A plan to impeach Obama

This topic is locked from further discussion.

Avatar image for -Sun_Tzu-
-Sun_Tzu-

17384

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#351 -Sun_Tzu-
Member since 2007 • 17384 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]Well..... He is a libertarian....... Aljosa23

That's what confuses me. You'd think he would be for everyone having rights instead of just those who are able to "conceptualize" it. smh

You haven't read Benjamin Tucker, have you?
Avatar image for nocoolnamejim
nocoolnamejim

15136

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 22

User Lists: 0

#352 nocoolnamejim
Member since 2003 • 15136 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]Well..... He is a libertarian....... Aljosa23

That's what confuses me. You'd think he would be for everyone having rights instead of just those who are able to "conceptualize" it. smh

Serious for a moment... I actually DO think that libertarianism COULD exist as a coherent governing philosophy. The general theme of "the government that governs best governs least" isn't entirely unreasonable intellectually. But the issue is that where the "least" part is drawn has been entirely coopted by really silly individuals.
Avatar image for deactivated-5b78379493e12
deactivated-5b78379493e12

15625

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 12

User Lists: 0

#353 deactivated-5b78379493e12
Member since 2005 • 15625 Posts

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]Well..... He is a libertarian....... Aljosa23

That's what confuses me. You'd think he would be for everyone having rights instead of just those who are able to "conceptualize" it. smh

There is also the point of having an extremely strange and provactive belief just to get attention for it. You know, like Glenn Beck, Alex Jones, Rush Limbaugh etc...

Avatar image for coolbeans90
coolbeans90

21305

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#354 coolbeans90
Member since 2009 • 21305 Posts

I like Laihendi's little game. No one aside from him agrees and/or comprehends his notions of rights, and consequently he is the only person that has them.

Avatar image for deactivated-5b1e62582e305
deactivated-5b1e62582e305

30778

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#355 deactivated-5b1e62582e305
Member since 2004 • 30778 Posts

[QUOTE="Aljosa23"]

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]Well..... He is a libertarian....... -Sun_Tzu-

That's what confuses me. You'd think he would be for everyone having rights instead of just those who are able to "conceptualize" it. smh

You haven't read Benjamin Tucker, have you?

Nope. I've read very little about political philosophy besides the old masters.

Avatar image for Teenaged
Teenaged

31764

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#356 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

Elijah Wood for president of the US!

Avatar image for PannicAtack
PannicAtack

21040

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#357 PannicAtack
Member since 2006 • 21040 Posts

Elijah Wood for president of the US!

Teenaged
Is this related to the Lord of the Rings thing or is there something else I'm missing?
Avatar image for -Sun_Tzu-
-Sun_Tzu-

17384

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#358 -Sun_Tzu-
Member since 2007 • 17384 Posts
[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

Elijah Wood for president of the US!

PannicAtack
Is this related to the Lord of the Rings thing or is there something else I'm missing?

Laihendi is Elijah Wood's 2016 campaign manager.
Avatar image for Abbeten
Abbeten

3140

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#359 Abbeten
Member since 2012 • 3140 Posts
My ethical principles are rational, therefore any ethical principles that contradict my own are irrational.Laihendi
can we please revisit this quote because it is my favorite ever
Avatar image for dave123321
dave123321

35554

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#360 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35554 Posts
[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

Elijah Wood for president of the US!

PannicAtack
Is this related to the Lord of the Rings thing or is there something else I'm missing?

Lai is in love with him
Avatar image for deactivated-5b78379493e12
deactivated-5b78379493e12

15625

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 12

User Lists: 0

#361 deactivated-5b78379493e12
Member since 2005 • 15625 Posts

[QUOTE="Laihendi"]My ethical principles are rational, therefore any ethical principles that contradict my own are irrational.Abbeten
can we please revisit this quote because it is my favorite ever

OTcars 2013.

