America's treatment of Native Americans, genocide or no?

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

So if Hitler's policies only managed to kill a few hundred thousand Jews rather than millions those policies wouldn't have been genocidal?

worlock77

Really? I couldn't make the point any clearer. The topic is genocide. Was the US's treatment of the Native Americans genocide? That is the question. I contend that it was. You, evidently, think otherwise because the policies enacted weren't effective enough. So for comparison's sake I use the best known example of genocide in history, and I ask the question: would the Nazi's policies agaist the Jews not have been genocide if they were less effective?

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]

[QUOTE="MissLibrarian"] The Treaty of Echota can be most likened to the Wannsee Conference imo. It was a 'final solution':genocide.

MissLibrarian

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Not sure how what a failed policy to kill American bison has to do with Hitler and the Jews. Grasping at straws there wanting to believe something I suppose.

KC_Hokie

Really? I couldn't make the point any clearer. The topic is genocide. Was the US's treatment of the Native Americans genocide? That is the question. I contend that it was. You, evidently, think otherwise because the policies enacted weren't effective enough. So for comparison's sake I use the best known example of genocide in history, and I ask the question: would the Nazi's policies agaist the Jews not have been genocide if they were less effective?

Genocide is the intentional targeting of one ethnic group. I really don't think that it matters how effective it is because the effort is still there. I beleive that in the early 1800s it could be called genocide, but once they were put on reservations it couldn't be, because obviously the goal of the US governmnet was no longer to kill them.

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="worlock77"]

Really? I couldn't make the point any clearer. The topic is genocide. Was the US's treatment of the Native Americans genocide? That is the question. I contend that it was. You, evidently, think otherwise because the policies enacted weren't effective enough. So for comparison's sake I use the best known example of genocide in history, and I ask the question: would the Nazi's policies agaist the Jews not have been genocide if they were less effective?

Tokugawa77

Genocide is the intentional targeting of one ethnic group. I really don't think that it matters how effective it is because the effort is still there. I beleive that in the early 1800s it could be called genocide, but once they were put on reservations it couldn't be, because obviously the goal of the US governmnet was no longer to kill them.

That treaty you mentioned only effected one tribe. And the Cherokee were a divided tribe with a history of brutal warfare.KC_Hokie

No. 90+% of the Native American population was wiped out by disease.

And it's not like Native Americans were peaceful, hippie-like creatures. They killed each other off for thousands of years before the 'white man' arrived. They hated each other so much they couldn't unify again the white man. The few times they tried they ended up fighting internally or their enemies allied against them with the whites.

Tribal society and disease were far more deteromential than the white man.

KC_Hokie

[QUOTE="Tokugawa77"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]What exactly was genocide? Disease that killed 90%+? Or the countless wars the Native Americans fought in and lost? Getting displaced is what happens if you're lucky to survive after that many defeats.LJS9502_basic

Genocide is the intentional targeting of one ethnic group. I really don't think that it matters how effective it is because the effort is still there. I beleive that in the early 1800s it could be called genocide, but once they were put on reservations it couldn't be, because obviously the goal of the US governmnet was no longer to kill them.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Tokugawa77"]

Genocide is the intentional targeting of one ethnic group. I really don't think that it matters how effective it is because the effort is still there. I beleive that in the early 1800s it could be called genocide, but once they were put on reservations it couldn't be, because obviously the goal of the US governmnet was no longer to kill them.

dsmccracken

[QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Was that ever the goal? Can you cite that particular legislation?LJS9502_basic

I gave a link about that. Seems the major reason the bison died off was not the military but capitalism.

LJS9502_basic

Actually - most of the damage to the Native Americans happened BEFORE there was an America.

Spain, France, and England are the guilty parties

Also the Africans who were not slaves, and there were many, used to chop off the heads of Native American children, and sell their scalps. So you can blame Africans as well.

Actually - most of the damage to the Native Americans happened BEFORE there was an America.

Spain, France, and England are the guilty parties

Also the Africans who were not slaves, and there were many, used to chop off the heads of Native American children, and sell their scalps. So you can blame Africans as well.

Born_Lucky

You mean the central and south American populations were. The natives in north America were very much untouched until the US came knocking

I believe it was a type of genocide

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Not sure how what a failed policy to kill American bison has to do with Hitler and the Jews. Grasping at straws there wanting to believe something I suppose.

KC_Hokie

Really? I couldn't make the point any clearer. The topic is genocide. Was the US's treatment of the Native Americans genocide? That is the question. I contend that it was. You, evidently, think otherwise because the policies enacted weren't effective enough. So for comparison's sake I use the best known example of genocide in history, and I ask the question: would the Nazi's policies agaist the Jews not have been genocide if they were less effective?

According to the definition of genocide the Americans did commit it.

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]Not sure how what a failed policy to kill American bison has to do with Hitler and the Jews. Grasping at straws there wanting to believe something I suppose.

KC_Hokie

Really? I couldn't make the point any clearer. The topic is genocide. Was the US's treatment of the Native Americans genocide? That is the question. I contend that it was. You, evidently, think otherwise because the policies enacted weren't effective enough. So for comparison's sake I use the best known example of genocide in history, and I ask the question: would the Nazi's policies agaist the Jews not have been genocide if they were less effective?