Calling Atheism a religion is like calling bald a hair color.

A religion is "a social institution that includes a set of common beliefs and practices generally helnd by a group of people often codified as rayer, ritual and religious law."
I love that quote too, and how atheism fits that definition as well.jts31689

QFT

You said: "so if a group believes the same...it's a religion". Or it could be reowrded as "If a group shares a belief, they are a religion."

I share the belief with millions that Queen is great band. Does that mean that I am part of a Queen religion?

I share the belief with millions that video games are enjoyable. Does that mean I am part of a video game religion?

I share the belief with millions that blue is the greatest color. Does that mean I am part of a blue religion?

I share the belief with many that the Playstation 3 is a good thing to have. Does that mean I am part of a Playstation 3 religion?

I share the belief with many that David Gemmell is one of the greatest modern fantasy authors. Does that mean I am part of aDavid Gemmell religion?

I share the belief with many that classic rock is the best subgenre of rock. Does that mean I am a part of classic rock religion?

I share the belief with millions that Paul McCartney and the Wings are a terrible band. Does that mean I am part of a Paul McCartney and the Wings are terrible religion?

The answer to all the questions is: no. I am not part of any of these religions. And to my knowledge, these religions don't even exist. But accoring to your definition, I am part of these religions. The point is: your definition is incorrect.

ShuLordLiuPei

Nope.....it's not my definition. And liking something is not the same as religion....which seems to be your entire argument.

I like The Cure.

I like the color blue.

I like videogames.

I like to have all the consoles so I can play any and all games that I want.

I like the Shannara series by Terry Brooks.

I dislike classic rock and like alternative.

Now if your going to have strong beliefs...and find others that do...it would qualify as "religion" in the sense that's it's a shared belief. But there is a difference between liking and going overboard into beliefs.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="MrGeezer"]

Does not compute. "Religion" is not a religion.

MrGeezer

I left it open for your choice...

Well then I'm sure you don't need me to explain to you how Christianity (for example)encompasses a set of beliefs.

Because you can't?

[QUOTE="Happyphilter"]

No it's one. Ill use the color example again. I believe that Blue is the best color ever, but I also believe that red is not as good as blue. Thats not a system.

By yuo saying athiests believe god doesnt exisit its implied they no not think god created the universe, and it is also implied they do not go to church and do not take communion. You are telling us what isn't rather than what is, so what do they believe in?

Christianity is a religion. All Chrisitans have a set of beliefs, but within that set are sub-sets of beliefs. If this subject is beyond you I insist that you stop before you embarass yourself.(anymore)

LJS9502_basic

What are the shared set of beliefs. God is one. Jesus is God...therefore, that is still one. Continue....

Thats not one, infact the denominations have different views on Jesus, but to save your head from exploding I will not go there.

Chrisitians believe in the Father(God) Son(Jesus) and the Holy spirit, that there is an afterlife and that you will be judged when you die. Jesus is the way to heaven. That God has created everything, that jesus died for our sins. The 10 commandments, the 7 deadly sins. In forgivness for thoes who repent.

Don't make me go on.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

:lol::roll: I didn't make up the definitions of religions. Perhaps you might avail yourself of more than one source. That is a false analogy. Shared set of beliefs. Atheists do believe in a shared set. God does not exist. The universe came about due to the natural laws of science. Man was not created by God but evolved. Pagans and Hindus don't come close to sharing the same beliefs...atheists, however, do.

ShuLordLiuPei

Atheism is as much as a religion as Theism (the belief) is a religion.

Atrus is incorrect though. Since they have specific gods in mind...they cannot share a belief.

:lol::roll: I didn't make up the definitions of religions. Perhaps you might avail yourself of more than one source. That is a false analogy. Shared set of beliefs. Atheists do believe in a shared set. God does not exist. The universe came about due to the natural laws of science. Man was not created by God but evolved. Pagans and Hindus don't come close to sharing the same beliefs...atheists, however, do.

LJS9502_basic

The bolded has nothing to do with Atheism, that is merely your own assumptions pressed onto the definition. You also shamefully avoided addressing why Christians, Hindus and Pagans shouldn't be considered of the same religion of Theism when you consider Atheism to be specific enough to be deemed one.

You also shamefully avoided addressing why Atheists aren't deemed to be a religion by the state in lieu of religions exemptions and benefits.

As I've said before, religions have to meet certain criterion to qualify as a religion. Creed, Code and Cult. The state tends to require even more than this, but Atheism itself doesn't even meet that.

Atrus is incorrect though. Since they have specific gods in mind...they cannot share a belief.

