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God, the people in this thread make me ashamed to be human...karriston

Its religion, youre supposed to simply have faith. And there is nothing wrong with it just like there is nothing wrong with only believing in what you can see and what can be proven.

Blind faith is the basis of religion and there is nothing wrong with it.

mrbojangles25

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"][QUOTE="Honenheim"]You know in your heart what is true, don't surround yourself in needless frustrations, you are who you are and what you know. You love and you care, that is enough to live your life to the fullest by the power of this universe that was created by the celestial father and that is ruled by absolute LOVE.Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="hillelslovak"][QUOTE="4seal"]

Really? like what?

How would you even know there is as much proof as any other religion? have you stuided other religions? Or are you just making stuff up?

4seal

The bible copied stuff from the torah and added extra stuff.

Thanks for not answering anything, nothing you say will be taken seriously at this point. Good night. P.S....The Quran copied alot from the Bible and perverted it.

The bible copied from the torah. Like literally, the first 46 books.

soo, if I write Bob was born in betlehem, to a virgin etc etc, does that make Bob the next messiah? And people will belive me and give me money so that I can say more things about Bob?

hmmm...

brb writing a book

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="Lansdowne5"]Would it be better to let a child live and be brought up in a rebellious household, no doubt coming to disobey and dishonour the Lord, or finitely punish the parents and give the children eternal life? Remember, God is the judge. Is it the judge's fault the criminal is punished, or the criminal's?Lansdowne5

soo, if I write Bob was born in betlehem, to a virgin etc etc, does that make Bob the next messiah? And people will belive me and give me money so that I can say more things about Bob?

hmmm...

brb writing a book

Enosh88

No, thats just a ripped off idea. Be original, and you would to prove this.

Becasue its not. I am a Christian, and I am sick and tired of hearing it on this forum. It's complete garbage. I beleive in Jesus, not because I'm afraid theres a hell and ill go there if I dont beleive in him. I beleive in Jesus, that he died for my sins on the cross, because it is true...4seal

You know, if you want to prove that you don't blindly believe in your religion, you shouldn't contradict the entire purpose of your topic before you even finish the first paragraph...

[QUOTE="karriston"]God, the people in this thread make me ashamed to be human...Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"][QUOTE="karriston"]God, the people in this thread make me ashamed to be human...karriston

To say said back-slapping is childish is subjective, and assumes everyone is as the same state of conciousness and on the same page in a book with too many pages to number.

To say "For Gods Sake", may hold tremendous meaning with you, while sitting meaningless in front of my own eyes. The great unsolvable question for some may be religion based, for others it may be a question of what they find to hold meaning within themselves.

To command one to "grow the hell up" is to force upon lessons that may or may not effect one in the same way they have affected you, and therefore may or may not severely hinder ones ability to learn from said lessons, and sufficiently "grow the hell up".

       Isn't the bible a great freaking idea? I mean, you write a few stories, say some stuff will happen that was most likely obvious in the time you were living in (example: the end of oil in a few years right now), create a few miracles, pen a few heroes and villains, lay out a few sins, basic and not applicable to today's society and: BAM! You have 2 Billion scared humans believing in some stories that promise something after death, an absurd notion of which only the most desperate of people could choose to believe in.

      I mean, think about it, do you believe in Santa Claus flying to chimneys on Christmas Eve? Delivering presents made by his labor force of elves? Why not? Isn't it the same as believing in a mystical creature that lives in the heavens, dictating our present and future lives, creating miracles and punishing people becasue of their "sins"? What is different? Don't say "proof", like the bible is any proof. Anyone could have written that. It's as much proof as the Tolkien books are of a mystical land of elves and demons. So what's so different? Have you had any first had experience with god? No, you haven't. You may think you have, as in, the "he is always in your life" crap but you have never seen any proof of god.

      Religion is based on faith. The hope that despite your common sense and basic knowledge, you will willingly believe in a story about a big man in the sky in order to calm your fear of death. People are willing to believe anything when they are scared, and sadly, that includes religion.

The Bible has been lost, translated from dead languages, interpreted in soooo many ways, and altered so many times, its so damn hard to take it seriously. How do I know the religion is not true? The prevelance of evolution basically being fact, and umm....Ive seen TBN and John Hagee. I believe that's more than enough proof for a rational human being to discern true from false.hillelslovak

Good lord.

Hebrew and Greek are hardly dead languages.

Evolution has nothing to do with religion.

TBN and John Hagee are not our leaders or representatives.

