Obama = Weak on the "Spanking" issue?

I misread the title as 'Obama = Speak on the "Wanking" issue? I'm not even kidding. U_UFunky_Llama

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]People are shaped by life experiences. If one is taught consequences and right from wrong they are in a much better position. The only exception would be mental illness.

LJS9502_basic

This issue is too important to be redirected.

Spanking is wrong, because we are too stupid to use it properly... and instead use it as a way of proving ourselves right towards a person incapable of fighting back or convincing us otherwise because of our ignorance and pride.

This issue is too important to be redirected.

Spanking is wrong, because we are too stupid to use it properly... and instead use it as a way of proving ourselves right towards a person incapable of fighting back or convincing us otherwise because of our ignorance and pride.

Cerebris

There are limitations between spanking and abuse, just ask social services. Just like a spanking that is not implemented properly, insulting when trying to "educate" is not effective. Take a step back a re-evaluate how you address others if you intend to be taken seriously.

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]I misread the title as 'Obama = Speak on the "Wanking" issue? I'm not even kidding. U_ULJS9502_basic

There are limitations between spanking and abuse, just ask social services. Just like a spanking that is not implemented properly, insulting when trying to "educate" is not effective. Take a step back a re-evaluate how you address others if you intend to be taken seriously.

warbmxjohn

QFT

Abuse is the phase where things get too much.

ok, how do you spank someone properlyshyskillz

[QUOTE="shyskillz"]ok, how do you spank someone properlyLJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="shyskillz"]ok, how do you spank someone properlyshyskillz

He is going a bit to far.

[QUOTE="shyskillz"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]Is the someone an adult?>__>

warbmxjohn

Sigh, I'll repost this since you're all too ignorant to read the entire thread.

Spanking has become a way to punish children and even teenagers, just because they disagree or don't go a long with what the parents state (and parents can be wrong, especially if you have an intelligent child) and that is unacceptable.

Rarely if ever is it used as a method of teaching, instead of punishment or pain.

You don't punish children, you go out and buy them ice-cream and talk about what happened.

Sigh, it's pathetic that people would want spanking to actually remain, because I've never seen it used as it should be, or even be effective when it's used as it shouldn't.

Kids may fear it, and thus they may not do what angers their parents, but that doesn't mean they agree with what they aren't doing, and thus they'll do it when their parents are away, and perhaps they should.

In truth the fear of being spanked encourages children to hide things from their parents, not tell them.

The point is that spanking should be banned, until such a time that the world has become mature and intelligent enough to use it properly (50 - 60 years at the least), and not in the aggressive and punishing manner that it is used for now.

Cerebris

I very much agree with this. Children need to be taught why their actions are wrong, and not simply avoid them because they fear punishment.

It should be the parents' choice how to discipline their children, not the government's.

You just used a vulgarity while referring to how you got beat if you said anything unintelligent.

So you learned nothing...

I see.

[QUOTE="Famiking"]I'm still disgusted as to how beating other humans with spatulas is being justified. Spanking children is the wife-beating of yesteryear.thepwninator

But you're a liar.

You use vulgarities.

You're not a well-rounded citizen at all, you're a hypocrite and you didn't learn any thing...

So no, it failed.

You just used a vulgarity while referring to how you got beat if you said anything unintelligent.

So you learned nothing...

I see.

Cerebris

Of course I learned something. I learned I shoudln't run my mouth off around my elders and peers. I'm a man now, I'll say whatever I damn well please, thank you very much.

[QUOTE="thepwninator"][QUOTE="Famiking"]I'm still disgusted as to how beating other humans with spatulas is being justified. Spanking children is the wife-beating of yesteryear.Spicy-McHaggis

It should be the parents' choice how to discipline their children, not the government's.

Jackboot343

[QUOTE="Spicy-McHaggis"][QUOTE="thepwninator"] Spatula =/= "beating". It's virtually impossible for any corporeal damage to occur-bruises, scratches, cuts, etc. are things that do not happen when individuals are spanked with spatulas. Just a quick injection of no-frills pain that lasts, at most, about 10 seconds so the child should understand that he/she is not to do certain things prior to developing the ability to understand WHY he/she should not do those things.thepwninator

I was never spanked or physically disciplined in any way, and I still have a strong moral compass.

But you're a liar.

You use vulgarities.

You're not a well-rounded citizen at all, you're a hypocrite and you didn't learn any thing...

So no, it failed.

Cerebris

I'm not a well-rounded citizen because I say naughty words? I'm a citizen, not a robot. My adjective and verbal vocabulary has absolutely nothing to do with my morals. I hold the door for ladies, I refer to all men as sir and all womena s madam or ma'am. I have manners, I'm respectful, so where's the problem?