LJS9502_basic

So why do you place Realians, Atheistic Buddhists, Spiritual Animists, and Secular Ideologues as one religion?

On a lighter note, I think this vid rocks

http://www.sickanimation.com/cd/
some bad language for those who are too young

Nope.....it's not my definition. And liking something is not the same as religion....which seems to be your entire argument.

I like The Cure.

I like the color blue.

I like videogames.

I like to have all the consoles so I can play any and all games that I want.

I like the Shannara series by Terry Brooks.

I dislike classic rock and like alternative.

Now if your going to have strong beliefs...and find others that do...it would qualify as "religion" in the sense that's it's a shared belief. But there is a difference between liking and going overboard into beliefs.

LJS9502_basic

I just love that quote :D

"Calling Atheism a religion is like calling bald a hair color." Don Hirschberg

Jelle87

Me too. I agree with that 1000%!

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Happyphilter"]

No it's one. Ill use the color example again. I believe that Blue is the best color ever, but I also believe that red is not as good as blue. Thats not a system.

By yuo saying athiests believe god doesnt exisit its implied they no not think god created the universe, and it is also implied they do not go to church and do not take communion. You are telling us what isn't rather than what is, so what do they believe in?

Christianity is a religion. All Chrisitans have a set of beliefs, but within that set are sub-sets of beliefs. If this subject is beyond you I insist that you stop before you embarass yourself.(anymore)

Happyphilter

What are the shared set of beliefs. God is one. Jesus is God...therefore, that is still one. Continue....

Thats not one, infact the denominations have different views on Jesus, but to save your head from exploding I will not go there.

Chrisitians believe in the Father(God) Son(Jesus) and the Holy spirit, that there is an afterlife and that you will be judged when you die. Jesus is the way to heaven. That God has created everything, that jesus died for our sins. The 10 commandments, the 7 deadly sins. In forgivness for thoes who repent.

Don't make me go on.

Yes...but the three are ONE God....so it's one belief. Afterlife is being with God....still...one belief. Jesus is God...still one. Yes God...still one. Word of the same God....still one. Basically, it's the belief in God. One belief.

Atheists believe God doesn't exist. Atheists believe the world was created by natural means. Atheists believe science answers all the questions vis a vis this creation. Atheists believe man evolved.

That's not one belief atheists share in common.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

:lol::roll: I didn't make up the definitions of religions. Perhaps you might avail yourself of more than one source. That is a false analogy. Shared set of beliefs. Atheists do believe in a shared set. God does not exist. The universe came about due to the natural laws of science. Man was not created by God but evolved. Pagans and Hindus don't come close to sharing the same beliefs...atheists, however, do.

Atrus

The bolded has nothing to do with Atheism, that is merely your own assumptions pressed onto the definition.

A religion is "a social institution that includes a set of common beliefs and practices generally helnd by a group of people often codified as rayer, ritual and religious law."
I love that quote too, and how atheism fits that definition as well.jts31689

but athiesm is not an institution, or related to institutionalism.

A religion is "a social institution that includes a set of common beliefs and practices generally helnd by a group of people often codified as rayer, ritual and religious law."
I love that quote too, and how atheism fits that definition as well.jts31689

It is not about if I like itor if I dislike it. It's that others agree with me. Meaning weshare a common belief of liking or disliking. According to your post, the simple fact that we share a common belief (of liking or disliking) qualifies us as a religion.ShuLordLiuPei

No...you share a common taste in various categories. If it gets to the belief level...and with others...you have made it a religion.

You like arguing semantics....why can't you see the difference between liking something in common...and making it a belief. Nonetheless, I posted a definition from Merriam Webster dictionary. "a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to wlith ardor and faith."

So if you have excessive ardor and faith in your "likes"...it's become a religion.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

:lol::roll: I didn't make up the definitions of religions. Perhaps you might avail yourself of more than one source. That is a false analogy. Shared set of beliefs. Atheists do believe in a shared set. God does not exist. The universe came about due to the natural laws of science. Man was not created by God but evolved. Pagans and Hindus don't come close to sharing the same beliefs...atheists, however, do.

Atrus

The bolded has nothing to do with Atheism, that is merely your own assumptions pressed onto the definition. You also shamefully avoided addressing why Christians, Hindus and Pagans shouldn't be considered of the same religion of Theism when you consider Atheism to be specific enough to be deemed one.

You also shamefully avoided addressing why Atheists aren't deemed to be a religion by the state in lieu of religions exemptions and benefits.

