i just bought 15 pound dumbell for myself....

[QUOTE="Niff_T"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

But dumbells are not for beginners anyway.

The_Mac_Daddy

Really? That's news to me.

yea.. i'll post this again:

dumbells are harder for beginners becuase most beginners have a hard time stabalizing the weight with one arm.. not to mention, one arm is usually stronger than the other. Beginners should train with a barbell first to get their strength up before they try dumbells

although your post is well thought out; its not exactly true. Infact, starting with dumbells helps your technique and helps develope the underdeveloped muscles that can undermine some excercises. In the end as long as you are carefull not to overextend yourself these details dont really matter as much as commitment and the other things I mentioned in my previous post.

One tip: if you start doing dumbell presses for a while before you even touch a bench...you can end up rocketting through your bench MAX sooner.

i just tried doing a couple of reps and i found it pretty hard. so isnt it a good thing for me? i just want bigger biceps.dragonmaster64

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

No, he is not right. Toning is only as good as the amount of fat you remove from your muscles. You can try and "tone" your abs by doing a million crunches all day all you want, but you will NOT see a difference until you wipe that fat away. And the only way to do that is to do cardio. Cardio is the most important factor of "toning".. or "cutting".

Hoobinator

http://www.smasa.asn.au/smartplay/moves/peak_perform/light_weights/weightsfacts.html

• to increase or maintain muscle fitness & muscular balance
• to build confidence and self esteem
• to help condition and change body shape - decrease fat
• to help improve bone density (strengthen bones)
• please note you will not get big bulky muscles using the light weights described in this program but you will become conditioned and look terrific!

All part of the 'shaping', 'definition' and 'toning' I was talking about.

You will condition your muscles by increasing endurance and a little strength. But there is really no such thing as "toning" or "shaping" or "firming".

Just type into google "no such thing as toning".. and you will get TONS of results. The only people who think there is a such thing as shaping and firming are people who are oblivious to weight training. This was started by gyms to get women to join and think they are just going to train light to "tone" and "firm up". It's a myth.

Here is just one link to show I'm not just making crap up:

http://weighttraining.about.com/b/2008/08/25/theres-no-such-thing-as-toning.htm

[QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

No, he is not right. Toning is only as good as the amount of fat you remove from your muscles. You can try and "tone" your abs by doing a million crunches all day all you want, but you will NOT see a difference until you wipe that fat away. And the only way to do that is to do cardio. Cardio is the most important factor of "toning".. or "cutting".

The_Mac_Daddy

http://www.smasa.asn.au/smartplay/moves/peak_perform/light_weights/weightsfacts.html

• to increase or maintain muscle fitness & muscular balance
• to build confidence and self esteem
• to help condition and change body shape - decrease fat
• to help improve bone density (strengthen bones)
• please note you will not get big bulky muscles using the light weights described in this program but you will become conditioned and look terrific!

All part of the 'shaping', 'definition' and 'toning' I was talking about.

You will condition your muscles by increasing endurance and a little strength. But there is really no such thing as "toning" or "shaping" or "firming".

Thanks for stating what I've been writing all along. These are the benefits of light weight curls.

Repetitive light weight curls help endurance in your muscles, reduce fat and deliver a more defined look to the muslces.

You've already agreed with what I was saying anyway.

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Niff_T"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

But dumbells are not for beginners anyway.

anasbouzid

Really? That's news to me.

yea.. i'll post this again:

dumbells are harder for beginners becuase most beginners have a hard time stabalizing the weight with one arm.. not to mention, one arm is usually stronger than the other. Beginners should train with a barbell first to get their strength up before they try dumbells

although your post is well thought out; its not exactly true. Infact, starting with dumbells helps your technique and helps develope the underdeveloped muscles that can undermine some excercises. In the end as long as you are carefull not to overextend yourself these details dont really matter as much as commitment and the other things I mentioned in my previous post.

One tip: if you start doing dumbell presses for a while before you even touch a bench...you can end up rocketting through your bench MAX sooner.

I'm just following what Mark Rippetoe says.. you know, one of the most well respected weight training coaches in the country. But you know, what does he know?

[QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"]

[QUOTE="kemar7856"]one 15pound dumbell is useless at least get the adjustable ones The_Mac_Daddy

Maybe it's not useless for him.

