you refuse to worship a violent god?
fine, I refuse to cling to an idea that has killed 100,000,000 people over the past 200 years
I refuse to worship such a violent god.
This topic is locked from further discussion.
The topic creator takes things too literally. :lol:
Total-KO
Seems like millions of people do. Little do they know is that the whole bible is just another book about astrology and myths.
If you read the bible after studying history of ancient Egypt, physics of planetary motion and a bit of cosmology - you will understand what God is, where it came from and why it was so important to the people in the past.
[QUOTE="Total-KO"]The topic creator takes things too literally. :lol:
aliend
Seems like millions of people do. Little do they know is that the whole bible is just another book about astrology and myths.
If you read the bible after studying history of ancient Egypt, physics of planetary motion and a bit of cosmology - you will understand what God is, where it came from and why it was so important to the people in the past.
yup, as well as the zodiac sign :)
Yes, I also refuse to worship any God who creates a hell for 'sinners' to be imprisoned, since I'm determined in the belief that even criminals deserve a place in heaven (if it exists).deepdreamer256
I agree, I see it just as a big waste of time and everything else to create a race that hates him, to create good and evil and for us to be able to do which ever as we want. And for him to send his own creation to hell till the end of times.
[QUOTE="diz360"]There is no pretence here. I did provide some evidence. Why resort to shouting?
How did I insult you?
One aspect - i.e. the entire old testament... There are plenty more, verses supporting jesus teaching old testament, as you concede yourself.
Why don't you play by your own rules and provide some verses?
Being offended and brushing away the gospel's "truth", while providing no evidence yourself does little to substantiate your argument in any way.
LJS9502_basic
1. It's called empahisis dude.
2. Reread the posts.
3. I didn't concede that. I stated that the only tie is between the promise made and Jesus being the fulfillment. That's exactly one aspect. One.
4. I gave you three examples....to your one.;)
1. I think your "emphasis" and tone come across as angry. Please don't be angry. Ta.
2. Was the insult to call you lazy? I stand by that comment, as you could not be bothered to look up the verse (Luke 24:27) in your bible.
3. OK -
Jesus did change some of the old testament teachings.
LJS9502_basic
I agree - you didn't concede that. You conceded that there were verses supporting jesus' teachings of the old testament, by implication of your above statement. Otherwise you would not have used the words "some of" in your quote.
I gave you a quote that you asked for (Chapter and verse), I got none of that from you, just inexplicable vagueary in response to my quote. For instance I can't understand about where "promise" and "fulfilment" come into it. I can't see they could be construed as "one aspect", what it is and why it matters.
4. Your bits from the bible, that you say jesus "changed" between testaments, were these:
You may want to look at his quotes in regard to pharisees and the law...the question of divorce....and working on the sabbath.
LJS9502_basic
OK, I have:
Sabbath - wrong
Divorce - wrong
Pharases and Law - wrong - Matthew 5:17
(These are all links to partial, religious sites)
Please give as you ask for, and provide at least some verse numbers we can discuss.
the bible is a spiritual book. when God wrote the bible, it was meant to have meaning to people with almost no understanding of science. that's one of the things youhave to understand when trying to interpret the bible. you have to understand the target audience. YOU are not the target audience.behind the details ofa story, there is a deep spiritual meaning that one could apply to his/her lifeWhy are you guys wasting your time discussing Christianity and God?
The Bible says the Earth is 6000 years old, and that the Earth is flat. 'Nuff said.
ab1205
[QUOTE="ab1205"]the bible is a spiritual book. when God wrote the bible, it was meant to have meaning to people with almost no understanding of science. that's one of the things youhave to understand when trying to interpret the bible. you have to understand the target audience. YOU are not the target audience.behind the details ofa story, there is a deep spiritual meaning that one could apply to his/her lifeWhy are you guys wasting your time discussing Christianity and God?
The Bible says the Earth is 6000 years old, and that the Earth is flat. 'Nuff said.
mig_killer2
Spirituality is a bunch of bull. When God says something, He means it (if He exists). If it's a book of spirituality, then it's a fantasy book. The 3 little pigs is also a story that has a moral behind it.
The target audience must have been a bunch of dumb people that would believe anything.
The Bible has nothing to argue about, it's a waste of time. The Koran however is a bit more tricky, it has some verses that can be interpreted differently, and they say that Mohammed was the first to know these Scientific discoveries (when non-prophets, aka Greek Philosophers knew most of the stuff in the Koran, such as embyrology, life from water, etc).