As I've said before, religions have to meet certain criterion to qualify as a religion. Creed, Code and Cult. The state tends to require even more than this, but Atheism itself doesn't even meet that.

Atheists believe God doesn't exist. Atheists believe the world was created by natural means. Atheists believe science answers all the questions vis a vis this creation. Atheists believe man evolved.

That's not one belief atheists share in common.

LJS9502_basic

I agree. He might as well be saying evolution is an atheistic principle.ShuLordLiuPei

It has so become.....or haven't you been paying attention to the religion arguments.? I've seen some incorrect interpretations of evolutionby atheists forcing their beliefs.

[QUOTE="Happyphilter"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Happyphilter"]

No it's one. Ill use the color example again. I believe that Blue is the best color ever, but I also believe that red is not as good as blue. Thats not a system.

By yuo saying athiests believe god doesnt exisit its implied they no not think god created the universe, and it is also implied they do not go to church and do not take communion. You are telling us what isn't rather than what is, so what do they believe in?

Christianity is a religion. All Chrisitans have a set of beliefs, but within that set are sub-sets of beliefs. If this subject is beyond you I insist that you stop before you embarass yourself.(anymore)

LJS9502_basic

What are the shared set of beliefs. God is one. Jesus is God...therefore, that is still one. Continue....

Thats not one, infact the denominations have different views on Jesus, but to save your head from exploding I will not go there.

Chrisitians believe in the Father(God) Son(Jesus) and the Holy spirit, that there is an afterlife and that you will be judged when you die. Jesus is the way to heaven. That God has created everything, that jesus died for our sins. The 10 commandments, the 7 deadly sins. In forgivness for thoes who repent.

Don't make me go on.

Yes...but the three are ONE God....so it's one belief. Afterlife is being with God....still...one belief. Jesus is God...still one. Yes God...still one. Word of the same God....still one. Basically, it's the belief in God. One belief.

Atheists believe God doesn't exist. Atheists believe the world was created by natural means. Atheists believe science answers all the questions vis a vis this creation. Atheists believe man evolved.

That's not one belief atheists share in common.

lol they are all about God, yes, and you forgot the other things I had listed. there are many more as well... such as rituals and practices.

You see, although there are many single beliefs, they all form a BELIEF SYSTEM. There is no system to athiesm.

Atheists believe God doesn't exist. Atheists believe the world was created by natural means. Atheists believe science answers all the questions vis a vis this creation. Atheists believe man evolved.

That's not one belief atheists share in common.

LJS9502_basic

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Atheism

Do you actually believe this or what?
quiglythegreat

Well.... I do believe some (not all) have made atheism a religion....yes. But you can break down atheism with some definitions of religion and it fits. Couple that with some individuals getting defensive about the term religion...and I've had a bit of fun tonight.

For the record though.....that is what atheists generally believe. ;)

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Atheists believe God doesn't exist. Atheists believe the world was created by natural means. Atheists believe science answers all the questions vis a vis this creation. Atheists believe man evolved.

That's not one belief atheists share in common.

EboyLOL

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Atheism

Good game man, GOOD GAME

Wrrrrrrroooooooooonnnnnnnnng. By definition, Atheism is only the disbelief in the existance of God.

EboyLOL

Not really. atheists do tend to have explanations for creation etc. I've yet to meet one that believed otherwise.

[QUOTE="ShuLordLiuPei"]

It is not about if I like itor if I dislike it. It's that others agree with me. Meaning weshare a common belief of liking or disliking. According to your post, the simple fact that we share a common belief (of liking or disliking) qualifies us as a religion.LJS9502_basic

No...you share a common taste in various categories. If it gets to the belief level...and with others...you have made it a religion.

You like arguing semantics....why can't you see the difference between liking something in common...and making it a belief. Nonetheless, I posted a definition from Merriam Webster dictionary. "a cause, principle, or system of beliefs held to wlith ardor and faith."

So if you have excessive ardor and faith in your "likes"...it's become a religion.

The definition you provided from the dictionary is much different than the one you created.

lol they are all about God, yes, and you forgot the other things I had listed. there are many more as well... such as rituals and practices.

You see, although there are many single beliefs, they all form a BELIEF SYSTEM. There is no system to athiesm.

Happyphilter

It's One BELIEF...by your definition...it can't be a belief system. I broke down what atheists believe....that is a system as well.Basically, atheists believe science explains everything. They have faith that science is correct. More than one belief....yes?

A belief is: "something believed; an opinion or conviction". I believe(it is an opinion of mine) that Queen is a great band. If others agree with me, we have a common belief. Meaning, according to your old definition, I am part of a religion with many others.