Avatar image for nocoolnamejim
nocoolnamejim

15136

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 22

User Lists: 0

#362 nocoolnamejim
Member since 2003 • 15136 Posts
[QUOTE="Laihendi"]My ethical principles are rational, therefore any ethical principles that contradict my own are irrational.Abbeten
can we please revisit this quote because it is my favorite ever

I notice that you lack a sig. Must be so embarrassing for you.
Avatar image for dave123321
dave123321

35554

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#363 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35554 Posts
[QUOTE="PannicAtack"][QUOTE="Teenaged"]

Elijah Wood for president of the US!

dave123321
Is this related to the Lord of the Rings thing or is there something else I'm missing?

Lai is in love with him

http://laihendi.tumblr.com/#
Avatar image for CycleOfViolence
CycleOfViolence

2813

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#364 CycleOfViolence
Member since 2011 • 2813 Posts

[QUOTE="Aljosa23"]

[QUOTE="DroidPhysX"]Well..... He is a libertarian....... nocoolnamejim

That's what confuses me. You'd think he would be for everyone having rights instead of just those who are able to "conceptualize" it. smh

Serious for a moment... I actually DO think that libertarianism COULD exist as a coherent governing philosophy. The general theme of "the government that governs best governs least" isn't entirely unreasonable intellectually. But the issue is that where the "least" part is drawn has been entirely coopted by really silly individuals.

I do too. The tenets of the ideology often get muddied when people start talking about how their shouldn't be seat belt laws and things of that nature.

Avatar image for Blood-Scribe
Blood-Scribe

6465

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#365 Blood-Scribe
Member since 2007 • 6465 Posts
[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

Elijah Wood for president of the US!

PannicAtack
Is this related to the Lord of the Rings thing or is there something else I'm missing?

Lai is trying to get Elijah Wood to run for the 2016 presidential election. [QUOTE="Laihendi"] Anyways I have reserved tumblr and twitter url's for the movement to draft him into running, but considering how far off the election is I am not going to be active with them for a while. Maybe I will start this summer.

Avatar image for CycleOfViolence
CycleOfViolence

2813

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#367 CycleOfViolence
Member since 2011 • 2813 Posts

It appears to be an unhealthy obsession, borderline creepy.

No, scratch that, it actually is creepy.

Avatar image for PannicAtack
PannicAtack

21040

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#368 PannicAtack
Member since 2006 • 21040 Posts

Lai is trying to get Elijah Wood to run for the 2016 presidential election.Blood-Scribe
Is this a joke?

Avatar image for nocoolnamejim
nocoolnamejim

15136

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 22

User Lists: 0

#369 nocoolnamejim
Member since 2003 • 15136 Posts

[QUOTE="Blood-Scribe"] Lai is trying to get Elijah Wood to run for the 2016 presidential election.PannicAtack

Is this a joke?

God I hope not.
Avatar image for dave123321
dave123321

35554

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#370 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35554 Posts
[QUOTE="PannicAtack"]

[QUOTE="Blood-Scribe"] Lai is trying to get Elijah Wood to run for the 2016 presidential election.nocoolnamejim

Is this a joke?

God I hope not.

Avatar image for Blood-Scribe
Blood-Scribe

6465

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#371 Blood-Scribe
Member since 2007 • 6465 Posts

[QUOTE="Blood-Scribe"] Lai is trying to get Elijah Wood to run for the 2016 presidential election.PannicAtack

Is this a joke?

 Probably not.
Avatar image for coolbeans90
coolbeans90

21305

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#372 coolbeans90
Member since 2009 • 21305 Posts

[QUOTE="Laihendi"]My ethical principles are rational, therefore any ethical principles that contradict my own are irrational.Abbeten
can we please revisit this quote because it is my favorite ever

BAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH

Avatar image for deactivated-5b78379493e12
deactivated-5b78379493e12

15625

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 12

User Lists: 0

#373 deactivated-5b78379493e12
Member since 2005 • 15625 Posts

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"]

[QUOTE="Blood-Scribe"] Lai is trying to get Elijah Wood to run for the 2016 presidential election.Blood-Scribe

Is this a joke?