And even if he does out grow the 15 pound dumbbell, it should still come in handy when he's toning his mucles, and will probably want to focus on lots of light weight repetitive curls, especially as a come down after heavy lifting.

There is no such thing as "toning".

Toning as in shaping his muscles and building definition, rather than out and out nulk and size. Small, lightweight, repetitive curls help in this regard.

Like I said.. no such thing. Small, lightweight, repetitive curls will only give your biceps more endurance. It will not make them bigger or much stronger or anything like that. It will not build definition.

Well then I must have been using some magic lightweight dumbbells, because from my own experiences, and one other user has already backed me on this, they do work. Small, lightweight, repetitive curls does build definition.

I do agree with you on the fat burning process, it's all part of a larger regimented exercise program, I was only focusing on the benefits of lightweight curls since everyone seemed to be putting them down and frankly saying they're a waste when they're quite clearly not.

your right. toning excercises are much like endurance except that it can range into medium weight excercises.

No, he is not right. Toning is only as good as the amount of fat you remove from your muscles. You can try and "tone" your abs by doing a million crunches all day all you want, but you will NOT see a difference until you wipe that fat away. And the only way to do that is to do cardio. Cardio is the most important factor of "toning".. or "cutting".

the bold part is true and most toning excercises are endurance excercises that target the fat over the muscle

http://www.weightlossresources.co.uk/exercise/body_toning/upper_body.htm

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

No, he is not right. Toning is only as good as the amount of fat you remove from your muscles. You can try and "tone" your abs by doing a million crunches all day all you want, but you will NOT see a difference until you wipe that fat away. And the only way to do that is to do cardio. Cardio is the most important factor of "toning".. or "cutting".

Hoobinator

http://www.smasa.asn.au/smartplay/moves/peak_perform/light_weights/weightsfacts.html

• to increase or maintain muscle fitness & muscular balance
• to build confidence and self esteem
• to help condition and change body shape - decrease fat
• to help improve bone density (strengthen bones)
• please note you will not get big bulky muscles using the light weights described in this program but you will become conditioned and look terrific!

All part of the 'shaping', 'definition' and 'toning' I was talking about.

You will condition your muscles by increasing endurance and a little strength. But there is really no such thing as "toning" or "shaping" or "firming".

Thanks for stating what I've been writing all along. These are the benefits of light weight curls.

You will gain a minute amount of strength just from lifting something other than the tv remote.. and your muscle endurance will increase because of the higher reps.. but you will not look any more "toned" than before. You will not be able to lift any more than you could before. The "strength" you gain will be as in I can lift 20 lbs. more times now than I could before. If you couldn't lift 50 before, you still would not be able to lift 50. And you do not much if any fat at all.

the bold part is true and most toning excercises are endurance excercises that target the fat over the muscle

http://www.weightlossresources.co.uk/exercise/body_toning/upper_body.htm

anasbouzid

Exactly, by focusing on lots of light weight repetitive curls, as I stated, you are building endurance in your muscles, wiping away fat layers and making those muscles more 'defined' and hence they end up looking more 'toned'.

This was pretty much my central argument as to the benefits of light weight curls and repetition.

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"]

[QUOTE="kemar7856"]one 15pound dumbell is useless at least get the adjustable ones anasbouzid

Maybe it's not useless for him.

And even if he does out grow the 15 pound dumbbell, it should still come in handy when he's toning his mucles, and will probably want to focus on lots of light weight repetitive curls, especially as a come down after heavy lifting.

There is no such thing as "toning".

Toning as in shaping his muscles and building definition, rather than out and out nulk and size. Small, lightweight, repetitive curls help in this regard.

Like I said.. no such thing. Small, lightweight, repetitive curls will only give your biceps more endurance. It will not make them bigger or much stronger or anything like that. It will not build definition.

Well then I must have been using some magic lightweight dumbbells, because from my own experiences, and one other user has already backed me on this, they do work. Small, lightweight, repetitive curls does build definition.

I do agree with you on the fat burning process, it's all part of a larger regimented exercise program, I was only focusing on the benefits of lightweight curls since everyone seemed to be putting them down and frankly saying they're a waste when they're quite clearly not.

your right. toning excercises are much like endurance except that it can range into medium weight excercises.