The definition you provided from the dictionary is much different than the one you created.

ShuLordLiuPei

No...it's not. I haven't created a definition.I simply said atheism fits...and it does.

[QUOTE="EboyLOL"]

Wrrrrrrroooooooooonnnnnnnnng. By definition, Atheism is only the disbelief in the existance of God.

LJS9502_basic

Not really. atheists do tend to have explanations for creation etc. I've yet to meet one that believed otherwise.

[QUOTE="ShuLordLiuPei"]

I agree. He might as well be saying evolution is an atheistic principle.LJS9502_basic

It has so become.....or haven't you been paying attention to the religion arguments.? I've seen some incorrect interpretations of evolutionby atheists forcing their beliefs.

Evolution is not an atheistic principle.

[QUOTE="Happyphilter"]

lol they are all about God, yes, and you forgot the other things I had listed. there are many more as well... such as rituals and practices.

You see, although there are many single beliefs, they all form a BELIEF SYSTEM. There is no system to athiesm.

LJS9502_basic

It's One BELIEF...by your definition...it can't be a belief system. I broke down what atheists believe....that is a system as well.Basically, atheists believe science explains everything. They have faith that science is correct. More than one belief....yes?

All athiests believe science explains everything? haha. I dont know how to tell you this, but after getting a degree in mechanical engineering I can tell you both physics and math are wrong, they literally disprove themselves. Even professors will contest to that. I know people who do not think science can explain everything, they just do not believe there is a god.

And like the good man said earlier, by definition it is only the disbelief in a god.

Again you say one belief, it is not, what I said was multiple beliefs.

There are probably millions of atheists who are indifferent to science. That does NOT mean that they believe science answers all questions.EboyLOL

Everyone has a belief in how the world was created. There are two basic ways....natural...supernatural. Do atheists believe in the supernatural?....ie a God? No. So they do believe the same in that regard.

[QUOTE="ShuLordLiuPei"] A belief is: "something believed; an opinion or conviction". I believe(it is an opinion of mine) that Queen is a great band. If others agree with me, we have a common belief. Meaning, according to your old definition, I am part of a religion with many others.

The definition you provided from the dictionary is much different than the one you created.

LJS9502_basic

No...it's not. I haven't created a definition.I simply said atheism fits...and it does.

"No... it's not" what?

Everyone has a belief in how the world was created.

LJS9502_basic

....really? News to me. Of course, you can explain why atheists beliefs regarding science are mysteriously missing from the definition of 'atheism', right?

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="ShuLordLiuPei"]

I agree. He might as well be saying evolution is an atheistic principle.ShuLordLiuPei

It has so become.....or haven't you been paying attention to the religion arguments.? I've seen some incorrect interpretations of evolutionby atheists forcing their beliefs.

Evolution is not an atheistic principle.

I didn't say it was an atheistic principle...I said it was a shared belief. Tis a bit of a difference now Shu.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Everyone has a belief in how the world was created.

EboyLOL

....really? News to me.

You know people that don't?:|

[QUOTE="EboyLOL"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Everyone has a belief in how the world was created.

LJS9502_basic

....really? News to me.

You know people that don't?:|

Last I checked there were many ideas on how things came to be that don't involve God...

Again you say one belief, it is not, what I said was multiple beliefs.

Happyphilter

And I showed you Christians have one belief. God. Checkmate.

Last I checked there were many ideas on how things came to be that don't involve God...

Happyphilter

Natural vs supernatural. I believe that is what I said. Only two ways......what is the third?

[QUOTE="ShuLordLiuPei"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="ShuLordLiuPei"]

I agree. He might as well be saying evolution is an atheistic principle.LJS9502_basic

It has so become.....or haven't you been paying attention to the religion arguments.? I've seen some incorrect interpretations of evolutionby atheists forcing their beliefs.

Evolution is not an atheistic principle.

I didn't say it was an atheistic principle...I said it was a shared belief. Tis a bit of a difference now Shu.

LJS9502_basic:"It has so become..."

[QUOTE="quiglythegreat"]Do you actually believe this or what?
LJS9502_basic

Well.... I do believe some (not all) have made atheism a religion....yes. But you can break down atheism with some definitions of religion and it fits. Couple that with some individuals getting defensive about the term religion...and I've had a bit of fun tonight.

For the record though.....that is what atheists generally believe. ;)

[QUOTE="EboyLOL"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Everyone has a belief in how the world was created.

LJS9502_basic

....really? News to me.