 Probably not.

Charrrrrr.....

Avatar image for Ace6301
Ace6301

21389

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#374 Ace6301
Member since 2005 • 21389 Posts

Charrrrrr.....

jimkabrhel
Shhh no spoilers.
Avatar image for Necrifer
Necrifer

10629

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#375 Necrifer
Member since 2010 • 10629 Posts
[spoiler]

[/spoiler]

Avatar image for dave123321
dave123321

35554

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#376 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35554 Posts
[spoiler]

[/spoiler]

Necrifer
[spoiler]

[/spoiler]

Avatar image for Ace6301
Ace6301

21389

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#377 Ace6301
Member since 2005 • 21389 Posts
Har har.
Avatar image for MrPraline
MrPraline

21351

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#378 MrPraline
Member since 2008 • 21351 Posts
Shhh no spoilers.
Avatar image for nocoolnamejim
nocoolnamejim

15136

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 22

User Lists: 0

#379 nocoolnamejim
Member since 2003 • 15136 Posts
Shhh no spoilers.MrPraline
They actually aren't opening for me anyway. :(
Avatar image for MrPraline
MrPraline

21351

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#380 MrPraline
Member since 2008 • 21351 Posts
[QUOTE="dave123321"][QUOTE="Necrifer"]
[spoiler]

[/spoiler]

Necrifer
[QUOTE="MrPraline"]Shhh no spoilers.nocoolnamejim
They actually aren't opening for me anyway. :(

Quick quote spoiled them for me and they are indeed empty ;{
Avatar image for MrPraline
MrPraline

21351

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#381 MrPraline
Member since 2008 • 21351 Posts
well that went well
Avatar image for dave123321
dave123321

35554

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#382 dave123321
Member since 2003 • 35554 Posts
[QUOTE="MrPraline"]Shhh no spoilers.nocoolnamejim
They actually aren't opening for me anyway. :(

lol
Avatar image for whipassmt
whipassmt

15375

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 24

User Lists: 0

#383 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

[QUOTE="Ace6301"][QUOTE="coolbeans90"]

Speaking of hobbits, why the fvck didn't the elves and wizards make their own more powerful rings?

coolbeans90

Sauron was basically an Angel come to earth just like Gandalf and the other wizards. Unlike them though he kept his full power and was already a master craftsmen in Middle-earth heaven. As such the rings he made were the most powerful possible.

So, during the interim period where he lost the ring, none of the Elves/Wizards ever thought "oh, maybe we should learn to make these rings sometimes over the next few thousand years."

What exactly do you mean by 'he kept his full power?' iirc, sauron was less power than morogoth.

They wouldn't have been able to make their rings as powerful as the one Ring because they were less powerful than Sauron. And Sauron was originally less powerful than Morgoth but Morgoth dissipated his power trying to subdue the matter of Arda and eventually made himself weaker than Sauron.

Avatar image for whipassmt
whipassmt

15375

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 24

User Lists: 0

#384 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

Yo, Layhenny, how come you haven't responded to the PM I sent you on Daves' place, yet?

Avatar image for Laihendi
Laihendi

5872

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#385 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts

Yo, Layhenny, how come you haven't responded to the PM I sent you on Daves' place, yet?

whipassmt
I don't go there often. I did just now though.
Avatar image for Laihendi
Laihendi

5872

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#386 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts

why is ability to conceptualize rights a necessary prerequisite to having them?Abbeten
Because rights are not relevant to someone/something that is incapable of even conceiving what it means to have rights. A tree cannot and will not ever be capable of understanding what it means to have rights, therefore a tree has no rights and it is not morally objectionable to cut one down and use it for whatever you will. It has no right to life. The same can be said for most animals. That is why it is not morally objectionable to swat a fly, use sheep for wool, etc.