After taking a look at the lengthy Convention online, I don't see where the would get UN authority to enforce such a bill.

"No child shall be subjected to arbitrary or unlawful interference with his or her privacy"

What does that even mean?

"States Parties recognize the right of every child to a standard of living adequate for the child's physical, mental, spiritual, moral and social development."

That has to be one of the most vague statements I have ever seen. How is that even enforceable?

[QUOTE="thepwninator"] Spatula =/= "beating". It's virtually impossible for any corporeal damage to occur-bruises, scratches, cuts, etc. are things that do not happen when individuals are spanked with spatulas. Just a quick injection of no-frills pain that lasts, at most, about 10 seconds so the child should understand that he/she is not to do certain things prior to developing the ability to understand WHY he/she should not do those things.Famiking

It should be the parents' choice how to discipline their children, not the government's.

Jackboot343

[QUOTE="thepwninator"][QUOTE="Spicy-McHaggis"] Pahaha! Love this topic. I got beat my arse beat with a cold metal spatula when I talked back to my mum, and it hurt, BAD! I'm a well rounded, respectable citizen now, and I know my moral boundries, so I'm part thankful.chessmaster1989

I was never spanked or physically disciplined in any way, and I still have a strong moral compass.

But you'll never know the true fear of the man. Which is very neccesary :P

Wow another page already... sigh there goes more posts that will never be read.

In any case, I've yet to see anyone justify the beating of a person or spanking of a person, without having used it in an aggressive manner or without having used it in a manner that wasn't needed, as communication and teaching BEFORE they did it, would have fixed the problem.

[QUOTE="Spicy-McHaggis"]

[QUOTE="Cerebris"]

You just used a vulgarity while referring to how you got beat if you said anything unintelligent.

So you learned nothing...

I see.

Cerebris

Of course I learned something. I learned I shoudln't run my mouth off around my elders and peers. I'm a man now, I'll say whatever I damn well please, thank you very much.

Physical abuse? Thats not abuse, its my parents right to kick my ass when I am rude. I now my boundries. I'm not violent, against your assumptions, I'm a Buddhist with a few flaws :P. I'd fight for any good man's rights though :). I can see your parents have raised an assumptual, arrogant, arguementative child, so you've obviously been spoiled enough to go with out discipline. My parents were strict. Inbeing strict, I've learned that it is improper for a child to disrespect their elders, let alone parents. My use of words does not at all effect my moral state as a human being, and if you believe that, you have lived a close minded, sheltered life.

Actually.

I taught myself, as my parents were obviously not fit for the job.

I have never used a vulgarity, and my English is proper beyond the definition.

By the definition of Arrogance, I do not actually follow it, as I am not arrogant due to the fact that my knowledge is not assumed or supposed, as much as it is proven, and factual.

I deal with my problems in a non-violent manner.

I am a state-certified genius.

I avoid all idiocy and have a vocabulary of over 25000 words.

I am on the path of the science-fiction writer and eventually will progress to either main journalism or business management depending on my desires.

I was not spoiled, as I had to do everything for myself.

I encountered violent idiots my entire school and / or life and thus they always reinforced my belief's toward society.

Try again... okay?

In extension...

Respect is a two way street, parents must respect you to deserve it, as must Elders and others.

The ability to be old does not mean you are wise, and thus respect in a basic manner is of course necessary and required via decency, but respect in terms of deferrment, is not as it is not deserved and may be poorly suited or placed.

Following the rules blindly is idiocy, as it shows you are not of your own mind.

I am one of the most strictest people ever... do not try to assume things.

You were a hypocrit by using an UNINTELLIGENT term, while saying you were taught not to be unintelligent via physical abuse.

I used that statement as a reference point.

I refer you to it, as it only further proves my point.

Actually.

I taught myself, as my parents were obviously not fit for the job.

I have never used a vulgarity, and my English is proper beyond the definition.

By the definition of Arrogance, I do not actually follow it, as I am not arrogant due to the fact that my knowledge is not assumed or supposed, as much as it is proven, and factual.

I deal with my problems in a non-violent manner.

I am a state-certified genius.

I avoid all idiocy and have a vocabulary of over 25000 words.

I am on the path of the science-fiction writer and eventually will progress to either main journalism or business management depending on my desires.

I was not spoiled, as I had to do everything for myself.

I encountered violent idiots my entire school and / or life and thus they always reinforced my belief's toward society.

Try again... okay?

Cerebris

[QUOTE="Cerebris"]

Actually.

I taught myself, as my parents were obviously not fit for the job.

I have never used a vulgarity, and my English is proper beyond the definition.

