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Space is infinite. The universe is not. the universe has a starting point as to when it began its expansion, and seeing as it's continuing to expand, it's not at infinity just yet. But it's really, really large.jman1553So you believe that an infinite quantity is contained without a finite volume. Go on... :roll:
[QUOTE="gamerguru100"]
What say you?
I'm indifferent since we can't know for sure.
Its been proved that the universe is expanding, as this is the case it cannot be infinite, just very large.
This is untrue... it could be infinite, expanding, and have been infinitely expanding for an infinite duration. Due to the Cosmological Event Horizon, we can't know. It's a conceptual kick in the balls, but expansion/contraction doesn't contradict infinite extent.To infinity and beyond!
But I'm not really sure what the answer would be. It could be, but maybe it isn't.
[QUOTE="jman1553"]Space is infinite. The universe is not. the universe has a starting point as to when it began its expansion, and seeing as it's continuing to expand, it's not at infinity just yet. But it's really, really large.Frame_DraggerSo you believe that an infinite quantity is contained without a finite volume. Go on... :roll: Please elaborate. Your post didn't make much sense to me. But if I did read your post correctly, I think you got my point wrong.
No, there's a border out there somewhere. Eventually, it will collapse back in on itself, and the cycle begins anew.JustPlainLucasThat's not what I heard from science lately. The new premise is that matter will continue to expand away from each other so that one day, there won't be enough matter to form new stars and everything will just burn out. That seems depressing to me, but I'm just saying what I've heard from someone that follows the scientific community and I trust as a source.
There is a new telescope being put into space in the semi-near future that will be able to see much farther and answer more questions than any current telescope can. The present day telescopes can only see a finite distance away (I believe) so with a more powerful telescope, hopefully we can see even further away. I will wait until then to decide if I think the Universe is indeed infinite. taylor888Whats interesting is that we're not seeing those things in real time but from thousands of years in the past since most of those other stars and galaxies are light years away.
[QUOTE="taylor888"]There is a new telescope being put into space in the semi-near future that will be able to see much farther and answer more questions than any current telescope can. The present day telescopes can only see a finite distance away (I believe) so with a more powerful telescope, hopefully we can see even further away. I will wait until then to decide if I think the Universe is indeed infinite. katana_duoWhats interesting is that we're not seeing those things in real time but from thousands of years in the past since most of those other stars and galaxies are light years away. All of them, except Sol, actually :P
[QUOTE="katana_duo"][QUOTE="taylor888"]There is a new telescope being put into space in the semi-near future that will be able to see much farther and answer more questions than any current telescope can. The present day telescopes can only see a finite distance away (I believe) so with a more powerful telescope, hopefully we can see even further away. I will wait until then to decide if I think the Universe is indeed infinite. xaosWhats interesting is that we're not seeing those things in real time but from thousands of years in the past since most of those other stars and galaxies are light years away. All of them, except Sol, actually :P Oh yeah :P
Doesn't it take around 7 minutes for the light from our sun to reach us? I suppose thats the closest thing to "real time" we have in regards to stars.jman15538 minutes is a hell of a lot better than.. say 40 lightyears :P
[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="NiKva"]It has to be finite because infinites don't exist.NiKva
An infinite amount of numbers isn't that mind blowing. Counting can be finite or infinite, numbers is what makes up infinity. Just because some smartasses could make up some theories and paradoxes doesn't mean that the universe is infinite. The universe is a large finite that expands, but is limited somewhere.NiKva
You have proof it is limited brother?
[QUOTE="NiKva"]An infinite amount of numbers isn't that mind blowing. Counting can be finite or infinite, numbers is what makes up infinity. Just because some smartasses could make up some theories and paradoxes doesn't mean that the universe is infinite. The universe is a large finite that expands, but is limited somewhere.Ilovegames1992
You have proof it is limited brother?
Do you have proof that it isn't?[QUOTE="Ilovegames1992"][QUOTE="NiKva"]An infinite amount of numbers isn't that mind blowing. Counting can be finite or infinite, numbers is what makes up infinity. Just because some smartasses could make up some theories and paradoxes doesn't mean that the universe is infinite. The universe is a large finite that expands, but is limited somewhere.NiKva
You have proof it is limited brother?
Do you have proof that it isn't?Mine first. But then i'm not claiming it is or isn't so i dont have to answer your question.