IMO, this topic and the other religion threads are going to transform OT into the biggest flame war ever made. More so than /b/tards vs. furries.

Oh man, I feel like a nerd knowing that flame war that destroyed YouTube and /b/ even existed..

You've got no reason to believe other than your willingness to believe. dracula_16

And how do you know this?

[QUOTE="dracula_16"]You've got no reason to believe other than your willingness to believe. Theokhoth

And how do you know this?

Why do I keep hearing that my belief in a giant pink turtle is based on blind faith? your answer would be similar to mine. No different.

Becasue its not. I am a Christian, and I am sick and tired of hearing it on this forum. It's complete garbage. I beleive in Jesus, not because I'm afraid theres a hell and ill go there if I dont beleive in him. I beleive in Jesus, that he died for my sins on the cross, because it is true. I beleive Jesus is the son of God, becuase Jesus fullfilled over 300PROPHECIES and did not miss a single one. These phrophecies where for the son of God, and could have only been fulfilled by the son of God, Jesus Christ. Some of these prophecies include, his birth place, the time of it, the manner of it. His death, the fact that his side would be pierced and not a bone would be broken. Which can be found here

Psalm 34:20 "He keeps all his bones, Not one of them is broken."

Zechariah 12:10 "And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn."

Jesus perdicted the fall of Jerusalem in Luke 19:43-44, "The days will come upon you when your enemies will build an embankment against you and encircle you in on every side. They will dash you to the ground, you and the children within your walls. They will not leave one stone on another, because you did not recognize the time of God's coming to you." Deuteronomy 28:64 prophesies "Then the Lord will scatter you among the nations from one end of the earth to the other." Jesus again predicts in Luke 21:24, "They will fall by the sword and will be taken prisoners to all the nations. Jerusalem will be trampled on by the Gentiles, until the time of the Gentiles is fulfilled."

The Bible also predicts the fall of the city of Tyre.

in the 26th chapter of Ezekiel (592-570 BC) seven things are predicted to happen to the city of Tyre:

1) Nebuchadnezzar will destroy the mainland of Tyre (Ezekiel 26:8).

2) Many nations against Tyre (Ezekiel 26:3).

3) Make her a bare rock; flat like the top of a rock (Ezekiel 26:4).

4) Fishermen will spread their nets over the site (Ezekiel 26:5).

5) Throw the debris into the water (Ezekiel 26:12).

6) Never be rebuilt (Ezekiel 26:14).

7) Never be found again (Ezekiel 26:21) (2/285)

Nebuchadnezzar laid siege to mainland Tyre three years after the prophecy and after a 13 year siege (585-573 BC) Tyre made terms and acknowledged Babylonian authority over them (4 xxii.452) When Nebuchadnezzar broke the gates down, he found the city almost empty. The majority of the people had moved by ship to an island about 1/2 miles off the coast and fortified a city there. The mainland city was destroyed in 573 BC, as predicted. The city of Tyre on the island remained a powerful city for several hundred years. (2/286)

So do not tell me my faith is based on nothing. I challange you to read these things for your self, you dont even need to have a Bible, you can find a free internet Bible, just google it. I also challange you to prove the Jesus did not complete all theseprophecies, because if he did complete them all, then he must be who he said he was, which is the Son of God. And there for you would be wise to beleive in him as your Lord and Savior. I am getting sick and tired of being treated like an idiot because I am a Christian. I am not saying everyone does it, becuase they dont, but there are some that do. And so if its wrong, show me. If Jesus did not predict the fall of Jerusalem. Please, prove everything I have said here wrong if you can.

Because I don't want to be a Christian if its wrong. Theres alot of people on here who seem to think I believe what I beleive because I cant handle the "reality" that we all came from a big bang billions of years ago. And thats not true. I beleive what I beleive, becasue I have found it to be the truth. I know Jesus is real, and that he loves me, that he died for my sins, he paid my price, and through him I am saved. Do you think its easy to be a Christian? Its not, so if its wrong, show me. Make my life easier, please.

4seal

In modern Bibles they use the word "World" alot, especially talking about end times. Replace World with the term "Age"....2 different things.