[QUOTE="Laihendi"]If this is so basic then it should not be difficult to explain. Which lifeforms are entitled to rights, and why? For those that are not entitled to rights - again, why?Aljosa23

It was just explained: whatever the Constitution, Bill of Rights or whatever document guarantees rights or other concepts similar to that says so, that's how it is. That's all there is to it.

In terms of your other question, animal rights DO exists. TheAnimal Enterprise Terrorism Act was strictly designed to protect animals and other lifeforms under it from humans hoping to endanger their well-being.


So you believe rights come from the government? That rights didn't exist before someone wrote them down in the constitution? If you really believe that then you don't believe in rights at all, you just believe in privileges granted by the government.
Avatar image for chrisrooR
chrisrooR

9027

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

#387 chrisrooR
Member since 2007 • 9027 Posts
[QUOTE="Abbeten"]why is ability to conceptualize rights a necessary prerequisite to having them?Laihendi
Because rights are not relevant to someone/something that is incapable of even conceiving what it means to have rights. A tree cannot and will not ever be capable of understanding what it means to have rights, therefore a tree has no rights and it is not morally objectionable to cut one down and use it for whatever you will. It has no right to life. The same can be said for most animals. That is why it is not morally objectionable to swat a fly, use sheep for wool, etc.

So people badly brain damaged who aren't able to conceptualize rights don't have any? Get real.
Avatar image for Laihendi
Laihendi

5872

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#388 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts

[QUOTE="Laihendi"][QUOTE="Abbeten"]why is ability to conceptualize rights a necessary prerequisite to having them?chrisrooR
Because rights are not relevant to someone/something that is incapable of even conceiving what it means to have rights. A tree cannot and will not ever be capable of understanding what it means to have rights, therefore a tree has no rights and it is not morally objectionable to cut one down and use it for whatever you will. It has no right to life. The same can be said for most animals. That is why it is not morally objectionable to swat a fly, use sheep for wool, etc.

So people badly brain damaged who aren't able to conceptualize rights don't have any? Get real.

Please provide an actual refutation of what I have just said. Please explain who/what has rights, and why.

Please explain how I am wrong.

Avatar image for Laihendi
Laihendi

5872

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#389 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts

I like Laihendi's little game. No one aside from him agrees and/or comprehends his notions of rights, and consequently he is the only person that has them.

coolbeans90
My position on rights is one of the basic principles of Objectivism, so you are wrong.
Avatar image for Ace6301
Ace6301

21389

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#390 Ace6301
Member since 2005 • 21389 Posts
So you believe rights come from the government? That rights didn't exist before someone wrote them down in the constitution? If you really believe that then you don't believe in rights at all, you just believe in privileges granted by the government.Laihendi
If no one is going to enforce those "rights" they don't exist. If you and I are starving on a desert island and you say to me "I have the right to not be eaten because I can conceptualize those rights" I'm going to laugh and then eat you. Rights come from a figure of authority. Whether that figure is society, government or a God figure. They require some backing to actually exist in a tangible way.
Avatar image for Yusuke420
Yusuke420

2770

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#391 Yusuke420
Member since 2012 • 2770 Posts

[QUOTE="Laihendi"]So you believe rights come from the government? That rights didn't exist before someone wrote them down in the constitution? If you really believe that then you don't believe in rights at all, you just believe in privileges granted by the government.Ace6301
If no one is going to enforce those "rights" they don't exist. If you and I are starving on a desert island and you say to me "I have the right to not be eaten because I can conceptualize those rights" I'm going to laugh and then eat you. Rights come from a figure of authority. Whether that figure is society, government or a God figure. They require some backing to actually exist in a tangible way.

Game.Set.Match to Ace:lol:

Avatar image for hartsickdiscipl
hartsickdiscipl

14787

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 10

User Lists: 0

#392 hartsickdiscipl
Member since 2003 • 14787 Posts

[QUOTE="whipassmt"]there are a decent number of Americans who would want Obama removed.Allicrombie
The South hasn't been relevant since the Civil War.