An infinite amount of numbers isn't that mind blowing. Counting can be finite or infinite, numbers is what makes up infinity. Just because some smartasses could make up some theories and paradoxes doesn't mean that the universe is infinite. The universe is a large finite that expands, but is limited somewhere.NiKvaSo your standard is how much this blows your mind... *facepalm*. I didn't CLAIM that the universe is infinite... I've said I believe that we're unlikely to ever know, but my personal belief is that it's finite and bounded. I answered YOUR question however, which was, "can you prove that infinities exist." I did... deal with it. I'd also say, that if you bothered to contemplate ANYTHING with an infinite scope, you'd find them all equally imponderable; we're not suited to consider any infinites. As for the rest, you make a claim about the nature of the universe without proof, having just shown that you don't really understand the subject with the same degree of finesse as someone who died 2500+ years before you were BORN.
An infinite amount of numbers isn't that mind blowing. Counting can be finite or infinite, numbers is what makes up infinity. Just because some smartasses could make up some theories and paradoxes doesn't mean that the universe is infinite. The universe is a large finite that expands, but is limited somewhere.NiKva
You have proof it is limited brother?
Do you have proof that it isn't? Look up, "Burden of Proof"... then trim your eyebrows... they're weighing down your brain.[QUOTE="NiKva"]An infinite amount of numbers isn't that mind blowing. Counting can be finite or infinite, numbers is what makes up infinity. Just because some smartasses could make up some theories and paradoxes doesn't mean that the universe is infinite. The universe is a large finite that expands, but is limited somewhere.Frame_DraggerSo your standard is how much this blows your mind... *facepalm*. I didn't CLAIM that the universe is infinite... I've said I believe that we're unlikely to ever know, but my personal belief is that it's finite and bounded. I answered YOUR question however, which was, "can you prove that infinities exist." I did... deal with it. I'd also say, that if you bothered to contemplate ANYTHING with an infinite scope, you'd find them all equally imponderable; we're not suited to consider any infinites. As for the rest, you make a claim about the nature of the universe without proof, having just shown that you don't really understand the subject with the same degree of finesse as someone who died 2500+ years before you were BORN. That's a bogus claim, a person 2500+ years ago thought that the sky was the heavens, not a universe :o
[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="NiKva"]An infinite amount of numbers isn't that mind blowing. Counting can be finite or infinite, numbers is what makes up infinity. Just because some smartasses could make up some theories and paradoxes doesn't mean that the universe is infinite. The universe is a large finite that expands, but is limited somewhere.NiKvaSo your standard is how much this blows your mind... *facepalm*. I didn't CLAIM that the universe is infinite... I've said I believe that we're unlikely to ever know, but my personal belief is that it's finite and bounded. I answered YOUR question however, which was, "can you prove that infinities exist." I did... deal with it. I'd also say, that if you bothered to contemplate ANYTHING with an infinite scope, you'd find them all equally imponderable; we're not suited to consider any infinites. As for the rest, you make a claim about the nature of the universe without proof, having just shown that you don't really understand the subject with the same degree of finesse as someone who died 2500+ years before you were BORN. That's a bogus claim, a person 2500+ years ago thought that the sky was the heavens, not a universe :o 2500 years... and Zeno's Paradox is as true as it ever was... your claim on the other hand is still unfounded and laughable. That is, unless you figured out a way to read a destination through an infinite series of half-steps? For the record, you should consider suing whatever schools you've been attending on the grounds of gross negligence.
Do you have proof that it isn't?[QUOTE="NiKva"][QUOTE="Ilovegames1992"]
You have proof it is limited brother?
Ilovegames1992
Mine first. But then i'm not claiming it is or isn't so i dont have to answer your question.
No? Ah well.
[QUOTE="taylor888"]There is a new telescope being put into space in the semi-near future that will be able to see much farther and answer more questions than any current telescope can. The present day telescopes can only see a finite distance away (I believe) so with a more powerful telescope, hopefully we can see even further away. I will wait until then to decide if I think the Universe is indeed infinite. katana_duoWhats interesting is that we're not seeing those things in real time but from thousands of years in the past since most of those other stars and galaxies are light years away. I think 13.6 billion light years is the furthest we are able to see. Quite a few years back I'd say. Something else that is related to this, if you took a super fast rocket (almost the speed of light) and went away from the earth for half a year and then came back, the Earth would have aged 10 years, while you only would have aged one.