Besides, original Greek Manuscripts of the Bible have been found to be almost entirely different from the Bible we have today. Heard of the Dead Sea scrolls?
I read every page of this thread, twice.FaceMelter93
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
Why are you guys wasting your time discussing Christianity and God?
The Bible says the Earth is 6000 years old, and that the Earth is flat. 'Nuff said.
ab1205
Its wrong to argue with religion on its own terms, I know.
It can be so easily done though - there are always plenty of different interpretations for the passages and incosistancies in the book. Its a book that often seems to disagree with itself.
Another reason, aside from authenticity, not to believe it.
[QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.Theempire30
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
I was being sarcastic.
But, the list of famous athiests in the video was interesting.
[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="ab1205"]the bible is a spiritual book. when God wrote the bible, it was meant to have meaning to people with almost no understanding of science. that's one of the things youhave to understand when trying to interpret the bible. you have to understand the target audience. YOU are not the target audience.behind the details ofa story, there is a deep spiritual meaning that one could apply to his/her lifeWhy are you guys wasting your time discussing Christianity and God?
The Bible says the Earth is 6000 years old, and that the Earth is flat. 'Nuff said.
ab1205
Spirituality is a bunch of bull. When God says something, He means it (if He exists). If it's a book of spirituality, then it's a fantasy book. The 3 little pigs is also a story that has a moral behind it.
The target audience must have been a bunch of dumb people that would believe anything.
The Bible has nothing to argue about, it's a waste of time. The Koran however is a bit more tricky, it has some verses that can be interpreted differently, and they say that Mohammed was the first to know these Scientific discoveries (when non-prophets, aka Greek Philosophers knew most of the stuff in the Koran, such as embyrology, life from water, etc).
Besides, original Greek Manuscripts of the Bible have been found to be almost entirely different from the Bible we have today. Heard of the Dead Sea scrolls?
yes. I have heard of the dead sea scrolls. the dead sea scrolls contain the entire book of isaiah. the book of isaiah in the dead sea scrolls is identical to the book of isaiah found in the king james version of the bible (of course the king james bible was written in old english and the dead sea scrolls were written in hebrew:P) BTW, the koran, I personally woulden't trust the koran. but hey, thats just me. the reason I'd never follow the koran or islam is because the entire koran, the ENTIRE koran was written by only 1 person. the Bible however was written by 40 different people. none of them contradict eachother on major biblical truthes (except for differences between the old and the new testament of course)[QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.Theempire30
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etcThe Koran however is a bit more tricky, it has some verses that can be interpreted differently, and they say that Mohammed was the first to know these Scientific discoveries (when non-prophets, aka Greek Philosophers knew most of the stuff in the Koran, such as embyrology, life from water, etc).
Besides, original Greek Manuscripts of the Bible have been found to be almost entirely different from the Bible we have today. Heard of the Dead Sea scrolls?
ab1205
I see the koran being no more tricky than the bible to rebut. It is based on the same original scripts. The scientific "truths" can be explained rationally. Evidence of greek, Indian and Egytian embryology ideas being known in koranic times is widespread.
The koran is open to huge interpretation - both moderates and extremists read fro the same book.
[QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.mig_killer2
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etc*hands flame shield*
[QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.mig_killer2
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etcthey didn't do the stuff in the name of atheism. Christians/Muslims murdered in the NAME of GOD.
Name one atheist that did what he did because he didn't believe in God, or said "kill the God worshippers" or something...lol.
Atheism isn't a religion, it's just a belief concerning disbelief in God.
[QUOTE="ab1205"]
The Koran however is a bit more tricky, it has some verses that can be interpreted differently, and they say that Mohammed was the first to know these Scientific discoveries (when non-prophets, aka Greek Philosophers knew most of the stuff in the Koran, such as embyrology, life from water, etc).
Besides, original Greek Manuscripts of the Bible have been found to be almost entirely different from the Bible we have today. Heard of the Dead Sea scrolls?
diz360
I see the koran being no more tricky than the bible to rebut. It is based on the same original scripts. The scientific "truths" can be explained rationally. Evidence of greek, Indian and Egytian embryology ideas being known in koranic times is widespread.
The koran is open to huge interpretation - both moderates and extremists read fro the same book.
I know but most Muslims always back up the Koran with the famous embryology part, then what you mention a Greek philosopher,etc they go "who?" lol.
At least the Koran can trick people. The Bible can't even trick people, it says the Earth is flat right there!
Who is the leading Christian Scientist today?
Dr. Francis Collins, who leads the Human Genome Project.
