[QUOTE="greenprince"][QUOTE="gameguy6700"][QUOTE="greenprince"][QUOTE="gameguy6700"][QUOTE="battlefront23"][QUOTE="gameguy6700"][QUOTE="Mythbuster4ever"][QUOTE="gameguy6700"][QUOTE="Mythbuster4ever"][QUOTE="KillaHalo2o9"]I'm not and I'm proud.gameguy6700
ZOMG ME TOOO YAY
Sciencce wont help you.
During 9-11, noo= one prayed to science.
Judging by the death figures from 9/11 I think its safe to say that religion won't help you either.
*cough*
I have a really bad cough, and nothings helping. And soad burns. Its getting anonying. And check out that pic I just posted.
What am I looking at? Looks like a piece of cloth on top of a cross...I don't see what it has to do with any of this.
I guess you're blind also...
If this picture is supposed to show a cross saving a church or something then shut up. 2,500+ people died on 9/11, most of whom were Christian. That cross probably saved, what, 10 people max? You don't think the people trapped on the planes that were flown into the pentagon and towers prayed? Or that people trapped on the upper floors of the WTC prayed to god to save them from the fire the same way that he saved some Jews in that bible story whose name I can't remember. And speaking of Jews, God's chosen people, why didn't God do anything to save them from the holocaust? Get it now? A fraction of a fraction of Christians get saved by a freak coincidence and attribute that to god, yet when most of them die just like expected its suddenly all part of "God's plan". Here's a good way to put it: If you get sick with a curable type of cancer, who are you going to turn to? Medical science or religion?
There was a huge explosion that engulfed several floors of the tower at once. Did God miraculously sustain the tower for an additional 30 minutes to allow people to escape? Given these circumstances, it seems likely that God miraculously intervened to limit the death toll in the attack on the World Trade Center towers. The third airliner crashed into the Pentagon. However, the side of the building hit was under renovation, limiting the loss of life. If the terrorists had crashed directly into the Pentagon from the original direction of flight (the plane had passed the Pentagon and made a 270 degree turn prior to impact), the loss of life would have been ten times greater. Was God involved in this?
The fourth airliner did not even reach its intended destination (probably the Capitol Building in Washington D.C.). Although God did not bring down this airliner directly, His people were involved in thwarting the attempt at mass destruction. Todd Beamer, a graduate of Wheaton College, a dedicated Christian who taught Sunday School, led a charge against the hijackers who had commandeered flight 93, resulting in the plane crashing into an unpopulated field outside of Pittsburgh. As it turned out, the plane crashed just 2 miles from an elementary school. Was God involved in steering the airliner away from the school?
It seems to me that you're focusing on the negative aspects of 9/11. I do not blame you but that type of perspective is bias at-most. It seems to me that you forgot that God granted freewill to all individuals and that includes Hitler and the Nazis, therefore they are the ones responsible for such atrocities not God. Another thing, religion and science are not exclusive therefore I choose both.
Or God could have made all the hijackers suffer from a heart attack instead or something else like that. That way the bad men still die and no casuality numbers in the thousands. Plus we avoid two wars in the middle east.
But hey, since you're so good at treating coincidence as divine intervention, what were some examples of God using damage control during the holocaust? Or the crusades? Or the Oklahoma City Bombing (he saved a bunch of grade schoolers from death according to your story so obviously he would have saved the daycare that was located in the...oh wait, no he didn't. Those kids died or got seriously maimed).
But then he would interfere with their free will of what they want to do wouldn't it? Another, thing you must consider is that they weren't truly evil. The terrorists truly believe they were doing the right thing but were brainwashed or influence to believe it just. If they weren't fully influence by bad role models,and raised normally, odds are they would reconsider their evil actions. I agree that there is a lot of evil in the world. In fact, there is too much evil in the world from what would be expected from chaos theory or the laws of physics.Look at all the evil perpetuated in the last century alone - 6 million Jews killed by Hitler 40 million Russians killed by Stalin, 2 million Cambodians killed by their own government in the 1970's. In fact, the Pol Pot regime specifically preached atheism and sought to exterminate all religious expression in Cambodia. In addition to these atrocities, there have been hundreds of massacres committed in virtually every nation of the world. The Bible says that the presence of evil is due to the spiritual component of our nature - something that animals do not possess.