No, he is not right. Toning is only as good as the amount of fat you remove from your muscles. You can try and "tone" your abs by doing a million crunches all day all you want, but you will NOT see a difference until you wipe that fat away. And the only way to do that is to do cardio. Cardio is the most important factor of "toning".. or "cutting".

the bold part is true and most toning excercises are endurance excercises that target the fat over the muscle

http://www.weightlossresources.co.uk/exercise/body_toning/upper_body.htm

There is NO SUCH THING as "TARGETING" fat. You can only burn fat through your WHOLE body. You cannot "target" fat.

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

No, he is not right. Toning is only as good as the amount of fat you remove from your muscles. You can try and "tone" your abs by doing a million crunches all day all you want, but you will NOT see a difference until you wipe that fat away. And the only way to do that is to do cardio. Cardio is the most important factor of "toning".. or "cutting".

Hoobinator

http://www.smasa.asn.au/smartplay/moves/peak_perform/light_weights/weightsfacts.html

• to increase or maintain muscle fitness & muscular balance
• to build confidence and self esteem
• to help condition and change body shape - decrease fat
• to help improve bone density (strengthen bones)
• please note you will not get big bulky muscles using the light weights described in this program but you will become conditioned and look terrific!

All part of the 'shaping', 'definition' and 'toning' I was talking about.

You will condition your muscles by increasing endurance and a little strength. But there is really no such thing as "toning" or "shaping" or "firming".

Thanks for stating what I've been writing all along. These are the benefits of light weight curls.

Repetitive light weight curls help endurance in your muscles, reduce fat and deliver a more defined look to the muslces.

You've already agreed with what I was saying anyway.

That's not what I said at all. There is no such thing as targeting fat. I'll post this again. Look at the link:

You will condition your muscles by increasing endurance and a little strength. But there is really no such thing as "toning" or "shaping" or "firming".

Just type into google "no such thing as toning".. and you will get TONS of results. The only people who think there is a such thing as shaping and firming are people who are oblivious to weight training. This was started by gyms to get women to join and think they are just going to train light to "tone" and "firm up". It's a myth.

Here is just one link to show I'm not just making crap up:

http://weighttraining.about.com/b/2008/08/25/theres-no-such-thing-as-toning.htm

You will gain a minute amount of strength just from lifting something other than the tv remote.. and your muscle endurance will increase because of the higher reps.. but you will not look any more "toned" than before. You will not be able to lift any more than you could before. The "strength" you gain will be as in I can lift 20 lbs. more times now than I could before. If you couldn't lift 50 before, you still would not be able to lift 50. And you do not much if any fat at all.

The_Mac_Daddy

Lots of light weight repetitive curls build endurance and wipe away that 'layer of fat' you've constantly referred to. It's all part of the 'conditioning' process which both of us have now referred to.

I also never once said light weight curls would build bulk or any real strength. In fact one of my first posts I stated that you will need heavy weights to build muscle bulk and genuine strength.

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

You will gain a minute amount of strength just from lifting something other than the tv remote.. and your muscle endurance will increase because of the higher reps.. but you will not look any more "toned" than before. You will not be able to lift any more than you could before. The "strength" you gain will be as in I can lift 20 lbs. more times now than I could before. If you couldn't lift 50 before, you still would not be able to lift 50. And you do not much if any fat at all.

Hoobinator

Lots of light weight repetitive curls build endurance and wipe away that 'layer of fat' you've constantly referred to. It's all part of the 'conditioning' process which both of us have now referred to.

I also never once said light weight curls would build bulk or any real strength. In fact one of my first posts I stated that you will need heavy weights to build muscle bulk and genuine strength.

God.. lots of repetitions will do nothing to wipe away any layer of fat. You can do a million sit ups all day and you will not see an ounce of fat removed from your stomach.

[QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Niff_T"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

But dumbells are not for beginners anyway.

