, 5% non-gamers, 30% hardcore. This is just a guestimate by my part and serves as no factual data.

well thinking about this post, i see alot of posts people complaing that their are not many hardcore gamers. sometime, maybe this weekend, ill try organize any statistics and definitions to see if we can get a general definition and agreement of what gamer is what. it's like saying your computer is outdated. to some it is to some it isn't. i forgot what I was thinking but. maybe ill comment later or something...

i agree with the topic starter. ive owned all the nintendo systems (except the snes), the sega genesis, sega cd, ps1, ps2, xbox 360 and my wii. i consider myself to be a "core gamer", i keep up with game releases and i preorder games for all my current systems

(ds,360,wii) and i love my wii best. the games are engaging and addictive, thats not saying i dont like my 360, but i find myself more drawn to my wii. i think that the only casuals buy/play wii statement is a fad born from fanboys needing some way to explain away the undeniable success of the wii and ds. i think that the true statement is that casuals dont buy 360s and ps3's, EVERYONE buys the wii.

i have spoken

[QUOTE="Sonick54"]

and you're basing this off of what exactly?

if 90% are gamers, why the hell did zack and wiky and no more heroes flop in sales? why is wii fit selling?

generally, gamers don't buy casuals junk so they're usually informed, regardless of ads.

Jaysonguy

Numbers, I'm basing it off numbers.

like I said above 92 and 93 percent of Wii's are sold to gamers who had a system last gen and went right out and got a Wii this gen.

Why do games not sell? No idea. I do know that they don't come much more "hardcore" then me and I passed over Zack and Wiki and No More Heroes but I'm getting Wii Fit day one.

So I guess why did Zack and Wiki and No More heroes sell poorly?

Gamers don't want them lol

This is purely out of personal interest, but please... explain to me why you would pass up on No More Heroes. You want the reason why games like it don't sell? It's because people like you don't buy them. I'm wondering why that is.

Also, I feel that the definition of "hardcore" is becoming less and less applicable (it may be an incorrect definition altogether), especially considering the radical differences between what the Wii offers and what the 360 and PS3 offer. In the case of No More Heroes, we have to consider that Killer7 didn't sell well for its ENTIRE time on the shelves, and that game was one of the most unique and engrossing titles I've played. On top of that, the game is a WEEK old here in the US, and less than a MONTH old in Japan. It's way too early to make conclusions about its sales.

i also dont understand why the average "hardcore" gamer is so threatened by the wii... nintendos new strategy is not all that shocking. they are making just as many if not more of there "hardcore" franchises as they have in the past, and also have new teams working on completly new and casual stuff to broaden the market and increase profits. if you dont like the approach then stick to the 360 or ps3, the wii does not and should not affect your gaming situation at all. people are wierd... it seems that alot of people see every casual game that comes out as just another wasted game because it could have been a hardcore game. i dont really understand that at all either. poeple will continue to make both hardcore and casual games

gamers benifit from the increased variety in video games, but they are so angry that they arent getting 2 or 3 more sequels from there favorite games this year... bah

suda has already said the wii had a non gaming corwd and i agree with him.

Sonick54

[QUOTE="Jaysonguy"]In reality over 90% of Wii buyers are gamers. What do I mean when I say gamers? I mean they're people who owned at least one console last gen. Nintendo's press conferences in Japan and the US showed that it's more like 92 and 93 respectively.JordanElek

Can we see a link for that? The only similar statistics I've seen were from Nintendo's E3 conference, but I skimmed through it again and didn't see this exact statistic anywhere.

No I don't and I hate that, if I still had them I would have linked to them in my thread.

I lost all my bookmarks since right before Thanksgiving and I've been looking for these two PR goodies. I know I came across the US one accidentally and found the Japanese one in the System Wars forum (who says nothing good comes from there? lol)

That's why I made this a double pronged argument so to speak. Sure on one side is the numbers and I have no problem with anyone saying "If I don't see the numbers I can't believe it totally" which I'm totally cool with.

The other direction of the argument is that people who say gamers aren't buying the console they're in turn saying that "novice" users are the ones who are spending a large chunk of their time tracking one down from camping out overnight to calling stores daily to track one down.

Once I finish in this thread with the replies I'm going to look more because that would REALLY help my case lol

This is purely out of personal interest, but please... explain to me why you would pass up on No More Heroes. You want the reason why games like it don't sell? It's because people like you don't buy them. I'm wondering why that is.