Is that why so many people are evacuating NY and CA and moving to TX?

Avatar image for Laihendi
Laihendi

5872

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#393 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts
[QUOTE="Laihendi"]So you believe rights come from the government? That rights didn't exist before someone wrote them down in the constitution? If you really believe that then you don't believe in rights at all, you just believe in privileges granted by the government.Ace6301
If no one is going to enforce those "rights" they don't exist. If you and I are starving on a desert island and you say to me "I have the right to not be eaten because I can conceptualize those rights" I'm going to laugh and then eat you. Rights come from a figure of authority. Whether that figure is society, government or a God figure. They require some backing to actually exist in a tangible way.

I have a right to live, therefore you do not have a right to murder me. If you murder me that doesn't mean I didn't have a right to live, that just means that you are a criminal thug who violated my right to live.
Avatar image for Laihendi
Laihendi

5872

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#394 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts

[QUOTE="Ace6301"][QUOTE="Laihendi"]So you believe rights come from the government? That rights didn't exist before someone wrote them down in the constitution? If you really believe that then you don't believe in rights at all, you just believe in privileges granted by the government.Yusuke420

If no one is going to enforce those "rights" they don't exist. If you and I are starving on a desert island and you say to me "I have the right to not be eaten because I can conceptualize those rights" I'm going to laugh and then eat you. Rights come from a figure of authority. Whether that figure is society, government or a God figure. They require some backing to actually exist in a tangible way.

Game.Set.Match to Ace:lol:

You should consider joining a cheer leading team.

And it's disturbing for someone to be so eager to to have it "proved" that rights don't exist. Do you want to live in a slave society? That is the impression I get from your posts.

Avatar image for Ilovegames1992
Ilovegames1992

14221

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 0

#396 Ilovegames1992
Member since 2010 • 14221 Posts

Every president after Grover Cleveland should have been impeached for some reason or another. The issue is, what the hell makes you think his replacement would be any better?famicommander

Possibly one of the best names in existence.

Avatar image for Ace6301
Ace6301

21389

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#397 Ace6301
Member since 2005 • 21389 Posts
[QUOTE="Ace6301"][QUOTE="Laihendi"]So you believe rights come from the government? That rights didn't exist before someone wrote them down in the constitution? If you really believe that then you don't believe in rights at all, you just believe in privileges granted by the government.Laihendi
If no one is going to enforce those "rights" they don't exist. If you and I are starving on a desert island and you say to me "I have the right to not be eaten because I can conceptualize those rights" I'm going to laugh and then eat you. Rights come from a figure of authority. Whether that figure is society, government or a God figure. They require some backing to actually exist in a tangible way.

I have a right to live, therefore you do not have a right to murder me. If you murder me that doesn't mean I didn't have a right to live, that just means that you are a criminal thug who violated my right to live.

Whose to say I'm a criminal thug? No one is around. No authority presides over me in this scenario. There's two people in this situation. One who claims the right to life and the other is hungry and doesn't care. Now the only other person to judge me is in my stomach. If you can prove the existence of an almighty being who can see what I've done and judge me then fine, you can claim you have a right. If you're killed in this scenario that means you had no right as, I, the only other human there did not recognize it.
Avatar image for Planeforger
Planeforger

20121

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#398 Planeforger
Member since 2004 • 20121 Posts

My position on rights is one of the basic principles of Objectivism, so you are wrong.Laihendi

Cute. If there was any obviously correct conception of rights, then rights theorists would have all agreed it centuries ago and thus wouldn't continue to be debating it today.

I have a right to live, therefore you do not have a right to murder me. If you murder me that doesn't mean I didn't have a right to live, that just means that you are a criminal thug who violated my right to live.Laihendi

Meanwhile, you seem to be saying that children and people wth mental disorders can't conceptualise their rights to life, and thus you can freely kill them. Is that correct?

