Is the problem of evil sufficient to disprove God?

No.

/thread

No, no it isn't. Religion threads are a fad that needs to stop... now.

No it's not. Thread over.LJS9502_basic

What's this? LJ, the master debater doesn't want to talk religion? :o

No, no it isn't. Religion threads are a fad that needs to stop... now.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]No it's not. Thread over.scorch-62

What's this? LJ, the master debater doesn't want to talk religion? :o

If only the stopping of religious threads was so. But it will never happen.

There is a lot of evil and suffering in the world. Is the problem of evil and suffering sufficient to disprove God?X4D

No, if anything that kind-of proves there is a god.

[QUOTE="scorch-62"]No, no it isn't. Religion threads are a fad that needs to stop... now.ferrari2001

If only the stopping of religious threads was so. But it will never happen.

If Christians stopped making futile attempts at over-the-Internet conversions, there might not be any. As a Christian, you say that God gave you free will, so it's obviously malicious users that start the threads.If they paid any attention to what they fall back on the most, we might not have ever had any. At all. Ever.

Yes! :D

I just wanted to add some variation.

No, evil doesn't disprove a possible God...

But nothing proves it either. Everything is just a stupid little belief, God is for people who need a push to keep on living.

Meh, do whatever makes you happy.

No, no it isn't. Religion threads are a fad that needs to stop... now.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]No it's not. Thread over.scorch-62

What's this? LJ, the master debater doesn't want to talk religion? :o

But I gave the correct answer....:(

No, if anything that kind-of proves there is a god.

nirvana563

But how so?

[QUOTE="scorch-62"]

No, no it isn't. Religion threads are a fad that needs to stop... now.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]No it's not. Thread over.LJS9502_basic

What's this? LJ, the master debater doesn't want to talk religion? :o

But I gave the correct answer....:(

Pfft. I beg to differ.

Pfft. I beg to differ.

Funky_Llama

In my opinion the problem of evil disproves an all-caring all-powerful God because such a God would not allow so much evil to occur.

Why does this all powerful creator, all loving and caring intelligent designer, create Plagues, Tsunamis, Tornadoes, Volcanic Eruptions, Floods, Droughts, Wars, Earth Quakes, Cancers and hundreds of debilitating diseases and serious body malfunctions? There are 12,000 known diseases that affect and punish mankind indiscriminately. Why does he permit millions of both young and old to starve to death or die of miserable diseases? Why punish millions of INNOCENT CHILDREN in this horrible way?

Religion is things hoped for but not yet seen or proven. Science is things seen and proven but not necessarily hoped for.

The objective evidence is that no gods created man but quite the opposite; that man created numerous imaginary gods. Christians do not accept that man evolved over millions of years from other life forms but have no problem with man being created from dirt

There is no objective verifiable evidence for the existence of any real gods. It IS obvious all god beliefs are no more than the IMAGINATIONS of man.

There are a thousands different religious/god beliefs. If there was a REAL god, why would he permit all this misleading information to mislead and confuse his flock?

Man can communicate with the whole world via TV, Radio, Cell Phone and the Internet.

Certainly any real God should be able to do equally well! Why would he not announce directly from his heaven that he is the real god and all the others are fakes? Why would he not smite all the fakes?

No it's not. Thread over.LJS9502_basic

Absolutely not. The moralities of mere mortal's are of absolutely no concern to the supreme power. deepdreamer256

Absolutely not. The moralities of mere mortal's are of absolutely no concern to the supreme power. deepdreamer256

Are you a deist, by any chance?

No.

But this is proof against Creationism ...

No, no it isn't. Religion threads are a fad that needs to stop... now.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]No it's not. Thread over.scorch-62

What's this? LJ, the master debater doesn't want to talk religion? :o

hhahahaha thats all i read and started laughing really hard

Many christians can answer this question in many ways but the simple answer is No. If we didn't know wat evil was then we wouldn't know the greatness of good. God gave us free will, and the consequence is that some people will go against God's wishes and commit evil. God loves us but we humans need to love him back in a true, authentic way too. This comes at a price. We have to experience suffering to know how love works. In the Christian belief, Jesus died on the cross because He loved us. Jesus even suffered. Because we human beings suffer we can begin to empathize with Jesus, we begin to see that somebody suffered many times more than we could possible suffer due to His love for us. That is why love from free will will have more meaning than forced love. All this evil in the world must exist alongside goodness, God does not cause the evil, instead he allows us human beings to choose it.

I don't want to shove Christianity down your throats, but i wanted to give a Christian perspective on the issue.

[QUOTE="deepdreamer256"]Absolutely not. The moralities of mere mortal's are of absolutely no concern to the supreme power. Funky_Llama

Are you a deist, by any chance?

All this evil in the world must exist alongside goodness, God does not cause the evil, instead he allows us human beings to choose it.

I don't want to shove Christianity down your throats, but i wanted to give a Christian perspective on the issue.

The_Nintendawg

Really? Then why does this all powerful, all loving and caring God also create Plagues, Tsunamis, Tornadoes, Volcanic Eruptions, Floods, Droughts, Wars, Earth Quakes, Cancers and hundreds of debilitating diseases and serious body malfunctions which are not caused by man and are far beyond man's control? Face it. These things are not caused by man but yet still they punish mankind indiscriminately.

I challenge ANY god/religious believer to provide ANY objective verifiable evidence for the ACTUAL EXISTENCE of ANY god.