[QUOTE="katana_duo"][QUOTE="taylor888"]There is a new telescope being put into space in the semi-near future that will be able to see much farther and answer more questions than any current telescope can. The present day telescopes can only see a finite distance away (I believe) so with a more powerful telescope, hopefully we can see even further away. I will wait until then to decide if I think the Universe is indeed infinite. taylor888Whats interesting is that we're not seeing those things in real time but from thousands of years in the past since most of those other stars and galaxies are light years away. I think 13.6 billion light years is the furthest we are able to see. Quite a few years back I'd say. Something else that is related to this, if you took a super fast rocket (almost the speed of light) and went away from the earth for half a year and then came back, the Earth would have aged 10 years, while you only would have aged one. I think that is up to about 46 billion
[QUOTE="NiKva"][QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"]Can you prove anything that is infinite? Yes I can... in fact, Euclid proved that there are an infinite number of Prime Numbers: N= p1...pn+1 Zeno's Paradox is another example of an infinite series... and he thought of this over 2500 years ago. Pay attention in school damn it! I don't think anyone can prove infinity exists, it is just an idea. Without the notion of infinite numbers though, a whole lot of theories and things we think we know about the world would have to be recalculated. I'm sure the majority of Calculus depends on infinity existing. Don't quote me on this, but didn't Einstein utilize Calculus to prove his theory of relativity? His theory is what every stellar theory has been derived from. So unless you want to rethink everything we know, we must assume that infinity exists.Frame_Dragger
Yes, because space is infinite.xdude85
we cant even honestly make it to the moon....so how in the world do we know its infinite?
[QUOTE="xdude85"]Yes, because space is infinite.VanDammFan
we cant even honestly make it to the moon....so how in the world do we know its infinite?
What do you mean we can't make it to the moon.
Not only have we (or our lander and orbiter, and rover) been there, we've landed rover on Mars for years, and we actually landed a probe as far as Saturn's sixth moon : Titan, we also have probes that's now flying out of the solar system, we are making progress here.
[QUOTE="VanDammFan"]
[QUOTE="xdude85"]Yes, because space is infinite.Ncsoftlover
we cant even honestly make it to the moon....so how in the world do we know its infinite?
What do you mean we can't make it to the moon.
Not only have we (or our lander and orbiter, and rover) been there, we've landed rover on Mars for years, and we actually landed a probe as far as Saturn's sixth moon : Titan, we also have probes that's now flying out of the solar system, we are making progress here.
NOPE...sorry..we have NOT been to the moon. THIS however is my opinion and not everyone else's
[QUOTE="Ncsoftlover"]
[QUOTE="VanDammFan"]
we cant even honestly make it to the moon....so how in the world do we know its infinite?
VanDammFan
What do you mean we can't make it to the moon.
Not only have we (or our lander and orbiter, and rover) been there, we've landed rover on Mars for years, and we actually landed a probe as far as Saturn's sixth moon : Titan, we also have probes that's now flying out of the solar system, we are making progress here.
NOPE...sorry..we have NOT been to the moon. THIS however is my opinion and not everyone else's
You know it doesn't actually matter if human have set foot on moon, we have the ability to land probe on Saturn's Titan, we have the ability to land a rover fully equiped to study Mars on its ground. We have the ability to fly our probes out of the solar system and taking images of neptune, uranus and pluto along the way, those are proven fact, and at this point, I'm not really interested in the man landing on moon controversy anymore, because honestly, you don't have to set foot somewhere to know about it, So your original statement about we can't make it to the moon in human (even assuming the minority opinion is true), doesn't not nesessarily mean we're not making progress knowing the universe, in fact, we know a lot about our solar system right now, the moon is not even the subject of interest anymore, and maybe one day, we'll know more about our own galaxy, and in the distant future, maybe we'll even venture further, not us, physically of course.
Gamespot folks, attempting to conclude in one thread what scores of physicists and the like still can't agree on. :|Hellfire-1If it helps, I don't think that the thread is meant to settle the question
if it weren't infinite I wonder what nothingness would look like. Would it be an endless blank white light? If so then where would the light be coming from? Would it be an endless blackness completely lacking in light? If so would that be any different from space?
Would you answer those questions please? :P Lol, good point though, I've wondered about some of those too.if it weren't infinite I wonder what nothingness would look like. Would it be an endless blank white light? If so then where would the light be coming from? Would it be an endless blackness completely lacking in light? If so would that be any different from space?
Serraph105
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