ScarecrowBirdy

The main reason is that it's not far away enough from what I've played before to warrant a purchase. I'm still fighting over Endless Ocean because it's the first kind of game like that of it's kind. I NEED to play Endless Ocean and I NEED to play Wii Fit. I need to taste what these new genres are bringing to the table.

That being said Endless Ocean is just that, endless. It's one thing to buy a game and be like "Ok I got the point, I finished it" Endless Ocean is more of an experience that you need to take your time with and sometimes I really hate that because then I'm playing three games at one time. Trying to finish one completely, trying to get farther in another, and then trying to take in the experience in another.

I'll eventually get No More Heroes because while Suda does tick me off I do like what he does.

I've always considered the term "casuals" (in ralation to the Wii) to be those people who simply by the console and purchase gaems off the shelf based on the back cover text and/or title. Occasionally they will purchase a game reccomended by a friend or family member.

"Hardcores", on the other hand, are the folks who review games before purchase, surf the web for news about future games, discuss the console/games on forums, etc.

That's just always how I've seen it. Nothing to do with how many games people purchase for themselves or how many hours they dump into playing them, jsut how educated or not they are on the whole situation.

I know a guy who has more money than he knows what to do with, so he has every console and butt loads of games for each, yet he is the least informed gamer I've ever met. I would consider him casual... rich, but casual. I also know of a few guys that I would consider pretty hard core, as they could tell you just about anything when it comes to the consoles, games, etc that are out right now or are coming out this year. They can even quote specs of cosoles off the tops of their heads. These guys usually only have a few games at a time, yet I would consider them pretty hardcore. I, myself, consider myself to be some where in between.

The question is, are the majority of people buying the Wii they type that simply see the commercial on TV and buy one (casual) or are they the type that eat, sleep and breath gaming 24 hours a day (hardcore)? Everyone's playing games these days, and we can't call everyone hardcore. Thus we have to consider if they supplement their gaming with extras, like news, reviews, forum discussion, etc.

and you're basing this off of what exactly?

if 90% are gamers, why the hell did zack and wik and no more heroes flop in sales? No more heroes is unstandable because suda's games are niche. but why zack? it was made by capcom, a generally well known third party company.

why is wii fit selling? why is mario party 8 selling?

generally, gamers don't buy casuals junk so they're usually informed, regardless of ads.

suda has already said the wii had a non gaming corwd and i agree with him.

thankfully, reports have shown wii software beat 360 software in december, which is good. but if things continue, main franchises won't come to wii if the fanbase won't get off their butts and buy hardcore games

Sonick54

i tottaly agree with you man, just by looking at the wii shelf on any videogames store is enough to see that there is a problem, either the vast majority of wii owbers are not "hard core gamers" or the game studios are misinformed... because 90% of the available titles doesnt look like gamers style...

[QUOTE="ScarecrowBirdy"]

This is purely out of personal interest, but please... explain to me why you would pass up on No More Heroes. You want the reason why games like it don't sell? It's because people like you don't buy them. I'm wondering why that is.

Jaysonguy

The main reason is that it's not far away enough from what I've played before to warrant a purchase. I'm still fighting over Endless Ocean because it's the first kind of game like that of it's kind. I NEED to play Endless Ocean and I NEED to play Wii Fit. I need to taste what these new genres are bringing to the table.

That being said Endless Ocean is just that, endless. It's one thing to buy a game and be like "Ok I got the point, I finished it" Endless Ocean is more of an experience that you need to take your time with and sometimes I really hate that because then I'm playing three games at one time. Trying to finish one completely, trying to get farther in another, and then trying to take in the experience in another.

I'll eventually get No More Heroes because while Suda does tick me off I do like what he does.

After looking over Jaysonguy's list, we would be hard pressed to say he doesn't support Wii software. Even if he didn't get Z&W or NMH, he is still buying 3rd party titles.

I've always considered the term "casuals" (in ralation to the Wii) to be those people who simply by the console and purchase gaems off the shelf based on the back cover text and/or title. Occasionally they will purchase a game reccomended by a friend or family member.

"Hardcores", on the other hand, are the folks who review games before purchase, surf the web for news about future games, discuss the console/games on forums, etc.

That's just always how I've seen it. Nothing to do with how many games people purchase for themselves or how many hours they dump into playing them, jsut how educated or not they are on the whole situation.