What does he believe? He believes evolution is a fact, and that "God did not intervine in the Universe after He created it, because there was no need to". So he pretty much uses the Bible for spirituality, that's it, even though he believes it's not divine.
Now where's all the other Christians? They're still argueing over "the fake evolution".
yes. I have heard of the dead sea scrolls. the dead sea scrolls contain the entire book of isaiah. the book of isaiah in the dead sea scrolls is identical to the book of isaiah found in the king james version of the bible (of course the king james bible was written in old english and the dead sea scrolls were written in hebrew:P) BTW, the koran, I personally woulden't trust the koran. but hey, thats just me. the reason I'd never follow the koran or islam is because the entire koran, the ENTIRE koran was written by only 1 person. the Bible however was written by 40 different people. none of them contradict eachother on major biblical truthes (except for differences between the old and the new testament of course)mig_killer2
The dead sea scrolls contain much more than just Isiah. New stories of Abraham, Enoch and Noah, new psalms and the oldest versions of deutronimy. for example. Prophecies by Ezekiel, Jeremiah and Daniel not found in the Bible are written in the Scrolls too.
The scrolls were also written in hebrew and arameic.
[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.ab1205
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etcthey didn't do the stuff in the name of atheism. Christians/Muslims murdered in the NAME of GOD.
Name one atheist that did what he did because he didn't believe in God, or said "kill the God worshippers" or something...lol.
Atheism isn't a religion, it's just a belief concerning disbelief in God.
athiesm is a hallmark of communism[QUOTE="ab1205"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.mig_killer2
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etcthey didn't do the stuff in the name of atheism. Christians/Muslims murdered in the NAME of GOD.
Name one atheist that did what he did because he didn't believe in God, or said "kill the God worshippers" or something...lol.
Atheism isn't a religion, it's just a belief concerning disbelief in God.
athiesm is a hallmark of communismcommunism LOL
Communism isn't a religion, it's a political agenda. Why are we involving religious beliefs with a political agenda? It's called nonsense, rubbish, and trying to put words in other people's mouths.
Ever heard of the peaceful Buddhism? They don't believe in a God and can be related to atheists in that aspect.
Once again, never ever bring politics and religion in the same discussion, it's one of the bigger rules.
[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="ab1205"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.ab1205
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etcthey didn't do the stuff in the name of atheism. Christians/Muslims murdered in the NAME of GOD.
Name one atheist that did what he did because he didn't believe in God, or said "kill the God worshippers" or something...lol.
Atheism isn't a religion, it's just a belief concerning disbelief in God.
athiesm is a hallmark of communismcommunism LOL
Communism isn't a religion, it's a political agenda. Why are we involving religious beliefs with a political agenda? It's called nonsense, rubbish, and trying to put words in other people's mouths.
Ever heard of the peaceful Buddhism? They don't believe in a God and can be related to atheists in that aspect.
Once again, never ever bring politics and religion in the same discussion, it's one of the bigger rules.
communists in the USSR were athiests. they were persecuting people because they practiced religion. how are they not motivated by atheism?Just thought I would share more versus.
Here is the one talking about the flat earth.
Revelation 7: 1
And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
How can there be four corners when the earth is round?
Here are some more violent ones.
"Take your son, your only son - yes, Isaac, whom you love so much - and go to the land of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains, which I will point out to you." [Genesis 22:1-18]
Sounds swell to tell the man that has followed everything his "god" told him to do to sacrifice his son...
This one is pretty big but just makes me see even more how violent god is.
"So Jephthah led his army against the Ammonites, and the LORD gave him victory. He thoroughly defeated the Ammonites from Aroer to an area near Minnith - twenty towns - and as far away as Abel-keramim. Thus Israel subdued the Ammonites. When Jephthah returned home to Mizpah, his daughter - his only child - ran out to meet him, playing on a tambourine and dancing for joy. When he saw her, he tore his clothes in anguish. "My daughter!" he cried out. "My heart is breaking! What a tragedy that you came out to greet me. For I have made a vow to the LORD and cannot take it back." And she said, "Father, you have made a promise to the LORD. You must do to me what you have promised, for the LORD has given you a great victory over your enemies, the Ammonites. But first let me go up and roam in the hills and weep with my friends for two months, because I will die a virgin." "You may go," Jephthah said. And he let her go away for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never have children. When she returned home, her father kept his vow, and she died a virgin. So it has become a custom in Israel for young Israelite women to go away for four days each year to lament the fate of Jephthah's daughter." (Judges 11:29-40 NLT)
Some more here.
