I Just dont get it How could you not believe in God

[QUOTE="Nifty_Shark"]

[QUOTE="EMOEVOLUTION"]

I'm not opposed to the possibility of a God. but from what I've observed through out my life.. humans either misuse the concept of God, or misunderstand their own concept of God. And their definitely is no Christian God. I'm not going to get into why. It's really irrelevant.

MystikFollower

No Christian God? What makes you so sure? I'm an atheist so my reasoining is rather boring but you say you aren't positive that there is no God.

He means that there is no logical way the Judeo-Christian God, as depicted in the Bible, exists. I agree with that assessment as well, having studied much of the Bible now. Either the Word of God is not the absolute word of God, or else God is a confusing jerk.

So is there a point to follow that religion then if the God is not believable as the way it is written? this a big deal no?

P.S. that first sentence I wrote is excruciating to read

[QUOTE="EMOEVOLUTION"]

I'm not opposed to the possibility of a God. but from what I've observed through out my life.. humans either misuse the concept of God, or misunderstand their own concept of God. And their definitely is no Christian God. I'm not going to get into why. It's really irrelevant.

Nifty_Shark

No Christian God? What makes you so sure? I'm an atheist so my reasoining is rather boring but you say you aren't positive that there is no God.

Both GabuEx and Dhyce have stated why already; the literal interpretation of God as depicted in the Bible makes no sense at all.

[QUOTE="MystikFollower"]

[QUOTE="Nifty_Shark"]

No Christian God? What makes you so sure? I'm an atheist so my reasoining is rather boring but you say you aren't positive that there is no God.

Nifty_Shark

He means that there is no logical way the Judeo-Christian God, as depicted in the Bible, exists. I agree with that assessment as well, having studied much of the Bible now. Either the Word of God is not the absolute word of God, or else God is a confusing jerk.

So is there a point to follow that religion then if the God is not believable as the way it is written? this a big deal no?

P.S. that first sentence I wrote is excruciating to read

I can't say that for sure since each individual needs to find their own path and their own truth that connects them to God. However, I will say for me personally, I still find many of the ideals and teachings of the Bible, and Christianity in general, to be based in truth and to be worthwhile of following. I do believe though that we as a people need to seriously question some of the beliefs we've held about God for thousands of years and possibly change them. I don't say stop following God over misinterpreted ideas, but I do say question the things you are told and welcome new ideas and new possibilities that could make more sense.

God hasn't offered enough proof for me to believe in him.

Everything is just in perfect balance.The birds singing the wind trees the flowers the world is beautiful..This all cant just happen by chance..I mean really come on just because you dont see it doesnt mean its not there.Everybody has a mind a brain a soul a voice that tells them right or wrong god gave everybody free will.And besides ive rather believe in something than not beieving in anything at all.Some atheists act like christians fear death and worry about it..We dont fear it we welcome it when our time comes to be with our family.And you guys think christians follow the rules without disobeying we dont god forgives us.I just dont get how you guys dont believe in God

wickedwaffle

If you see a car or a computer or even a playstation, you think it was made and designed because what are the chances that random parts just happened to collide and form a functioning car, a car is complicated. Now what about the whole universe, is not that more complicated than a car! What are the chances that particles would collide in such a way as to create not only a universe, but living, moving beings, some with thoughts and even highly complex and abstract thoughts? Look at the unique properties of a water molecule that are really so strange, no other molecule works that way. How can all this be mere chance? People try to think there is conflict between God and science, but God created science!

whipassmt

[QUOTE="jalexbrown"][QUOTE="MystikFollower"]

I do still praise Free Will as a gift from God. Would you rather we were all mindless little robots with no ability to free think that automatically did what God desired us to do? Doesn't sound like any sort of existence to me. This is an argument that is brought up too much against God. Suffering, and pain, ironically caused by Humans, not God. Yet, people love to take all the suffering in this poor world and put all the blame off of us. But if death is really only the beginning of an eternal existence, then 80 or so years on this planet is aninfinitesimal amount of time compared with the rest of existence, which makes death not nearly as tragic an event as it usually seems. I honestly look forward to death and finally knowing and experiencing for myself this incomprehensible God.

