Christianity

to persuade me to go into any religion is if god comes down here and proves to me that he is what he is. therefore there's evidence of him existing.

i dont like to be told whats right and whats wrong by a fairytale in a book.

No one that I'm aware of claims he was a priest. Jesus was not a part of the religious establishment of his day. You need to back this up with some sources.

[QUOTE="BumFluff122"]There was also cannabis, which was found in bronze age tombs in the region, magic mushrooms, the Egyptian Lotus, a checmical similar to cocaine was also found in hair samples, and ergot mold, which was found on bread. I've read that according to Matthew 27:34 before the crucifixtion Jesus was offered wine mixed with gall while Mark 15:23 says it was mixed with myrrh. Gall is suppose to have a narcotic effect to lesson the sufferign of the individual. Also Hemlock, which is mentioend numerous times in the bible, is classified as a poison/psychoactive drug.MatrixSamurai27

Once again, where are references for this? Also, lessoning the suffering of an individual has nothing to do with hallucinations. As for the hemlock, key word: POISON.

No that was not what I stated. Why I stated this is because Jesus would have been able to get these types of Narcottics easily and then give them to his followers. I don't know what would make you believe I was arguing "Jesus saw himself rise from the dead."BumFluff122

The problem is that you still need to demonstrate points 1 & 2 for this to have any relevance to the debate. Nothing you have said demonstrates that people in 1st century Israel would have been using these drugs, much less the apostles. You realize you're trying to dismiss the resurrection by arguing it was possible that the apostles were druggies? I mean, come on, you think this is actually rational?

*takes out sword and sheild* Someone quote me so I can have a debate....MgamerBD

Which side do you want to debate for?

Now, my debate with the last person has grown "repetitive" to say the least, and I think he gave an "interesting" counter-argument (interesting because in all the skeptical arguments I have read, I haven't seen anyone try to take that route). So does anyone else want to take a stab at my argument for Jesus' resurrection?

I will restate it.

There are several lines of evidence. We will discuss one for right now.

1. The 12 Apostles claimed to have seen Jesus risen from the dead.

2. Some of them suffered martydom for their faith because they didn't recant.

3. People do not die for something they know to be a lie.

4. Therefore, Jesus rose from the dead.

*Notice an important nuance in the argument. They didn't merely claim to believe he rose from the dead, but that they had seen him risen from the dead. Please don't make comparisons to people today who die for their religion who have no firsthand knowledge of its truthfulness.

**If you're going to claim they hallunicated in seeing him, you better be ready to explain how that was possible considering the circumstances.MatrixSamurai27

god told Abraham to kil his son , Abraham was going to do it ....... what can i say except somebody call Child Services

if you speak to god ( by praying) your faithful but if god speaks to you you are INSANE!!!!!

god told Abraham to kil his son , Abraham was going to do it ....... what can i say except somebody call Child Services

if you speak to god ( by praying) your faithful but if god speaks to you you are INSANE!!!!!

zappolynk

And btw, I must be insane according to your standard (not audibly but God does speak to me). :wink:mindstorm

It's when you can carry on an extended conversation with God that you might consider the asylum. :P

[QUOTE="mindstorm"]And btw, I must be insane according to your standard (not audibly but God does speak to me). :wink:GabuEx

It's when you can carry on an extended conversation with God that you might consider the asylum. :P

[QUOTE="MgamerBD"]*takes out sword and sheild* Someone quote me so I can have a debate....MatrixSamurai27

Which side do you want to debate for?

Now, my debate with the last person has grown "repetitive" to say the least, and I think he gave an "interesting" counter-argument (interesting because in all the skeptical arguments I have read, I haven't seen anyone try to take that route). So does anyone else want to take a stab at my argument for Jesus' resurrection?

I will restate it.

[QUOTE="MatrixSamurai27"] There are several lines of evidence. We will discuss one for right now.

1. The 12 Apostles claimed to have seen Jesus risen from the dead.

2. Some of them suffered martydom for their faith because they didn't recant.

3. People do not die for something they know to be a lie.

4. Therefore, Jesus rose from the dead.

*Notice an important nuance in the argument. They didn't merely claim to believe he rose from the dead, but that they had seen him risen from the dead. Please don't make comparisons to people today who die for their religion who have no firsthand knowledge of its truthfulness.

**If you're going to claim they hallunicated in seeing him, you better be ready to explain how that was possible considering the circumstances.

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="mindstorm"]And btw, I must be insane according to your standard (not audibly but God does speak to me). :wink:mindstorm

It's when you can carry on an extended conversation with God that you might consider the asylum. :P

[QUOTE="GabuEx"]

[QUOTE="mindstorm"]And btw, I must be insane according to your standard (not audibly but God does speak to me). :wink:mindstorm

It's when you can carry on an extended conversation with God that you might consider the asylum. :P

"Mindstorm, this is God."

"Oh hey God, what's up?"

"You know that orphanage down the street?"

"Yeah."