The_Mac_Daddy

Really? That's news to me.

yea.. i'll post this again:

dumbells are harder for beginners becuase most beginners have a hard time stabalizing the weight with one arm.. not to mention, one arm is usually stronger than the other. Beginners should train with a barbell first to get their strength up before they try dumbells

although your post is well thought out; its not exactly true. Infact, starting with dumbells helps your technique and helps develope the underdeveloped muscles that can undermine some excercises. In the end as long as you are carefull not to overextend yourself these details dont really matter as much as commitment and the other things I mentioned in my previous post.

One tip: if you start doing dumbell presses for a while before you even touch a bench...you can end up rocketting through your bench MAX sooner.

I'm just following what Mark Rippetoe says.. you know, one of the most well respected weight training coaches in the country. But you know, what does he know?

dude, stop being so cocky. I mean Im just saying from experience and a previous coach. Here what I say to that....

I bet Mark was refering to heavy weight lifting....and so it is obviously true that doing huge dumbells close to your max when you have just started or returning after a while of not working out.

It was suggested to me to start with free weights specifically because I needed to develope the muscles that help with balancing the weights...and the whole dumbell press thing works and it helped me break through a plateau.

God.. lots of repetitions will do nothing to wipe away any layer of fat. You can do a million sit ups all day and you will not see an ounce of fat removed from your stomach.

The_Mac_Daddy

Wrong. Almost any weight training exercise if done right can help reduce body fat.

Again all part of a good exercise program.

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Niff_T"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

But dumbells are not for beginners anyway.

anasbouzid

Really? That's news to me.

yea.. i'll post this again:

dumbells are harder for beginners becuase most beginners have a hard time stabalizing the weight with one arm.. not to mention, one arm is usually stronger than the other. Beginners should train with a barbell first to get their strength up before they try dumbells

although your post is well thought out; its not exactly true. Infact, starting with dumbells helps your technique and helps develope the underdeveloped muscles that can undermine some excercises. In the end as long as you are carefull not to overextend yourself these details dont really matter as much as commitment and the other things I mentioned in my previous post.

One tip: if you start doing dumbell presses for a while before you even touch a bench...you can end up rocketting through your bench MAX sooner.

I'm just following what Mark Rippetoe says.. you know, one of the most well respected weight training coaches in the country. But you know, what does he know?

dude, stop being so cocky. I mean Im just saying from experience and a previous coach. Here what I say to that....

I bet Mark was refering to heavy weight lifting....and so it is obviously true that doing huge dumbells close to your max when you have just started or returning after a while of not working out.

It was suggested to me to start with free weights specifically because I needed to develope the muscles that help with balancing the weights...and the whole dumbell press thing works and it helped me break through a plateau.

I AM talking about free weights. Starting with a barbell is better than starting with a dumbell. You will never get your arms on the same page if beginners start with dumbells. It is incredibly akward for a beginner to start with dumbells.

And no.. when you start off as a beginner, you don't start heavy. So he was not even refering to heavy weights.

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

God.. lots of repetitions will do nothing to wipe away any layer of fat. You can do a million sit ups all day and you will not see an ounce of fat removed from your stomach.

Hoobinator

Wrong. Almost any weight training exercise if done right can help reduce body fat.

Again all part of a good exercise program.

You are wrong, sir. Weight training removes almost no body fat compared to cardio and eating the right foods. Even if you just eat the right foods, you will lose more weight than eating normal and weight training.

You CANNOT just do a million situps and expect to see your abs. You will never ever see them by doing situps alone. Ever heard that everybody has a six pack? Look at the worlds strongest men. You better believe they have some big abs.. their abs are strong as hell. They are big. But you cannot see most of those guys abs because they have fat covering them. You better believe they train their abs like hell. But no amount of training will allow them to show until you burn the fat off of your body as a WHOLE.

[QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

God.. lots of repetitions will do nothing to wipe away any layer of fat. You can do a million sit ups all day and you will not see an ounce of fat removed from your stomach.

The_Mac_Daddy

Wrong. Almost any weight training exercise if done right can help reduce body fat.

Again all part of a good exercise program.

You are wrong, sir. Weight training removes almost no body fat compared to cardio and eating the right foods. Even if you just eat the right foods, you will lose more weight than eating normal and weight training.

First stop referring to sit-ups they're a different exercise group,

Secondly you're sadly very wrong. Lots of light weight repetitive curls build endurance and help remove body fat, whilst building definition to the arms.

I speak from first hand experience. They worked for me.

[QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Niff_T"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

But dumbells are not for beginners anyway.

The_Mac_Daddy

Really? That's news to me.

yea.. i'll post this again:

dumbells are harder for beginners becuase most beginners have a hard time stabalizing the weight with one arm.. not to mention, one arm is usually stronger than the other. Beginners should train with a barbell first to get their strength up before they try dumbells

although your post is well thought out; its not exactly true. Infact, starting with dumbells helps your technique and helps develope the underdeveloped muscles that can undermine some excercises. In the end as long as you are carefull not to overextend yourself these details dont really matter as much as commitment and the other things I mentioned in my previous post.

One tip: if you start doing dumbell presses for a while before you even touch a bench...you can end up rocketting through your bench MAX sooner.

I'm just following what Mark Rippetoe says.. you know, one of the most well respected weight training coaches in the country. But you know, what does he know?

dude, stop being so cocky. I mean Im just saying from experience and a previous coach. Here what I say to that....

I bet Mark was refering to heavy weight lifting....and so it is obviously true that doing huge dumbells close to your max when you have just started or returning after a while of not working out.

It was suggested to me to start with free weights specifically because I needed to develope the muscles that help with balancing the weights...and the whole dumbell press thing works and it helped me break through a plateau.

I AM talking about free weights. Starting with a barbell is better than starting with a dumbell. You will never get your arms on the same page if beginners start with dumbells. It is incredibly akward for a beginner to start with dumbells.

And no.. when you start off as a beginner, you don't start heavy. So he was not even refering to heavy weights.

first off I wanna see the link

second off.

I weight train. I was a beginner. I highly doubt that if I had started with the curl bar I would be much stronger now and anyways, this detail isnt as important as diet, routine, and sleep when it comes to gaining muscle mass. If you are starting out, use 5lb dumbells, hell, use 2.5lbs if 5 is to heavy.

also when you lift a curl bar each arm isnt doing the same amount of lifting, by the way. Just go ahead and try it!!! Doing dumbells can help you learn how much stronger one arm is and is a way to target the weaker arm with focus.

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Niff_T"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

But dumbells are not for beginners anyway.

anasbouzid

Really? That's news to me.

yea.. i'll post this again:

dumbells are harder for beginners becuase most beginners have a hard time stabalizing the weight with one arm.. not to mention, one arm is usually stronger than the other. Beginners should train with a barbell first to get their strength up before they try dumbells

although your post is well thought out; its not exactly true. Infact, starting with dumbells helps your technique and helps develope the underdeveloped muscles that can undermine some excercises. In the end as long as you are carefull not to overextend yourself these details dont really matter as much as commitment and the other things I mentioned in my previous post.

One tip: if you start doing dumbell presses for a while before you even touch a bench...you can end up rocketting through your bench MAX sooner.

I'm just following what Mark Rippetoe says.. you know, one of the most well respected weight training coaches in the country. But you know, what does he know?

dude, stop being so cocky. I mean Im just saying from experience and a previous coach. Here what I say to that....

I bet Mark was refering to heavy weight lifting....and so it is obviously true that doing huge dumbells close to your max when you have just started or returning after a while of not working out.

It was suggested to me to start with free weights specifically because I needed to develope the muscles that help with balancing the weights...and the whole dumbell press thing works and it helped me break through a plateau.

I AM talking about free weights. Starting with a barbell is better than starting with a dumbell. You will never get your arms on the same page if beginners start with dumbells. It is incredibly akward for a beginner to start with dumbells.

And no.. when you start off as a beginner, you don't start heavy. So he was not even refering to heavy weights.

first off I wanna see the link

second off.

I weight train. I was a beginner. I highly doubt that if I had started with the curl bar I would be much stronger now and anyways, this detail isnt as important as diet, routine, and sleep when it comes to gaining muscle mass. If you are starting out, use 5lb dumbells, hell, use 2.5lbs if 5 is to heavy.

also when you lift a curl bar each arm isnt doing the same amount of lifting, by the way. Just go ahead and try it!!! Doing dumbells can help you learn how much stronger one arm is and is a way to target the weaker arm with focus.

I read it from one of his books. I'm sure you may be able to find why it's better to start with a barbell online anyway. And I now doubt your experience in this subject, seeing how you called it a "curl bar".