Subjective OPINIONS are not objective verifiable evidence! There are hundreds of different god/religious beliefs, If there was a real god, why would he permit his flock to be so grossly misled and confused??? Does ANYONE have objective verifiable evidence that there is any REAL god?

Many christians can answer this question in many ways but the simple answer is No. If we didn't know wat evil was then we wouldn't know the greatness of good. God gave us free will, and the consequence is that some people will go against God's wishes and commit evil. God loves us but we humans need to love him back in a true, authentic way too. This comes at a price. We have to experience suffering to know how love works. In the Christian belief, Jesus died on the cross because He loved us. Jesus even suffered. Because we human beings suffer we can begin to empathize with Jesus, we begin to see that somebody suffered many times more than we could possible suffer due to His love for us. That is why love from free will will have more meaning than forced love. All this evil in the world must exist alongside goodness, God does not cause the evil, instead he allows us human beings to choose it.

I don't want to shove Christianity down your throats, but i wanted to give a Christian perspective on the issue.

The_Nintendawg

No it's not. Thread over.LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]No it's not. Thread over.nickkcin10

I don't mind a thread that has some thought put into it. They don't come along very often, however...

OK, you guys look if you want physical actual proof of God, sorry but you are not going to find it. But Atheists, you all believe that there is no way there is a God. But you don't know that for sure. You guys cannot rule out the possibility of a God. Both sides of the argument will have to revolve around some faith.

Now for those who may acknowledge that there is a God, to understand why there is so much suffering depends on who's viewpoint you want to look at. Christian? Buddhist? Hindu? Muslim? But all in all it's a mystery of why there is so much suffering. God loves us very much but he's very wise, that's his part of his Perfect nature. You may think God is wrong, you may disagree with Him, but that isn't possible because God is Perfect. We humans are not perfect, we can't do the things God can, and as a result, we cannot understand some of the things that God does. It may very well be that the problem of evil is absolutely necessary to carry on the best plan that God has for all of us.

You may think God is wrong, you may disagree with Him, but that isn't possible because God is Perfect. We humans are not perfect, we can't do the things God can, and as a result, we cannot understand some of the things that God does. It may very well be that the problem of evil is absolutely necessary to carry on the best plan that God has for all of us.

The_Nintendawg

when the perfect one decides what counts as perfect, I'd say there's at least some chance of bias there.

Whatever the perfect one does, it's perfect, there is no biasThe_Nintendawg

but who says the perfect one is perfect?

OK, you guys look if you want physical actual proof of God, sorry but you are not going to find it. But Atheists, you all believe that there is no way there is a God. But you don't know that for sure. You guys cannot rule out the possibility of a God. Both sides of the argument will have to revolve around some faith.

Now for those who may acknowledge that there is a God, to understand why there is so much suffering depends on who's viewpoint you want to look at. Christian? Buddhist? Hindu? Muslim? But all in all it's a mystery of why there is so much suffering. God loves us very much but he's very wise, that's his part of his Perfect nature. You may think God is wrong, you may disagree with Him, but that isn't possible because God is Perfect. We humans are not perfect, we can't do the things God can, and as a result, we cannot understand some of the things that God does. It may very well be that the problem of evil is absolutely necessary to carry on the best plan that God has for all of us.

The_Nintendawg

So, no proof of a God. Thus, because of the principle of the Burden of Proof, it is natural to not believe in him.

Besides, there are plenty of flaws in theism, and the one here - the problem of evil - is apparently something to which you lack an answer.

it's the part of the definition of a God, one that is all-everything, everything He does is perfect. God cannot make mistakes or that would go against His nature.

I don't think you can actually prove that something doesn't exist, only that it is highly improbable that it exists.

Anyway, the answer to your question is no, because many would just argue that it is human's abuse of free will that created evil.

Whatever the perfect one does, it's perfect, there is no biasThe_Nintendawg

Humans are imperfect. God designed them. Thus God is an inept designer, and so not perfect.

[QUOTE="The_Nintendawg"]Whatever the perfect one does, it's perfect, there is no biasFunky_Llama

Humans are imperfect. God designed them. Thus God is an inept designer, and so not perfect.

And if God created man in his image, God is imperfect. Either that, or its the inverse: Man created God in their image, which makes a lot more sense than the other one.

[QUOTE="The_Nintendawg"]Whatever the perfect one does, it's perfect, there is no biasFunky_Llama

Humans are imperfect. God designed them. Thus God is an inept designer, and so not perfect.

God's original creation was perfect, but humans being brought imperfection to the world through their free will

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]

[QUOTE="The_Nintendawg"]Whatever the perfect one does, it's perfect, there is no biasThe_Nintendawg

Humans are imperfect. God designed them. Thus God is an inept designer, and so not perfect.

God's original creation was perfect, but humans being brought imperfection to the world through their free will

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]

[QUOTE="The_Nintendawg"]Whatever the perfect one does, it's perfect, there is no biasThe_Nintendawg

Humans are imperfect. God designed them. Thus God is an inept designer, and so not perfect.

God's original creation was perfect, but humans being brought imperfection to the world through their free will

Let me restate i screwd that post up

first of God's creation was perfect but not humans since that would defy God's nature. Only God is perfect. Humans later brought further imperfection into the world.

How can free will ruin perfection?Isn't being unflawed perfect?If so,then god giving humans free will was a flaw.Harshvardhan666