Parents try to raise Genderless Children

[QUOTE="chrisrooR"]I think that the fact that the kids name is Storm puts him at a much higher risk of bullying than an undeclared gender.Theokhoth

Oh p'shaw, that's enough out of you Audio Science.

It's a pretty interesting idea. However once the child grows up and starts watching TV and gets exposed to the outside world more, they will have a gender that is pretty normal for whatever sexuality the child is. Socialization is pretty powerful and hard to avoid.

After reading the whole article I think it's a nice idea, to give children the choice to explore and choose who they are but it doesn't work in the real world. And I completely disagree with unschooling - it's cruel to set a child up with no qualifications or skills needed for adulthood.tofu-lion91

............especially since its going to be the kids that pay the price. Yeah, really courageous of them. If they want to prove a point, let them be the one's out there being genderless or genderneutral or whatever it is they are trying to thrust upon the kids.YellowOneKinobi

Oh, look, more people who can't fathom the difference between sex (genitalia, chromosomes) and gender (social construct).Theokhoth

[QUOTE="YellowOneKinobi"]............especially since its going to be the kids that pay the price. Yeah, really courageous of them. If they want to prove a point, let them be the one's out there being genderless or genderneutral or whatever it is they are trying to thrust upon the kids.foxhound_fox

I agree but I think this parents are doing it wrong and it could affect the children in a bad way. The best way to teach their children about this is to show respect and appreciation for the people who made the choice of a gender and teach the children that these people are normal human beings that should be treated with respect and understanding. Furthermore, if one of their kids chooses a different gender in the future they should be as supportive as they can. But keeping the children away from anything that can define a gender seems strange and I think they are making the problem worse by probably shunning him or her from making his/her own choices and building his/her own identity which could end up confusing the kids even more. For example what if the kid is a boy that likes cars, girls and tools? will they keep him away from all these things just because they are stereotypes and in order for him to become gender neutral? I think they are doing exactly what they are complaining about and possibly worse.

"Witterick smiles, opens her arms wide, comments on the sunny spring day, and keeps walking"

Ah, so they're essentially attention whores. Poor kids...

[QUOTE="YellowOneKinobi"]............especially since its going to be the kids that pay the price. Yeah, really courageous of them. If they want to prove a point, let them be the one's out there being genderless or genderneutral or whatever it is they are trying to thrust upon the kids.foxhound_fox

Further, as an expectant father I will completely encourage my kid not to blindly "go with the flow"...... that being said, I realize that my child will not be growing up in a vacuum. There is a reason basic social norms exist (you know, complex things like boys and girls are different). To put kids in a position that can only lead to confusion within and torment from the outside world is borderline child abuse, and I'm being generous with the term "borderline."

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"][QUOTE="YellowOneKinobi"]............especially since its going to be the kids that pay the price. Yeah, really courageous of them. If they want to prove a point, let them be the one's out there being genderless or genderneutral or whatever it is they are trying to thrust upon the kids.kuraimen

I agree but I think this parents are doing it wrong and it could affect the children in a bad way. The best way to teach their children about this is to show respect and appreciation for the people who made the choice of a gender and teach the children that these people are normal human beings that should be treated with respect and understanding. Furthermore, if one of their kids chooses a different gender in the future they should be as supportive as they can. But keeping the children away from anything that can define a gender seems strange and I think they are making the problem worse by probably shunning him or her from making his/her own choices and building his/her own identity which could end up confusing the kids even more. For example what if the kid is a boy that likes cars, girls and tools? will they keep him away from all these things just because they are stereotypes and in order for him to become gender neutral? I think they are doing exactly what they are complaining about and possibly worse.

Maybe the parents don't want the kid growing up think that that he/she needs to fit certain gender roles.Lonelynight

[QUOTE="kuraimen"]

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"] Someone needs to take the first step. The fact that you say that "the kids will pay the price" proves just how forced gender expectations are in our society. Forcing a boy to play with cars or wear pants when he wants to play with dolls and wear a dress, or vice-versa in girls is exactly what is wrong in today's society. People should be be encouraged to be the gender they feel, not the one society "expects" of them. Kids who make fun of a boy who likes to wear dresses should be reprimanded. Gender in reality is very fluid... it isn't this black and white "flip-the-coin" choice people "have" to make. And it all needs to change if we can develop towards greater equality.Lockedge

I agree but I think this parents are doing it wrong and it could affect the children in a bad way. The best way to teach their children about this is to show respect and appreciation for the people who made the choice of a gender and teach the children that these people are normal human beings that should be treated with respect and understanding. Furthermore, if one of their kids chooses a different gender in the future they should be as supportive as they can. But keeping the children away from anything that can define a gender seems strange and I think they are making the problem worse by probably shunning him or her from making his/her own choices and building his/her own identity which could end up confusing the kids even more. For example what if the kid is a boy that likes cars, girls and tools? will they keep him away from all these things just because they are stereotypes and in order for him to become gender neutral? I think they are doing exactly what they are complaining about and possibly worse.