And the point of using the barbell instead, is because of two reasons. 1. It is easier to stabalize the weight with two arms than one. It will build up your stabalizer muscles much easier by using a barbell. 2. Most beginners have one arm stronger than the other. When you use the barbell, this causes the other weaker arm to catch up, thus making both of your arms porportional in strength. If you use dumbells, you only increase the problem. So, if you start with dumbells, when you go to do a bench press with the barbell, you will have one stronger arm than the other, causing the weight to be off balance.

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

God.. lots of repetitions will do nothing to wipe away any layer of fat. You can do a million sit ups all day and you will not see an ounce of fat removed from your stomach.

Hoobinator

Wrong. Almost any weight training exercise if done right can help reduce body fat.

Again all part of a good exercise program.

You are wrong, sir. Weight training removes almost no body fat compared to cardio and eating the right foods. Even if you just eat the right foods, you will lose more weight than eating normal and weight training.

First stop referring to sit-ups they're a different exercise group,

Secondly you're sadly very wrong. Lots of light weight repetitive curls build endurance and help remove body fat, whilst building definition to the arms.

I speak from first hand experience. They worked for me.

It doesn't matter if it's situps, curls, bench press, or anything. The same rules still apply. There is no such thing as targeting body fat.

And sadly, YOU are very wrong. Very inexperienced, and you need to admit when you are wrong. You can go to google and type in "no such thing as toning". You can buy books to see how you are wrong. Go to your local gym and talk to someone who is ripped and ask him. Don't ask the trainers there because they will most likely tell you yes to get you to join their gym. Like I said, the words "toning" and "firming" came about to get women to join the gyms so they can lift weights without thinking they are going to get huge bulky muscles.

I know you are inexperienced in this matter seeing how you actually believe in the whole "toning" non-sense.

[QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

God.. lots of repetitions will do nothing to wipe away any layer of fat. You can do a million sit ups all day and you will not see an ounce of fat removed from your stomach.

The_Mac_Daddy

Wrong. Almost any weight training exercise if done right can help reduce body fat.

Again all part of a good exercise program.

You are wrong, sir. Weight training removes almost no body fat compared to cardio and eating the right foods. Even if you just eat the right foods, you will lose more weight than eating normal and weight training.

First stop referring to sit-ups they're a different exercise group,

Secondly you're sadly very wrong. Lots of light weight repetitive curls build endurance and help remove body fat, whilst building definition to the arms.

I speak from first hand experience. They worked for me.

It doesn't matter if it's situps, curls, bench press, or anything. The same rules still apply. There is no such thing as targeting body fat.

And sadly, YOU are very wrong. Very inexperienced, and you need to admit when you are wrong. You can go to google and type in "no such thing as toning". You can buy books to see how you are wrong. Go to your local gym and talk to someone who is ripped and ask him. Don't ask the trainers there because they will most likely tell you yes to get you to join their gym. Like I said, the words "toning" and "firming" came about to get women to join the gyms so they can lift weights without thinking they are going to get huge bulky muscles.

I know you are inexperienced in this matter seeing how you actually believe in the whole "toning" non-sense.

And I can tell you are delusional and following some mistaken philosophy because you don't accept that light weight dumbbells can help define muscle, reduce fat as part of a good exercise program and help build endurance.

Maybe you should google 'benefits of ight weight training, and understand that there are plenty of benefits from training with low weight dumbbells.

You will condition your muscles by increasing endurance and a little strength

The_Mac_Daddy

Technically this conversation was already over in my favour when you admitted that there were benefits to light weight dumbbell training, which was pretty muh what my originall argument was about.

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Hoobinator"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

God.. lots of repetitions will do nothing to wipe away any layer of fat. You can do a million sit ups all day and you will not see an ounce of fat removed from your stomach.

Hoobinator

Wrong. Almost any weight training exercise if done right can help reduce body fat.

Again all part of a good exercise program.

You are wrong, sir. Weight training removes almost no body fat compared to cardio and eating the right foods. Even if you just eat the right foods, you will lose more weight than eating normal and weight training.