I know a guy who has more money than he knows what to do with, so he has every console and butt loads of games for each, yet he is the least informed gamer I've ever met. I would consider him casual... rich, but casual. I also know of a few guys that I would consider pretty hard core, as they could tell you just about anything when it comes to the consoles, games, etc that are out right now or are coming out this year. They can even quote specs of cosoles off the tops of their heads. These guys usually only have a few games at a time, yet I would consider them pretty hardcore. I, myself, consider myself to be some where in between.

The question is, are the majority of people buying the Wii they type that simply see the commercial on TV and buy one (casual) or are they the type that eat, sleep and breath gaming 24 hours a day (hardcore)? Everyone's playing games these days, and we can't call everyone hardcore. Thus we have to consider if they supplement their gaming with extras, like news, reviews, forum discussion, etc.

Mike1978Smith

how abou cooking mamma do you play that by any chance during your hardcore gaming hours?

[QUOTE="Sonick54"]

and you're basing this off of what exactly?

if 90% are gamers, why the hell did zack and wik and no more heroes flop in sales? No more heroes is unstandable because suda's games are niche. but why zack? it was made by capcom, a generally well known third party company.

why is wii fit selling? why is mario party 8 selling?

generally, gamers don't buy casuals junk so they're usually informed, regardless of ads.

suda has already said the wii had a non gaming corwd and i agree with him.

thankfully, reports have shown wii software beat 360 software in december, which is good. but if things continue, main franchises won't come to wii if the fanbase won't get off their butts and buy hardcore games

samiup

i tottaly agree with you man, just by looking at the wii shelf on any videogames store is enough to see that there is a problem, either the vast majority of wii owbers are not "hard core gamers" or the game studios are misinformed... because 90% of the available titles doesnt look like gamers style...

I'm quite sorry you're forced to buy every single title where you live, is there a way that you can move maybe to one of the major regions for games?

There's games for everyone and rather nice games at that, if you have a problem with people having a choice I can only say that if you follow history a dictatorship always fails. let people play what they want.

[QUOTE="samiup"][QUOTE="Sonick54"]

and you're basing this off of what exactly?

if 90% are gamers, why the hell did zack and wik and no more heroes flop in sales? No more heroes is unstandable because suda's games are niche. but why zack? it was made by capcom, a generally well known third party company.

why is wii fit selling? why is mario party 8 selling?

generally, gamers don't buy casuals junk so they're usually informed, regardless of ads.

suda has already said the wii had a non gaming corwd and i agree with him.

thankfully, reports have shown wii software beat 360 software in december, which is good. but if things continue, main franchises won't come to wii if the fanbase won't get off their butts and buy hardcore games

Jaysonguy

i tottaly agree with you man, just by looking at the wii shelf on any videogames store is enough to see that there is a problem, either the vast majority of wii owbers are not "hard core gamers" or the game studios are misinformed... because 90% of the available titles doesnt look like gamers style...

I'm quite sorry you're forced to buy every single title where you live, is there a way that you can move maybe to one of the major regions for games?

There's games for everyone and rather nice games at that, if you have a problem with people having a choice I can only say that if you follow history a dictatorship always fails. let people play what they want.

how abou cooking mamma do you play that by any chance during your hardcore gaming hours?

and whats that supposed to mean, sombody is preventing you from what you like to play? thats out of subject dude...

how abou cooking mamma do you play that by any chance during your hardcore gaming hours?

and whats that supposed to mean, sombody is preventing you from what you like to play? thats out of subject dude...

samiup

I don't have Cooking Mama so my time on the game is very limited to just about zero

As far as what I said above just because YOU don't like the titles doesn't mean that you're right and just because those aren't the genres YOU expect doesn't mean they have the wrong ones.

The idea that the Wii library can't appeal to everyone and be for gamers is absurd. Everyone should be able to have games to play and not everyone likes the same thing so why would you even say that diversity is a bad thing?

The Wii had one of the strongest launches in console history because it hit so many different genres very well. What's the matter if when Metroid comes out they also release an all ages platformer, a puzzle game, and a mini game collection? Are you of the mindset that they could release 4 shooters (with Metroid being one) and that would appeal to gamers? Because I'm not keen on the fact that everyone else has to do without so I can play more of what I already have.

[QUOTE="samiup"]

how abou cooking mamma do you play that by any chance during your hardcore gaming hours?

and whats that supposed to mean, sombody is preventing you from what you like to play? thats out of subject dude...