The more I read into this article, the more the parents sound like leftover radical anti-establishment proponents from the 70s. These kids are in for a rough ride.

The more I read into this article, the more the parents sound like leftover radical anti-establishment proponents from the 70s. These kids are in for a rough ride.

Verge_6

those parents sound like idiots, like they actually believe that their child is 'unique' when their baby is probably no more unique than any other baby.

""If you really want to get to know someone, you don't ask what's between their legs," says Stocker."

that makes no sense at all, of course you don't ask, because you'll be able to tell just by looking at them.

i can see it, one of child's ****ates come home from school and the parent asks them "you know that child Storm in your cl@ss i bet you're wondering whether Storm is a boy or a girl, hmm?"

"i'm pretty sure Storm is a boy. talks like a boy and looks like a boy."

besides, Storm is a boys name.

i'm putting $20 that the child is a boy.

[QUOTE="Lockedge"][QUOTE="kuraimen"]

I agree but I think this parents are doing it wrong and it could affect the children in a bad way. The best way to teach their children about this is to show respect and appreciation for the people who made the choice of a gender and teach the children that these people are normal human beings that should be treated with respect and understanding. Furthermore, if one of their kids chooses a different gender in the future they should be as supportive as they can. But keeping the children away from anything that can define a gender seems strange and I think they are making the problem worse by probably shunning him or her from making his/her own choices and building his/her own identity which could end up confusing the kids even more. For example what if the kid is a boy that likes cars, girls and tools? will they keep him away from all these things just because they are stereotypes and in order for him to become gender neutral? I think they are doing exactly what they are complaining about and possibly worse.

kuraimen

When my cousin was born it was an entirely different story. Entirely. Because she was a girl.THere was pink everywhere. She was coddled and hugged and kissed exponentially more than my brother. She was constantly told how cute, how pretty, how sweet, how polite she was. She was pushed into ballet and horse-riding(well, her dad's a doctor, he could afford it). She was constantly told how one day she'll be a mom, how she's a 'good girl'.

And those are just the surface level things from ages 0-9. Maybe, just maybe, they want to put as many of those external forces to the side and instead of forcing their kid one way, they let them decide. If the kid's sex wasn't kept secret, I don't think they could trust people to not wind up pushing those norms on the kid like they normally would. I will, however, say I'm not a fan of unschooling. Poor kids won't have an education at this rate.

[QUOTE="Lonelynight"]Maybe the parents don't want the kid growing up think that that he/she needs to fit certain gender roles.kuraimen

[QUOTE="kuraimen"][QUOTE="Lockedge"] Well, they're letting the kid decide for what he/she wants to play with, what clothing to wear, etc. like their other kids. They just don't want the gendered social norms pushing their kid in one direction to appease someone else's expectations. If the kid is a boy that likes cars, girls and tools, then that's what he likes. They let their older kids decide what they like, I don't think there's going to be a difference with this kid. They're not raising him entirely gender neutral, they're just trying to keep the impact of gender socialization to a bare minimum. Lockedge

When my cousin was born it was an entirely different story. Entirely. Because she was a girl.THere was pink everywhere. She was coddled and hugged and kissed exponentially more than my brother. She was constantly told how cute, how pretty, how sweet, how polite she was. She was pushed into ballet and horse-riding(well, her dad's a doctor, he could afford it). She was constantly told how one day she'll be a mom, how she's a 'good girl'.

And those are just the surface level things from ages 0-9. Maybe, just maybe, they want to put as many of those external forces to the side and instead of forcing their kid one way, they let them decide. If the kid's sex wasn't kept secret, I don't think they could trust people to not wind up pushing those norms on the kid like they normally would. I will, however, say I'm not a fan of unschooling. Poor kids won't have an education at this rate.

[QUOTE="kuraimen"][QUOTE="Lonelynight"]Maybe the parents don't want the kid growing up think that that he/she needs to fit certain gender roles.needled24-7

Small differences like the ones pointed out by Lockedge above you and bigger differences like the roles each gender has in society like the man being the provider or stuff like that.

I suggest you read this. It is an eye opener on how stupid early gender roles can be harmful to children http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/23/books/review/Paul-t.html?_r=2&WT.mc_id=AR-SM-E-FB-SM-LIN-IPN-012411-NYT-NA&WT.mc_ev=click I have many psychologists friends that tell me how the "Pink" culture affects many women when they grow up and leaves them with a lot of mental issues about their role and what they should expect from society leading to depression and other bigger issues.

I dont get it, does the baby have some disorder of some kind or are the parents just dumba***s?