I find it very weird how you don't see how many prophets that "existed", at least in idea, before the time of Jesus Christ. With nearly identical qualities. It is almost impossible to even believe there was a Jesus Christ with his only references being the Bible and one eccentric historian. So many historians lived during the time of jesus and did not write about him it seems very weird. You would think someone that fullfilled "prophecy" and miracles would be written about alot. The life of jesus is a timeline for the life of the sun. Its a metaphor. Think hard about the symbolism in pictures and in words. For instance, Communion once a month is used to celebrate women's fertility. Water into wine is a metaphor for the sun cycles and its relation with the female fertility. There are a great many other, most notably the story of Jesus's death and resurrection.

The whole Bible is like this. It is pretty much ye old almanac, and it is not hard to believe how the predictions were made - considering the Mayans predicted future events in much the same manner. The whole concept of God is a metaphysical representation of the idea of evolution. As time progresses through the bible, you get to see that evolution very vividly as well. Everything that happens, and things that God say are strives towards being more perfect. For instance, You wish to constantly do good and grow and follow Bible law so that you can get to a more perfect place. If you don't follow some of these laws then society may regress....devolution, something not valued by God. Remember, the Bible was basicaly used as a form of law when it was first made. It was very efficient. Almanac, Lawbook, prophecy, and most noticeably nowadays....blind order. Sadly, the last peice of the Bible is the only thing people seem to stick to today.

This isn't to say that there isn't a metaphysical side to things....and everything is so cut and dry, physically 2D...as atheist will have you believe. They simply have lost touch with themselves. It is your job to understand how to not take things in too much and not too less. Atheist suffer from the latter, and Christians like to suffer from the first. Understand everything you need to pay attention to in the Bible, and how to do so.....but do not just rule out everything the bible has to say, everything metaphysical, just because you can't accept the false definition of God as some big guy that made us all and everything. You will find peace in moderation.

[QUOTE="dracula_16"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

And how do you know this?

Theokhoth

Why do I keep hearing that my belief in a giant pink turtle is based on blind faith? your answer would be similar to mine. No different.

Not really, and I'm kinda tired of the faulty comparisons. But when all you have is insults and faulty arguments to back on, I guess I can see why you new atheists love to jump to unicorns and crap rather than logic to back up your insecurity.

If you're in his head and know what he believes and why, then we could use you in more court cases. Face it: the fact that people believe differently than you is not proof that he has no reason to believe it.

I just thought I'd have some fun with a question that was dead before it was even asked. Sorry that I offended you. I am such a monster.

[QUOTE="DarkPrinceXC"][QUOTE="Lansdowne5"] Children aren't judged. It's a basic principle of the Old Testament that they know neither right or wrong in terms of Sin.Lansdowne5

Slightly misunderstood. Sin means trangression of the law. Transgression means to step beyond bounds. Pushing boundaries isn't necessarily a bad thing...in fact it is required for evolution. Before Adam and Eve ate from the tree of knowledge they were blind to judgements. Both good and bad judgements. Sinning isn'tsomething that is necessarily bad. After eating from the tree they were able to push boundaries in a bad way, but they were able to push boundaries for the sake of being more perfect as well. It is an illustration of how we have the ability of free will to either regress or progress. The funny thing is, if every action you choose involves progression....is that free will?

Would it be better to let a child live and be brought up in a rebellious household, no doubt coming to disobey and dishonour the LordYou

Would it be better to let a child live and be brought up in a rebellious household, no doubt coming to disobey and dishonour the LordYou

so, every child that dies would've been a (greater than usual) sinner?

Would it be better to let a child live and be brought up in a rebellious household, no doubt coming to disobey and dishonour the LordYou

so, every child that dies would've been a (greater than usual) sinner?

Children are not "greater than usual", the difference is that they're not wilfully doing it. Lansdowne5

[QUOTE="-eddy-"][QUOTE="4seal"]

 

 

1. Really?, I dont understand how david blaine can predict what card someone will pick and thats "amazing". But when Jesus predicts the rise and fall of nations, this is regarded for nothing. Of course it counts. It is impossible for Jesus to have fulfilled all that was said (and on top of that predict the rise and fall of nations)  unless he was who he said he was, the Son of God.

 

2. Jesus said his words would never pass away, this means that he knew what was to be written would be his words, and that they would be correct, and would not pass away (duh). And I see no reason not to believe what he said because he was right about everything he said. Show me something he said wrong? Not to mention, if you take into account that Jesus is the Son of God, and the men who wrote the gospels had the holy spirit (as do all Christians) would God allow them to mess it up? what kind of God would that be? he comes and dies for everyones sins (thats a big thing) and then lets people give a wrong account on what happened? I dont think so.