*edit* Hell, you also seem to be saying that people who disagree with your conception of the right to life do not enjoy a right to life.

Because rights are not relevant to someone/something that is incapable of even conceiving what it means to have rights. A tree cannot and will not ever be capable of understanding what it means to have rights, therefore a tree has no rights and it is not morally objectionable to cut one down and use it for whatever you will. It has no right to life. The same can be said for most animals. That is why it is not morally objectionable to swat a fly, use sheep for wool, etc.Laihendi

Some questions:

- How do you define 'conceiving of rights'? What's the threshold upon which you suddenly have that right? Do the uneducated or the stupid not have rights? Do people with slightly different conceptions of those rights not enjoy their protection? Do people educated in philosophy, political science and the law have stronger rights than others, since they would theoretically understand rights far better than anyone else?

- Do you have to be constantly coceiving of those rights to be shielded by them? Do sleeping people have rights?

- Are we allowed to conceive of any rights that we like, or is there a set free-standing list somewhere, which we automatically fall under as soon as we recognise the truth of it? If there is a free-standing list, what are they, and how can we possibly all agree on them?

- If we have to conceive of these rights in order to enliven them, do they simply not exist until people have first thought them up? If so, how are they not different from privileges, since they don't exist independently or apply to all humans?

- How can we possibly found a legal system upon concepts of rights that don't come into existence until people think of them, and which don't seem to have an agreed-upon list?

- Also, what distinguishes your rights from a mere set of personal moral principles, if no authority is ever going to adopt or enforce your conception of rights? You can argue the universal truth of them all you want, but that won't have any affect on the real world.

Avatar image for worlock77
worlock77

22552

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#399 worlock77
Member since 2009 • 22552 Posts
[QUOTE="Ace6301"][QUOTE="Laihendi"]So you believe rights come from the government? That rights didn't exist before someone wrote them down in the constitution? If you really believe that then you don't believe in rights at all, you just believe in privileges granted by the government.Laihendi
If no one is going to enforce those "rights" they don't exist. If you and I are starving on a desert island and you say to me "I have the right to not be eaten because I can conceptualize those rights" I'm going to laugh and then eat you. Rights come from a figure of authority. Whether that figure is society, government or a God figure. They require some backing to actually exist in a tangible way.

I have a right to live, therefore you do not have a right to murder me. If you murder me that doesn't mean I didn't have a right to live, that just means that you are a criminal thug who violated my right to live.

The point is rights only exist so long as someone (be it yourself or someone acting on your behalf) is willing/able to enforce them.
Avatar image for Laihendi
Laihendi

5872

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#400 Laihendi
Member since 2009 • 5872 Posts
[QUOTE="Ace6301"][QUOTE="Laihendi"][QUOTE="Ace6301"] If no one is going to enforce those "rights" they don't exist. If you and I are starving on a desert island and you say to me "I have the right to not be eaten because I can conceptualize those rights" I'm going to laugh and then eat you. Rights come from a figure of authority. Whether that figure is society, government or a God figure. They require some backing to actually exist in a tangible way.

I have a right to live, therefore you do not have a right to murder me. If you murder me that doesn't mean I didn't have a right to live, that just means that you are a criminal thug who violated my right to live.

Whose to say I'm a criminal thug? No one is around. No authority presides over me in this scenario. There's two people in this situation. One who claims the right to life and the other is hungry and doesn't care. Now the only other person to judge me is in my stomach. If you can prove the existence of an almighty being who can see what I've done and judge me then fine, you can claim you have a right. If you're killed in this scenario that means you had no right as, I, the only other human there did not recognize it.

I have a right to live, because I am alive, I want to be alive, and me being alive does not harm anyone. If you kill me then you violated my right to live and you are a murderer. It doesn't matter what you call yourself, what the government calls you, what the world calls you, or what nobody calls you because you are the last human alive. You are still a murderer, a criminal, and a thug.