The one who has stolen what was set apart for destruction will himself be burned with fire, along with everything he has, for he has broken the covenant of the LORD and has done a horrible thing in Israel." (Joshua 7:15 NLT)
"I have wiped out many nations, devastating their fortress walls and towers. Their cities are now deserted; their streets are in silent ruin. There are no survivors to even tell what happened. I thought, 'Surely they will have reverence for me now! Surely they will listen to my warnings, so I won't need to strike again.' But no; however much I punish them, they continue their evil practices from dawn till dusk and dusk till dawn." So now the LORD says: "Be patient; the time is coming soon when I will stand up and accuse these evil nations. For it is my decision to gather together the kingdoms of the earth and pour out my fiercest anger and fury on them. All the earth will be devoured by the fire of my jealousy. "On that day I will purify the lips of all people, so that everyone will be able to worship the LORD together. My scattered people who live beyond the rivers of Ethiopia will come to present their offerings. (Zephaniah 3:6-10 NLT)
Sounds very mad and jealous to be the almighty perfect creator.
Just thought I would share more versus.
Here is the one talking about the flat earth.
Revelation 7: 1
And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
How can there be four corners when the earth is round?
Four hemispheres?
Here are some more violent ones.
"Take your son, your only son - yes, Isaac, whom you love so much - and go to the land of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains, which I will point out to you." [Genesis 22:1-18]
God stopped Abraham from killing Issac
Sounds swell to tell the man that has followed everything his "god" told him to do to sacrifice his son...
This one is pretty big but just makes me see even more how violent god is.
"So Jephthah led his army against the Ammonites, and the LORD gave him victory. He thoroughly defeated the Ammonites from Aroer to an area near Minnith - twenty towns - and as far away as Abel-keramim. Thus Israel subdued the Ammonites. When Jephthah returned home to Mizpah, his daughter - his only child - ran out to meet him, playing on a tambourine and dancing for joy. When he saw her, he tore his clothes in anguish. "My daughter!" he cried out. "My heart is breaking! What a tragedy that you came out to greet me. For I have made a vow to the LORD and cannot take it back." And she said, "Father, you have made a promise to the LORD. You must do to me what you have promised, for the LORD has given you a great victory over your enemies, the Ammonites. But first let me go up and roam in the hills and weep with my friends for two months, because I will die a virgin." "You may go," Jephthah said. And he let her go away for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never have children. When she returned home, her father kept his vow, and she died a virgin. So it has become a custom in Israel for young Israelite women to go away for four days each year to lament the fate of Jephthah's daughter." (Judges 11:29-40 NLT)
Some more here.
The one who has stolen what was set apart for destruction will himself be burned with fire, along with everything he has, for he has broken the covenant of the LORD and has done a horrible thing in Israel." (Joshua 7:15 NLT)
"I have wiped out many nations, devastating their fortress walls and towers. Their cities are now deserted; their streets are in silent ruin. There are no survivors to even tell what happened. I thought, 'Surely they will have reverence for me now! Surely they will listen to my warnings, so I won't need to strike again.' But no; however much I punish them, they continue their evil practices from dawn till dusk and dusk till dawn." So now the LORD says: "Be patient; the time is coming soon when I will stand up and accuse these evil nations. For it is my decision to gather together the kingdoms of the earth and pour out my fiercest anger and fury on them. All the earth will be devoured by the fire of my jealousy. "On that day I will purify the lips of all people, so that everyone will be able to worship the LORD together. My scattered people who live beyond the rivers of Ethiopia will come to present their offerings. (Zephaniah 3:6-10 NLT)
Sounds very mad and jealous to be the almighty perfect creator.
Theempire30
[QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.mig_killer2
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etcHmmm and you know who was a Christian?
Hitler...
a) Hitler was baptized as Roman Catholic during infancy in Austria
b) Hitler was a communicant and an altar boy in the Catholic Church
c) Hitler was NEVER excommunicated nor condemned by his church. Matter of fact the Church felt he was JUST and "avenging for God" in attacking the Jews for they deemed the Semites the killers of Jesus.
[QUOTE="Theempire30"]Just thought I would share more versus.
Here is the one talking about the flat earth.
Revelation 7: 1
And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
How can there be four corners when the earth is round?
Four hemispheres?
Here are some more violent ones.
"Take your son, your only son - yes, Isaac, whom you love so much - and go to the land of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains, which I will point out to you." [Genesis 22:1-18]
God stopped Abraham from killing Issac
Sounds swell to tell the man that has followed everything his "god" told him to do to sacrifice his son...