MystikFollower

I understand how you and others could easily feel that way. It's very difficult to look at the world we've created and see a purpose there, see a blessing there, but Free Will is the best thing we could've ever hoped for. By first creating the choice to do wrong, Adam and Eve gave us the ability to experience paradise again. Without knowing or experiencing any evil, we were unable to experience the good. Just like there's no up unless you know down, and you can't know cold without hot. To our limited human experience and perspective, there doesn't seem to be much care from a God that lets us do horrible things to each other, and lets hundreds of thousands of us die in natural disasters caused by Nature. However, at least for those of us who do believe in a higher power, we much realize that things are so much more grand and vast than us and our tiny little speck of existence on this plane. We can't understand or comprehend the planning behind something so universally grand, so often times we are at a loss and ask, "how could God let something like this happen?" It's an honest and good question, that I've posed many times. From my experience though, God will let anything happen that we choose to happen. We are creators here, whether our species is ready to take responsibility for the creation of our world or not, is yet to be seen, but we create our realities, individually and collectively.

Until we take responsibility for this creation and stop blaming God for our mistakes and misinterpretations, things wont change on this planet.

[QUOTE="MystikFollower"]

[QUOTE="jalexbrown"] Free will might have at one time been a blessing. But people abuse it, and it becomes a curse. Looking at the world today, I don't see free will as a gift at all; I see it as a terrible curse on society. So yes, I would in fact rather be a mindless robot than have to live in a world where people will use free will to blow buildings up (just as one example).tocool340

I understand how you and others could easily feel that way. It's very difficult to look at the world we've created and see a purpose there, see a blessing there, but Free Will is the best thing we could've ever hoped for. By first creating the choice to do wrong, Adam and Eve gave us the ability to experience paradise again. Without knowing or experiencing any evil, we were unable to experience the good. Just like there's no up unless you know down, and you can't know cold without hot. To our limited human experience and perspective, there doesn't seem to be much care from a God that lets us do horrible things to each other, and lets hundreds of thousands of us die in natural disasters caused by Nature. However, at least for those of us who do believe in a higher power, we much realize that things are so much more grand and vast than us and our tiny little speck of existence on this plane. We can't understand or comprehend the planning behind something so universally grand, so often times we are at a loss and ask, "how could God let something like this happen?" It's an honest and good question, that I've posed many times. From my experience though, God will let anything happen that we choose to happen. We are creators here, whether our species is ready to take responsibility for the creation of our world or not, is yet to be seen, but we create our realities, individually and collectively.

Until we take responsibility for this creation and stop blaming God for our mistakes and misinterpretations, things wont change on this planet.

I've read and re-read Genesis to try and get an idea of what I believe the symbology in it is referring to and the best I've come up with so far is that the story is an allegory for our becoming Self Aware and fully conscious. No longer did we live in harmony with nature and we realized we were "here" and the rest of the world was "out there". It probably frightened early humans, along with many of the aspects of nature that newly aware people wouldn't have understood and would have thought it was God's wrath. I don't believe it was an Original Sin and I don't believe God ever condemned us to sin and death because we evolved to a point where we could choose between paradise and evil. As you said, that whole concept doesn't make any logical sense.

I mean really come on just because you dont see it doesnt mean its not there

wickedwaffle

[QUOTE="tocool340"]

[QUOTE="MystikFollower"]

I understand how you and others could easily feel that way. It's very difficult to look at the world we've created and see a purpose there, see a blessing there, but Free Will is the best thing we could've ever hoped for. By first creating the choice to do wrong, Adam and Eve gave us the ability to experience paradise again. Without knowing or experiencing any evil, we were unable to experience the good. Just like there's no up unless you know down, and you can't know cold without hot. To our limited human experience and perspective, there doesn't seem to be much care from a God that lets us do horrible things to each other, and lets hundreds of thousands of us die in natural disasters caused by Nature. However, at least for those of us who do believe in a higher power, we much realize that things are so much more grand and vast than us and our tiny little speck of existence on this plane. We can't understand or comprehend the planning behind something so universally grand, so often times we are at a loss and ask, "how could God let something like this happen?" It's an honest and good question, that I've posed many times. From my experience though, God will let anything happen that we choose to happen. We are creators here, whether our species is ready to take responsibility for the creation of our world or not, is yet to be seen, but we create our realities, individually and collectively.