By the definition of Arrogance, I do not actually follow it, as I am not arrogant due to the fact that my knowledge is not assumed or supposed, as much as it is proven, and factual.

I deal with my problems in a non-violent manner.

I am a state-certified genius.

I avoid all idiocy and have a vocabulary of over 25000 words.

I am on the path of the science-fiction writer and eventually will progress to either main journalism or business management depending on my desires.

I was not spoiled, as I had to do everything for myself.

I encountered violent idiots my entire school and / or life and thus they always reinforced my belief's toward society.

Try again... okay?

limpbizkit818

Do you have any backing for your assertion that it serves no good whatsoever? There is anecdotal evidence indicating that it does not, and there is also anecdotal evidence that it does (such as my own, which I don't really care too much about typing at the moment). What makes the former anecdotal evidence more valid than the latter?thepwninator

When in doubt, go to studies. Corporal punishment has been linked to:

- adult depression

- anti-social behavior

- lower IQ

- decreased success in life

- drug addiction

- psychological disorders

...and the only real benefits that you get is an immediate short-term cessation of whatever it is you're hitting the kid for, all while ignoring the much more important question of why the child wants to do whatever it is. I can see the use of corporal punishment in the years before a child is even self-aware (and thus can only operate in the context of "that causes pain, so avoid it"), but the moment your child arrives at the age where he or she is capable of reason, there is no excuse whatsoever to continue using corporal punishment as a means of behavioral correction. It's basically the physical equivalent of "because I said so" (another one of my hugest parental pet peeves).

There are so many better ways to discipline one's kids that don't involve physical abuse that there really is no reason to use corporal punishment.

[QUOTE="thepwninator"]Do you have any backing for your assertion that it serves no good whatsoever? There is anecdotal evidence indicating that it does not, and there is also anecdotal evidence that it does (such as my own, which I don't really care too much about typing at the moment). What makes the former anecdotal evidence more valid than the latter?GabuEx

When in doubt, go to studies. Corporal punishmenthas beenlinked to:

- adult depression

- anti-social behavior

- lower IQ

- decreased success in life

- drug addiction

- psychological disorders

...and the only real benefits that you get is an immediate short-term cessation of whatever it is you're hitting the kid for.

There are so many better ways to discipline one's kids that doesn't involve physical abuse that there really is no reason to use corporal punishment.

Ah, GabuEx, always bringing in studies contrary to my opinion :P

Based on the evidence that he had brought into the argument, there was nothing to go on but anecdotal evidence, and I was unaware of those studies at the time.

Those studies shall, shortly, be studied (by me) :P

I feel when you have to bring up studies you've already lost, as your ability to convince others is lacking or has failed, and I prefer to only use studies if theirs no other choice, and I rarely give up so I rarely use them.

Ah, GabuEx, always bringing in studies contrary to my opinion :P

Based on the evidence that he had brought into the argument, there was nothing to go on but anecdotal evidence, and I was unaware of those studies at the time.

Those studies shall, shortly, be studied (by me) :P

thepwninator

Well, I should note, as a caveat, that those who speak of mild or very infrequent corporal punishment not having a terrible effect on the child largely have their views more or less corroborated by these studies... but there's pretty much a linear relationship between the amount of corporal punishment and the negative effects it has on the child. As a result, one can obviously come to the conclusion that no corporal punishment has the least negative effect on the child.

As I said in my edit, I can see corporal punishment when a child is in the infancy stage and is not even self-aware, let alone capable of reason, but once a child becomes reasonable I remain of the strong opinion that there is quite frankly no excuse to continue to use corporal punishment past that stage.

YOU WANT TO HIT AN INFANT?!

SERIOUSLY?!?!?!

IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY AS AN INFORMED AND CONCERNED PARENT TO WATCH YOUR CHILD IN THE INFANCY STAGES AT ALL TIMES.

You do that, and you'll be responsible enough to NOT let them go out and run in the street.

I feel when you have to bring up studies you've already lost, as your ability to convince others is lacking or has failed, and I prefer to only use studies if theirs no other choice, and I rarely give up so I rarely use them.

Cerebris

[QUOTE="Famiking"][QUOTE="thepwninator"] Hands have the potential to cause more damage than spatulas due to their greater momentum and mass, and are far more easily used incorrectly.thepwninator

Sorry but you're just dead wrong. You can do damage with any form of spanking, especially when using an implement. Hand spankings are the safest way to go because the spanker can tell just how much damage they're doing by how much their hand is stinging. When using an implement you have no idea if you're using too much force, too little force, or when it's time to stop. Surface area doesn't make an implement harmless. It's more than possible to give someone bruises even with a fly swatter.