This one is pretty big but just makes me see even more how violent god is.
"So Jephthah led his army against the Ammonites, and the LORD gave him victory. He thoroughly defeated the Ammonites from Aroer to an area near Minnith - twenty towns - and as far away as Abel-keramim. Thus Israel subdued the Ammonites. When Jephthah returned home to Mizpah, his daughter - his only child - ran out to meet him, playing on a tambourine and dancing for joy. When he saw her, he tore his clothes in anguish. "My daughter!" he cried out. "My heart is breaking! What a tragedy that you came out to greet me. For I have made a vow to the LORD and cannot take it back." And she said, "Father, you have made a promise to the LORD. You must do to me what you have promised, for the LORD has given you a great victory over your enemies, the Ammonites. But first let me go up and roam in the hills and weep with my friends for two months, because I will die a virgin." "You may go," Jephthah said. And he let her go away for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never have children. When she returned home, her father kept his vow, and she died a virgin. So it has become a custom in Israel for young Israelite women to go away for four days each year to lament the fate of Jephthah's daughter." (Judges 11:29-40 NLT)
Some more here.
The one who has stolen what was set apart for destruction will himself be burned with fire, along with everything he has, for he has broken the covenant of the LORD and has done a horrible thing in Israel."(Joshua 7:15 NLT)
"I have wiped out many nations, devastating their fortress walls and towers. Their cities are now deserted; their streets are in silent ruin. There are no survivors to even tell what happened. I thought, 'Surely they will have reverence for me now! Surely they will listen to my warnings, so I won't need to strike again.' But no; however much I punish them, they continue their evil practices from dawn till dusk and dusk till dawn." So now the LORD says: "Be patient; the time is coming soon when I will stand up and accuse these evil nations. For it is my decision to gather together the kingdoms of the earth and pour out my fiercest anger and fury on them. All the earth will be devoured by the fire of my jealousy. "On that day I will purify the lips of all people, so that everyone will be able to worship the LORD together. My scattered people who live beyond the rivers of Ethiopia will come to present their offerings. (Zephaniah 3:6-10 NLT)
Sounds very mad and jealous to be the almighty perfect creator.
mig_killer2
True he did stop Abraham. But why put him threw all that trouble, why make him feel so bad for absolutely nothing.
[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.Theempire30
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etcHmmm and you know who was a Christian?
Hitler...
a) Hitler was baptized as Roman Catholic during infancy in Austria
b) Hitler was a communicant and an altar boy in the Catholic Church
c) Hitler was NEVER excommunicated nor condemned by his church. Matter of fact the Church felt he was JUST and "avenging for God" in attacking the Jews for they deemed the Semites the killers of Jesus.
Death Toll by Hitler 12,000,000
Death toll by Stalin: 20,000,000
Death toll by Mao Tse Tung: 40,000,000
Hitler didn't kill people in the name of God.
[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Theempire30"]Just thought I would share more versus.
Here is the one talking about the flat earth.
Revelation 7: 1
And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.
How can there be four corners when the earth is round?
Four hemispheres?
Here are some more violent ones.
"Take your son, your only son - yes, Isaac, whom you love so much - and go to the land of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains, which I will point out to you." [Genesis 22:1-18]
God stopped Abraham from killing Issac
Sounds swell to tell the man that has followed everything his "god" told him to do to sacrifice his son...
This one is pretty big but just makes me see even more how violent god is.
"So Jephthah led his army against the Ammonites, and the LORD gave him victory. He thoroughly defeated the Ammonites from Aroer to an area near Minnith - twenty towns - and as far away as Abel-keramim. Thus Israel subdued the Ammonites. When Jephthah returned home to Mizpah, his daughter - his only child - ran out to meet him, playing on a tambourine and dancing for joy. When he saw her, he tore his clothes in anguish. "My daughter!" he cried out. "My heart is breaking! What a tragedy that you came out to greet me. For I have made a vow to the LORD and cannot take it back." And she said, "Father, you have made a promise to the LORD. You must do to me what you have promised, for the LORD has given you a great victory over your enemies, the Ammonites. But first let me go up and roam in the hills and weep with my friends for two months, because I will die a virgin." "You may go," Jephthah said. And he let her go away for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never have children. When she returned home, her father kept his vow, and she died a virgin. So it has become a custom in Israel for young Israelite women to go away for four days each year to lament the fate of Jephthah's daughter." (Judges 11:29-40 NLT)
Some more here.