God endowed His spiritual creatures (humans and angels) with free will to love God or to oppose Him. The most powerful created being (the angel Satan) rebelled and led one third of the angels into opposition against God. Those humans who oppose or ignore God follow Satan into rebellion - either consciously or unconsciously. Some people blame the evil on "society." However, society is composed of individuals who make individual choices. Most of the evil is committed by people who oppose the will of society. In contrast, there are many examples of societies in the animal kingdom, especially among the primates. None of these societies have the capacity for evil that we have. We are different from all other animals on our planet - a fact that has no scientific or evolutionary explanation.
Again, you are looking at the negative aspects of the situation which clouds your judgement. There is a reason why we have choices, and how are choices whether good or bad has a outcome or consequence. Instead of blaming God for mankind's problems, you should consider that mankind started these problems. God is there for support, he is all powerful and it is foretold in the future of Christian belief that he will cleanse the world of sin and malice. And the punishthe wicked. Until then all we could do is make the world as moral as it can possibly be.
I thought you would say that. Might I redirect you to your previous post:
Although God did not bring down this airliner directly, His people were involved in thwarting the attempt at mass destruction. Todd Beamer, a graduate of Wheaton College, a dedicated Christian who taught Sunday School, led a charge against the hijackers who had commandeered flight 93, resulting in the plane crashing into an unpopulated field outside of Pittsburgh.greenprince
So which is it? Does God interfere with free will or not? Because causing someone to have a heart attack requires much less interference in their free will (in fact it requires none) than making someone decide to board a plane in order to put them in a position to stop terrorists.
I'll go ahead and answer that question for you: yes, god interferes with free will. Remember in exodus when Moses is trying to get the Pharaoh to free the slaves? The bible explicitly states multiple times that God forced the pharoh to not let the slaves go (he "hardened his heart") just so God could kill off every first born male in Egypt to make a point.
What are you talking about? causing a person heat attacks before they commit to an act or board the plane as you claimed interferes with their decision or free will of doing so. God did not stop the hijackers it states that his followers did. You are confusing my words, sorry if you found my words confusing and mixed.God did not force the Pharoh to have a hardened hear as you clamied. But according to 1 Samuel 6:6, God didn't harden the Pharaoh's heart; the Pharaoh did it himself .
An excellent explanation is available that account for the Exodus declarations, each perfectly plausible and sufficient to Both explanations pertain to the fact that every language has its own way of using certain types of words and phrases that might appear odd to a person not familiar with the language. For instance, suppose a person commented that his boss became angry and bit his head off."Would anyone think that the speaker actually had his head bitten off? English-speaking people understand this example of figurative speech.In the same way, the biblical languages had idioms, colloquialisms, Semitisms, and word usages peculiar to them, which those familiar with the language would understand.
With that in mind, list of idiomatic verbs deals with active verbs that were used by the Hebrews to express, not the doing of the thing, but the permission,So in all the passages which speak of the hardening of Pharaoh's heart. As is clear from the common use of the same Idiom in the following passages. He then listed Jeremiah 4:10, Lord God, surely thou hast greatly deceived this people': i.e., thou hast suffered this People to be greatly deceived, by the false prophet. Ezekiel 14:9 is also given as an example of this type of usage: If the prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the Lord have deceived that prophet: i.e. I have permitted him to deceive himself. in a lengthy section on biblical idioms, that in Hebrew active verbs can express permission and not direct action. This explanation unquestionably clarifies the question of God hardening Pharaoh's heart. When the text says that God hardened Pharaoh's heart, it means that God would permit or allow Pharaoh's heart to be hardened.
I can see why you can get the worng message but the wirting and interpetion of the Bible is so mixed and diverse that you can get that problem.
I'm really sorry but I can not contiune this conversation. If you want to continue it please pm or add me in your friend list but it is 12am where I live (Canada) and I must sleep.
Log in to comment