You know people that don't?:|

And as a matter of fact, one of my friends doesn't, as in he is indifferent to science and doesn't believe a God exists.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

Everyone has a belief in how the world was created.

EboyLOL

....really? News to me. Of course, you can explain why atheists beliefs regarding science are mysteriously missing from the definition of 'atheism', right?

When the term atheism came to be that is all it meant. However, in today's world it does mean much more. And I showed a link that wouldn't let me link that have various definitions of religion.....and it included atheism and agnosticism as religion. Which is why I said it depends on your definition. Nonetheless, atheism has become a religion to some...which I also said...and you should be able to pick out those that belong to that particular religion. Notice any atheists trying to convert? I have....some even in this thread.;)

[QUOTE="Happyphilter"]

Again you say one belief, it is not, what I said was multiple beliefs.

LJS9502_basic

And I showed you Christians have one belief. God. Checkmate.

eh...no. Christians believe:

- That Jesus is the son of God

- That God is responsible for the creation of the universe and all that other good stuff

- That there is an afterlife

- That to get into heaven one has to abide by a very large set of moral beliefs

- That those moral beliefs were ordained from God

- That the bible is the word of God

And many other beliefs. If all Christians believed was "there is a God" it wouldn't be much of a religion, much less a religion distinguishable from any other religion on Earth.

Also, the belief that the universe and everything in it arose via purely natural, non-paranormal causes is called "naturalism" which you seem to be getting confused with atheism.

Uh, GENERALLY. Would you call people who prefer mint chocolate-chip ice cream above all other foods as being part of a certain religion? It is only one belief. You can stereotype atheists as much as you want, but that doesn't mean you can expand the definition of atheism well, well beyond what it is, as you obviously have and will probably continue to do. Atheism is the lack of belief in a god. NOTHING else. Nothing else at all. You need to accept that.
quiglythegreat

Preference is not belief. Atheism has changed since the term was coined.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Happyphilter"]

Again you say one belief, it is not, what I said was multiple beliefs.

gameguy6700

And I showed you Christians have one belief. God. Checkmate.

eh...no. Christians believe:

- That Jesus is the son of God

- That God is responsible for the creation of the universe and all that other good stuff

- That there is an afterlife

- That to get into heaven one has to abide by a very large set of moral beliefs

- That those moral beliefs were ordained from God

- That the bible is the word of God

And many other beliefs. If all Christians believed was "there is a God" it wouldn't be much of a religion, much less a religion distinguishable from any other religion on Earth.

Also, the belief that the universe and everything in it arose via purely natural, non-paranormal causes is called "naturalism" which you seem to be getting confused with atheism.

*sigh* And that all equals a belief in a particular God. ONE belief. I went over that already.

I edited my last post.

And as a matter of fact, one of my friends doesn't, as in he is indifferent to science and doesn't believe a God exists.

EboyLOL

But he can still believe the world came to be one of two ways...and if he's atheist....it's one way. So he has a belief about it. He may not particularly care about it....but he's not going to believe God created the world now is he?

[QUOTE="ShuLordLiuPei"]

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Religion is a set of shared beliefs....so if a group believes the same...it's a religion.;)LJS9502_basic

Sharing beliefs within a group does not equal being in a religion with them.

Worshipping Queen can, in fact, be a religion.

But atheists don't worship the same thing. Or worship at all.

But there Atheists don't worship the same thing. Or worship at all.

The_Ish

But they have the same belief...that God/gods don't exist.

[QUOTE="gameguy6700"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Happyphilter"]

Again you say one belief, it is not, what I said was multiple beliefs.

LJS9502_basic

And I showed you Christians have one belief. God. Checkmate.

eh...no. Christians believe:

- That Jesus is the son of God

- That God is responsible for the creation of the universe and all that other good stuff

- That there is an afterlife

- That to get into heaven one has to abide by a very large set of moral beliefs

- That those moral beliefs were ordained from God

- That the bible is the word of God

And many other beliefs. If all Christians believed was "there is a God" it wouldn't be much of a religion, much less a religion distinguishable from any other religion on Earth.

Also, the belief that the universe and everything in it arose via purely natural, non-paranormal causes is called "naturalism" which you seem to be getting confused with atheism.

*sigh* And that all equals a belief in a particular God. ONE belief. I went over that already.

They are all different! It isnt "We believe in a God" Its all thoes things listed! And dare I bring up rituals? Are rituals and practices 'God' as well? What you are doing is taking everything and saying because it relates to god it is god, this isnt transitive. Stop trying to twist what people say to make yourself seem right, because by now you should know you are not.