The one who has stolen what was set apart for destruction will himself be burned with fire, along with everything he has, for he has broken the covenant of the LORD and has done a horrible thing in Israel."(Joshua 7:15 NLT)
"I have wiped out many nations, devastating their fortress walls and towers. Their cities are now deserted; their streets are in silent ruin. There are no survivors to even tell what happened. I thought, 'Surely they will have reverence for me now! Surely they will listen to my warnings, so I won't need to strike again.' But no; however much I punish them, they continue their evil practices from dawn till dusk and dusk till dawn." So now the LORD says: "Be patient; the time is coming soon when I will stand up and accuse these evil nations. For it is my decision to gather together the kingdoms of the earth and pour out my fiercest anger and fury on them. All the earth will be devoured by the fire of my jealousy. "On that day I will purify the lips of all people, so that everyone will be able to worship the LORD together. My scattered people who live beyond the rivers of Ethiopia will come to present their offerings. (Zephaniah 3:6-10 NLT)
Sounds very mad and jealous to be the almighty perfect creator.
Theempire30
True he did stop Abraham. But why put him threw all that trouble, why make him feel so bad for absolutely nothing.
test his faith in god:?[QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.mig_killer2
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etcHmmm and you know who was a Christian?
Hitler...
a) Hitler was baptized as Roman Catholic during infancy in Austria
b) Hitler was a communicant and an altar boy in the Catholic Church
c) Hitler was NEVER excommunicated nor condemned by his church. Matter of fact the Church felt he was JUST and "avenging for God" in attacking the Jews for they deemed the Semites the killers of Jesus.
Death Toll by Hitler 12,000,000
Death toll by Stalin: 20,000,000
Death toll by Mao Tse Tung: 40,000,000
Hitler didn't kill people in the name of God.
Your kidding right? Hitler is responsible for World War 2=60 Million people.
And last time I checked Stalin and Mao Tse Tung dint kill in the name of science either.
You will never see a Church preaching to kill others, and most do not follow the Bibile word for word.
But ok, you don't need to worship Him. No one said you have too.
limpbizkit818
Then they are wrong. It is the word of God. You can't just pick and choose the parts you like. You either follow all of it, or none of it.
[QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="mig_killer2"][QUOTE="Theempire30"][QUOTE="FaceMelter93"]I read every page of this thread, twice.Theempire30
It's a very good discussion.
I highly recommend you guys watch this.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU
hmmm. very interesting video. You know who else were athiests? Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao Tse Tung, those 2 boys who shot up columbine, etc. etcHmmm and you know who was a Christian?
Hitler...
a) Hitler was baptized as Roman Catholic during infancy in Austria
b) Hitler was a communicant and an altar boy in the Catholic Church
c) Hitler was NEVER excommunicated nor condemned by his church. Matter of fact the Church felt he was JUST and "avenging for God" in attacking the Jews for they deemed the Semites the killers of Jesus.
Death Toll by Hitler 12,000,000
Death toll by Stalin: 20,000,000
Death toll by Mao Tse Tung: 40,000,000
Hitler didn't kill people in the name of God.
Your kidding right? Hitler is responsible for World War 2=60 Million people.
And last time I checked Stalin and Mao Tse Tung dint kill in the name of science either.
athiesm=hallmark of communismTrue he did stop Abraham. But why put him threw all that trouble, why make him feel so bad for absolutely nothing.
test his faith in god:?If god is perfect there be no point in checking on his believers on how strong their faith is since he created them...I would think the almighty creator would know if Abraham was worshiping a rock or something.
Here is the one talking about the flat earth.Revelation 7: 1And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. How can there be four corners when the earth is round?Theempire30That is a mataphor that is STILL used today!
Uh, read the rest of the way. That verse, like all the others you point out, are EXTREMELY out of context. God told Abraham to STOP the sacrifise, and told him that He never even WANTED a sacrifise!Here are some more violent ones."Take your son, your only son - yes, Isaac, whom you love so much - and go to the land of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains, which I will point out to you." [Genesis 22:1-18]Sounds swell to tell the man that has followed everything his "god" told him to do to sacrifice his son...