First stop referring to sit-ups they're a different exercise group,

Secondly you're sadly very wrong. Lots of light weight repetitive curls build endurance and help remove body fat, whilst building definition to the arms.

I speak from first hand experience. They worked for me.

It doesn't matter if it's situps, curls, bench press, or anything. The same rules still apply. There is no such thing as targeting body fat.

And sadly, YOU are very wrong. Very inexperienced, and you need to admit when you are wrong. You can go to google and type in "no such thing as toning". You can buy books to see how you are wrong. Go to your local gym and talk to someone who is ripped and ask him. Don't ask the trainers there because they will most likely tell you yes to get you to join their gym. Like I said, the words "toning" and "firming" came about to get women to join the gyms so they can lift weights without thinking they are going to get huge bulky muscles.

I know you are inexperienced in this matter seeing how you actually believe in the whole "toning" non-sense.

And I can tell you are delusional and following some mistaken philosophy because you don't accept that light weight dumbbells can help define muscle, reduce fat as part of a good exercise program and help build endurance.

Maybe you should google 'benefits of ight weight training, and understand that there are plenty of benefits from training with low weight dumbbells.

You will condition your muscles by increasing endurance and a little strength

The_Mac_Daddy

Technically this conversation was already over in my favour when you admitted that there were benefits to light weight dumbbell training, which was pretty muh what my originall argument was about.

I'm not denying there are benefits to light weight training. That is not even what we are talking about. We are talking about the delusion that you can burn fat and "firm up" or "tone" by doing high rep, light weight training. And this just is not so. And for you to think it is possible shows your gullibility by believing that catch word that people came up with, and your inexperience with weight training.

[QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Niff_T"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

But dumbells are not for beginners anyway.

The_Mac_Daddy

Really? That's news to me.

yea.. i'll post this again:

dumbells are harder for beginners becuase most beginners have a hard time stabalizing the weight with one arm.. not to mention, one arm is usually stronger than the other. Beginners should train with a barbell first to get their strength up before they try dumbells

although your post is well thought out; its not exactly true. Infact, starting with dumbells helps your technique and helps develope the underdeveloped muscles that can undermine some excercises. In the end as long as you are carefull not to overextend yourself these details dont really matter as much as commitment and the other things I mentioned in my previous post.

One tip: if you start doing dumbell presses for a while before you even touch a bench...you can end up rocketting through your bench MAX sooner.

I'm just following what Mark Rippetoe says.. you know, one of the most well respected weight training coaches in the country. But you know, what does he know?

dude, stop being so cocky. I mean Im just saying from experience and a previous coach. Here what I say to that....

I bet Mark was refering to heavy weight lifting....and so it is obviously true that doing huge dumbells close to your max when you have just started or returning after a while of not working out.

It was suggested to me to start with free weights specifically because I needed to develope the muscles that help with balancing the weights...and the whole dumbell press thing works and it helped me break through a plateau.

I AM talking about free weights. Starting with a barbell is better than starting with a dumbell. You will never get your arms on the same page if beginners start with dumbells. It is incredibly akward for a beginner to start with dumbells.

And no.. when you start off as a beginner, you don't start heavy. So he was not even refering to heavy weights.

first off I wanna see the link

second off.

I weight train. I was a beginner. I highly doubt that if I had started with the curl bar I would be much stronger now and anyways, this detail isnt as important as diet, routine, and sleep when it comes to gaining muscle mass. If you are starting out, use 5lb dumbells, hell, use 2.5lbs if 5 is to heavy.

also when you lift a curl bar each arm isnt doing the same amount of lifting, by the way. Just go ahead and try it!!! Doing dumbells can help you learn how much stronger one arm is and is a way to target the weaker arm with focus.

I read it from one of his books. I'm sure you may be able to find why it's better to start with a barbell online anyway. And I now doubt your experience in this subject, seeing how you called it a "curl bar".

And the point of using the barbell instead, is because of two reasons. 1. It is easier to stabalize the weight with two arms than one. It will build up your stabalizer muscles much easier by using a barbell. 2. Most beginners have one arm stronger than the other. When you use the barbell, this causes the other weaker arm to catch up, thus making both of your arms porportional in strength. If you use dumbells, you only increase the problem. So, if you start with dumbells, when you go to do a bench press with the barbell, you will have one stronger arm than the other, causing the weight to be off balance.