Until we take responsibility for this creation and stop blaming God for our mistakes and misinterpretations, things wont change on this planet.

MystikFollower

I've read and re-read Genesis to try and get an idea of what I believe the symbology in it is referring to and the best I've come up with so far is that the story is an allegory for our becoming Self Aware and fully conscious. No longer did we live in harmony with nature and we realized we were "here" and the rest of the world was "out there". It probably frightened early humans, along with many of the aspects of nature that newly aware people wouldn't have understood and would have thought it was God's wrath. I don't believe it was an Original Sin and I don't believe God ever condemned us to sin and death because we evolved to a point where we could choose between paradise and evil. As you said, that whole concept doesn't make any logical sense.

Wow, I'm gone for a week and another 1000+ post atheist thread breaks out:lol:

Wow, I'm gone for a week and another 1000+ post atheist thread breaks out:lol:

racer8dan

Wrong. Strong/gnostic atheism is the affirmative claim "there is most certainly is no God", while weak/agnostic atheism is the lack of a belief in a God, gods or the supernatural due to a lack of evidence. Pure agnosticism is fence sitting and the claim that "we ultimately can never know either way" and is essentially atheism.

Most atheists (read: probably over 95%) are weak atheists and don't claim absolutely "there is most certainly is no God". Most of the time it is "I do not see any evidence for a God, and see it as a highly unlikely possibility given the current definitions". We are all technically agnostics, because there is absolutely no way to "know" either way. But that isn't a position, but just a mere fact.

You can't put everyone in two to three distinct cIasses, it is just too broad.

foxhound_fox

To expound further on my previous and intoxicated statement; God as a concept only works in my eyes from a Deistic standpoint. Even then, there is no reason to believe in it, it's absolutely speculatory. Indeed we are all in a sense Agnostic, likewise all religious individuals are Atheists of each religion they don't subscribe to. It's not that I claim there is no God, I rather infer from a lack of any evidence that the entire concept of a God carries with it no warrant for belief or even intense consideration. Why? It so happens to be one of those few imaginary constructs we supply any deep contemplation, just as well, I can assert the universe COULD have been invented by a lion covered in eyes with six wings, but why would I? It is just as reasonable to assume. So, no claim is made on my part, the case for a creator has not been made, so, I can safely walk away with a bounce in my step and a quirky smile present across my lips.

To clarify this, the way we communicate an Atheist's definition is flawed. I am an Atheist because those who make the positive claim of a deity cannot show me any evidence, and I also don't view the Deistic or ever-present-in-everything version of a Deity as not intellectually valuable because it's impossible to EVER prove or gather evidence for, just as any imaginary creature. Ergo, no claim made by me and I am still an Atheist. There is no God, in my opinion. That is not a claim, it is a highly educated conclusion.

Well if you don't believe in GOD you really have no belief because you believe in nothing. Nothing wrong in believing in something. It's more positive believing in something.

Well if you don't believe in GOD you really have no belief because you believe in nothing. Nothing wrong in believing in something. It's more positive believing in something.

Mrmedia01

But beliefs do not only revolve around dieties or the supernatural.

[QUOTE="racer8dan"]

Wow, I'm gone for a week and another 1000+ post atheist thread breaks out:lol:

jalexbrown

I'm probably another one. I understand people's dislike for religious threads, but when I get into a good discussion, I really enjoy it. Spirituality is a really large part of my life right now, so I love defending ideas, and learning new ones all the time. Life is mean't for evolution, which is what I'm trying to do, and a lot of these types of threads actually help me with. The kinds with intelligent discussions at least :P.