Yet another verse out of context. The man promised God, himself, and his people that he would sacrifise his daughter if they won. Back then, if he did not keep his promise, he would die. Also, the daughter was not an unwilling sacrifise, so it really does not matter.This one is pretty big but just makes me see even more how violent god is."So Jephthah led his army against the Ammonites, and the LORD gave him victory. He thoroughly defeated the Ammonites from Aroer to an area near Minnith - twenty towns - and as far away as Abel-keramim. Thus Israel subdued the Ammonites. When Jephthah returned home to Mizpah, his daughter - his only child - ran out to meet him, playing on a tambourine and dancing for joy. When he saw her, he tore his clothes in anguish. "My daughter!" he cried out. "My heart is breaking! What a tragedy that you came out to greet me. For I have made a vow to the LORD and cannot take it back." And she said, "Father, you have made a promise to the LORD. You must do to me what you have promised, for the LORD has given you a great victory over your enemies, the Ammonites. But first let me go up and roam in the hills and weep with my friends for two months, because I will die a virgin." "You may go," Jephthah said. And he let her go away for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never have children. When she returned home, her father kept his vow, and she died a virgin. So it has become a custom in Israel for young Israelite women to go away for four days each year to lament the fate of Jephthah's daughter." (Judges 11:29-40 NLT)
Um, He said He would wipe out evil.:| How is that bad?Learn to get some verses in context.;)ome more here.The one who has stolen what was set apart for destruction will himself be burned with fire, along with everything he has, for he has broken the covenant of the LORD and has done a horrible thing in Israel." (Joshua 7:15 NLT) "I have wiped out many nations, devastating their fortress walls and towers. Their cities are now deserted; their streets are in silent ruin. There are no survivors to even tell what happened. I thought, 'Surely they will have reverence for me now! Surely they will listen to my warnings, so I won't need to strike again.' But no; however much I punish them, they continue their evil practices from dawn till dusk and dusk till dawn." So now the LORD says: "Be patient; the time is coming soon when I will stand up and accuse these evil nations. For it is my decision to gather together the kingdoms of the earth and pour out my fiercest anger and fury on them. All the earth will be devoured by the fire of my jealousy. "On that day I will purify the lips of all people, so that everyone will be able to worship the LORD together. My scattered people who live beyond the rivers of Ethiopia will come to present their offerings. (Zephaniah 3:6-10 NLT) Sounds very mad and jealous to be the almighty perfect creator.
Theempire30
True he did stop Abraham. But why put him threw all that trouble, why make him feel so bad for absolutely nothing.
test his faith in god:?If god is perfect there be no point in checking on his believers on how strong their faith is since he created them...I would think the almighty creator would know if Abraham was worshiping a rock or something.
how much would that help us? "and God checked abrahams faith". how does that story apply to us?If god is perfect there be no point in checking on his believers on how strong their faith is since he created them...I would think the almighty creator would know if Abraham was worshiping a rock or something.
Theempire30
The test was for Abraham, not God.;)
[QUOTE="limpbizkit818"]You will never see a Church preaching to kill others, and most do not follow the Bibile word for word.
But ok, you don't need to worship Him. No one said you have too.
Gamer556
Then they are wrong. It is the word of God. You can't just pick and choose the parts you like. You either follow all of it, or none of it.
How interesting that an ATHEIST is telling people what to believe and how to believe. . .:roll:
[QUOTE="mig_killer2"] atheism=hallmark of communismdiz360
Agreed - in so much as:
christian theism=hallmark of fascism
nazism was deeply rooted in norse mythology[QUOTE="Theempire30"] Here is the one talking about the flat earth.Revelation 7: 1And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. How can there be four corners when the earth is round?Silver_Dragon17That is a mataphor that is STILL used today!
Uh, read the rest of the way. That verse, like all the others you point out, are EXTREMELY out of context. God told Abraham to STOP the sacrifise, and told him that He never even WANTED a sacrifise!Here are some more violent ones."Take your son, your only son - yes, Isaac, whom you love so much - and go to the land of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains, which I will point out to you."[Genesis 22:1-18]Sounds swell to tell the man that has followed everything his "god" told him to do to sacrifice his son...