I own a stupid barbell you d&(*(&, I own about 300lbs of weights (plates), a standard olympic barbell and a curlbar which is what most use when doing arm excercises.

check it out you can get one of your own!!!

curlbar

[QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="anasbouzid"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"][QUOTE="Niff_T"][QUOTE="The_Mac_Daddy"]

But dumbells are not for beginners anyway.

anasbouzid

Really? That's news to me.

yea.. i'll post this again:

dumbells are harder for beginners becuase most beginners have a hard time stabalizing the weight with one arm.. not to mention, one arm is usually stronger than the other. Beginners should train with a barbell first to get their strength up before they try dumbells

although your post is well thought out; its not exactly true. Infact, starting with dumbells helps your technique and helps develope the underdeveloped muscles that can undermine some excercises. In the end as long as you are carefull not to overextend yourself these details dont really matter as much as commitment and the other things I mentioned in my previous post.

One tip: if you start doing dumbell presses for a while before you even touch a bench...you can end up rocketting through your bench MAX sooner.

I'm just following what Mark Rippetoe says.. you know, one of the most well respected weight training coaches in the country. But you know, what does he know?

dude, stop being so cocky. I mean Im just saying from experience and a previous coach. Here what I say to that....

I bet Mark was refering to heavy weight lifting....and so it is obviously true that doing huge dumbells close to your max when you have just started or returning after a while of not working out.

It was suggested to me to start with free weights specifically because I needed to develope the muscles that help with balancing the weights...and the whole dumbell press thing works and it helped me break through a plateau.

I AM talking about free weights. Starting with a barbell is better than starting with a dumbell. You will never get your arms on the same page if beginners start with dumbells. It is incredibly akward for a beginner to start with dumbells.

And no.. when you start off as a beginner, you don't start heavy. So he was not even refering to heavy weights.

first off I wanna see the link

second off.

I weight train. I was a beginner. I highly doubt that if I had started with the curl bar I would be much stronger now and anyways, this detail isnt as important as diet, routine, and sleep when it comes to gaining muscle mass. If you are starting out, use 5lb dumbells, hell, use 2.5lbs if 5 is to heavy.

also when you lift a curl bar each arm isnt doing the same amount of lifting, by the way. Just go ahead and try it!!! Doing dumbells can help you learn how much stronger one arm is and is a way to target the weaker arm with focus.

I read it from one of his books. I'm sure you may be able to find why it's better to start with a barbell online anyway. And I now doubt your experience in this subject, seeing how you called it a "curl bar".

And the point of using the barbell instead, is because of two reasons. 1. It is easier to stabalize the weight with two arms than one. It will build up your stabalizer muscles much easier by using a barbell. 2. Most beginners have one arm stronger than the other. When you use the barbell, this causes the other weaker arm to catch up, thus making both of your arms porportional in strength. If you use dumbells, you only increase the problem. So, if you start with dumbells, when you go to do a bench press with the barbell, you will have one stronger arm than the other, causing the weight to be off balance.

I own a stupid barbell you d&(*(&, I own about 300lbs of weights (plates), a standard olympic barbell and a curlbar which is what most use when doing arm excercises.

check it out you can get one of your own!!!

curlbar

I never said anything about only doing curls with a barbell and dumbells. But even so, barbells are better than those "EZ" curl bars that are jagged shaped. The problem with them is that they are not nearly as effective as a straight bar for recruiting bicep contraction. The curl bar does in fact take the stress of supination off of the wrists and elbows, but it does so at the expense of a quality bicep contraction.

What an intresting thread.

i just bought 15 pound dumbell for myself and i know its not alot but i found it to fit me. i heard things about "reps" and im not really sure what it is. right now i want to work on my biceps but im not really sure how many to do. do i just keep going until i get tired? or do i do some then stop then do some then stop? can anyone help me here?dragonmaster64

How much did you buy it for? Re-sell it to redeem yourself.

good lord. please tell me you mean a one handed dumbell and not a two handed barbell.

im only 14, ive been working out in my school gym and usually use a 40 pound barbell, 90 for the ol bench

and 250 for the leg press.

im gunna assume your older than me, but you need to up the weight pal.

build then define.