[QUOTE="jalexbrown"]

[QUOTE="racer8dan"]

Wow, I'm gone for a week and another 1000+ post atheist thread breaks out:lol:

MystikFollower

I'm probably another one. I understand people's dislike for religious threads, but when I get into a good discussion, I really enjoy it. Spirituality is a really large part of my life right now, so I love defending ideas, and learning new ones all the time. Life is mean't for evolution, which is what I'm trying to do, and a lot of these types of threads actually help me with. The kinds with intelligent discussions at least :P.

[QUOTE="jalexbrown"]

[QUOTE="racer8dan"]

Wow, I'm gone for a week and another 1000+ post atheist thread breaks out:lol:

MystikFollower

I'm probably another one. I understand people's dislike for religious threads, but when I get into a good discussion, I really enjoy it. Spirituality is a really large part of my life right now, so I love defending ideas, and learning new ones all the time. Life is mean't for evolution, which is what I'm trying to do, and a lot of these types of threads actually help me with. The kinds with intelligent discussions at least :P.

And yet here I am posting in it:x I'm not debating though;)

[QUOTE="MystikFollower"]

[QUOTE="jalexbrown"] A lot of them due to the same two or three posters - I must be one - that keep it going.

racer8dan

I'm probably another one. I understand people's dislike for religious threads, but when I get into a good discussion, I really enjoy it. Spirituality is a really large part of my life right now, so I love defending ideas, and learning new ones all the time. Life is mean't for evolution, which is what I'm trying to do, and a lot of these types of threads actually help me with. The kinds with intelligent discussions at least :P.

And yet here I am posting in it:x I'm not debating though;)

[QUOTE="MystikFollower"]

[QUOTE="jalexbrown"] A lot of them due to the same two or three posters - I must be one - that keep it going.

racer8dan

I'm probably another one. I understand people's dislike for religious threads, but when I get into a good discussion, I really enjoy it. Spirituality is a really large part of my life right now, so I love defending ideas, and learning new ones all the time. Life is mean't for evolution, which is what I'm trying to do, and a lot of these types of threads actually help me with. The kinds with intelligent discussions at least :P.

And yet here I am posting in it:x I'm not debating though;)

Maybe I'm just weird, but I never get bored with posting the same arguments and thoughts. I'm pretty clear now on what my beliefs are, based on the knowledge and understanding I've accumulated, and continue to accumulate. I've actually had my beliefs and understandings challenged quite a bit on this forum, and it's great because I've learned a lot and changed my views based on what I've learned. A good debate and a good discussion is what keeps me coming to this forum.

Well if you don't believe in GOD you really have no belief because you believe in nothing. Nothing wrong in believing in something. It's more positive believing in something.

Mrmedia01

[QUOTE="racer8dan"]

[QUOTE="MystikFollower"]

I'm probably another one. I understand people's dislike for religious threads, but when I get into a good discussion, I really enjoy it. Spirituality is a really large part of my life right now, so I love defending ideas, and learning new ones all the time. Life is mean't for evolution, which is what I'm trying to do, and a lot of these types of threads actually help me with. The kinds with intelligent discussions at least :P.

jalexbrown

And yet here I am posting in it:x I'm not debating though;)

[QUOTE="jalexbrown"][QUOTE="racer8dan"]I enjoy a good debate as well, including religious discusions, they help strengthen or question my own beliefs, but I would say give it a month . I have no desire to re-post the same stuff I just argued in a another thread a few days ago, specialy in such a large thread in which I posted a lot of information in, I'm still wore out.

And yet here I am posting in it:x I'm not debating though;)

racer8dan

[QUOTE="racer8dan"]

[QUOTE="jalexbrown"] You cannot resist me...DEBATE!jalexbrown

perfect balance? everything seems pretty chaotic to me..

anyways, if there is some sort of creator, i really don't care. I've felt no sort of divine love or divine anything for that matter.. so i see no reason to worship or even care about something that doesn't affect me at all

I don't believe in God simply because I don't find the "evidence" presented to me credible. It's almost laughable actually.HoolaHoopMan

It's very simple.

Do you believe in the pink elephant that lives in space? No? Why? You can't see him? But he's there, I assure you. He guides all creation in the universe, he guides your life and loves you and anything you can't explain he is the cause of. He makes life, and he makes life meaningful.