Yet another verse out of context. The man promised God, himself, and his people that he would sacrifise his daughter if they won. Back then, if he did not keep his promise, he would die. Also, the daughter was not an unwilling sacrifise, so it really does not matter.This one is pretty big but just makes me see even more how violent god is."So Jephthah led his army against the Ammonites, and the LORD gave him victory. He thoroughly defeated the Ammonites from Aroer to an area near Minnith - twenty towns - and as far away as Abel-keramim. Thus Israel subdued the Ammonites. When Jephthah returned home to Mizpah, his daughter - his only child - ran out to meet him, playing on a tambourine and dancing for joy. When he saw her, he tore his clothes in anguish. "My daughter!" he cried out. "My heart is breaking! What a tragedy that you came out to greet me. For I have made a vow to the LORD and cannot take it back." And she said, "Father, you have made a promise to the LORD. You must do to me what you have promised, for the LORD has given you a great victory over your enemies, the Ammonites. But first let me go up and roam in the hills and weep with my friends for two months, because I will die a virgin." "You may go," Jephthah said. And he let her go away for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never have children. When she returned home, her father kept his vow, and she died a virgin. So it has become a custom in Israel for young Israelite women to go away for four days each year to lament the fate of Jephthah's daughter." (Judges 11:29-40 NLT)
Um, He said He would wipe out evil.:| How is that bad?Learn to get some verses in context.;)ome more here.The one who has stolen what was set apart for destruction will himself be burned with fire, along with everything he has, for he has broken the covenant of the LORD and has done a horrible thing in Israel."(Joshua 7:15 NLT) "I have wiped out many nations, devastating their fortress walls and towers. Their cities are now deserted; their streets are in silent ruin. There are no survivors to even tell what happened. I thought, 'Surely they will have reverence for me now! Surely they will listen to my warnings, so I won't need to strike again.' But no; however much I punish them, they continue their evil practices from dawn till dusk and dusk till dawn." So now the LORD says: "Be patient; the time is coming soon when I will stand up and accuse these evil nations. For it is my decision to gather together the kingdoms of the earth and pour out my fiercest anger and fury on them. All the earth will be devoured by the fire of my jealousy. "On that day I will purify the lips of all people, so that everyone will be able to worship the LORD together. My scattered people who live beyond the rivers of Ethiopia will come to present their offerings. (Zephaniah 3:6-10 NLT) Sounds very mad and jealous to be the almighty perfect creator.
They are in context...their taken out of the Bible.
How can you say the little girl dint matter? ITS A LIFE! Not even the father has the right to kill his own daughter. And for what a victory over some land?
Hmmm and you know who was a Christian?
Hitler...
a) Hitler was baptized as Roman Catholic during infancy in Austria
b) Hitler was a communicant and an altar boy in the Catholic Church
c) Hitler was NEVER excommunicated nor condemned by his church. Matter of fact the Church felt he was JUST and "avenging for God" in attacking the Jews for they deemed the Semites the killers of Jesus.
Theempire30
Hitler was NOT a Christian, and I can quote his own personal letters to prove it.
Baptism does not =Christian.:|
Communicant and alter boy does not = Christian.:|
The Church did not support or condemn Hitler The Church stayed out of it altogether, because it was futile for them to partake in a war they would surely lose.;)
They are in context...their taken out of the Bible.
How can you say the little girl dint matter? ITS A LIFE! Not even the father has the right to kill his own daughter. And for what a victory over some land?
Theempire30
That doesn't mean they're in context.:|:|:| When you take something out of context, you take something that means one thing and act like it means another thing by cutting out parts of it, like what you do. They are out of context.
The girl was not "little," she was a grown woman. And she was willing to die for her people. That's why it does not much matter. She was not sacrificed kicking and screaming, as the verse CLEARLY points out.
Give Sheeba the Hindi god a chance he has 8 arms and a good work ethic. Not to mention if you die in my religion u can always come back as something else which is nice.Last_Love_Song
Welcome to GameSpot, where religion threads aredominant and ignorance is truly bliss.:)
[QUOTE="Theempire30"]If god is perfect there be no point in checking on his believers on how strong their faith is since he created them...I would think the almighty creator would know if Abraham was worshiping a rock or something.
Silver_Dragon17
The test was for Abraham, not God.;)
I never said god was testing himself...or that Abraham was testing him. I just said that I see no point in making his believer almost kill his son. I mean wtf...if a voice told you that it was god and told you to kill the person you most love you would be either very confused, sad or just mad. Its ridicules for god to give these "tests" when they are orders to kill kids. Why not have him tested in another way that has nothing to do with blood.
[QUOTE="Silver_Dragon17"][QUOTE="Theempire30"]If god is perfect there be no point in checking on his believers on how strong their faith is since he created them...I would think the almighty creator would know if Abraham was worshiping a rock or something.
Theempire30
The test was for Abraham, not God.;)
I never said god was testing himself...or that Abraham was testing him. I just said that I see no point in making his believer almost kill his son. I mean wtf...if a voice told you that it was god and told you to kill the person you most love you would be either very confused, sad or just mad. Its ridicules for god to give these "tests" when they are orders to kill kids. Why not have him tested in another way that has nothing to do with blood.
I didn't say Abraham was testing God either.:|
NOBODY WAS KILLED! READ THE REST OF THE VERSE!!
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