"You should blow it up, it's possessed by Satan. Tell no one. They're all out to get you now."

Maybe you could tell us some of the convos you have with him. Is it lik e"Hey buddy how was yoru day today? Oh it was great! I went on Gamespot today! I spoke with GabuEx. He's a wonderful man."

BumFluff122

Examples might be me coming to realize just how holy God is... followed by me in a 30 minute prayer/praise, being told to do a specific task for someone, or knowing without a doubt what it is I should do in a specific situation. I suppose you could try to argue that I'm insane, overtaken by emotions, etc. but it has never lead me wrongly, and I only hear him when I'm in right standing with God (aka, I've recently repented of my sins, in an attitude of prayer, etc.).

[QUOTE="BumFluff122"]Maybe you could tell us some of the convos you have with him. Is it lik e"Hey buddy how was yoru day today? Oh it was great! I went on Gamespot today! I spoke with GabuEx. He's a wonderful man."

mindstorm

Examples might be me coming to realize just how holy God is... followed by me in a 30 minute prayer/praise, being told to do a specific task for someone, or knowing without a doubt what it is I should do in a specific situation. I suppose you could try to argue that I'm insane, overtaken by emotions, etc. but it has never lead me wrongly, and I only hear him when I'm in right standing with God (aka, I've recently repented of my sins, in an attitude of prayer, etc.).

Typically it's more of a revelation of some type. I'm not talking about being able to tell the future or anything, but more of a realization or being told to do something by a voice that can't be heard. I'm not completely sure how to explain what I'm talking about as I can't make sense of it myself. o.0

Examples might be me coming to realize just how holy God is... followed by me in a 30 minute prayer/praise, being told to do a specific task for someone, or knowing without a doubt what it is I should do in a specific situation. I suppose you could try to argue that I'm insane, overtaken by emotions, etc. but it has never lead me wrongly, and I only hear him when I'm in right standing with God (aka, I've recently repented of my sins, in an attitude of prayer, etc.).\

mindstorm

Well, as long as this revelation doesn't come in the form of "everyone's out to get you, you must kill them first", then I think you're good. :P

"Mindstorm, this is God."

"Oh hey God, what's up?"

"You know that orphanage down the street?"

"Yeah."

"You should blow it up, it's possessed by Satan. Tell no one. They're all out to get you now."

GabuEx

"Mindstorm, this is God."

"Oh, hey. I'm doing good right?

"No, you haven't called your friend yet who is going through hard times have you?"

"No I haven't... I'll get to it sometime."

"Well here is a nudge." *friend calls mindstorm*

"Oh hey, I was just thinking about you... etc. ...How is everything?.... etc."

I don't thinhk you're insane. Your probably more sane than me. *goes off to tie his roommates panties in a bandana so he can summon the great goddess of the moon to destroy the broccilli his roommate bought that is in the fridge*

BumFluff122

I can't say I've had one quite like that. Typically it's more of an...

"Mindstorm, this is God."

"Oh, hey. I'm doing good right?

"No, you haven't called your friend yet who is going through hard times have you?"

"No I haven't... I'll get to it sometime."

"Well here is a nudge." *friend calls mindstorm*

"Oh hey, I was just thinking about you... etc. ...How is everything?.... etc."

mindstorm

I've had times like that on occasion... although usually I'm never quite sure whether it wasn't just a coincidence. There was one time that I honestly just can't explain it as anything else, though, although I'm sure many here could do so. :P

[QUOTE="BumFluff122"]I don't thinhk you're insane. Your probably more sane than me. *goes off to tie his roommates panties in a bandana so he can summon the great goddess of the moon to destroy the broccilli his roommate bought that is in the fridge*

mindstorm

[QUOTE="mindstorm"]

I can't say I've had one quite like that. Typically it's more of an...

"Mindstorm, this is God."

"Oh, hey. I'm doing good right?

"No, you haven't called your friend yet who is going through hard times have you?"

"No I haven't... I'll get to it sometime."

"Well here is a nudge." *friend calls mindstorm*

"Oh hey, I was just thinking about you... etc. ...How is everything?.... etc."

GabuEx

I've had times like that on occasion... although usually I'm never quite sure whether it wasn't just a coincidence. There was one time that I honestly just can't explain it as anything else, though, although I'm sure many here could do so. :P

I suppose it could be a coincidence, but it seems to happen too often for it to be that. I find that the more I actually listen and do, the more I'm told.mindstorm

Of course, one could argue that that could just be your brain feeding back into itself when you let it.

But there's no fun in that interpretation. ;)

[QUOTE="mindstorm"]I suppose it could be a coincidence, but it seems to happen too often for it to be that. I find that the more I actually listen and do, the more I'm told.GabuEx

Of course, one could argue that that could just be your brain feeding back into itself when you let it.

But there's no fun in that interpretation. ;)

I agree. "God inspired me" simply sounds cooler and is more authoritative. :shock: :Pmindstorm

Exactly, now you've got it. :P