Jaysonguy

I don't have Cooking Mama so my time on the game is very limited to just about zero

As far as what I said above just because YOU don't like the titles doesn't mean that you're right and just because those aren't the genres YOU expect doesn't mean they have the wrong ones.

The idea that the Wii library can't appeal to everyone and be for gamers is absurd. Everyone should be able to have games to play and not everyone likes the same thing so why would you even say that diversity is a bad thing?

The Wii had one of the strongest launches in console history because it hit so many different genres very well. What's the matter if when Metroid comes out they also release an all ages platformer, a puzzle game, and a mini game collection? Are you of the mindset that they could release 4 shooters (with Metroid being one) and that would appeal to gamers? Because I'm not keen on the fact that everyone else has to do without so I can play more of what I already have.

first i never said that diversity is bad! WHERE DID YOU READ THAT?

i think its stupid to start discussing what are hardore gamers kind of games and what are not. you can never talk about PC or 360 or PS and start arguing that the line up is not for hardcore gamers. so its really clear... no need to clarify more ok.

this thread itself and even this discussion is proof enough that there is somthing wrong abou the wii lineup (so far).

first i never said that diversity is bad! WHERE DID YOU READ THAT?

i think its stupid to start discussing what are hardore gamers kind of games and what are not. you can never talk about PC or 360 or PS and start arguing that the line up is not for hardcore gamers. so its really clear... no need to clarify more ok.

this thread itself and even this discussion is proof enough that there is somthing wrong abou the wii lineup (so far).

samiup

Read the first part in bold, answer it with the second part in bold.

[QUOTE="samiup"]

first i never said that diversity is bad! WHERE DID YOU READ THAT?

i think its stupid to start discussing what are hardore gamers kind of games and what are not. you can never talk about PC or 360 or PS and start arguing that the line up is not for hardcore gamers. so its really clear... no need to clarify more ok.

this thread itself and even this discussion is proof enough that there is somthing wrong abou the wii lineup (so far).

Jaysonguy

Read the first part in bold, answer it with the second part in bold.

oh ok, lit me see, you went into the future and answered my question from my nect post, wow, brave, most briliant !!! LoL

anyway, what has "somthing wrong about the wii lineup" has to do with diversity?

I think the key to seeing why it's called casual is to look at the attach rate of the games. the 360 is so far seen as the "hardcore" system and has a very high software attach rate. i think it's something like every 360 owner owns on average 6-7 games.

on the Wii the number is much lower and the system even ships with a game.

if you do market the grandmothers, the adults and people that aren't into gaming, the Wii mote is nothing more than a gimmick that is fun for a while but you can only do so much wii bowling or mario parties before it gets old.

I own 6-7 games for the system so that means somewhere out there somone just owns 1 game to offset me

I think the key to seeing why it's called casual is to look at the attach rate of the games. the 360 is so far seen as the "hardcore" system and has a very high software attach rate. i think it's something like every 360 owner owns on average 6-7 games.

on the Wii the number is much lower and the system even ships with a game.

smerlus

Attach rate is higher on the Wii even if you take out the two regions that the Wii comes packed with a game.

Someone will post the link to the results I'm sure.

[QUOTE="smerlus"]

I think the key to seeing why it's called casual is to look at the attach rate of the games. the 360 is so far seen as the "hardcore" system and has a very high software attach rate. i think it's something like every 360 owner owns on average 6-7 games.

on the Wii the number is much lower and the system even ships with a game.

Jaysonguy

Attach rate is higher on the Wii even if you take out the two regions that the Wii comes packed with a game.

Someone will post the link to the results I'm sure.

yes i agree, Attach rate is higher on the Wii, ive seen that too.

[QUOTE="Jaysonguy"][QUOTE="samiup"]

first i never said that diversity is bad! WHERE DID YOU READ THAT?

i think its stupid to start discussing what are hardore gamers kind of games and what are not. you can never talk about PC or 360 or PS and start arguing that the line up is not for hardcore gamers. so its really clear... no need to clarify more ok.

this thread itself and even this discussion is proof enough that there is somthing wrong abou the wii lineup (so far).

samiup

Read the first part in bold, answer it with the second part in bold.

oh ok, lit me see, you went into the future and answered my question from my nect post, wow, brave, most briliant !!! LoL

anyway, what has "somthing wrong about the wii lineup" has to do with diversity?