4seal

 They where knowen, go take a look at when the books where written, they where written waayyyy before Christ. It was not secret, infact, John the Baptist was preaching that Christ was coming soon (which was also predicted) . Everyone was waiting for him to come, its no secret, they knew what was said about him.

Again, your evidence that they knew he was coming, is in the bible. It was written after all that happened, so it's still not exactly very convincing, seems more like "well now it's happened, and alos, we knew it would all happen, honest"

[QUOTE="Lansdowne5"] Children are not "greater than usual", the difference is that they're not wilfully doing it. Hewkii

well looks like god missed the day Stalin was born :P

Well, there are two real important things to remember about what God says about "faith."

1. The Bible says, "It is IMPOSSIBLE to please God without faith." Hebrew 11:6

2. Jesus says, "Blessed are those who have not seen and yet still believe." John 20:29

Those are the only two versus you really need to tell someone when they say Christian faith or belief in God is "blind."

Also in Hebrews 11:6, it says, "Anyone who comes to God MUST BELIEVE THAT HE EXISTS and that He rewards those who earnestly seek Him."

There's a saying I heard many times where someone says, "Show me God and then I'll believe." And a pastor would answer, "Believe, and then God will show you."

Well, there are two real important things to remember about what God says about "faith."

1. The Bible says, "It is IMPOSSIBLE to please God without faith." Hebrew 11:6

2. Jesus says, "Blind are those who have not seen and yet still believe." John 20:29

Those are the only two versus you really need to tell someone when they say Christian faith or belief in God is "blind."ASK_Story

Fixed?

o___O

[QUOTE="ASK_Story"]Well, there are two real important things to remember about what God says about "faith."

1. The Bible says, "It is IMPOSSIBLE to please God without faith." Hebrew 11:6

2. Jesus says, "Stupid are those who have not seen and yet still believe." John 20:29

Those are the only two versus you really need to tell someone when they say Christian faith or belief in God is "blind."luke1889

Fixed?

o___O

I'm sorry you would do that. This is what Jesus Himself said not me. 

Just keep in mind this verse:

"Every word of God is flawless; DO NOT add to His words or He will rebuke you and prove you a liar." Proverbs 30:5-6

Why would a person die for somebody else's sins? That doesn't make sense to me, So Jesus died for your sins, does that mean that even if you commit sins they'll be forgiven just because he died for them? Anyway your grammar is atrocious, no wonder normal people don't take religious people seriously, because they are considered intellectually inferior

Anyway those weird prophecies or whatever don't make your 'Book' any more true, according to you those prophecies were fulfilled by events happening a dozen years after they were made all of which happened what, 2000 years ago? I don't think history records were very accurate then so I wouldn't trust them, anyway if you want to put a strain on your 'beliefs' why don't you go on youtube and search 'autopsy' (you'll need an account to watch those videos) and you'll realize that people are nothing more than just biological machines, sad really but humans are quite a superficial entity if you think about it... Everything you see and everything you imagine are all created by the brain, all your feelings and pain and dreams and tears all made by a motherboard coated by a strong and rigid calcic structure (better known as the skull). All lives are worthless if you took a non-subjective point of view (such as that of a rock :) but because people have only one, it is considered very precious, but what is the point in living in the first place as everything pleasurable and amusing and so on that you experience in life are in fact artificial and generated by the mind according to what it believes should be pleasurable (which is genetically determined), so really if they was a 'creator' he wouldn't 'think' on a human level, probably didn't even create us purposely

[QUOTE="_Tobli_"]

1. Self fulfilling prophesies should not be regarded as solid evidence for anything.

2. It's just a book written by humans, and it is not verified by outside sources. Which is a bit suspect.

 

4seal

1. Really?, I dont understand how david blaine can predict what card someone will pick and thats "amazing". But when Jesus predicts the rise and fall of nations, this is regarded for nothing. Of course it counts. It is impossible for Jesus to have fulfilled all that was said (and on top of that predict the rise and fall of nations)  unless he was who he said he was, the Son of God.

2. Jesus said his words would never pass away, this means that he knew what was to be written would be his words, and that they would be correct, and would not pass away (duh). And I see no reason not to believe what he said because he was right about everything he said. Show me something he said wrong? Not to mention, if you take into account that Jesus is the Son of God, and the men who wrote the gospels had the holy spirit (as do all Christians) would God allow them to mess it up? what kind of God would that be? he comes and dies for everyones sins (thats a big thing) and then lets people give a wrong account on what happened? I dont think so.