You still don't believe in him?

Well neither do I.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]I don't believe in God simply because I don't find the "evidence" presented to me credible. It's almost laughable actually.GTbiking4life

ahh okay........zZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz snore

It's very simple.

Do you believe in the pink elephant that lives in space? No? Why? You can't see him? But he's there, I assure you. He guides all creation in the universe, he guides your life and loves you and anything you can't explain he is the cause of. He makes life, and he makes life meaningful.

You still don't believe in him?

Well neither do I.

DigitalExile

[QUOTE="GTbiking4life"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]I don't believe in God simply because I don't find the "evidence" presented to me credible. It's almost laughable actually.jalexbrown

Don't let it bother you. Mind your own business and aint the business of others.Hemmaroids

Jesus gets tough sins out. That's all I have to say on the matter.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]I don't believe in God simply because I don't find the "evidence" presented to me credible. It's almost laughable actually.GTbiking4life

[QUOTE="DigitalExile"]

It's very simple.

Do you believe in the pink elephant that lives in space? No? Why? You can't see him? But he's there, I assure you. He guides all creation in the universe, he guides your life and loves you and anything you can't explain he is the cause of. He makes life, and he makes life meaningful.

You still don't believe in him?

Well neither do I.

GTbiking4life

The only difference is it's less accepted.

[QUOTE="GTbiking4life"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]I don't believe in God simply because I don't find the "evidence" presented to me credible. It's almost laughable actually.HoolaHoopMan

[QUOTE="GTbiking4life"][QUOTE="DigitalExile"]

It's very simple.

Do you believe in the pink elephant that lives in space? No? Why? You can't see him? But he's there, I assure you. He guides all creation in the universe, he guides your life and loves you and anything you can't explain he is the cause of. He makes life, and he makes life meaningful.

You still don't believe in him?

Well neither do I.

DigitalExile

The only difference is it's less accepted.

I am a Christian and I feel completely embarrassed by posts like this. Please if you want to have a discussion about your faith, at least know the basic theology behind it. Learn a little bit about your beliefs before you want to share. Open your Bible and actually read it. Stop relying on the same Bible stories to try to force your ideas on people use actual Gospel sharing techniques in a loving way that is open to discussion. The fact that you don't know what omnipotent means is completely incredible. I am sorry everybody and if you would actually like to discuss please feel free to ask me anything.

[QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]I don't believe in God simply because I don't find the "evidence" presented to me credible. It's almost laughable actually.GTbiking4life

[QUOTE="DigitalExile"]

[QUOTE="GTbiking4life"] Nope. Don't believe in a pink elephant that lives in space. Let's move on now....GTbiking4life

The only difference is it's less accepted.

I am a Christian and I feel completely embarrassed by posts like this. Please if you want to have a discussion about your faith, at least know the basic theology behind it. Learn a little bit about your beliefs before you want to share. Open your Bible and actually read it. Stop relying on the same Bible stories to try to force your ideas on people use actual Gospel sharing techniques in a loving way that is open to discussion. The fact that you don't know what omnipotent means is completely incredible. I am sorry everybody and if you would actually like to discuss please feel free to ask me anything.

fbstar57

[QUOTE="GTbiking4life"][QUOTE="HoolaHoopMan"]I don't believe in God simply because I don't find the "evidence" presented to me credible. It's almost laughable actually.Bloodseeker23

I'm on the side of the argument that does not believe in pink elephants...lol. Seriously though...why do I need to pick a side? What do you mean you skipped over all 1000 or so posts??? It shouldn't take that much time to read 'em...pure laziness I say, pure laziness.GTbiking4life

Why don't you believe in pink elephants?

[QUOTE="GTbiking4life"] I'm on the side of the argument that does not believe in pink elephants...lol. Seriously though...why do I need to pick a side? What do you mean you skipped over all 1000 or so posts??? It shouldn't take that much time to read 'em...pure laziness I say, pure laziness.DigitalExile

Why don't you believe in pink elephants?