You asked the same question twice so it was easy to find the answer, I'm just glad you did it in one post so I didn't have to copy and paste another of your posts first.

There's nothing wrong with it's lineup because it's a diverse lineup that has something for everyone.

The best platformer

One of the best shooters

One of the best sports games

The best Party Game

One of the best puzzle games

Now that can be broken down even more into games that people find as worthwhile experiences.

Also there's games that scare away the ummmm ones that "aren't sure of themselves" let's call it? Chicken Little is a fun Ratchet and Clank clone that uses the Wiimote to aim and Adam West is just the icing baby. Lots of gamers were afraid of playing it so they never had the chance. The ones that were smart enough had fun with it.

There's something for everyone on the Wii lineup, no one in their right mind can look at the library and say they don't want to play anything.

[QUOTE="Sonick54"]

and you're basing this off of what exactly?

if 90% are gamers, why the hell did zack and wiky and no more heroes flop in sales? why is wii fit selling?

generally, gamers don't buy casuals junk so they're usually informed, regardless of ads.

Jaysonguy

Numbers, I'm basing it off numbers.

like I said above 92 and 93 percent of Wii's are sold to gamers who had a system last gen and went right out and got a Wii this gen.

Why do games not sell? No idea. I do know that they don't come much more "hardcore" then me and I passed over Zack and Wiki and No More Heroes but I'm getting Wii Fit day one.

So I guess why did Zack and Wiki and No More heroes sell poorly?

Gamers don't want them lol

that's a surprise to me tbqh. i'd find it weird for a gamer who usually playes games like call of duty or mario to go out and buy many "casual" games likes wii fit instead of traditional games like NMH

[QUOTE="samiup"][QUOTE="Jaysonguy"][QUOTE="samiup"]

first i never said that diversity is bad! WHERE DID YOU READ THAT?

i think its stupid to start discussing what are hardore gamers kind of games and what are not. you can never talk about PC or 360 or PS and start arguing that the line up is not for hardcore gamers. so its really clear... no need to clarify more ok.

this thread itself and even this discussion is proof enough that there is somthing wrong abou the wii lineup (so far).

Jaysonguy

Read the first part in bold, answer it with the second part in bold.

oh ok, lit me see, you went into the future and answered my question from my nect post, wow, brave, most briliant !!! LoL

anyway, what has "somthing wrong about the wii lineup" has to do with diversity?

You asked the same question twice so it was easy to find the answer, I'm just glad you did it in one post so I didn't have to copy and paste another of your posts first.

There's nothing wrong with it's lineup because it's a diverse lineup that has something for everyone.

The best platformer

One of the best shooters

One of the best sports games

The best Party Game

One of the best puzzle games

Now that can be broken down even more into games that people find as worthwhile experiences.

Also there's games that scare away the ummmm ones that "aren't sure of themselves" let's call it? Chicken Little is a fun Ratchet and Clank clone that uses the Wiimote to aim and Adam West is just the icing baby. Lots of gamers were afraid of playing it so they never had the chance. The ones that were smart enough had fun with it.

There's something for everyone on the Wii lineup, no one in their right mind can look at the library and say they don't want to play anything.

well you said it, it has one best and one... and the rest is crap...

[QUOTE="smerlus"]

I think the key to seeing why it's called casual is to look at the attach rate of the games. the 360 is so far seen as the "hardcore" system and has a very high software attach rate. i think it's something like every 360 owner owns on average 6-7 games.

on the Wii the number is much lower and the system even ships with a game.

Jaysonguy

Attach rate is higher on the Wii even if you take out the two regions that the Wii comes packed with a game.

Someone will post the link to the results I'm sure.

http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2008/01/25/wii-attach-rate-soared-to-81-for-december

http://www.thetanooki.com/2008/01/27/wii-enjoys-81-software-attach-rate-in-december/

"The Wii may have had the lowest lifetime software attach rate of all three current-gen home consoles, but that's because Wii Sports is all the casuals need at the moment."

[QUOTE="Mike1978Smith"]

I've always considered the term "casuals" (in ralation to the Wii) to be those people who simply by the console and purchase gaems off the shelf based on the back cover text and/or title. Occasionally they will purchase a game reccomended by a friend or family member.

"Hardcores", on the other hand, are the folks who review games before purchase, surf the web for news about future games, discuss the console/games on forums, etc.

That's just always how I've seen it. Nothing to do with how many games people purchase for themselves or how many hours they dump into playing them, jsut how educated or not they are on the whole situation.

I know a guy who has more money than he knows what to do with, so he has every console and butt loads of games for each, yet he is the least informed gamer I've ever met. I would consider him casual... rich, but casual. I also know of a few guys that I would consider pretty hard core, as they could tell you just about anything when it comes to the consoles, games, etc that are out right now or are coming out this year. They can even quote specs of cosoles off the tops of their heads. These guys usually only have a few games at a time, yet I would consider them pretty hardcore. I, myself, consider myself to be some where in between.

The question is, are the majority of people buying the Wii they type that simply see the commercial on TV and buy one (casual) or are they the type that eat, sleep and breath gaming 24 hours a day (hardcore)? Everyone's playing games these days, and we can't call everyone hardcore. Thus we have to consider if they supplement their gaming with extras, like news, reviews, forum discussion, etc.

samiup

how abou cooking mamma do you play that by any chance during your hardcore gaming hours?

I'm trying really hard to see what point your question has in regards to my post.

I'm thinking you might have missed the entire point of my post. Re-read my post with the understanding that I'm not supporting one side of any argument or the other. I'm just simply stating my opinions on what hardcore and casual means.

well you said it, it has one best and one... and the rest is crap...

samiup

Again, I'm sorry if you live out of the three major regions and don't have all the game available to you.

[QUOTE="samiup"]

well you said it, it has one best and one... and the rest is crap...

Jaysonguy

Again, I'm sorry if you live out of the three major regions and don't have all the game available to you.

no i live in the US, my point is that not all of the available games are just not enough, take alook at the ratings new wii games are getting right here at game spot, the only games doing good are mario sequels or VC ports... all the other games have poor to very bad reviews... i know there are good games on the wii, unfortunatly the good one are the exception...

[QUOTE="Jaysonguy"][QUOTE="samiup"]

well you said it, it has one best and one... and the rest is crap...

samiup

Again, I'm sorry if you live out of the three major regions and don't have all the game available to you.

no i live in the US, my point is that not all of the available games are just not enough, take alook at the ratings new wii games are getting right here at game spot, the only games doing good are mario sequels or VC ports... all the other games have poor to very bad reviews... i know there are good games on the wii, unfortunatly the good one are the exception...

Oh great, I didn't know we were having that "I'm unable to think for myself I only follow reviews" talk.

So you picked up Fishing Master right? I mean it scored a 7 here and is the best link to real fishing on a console. So I expect at launch you grabbed it.

[QUOTE="Jaysonguy"][QUOTE="samiup"]

well you said it, it has one best and one... and the rest is crap...

samiup

Again, I'm sorry if you live out of the three major regions and don't have all the game available to you.

no i live in the US, my point is that not all of the available games are just not enough, take alook at the ratings new wii games are getting right here at game spot, the only games doing good are mario sequels or VC ports... all the other games have poor to very bad reviews... i know there are good games on the wii, unfortunatly the good one are the exception...

LOL! You listen to a review site that accepts bribes? You just lost all credibility now. By the way, you really love to argue with Jasonguy don't you? I see you guys arguing in a lot of topics nowadays.

[QUOTE="samiup"][QUOTE="Jaysonguy"][QUOTE="samiup"]

well you said it, it has one best and one... and the rest is crap...

Jaysonguy

Again, I'm sorry if you live out of the three major regions and don't have all the game available to you.

no i live in the US, my point is that not all of the available games are just not enough, take alook at the ratings new wii games are getting right here at game spot, the only games doing good are mario sequels or VC ports... all the other games have poor to very bad reviews... i know there are good games on the wii, unfortunatly the good one are the exception...

Oh great, I didn't know we were having that "I'm unable to think for myself I only follow reviews" talk.

So you picked up Fishing Master right? I mean it scored a 7 here and is the best link to real fishing on a console. So I expect at launch you grabbed it.

He only got it if you fish for zombie bass with dynamite and a 9mm in a FPS/Horror survival style.

I do agree that gamers are buying the wii not just kiddies but there sure are a lot of kiddy games and Im not just saying that. I mean all these crappy shovel ware are meant for kids. Also I think some parents would stand in line for a wii around the holidays, just because everyone wants one. Even though older people do play it I think there like 1% lol cause I really cant see granny's buying wii's for themselves.

But yeah I agree that gamers are buying it. I mean look at this forum there is proof enough.