Jolt_counter119

They just dumba%#es. I see kind of what they trying to accomplish so that there aren't any stereotypes, but honestly, everyone uses them. In this case it's about whether it's a boy or a girl and they're afraid that people will treat it different based on the sex. Guess what? They will just like everyone else in the freaking world. They think they're setting some precedent and that somehow magically this world will all be peaceful singing KumBaiYa in a circle because there won't be anymore sexual stereotypes. Not all of them are bad. If they want to raise an "It's Pat," like the ambiguous transgendered human from SNL and later a movie, that's fine, but they have to realize that kids are going to make fun of him/her as he/she gets a little older. I understand there are a lot of things from not getting equal pay to sexual dominance as in rape as well as other negatives, but there are good distinctions as well. Such as a male protecting his family from threats as well as sexual such as females like masculine, not overly macho, but masculine, not effiminate men. There are others, the point is that this overly p.c.ness has got to have a line drawn somewhere. I see this and I just feel sorry for the child who has whackos for parents. Thank God that my dad wanted to raise me as a boy and not some question mark.

I actually don't see what the big deal is. The child's gender will probably be incredibly obvious once he/she gets older. I definitely don't think the parents are ruining the kid's life. Even if the child grows up and keeps an androgynous appearance, so what?

It's not a big deal. People are getting upset because they feel like their precious masculine/feminine ideals are being threatened.

How's he being set up to be ridiculed? It's not as if he's actually genderless. Lotus-Edge

Maybe the parents don't want the kid growing up think that that he/she needs to fit certain gender roles.Lonelynight

No, I don't think it's just a matter of letting the kid pick their own gender. I really believe they want the child to be GenderLESS, meaning they don't want it to feel like a boy or a girl because that would somehow lead to gender stereotypes that will hold it back. So when it grows up it doesn't know whether it's a man or woman. They want a drone, simple as that. Could you imagine if everyone didn't know if they were a man or woman? That's just freakishly eerie. People like this don't need to have an influence in anyone's life but their own.

I understand that they don't want to force a specific gender on their child, but I honestly do think it still is a bit bizarre and unnecessary. Their kid is named Storm though, so it's not entirely suprising.

"What we noticed is that parents make so many choices for their children. It's obnoxious," says Stocker. (From the article)

I love this line. They should let the kids pick what they want then most of the time unless it's life threatening. So they should let the kids eat what they want. I have a feeling it'll be something sweet and junky. They should let the kids go to bed when they want to whether it be 10, 2, or 6 in the morning. They should let them pick out the toy of their choice even if it's the most expensive. . . Really?!? This blanket statement is just ridiculous. YEAH.... Of course parents make choices and decisions for their kids. It's because they're KIDS and don't know any better unless you teach them and raise them properly and that means sometimes having to make decisions for them. This guy is clearly a moron and he's actually the obnoxious one.

This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"] Storm isn't a terrible name compared to some others out there.Omni-Slash

quite strange.

Hey what do you know. I looked up an article I had read months ago called "Top 10 Boneheaded Parenting tips from the left" (I didn't remember top ten I just googled "boneheaded parenting tips from the left") to see if this "genderless children" was one of them. And sure enough, it's the first one listed!

by the way if you're interested here are all ten of the "boneheaded" tips:

1. Genderless Children

2. Bottomless babies (it's more enviromentally friendly to just let the crap fall out rather than using a diaper is the rationale for this idea)

3. Be your child's best friend

4. Teacup parenting (i.e. treating kids like their fragile)

5. Giving your child everything they want without earning it

6. No "exposure" to religion until they're over 18 (China actually requires that children under 18 cannot be taught about religion by their parents, though I doubt China has any trouble with letting the kids learn about Marxism and Communism and similar ideologies)

7. No restraints when it comes to sexuality

8. Allowing others to raise your kids because they must know better

9. Self-esteem is supreme

10. Corporal punishment should be outlawed.

"What we noticed is that parents make so many choices for their children. It's obnoxious," says Stocker. (From the article)

I love this line. They should let the kids pick what they want then most of the time unless it's life threatening. So they should let the kids eat what they want. I have a feeling it'll be something sweet and junky. They should let the kids go to bed when they want to whether it be 10, 2, or 6 in the morning. They should let them pick out the toy of their choice even if it's the most expensive. . . Really?!? This blanket statement is just ridiculous. YEAH.... Of course parents make choices and decisions for their kids. It's because they're KIDS and don't know any better unless you teach them and raise them properly and that means sometimes having to make decisions for them. This guy is clearly a moron and he's actually the obnoxious one.

Sunfyre7896

I don't see why this is needed.. Gender roles are slowly but surely breaking down to begin with in the 21st century.. Women can have careers, and Men can stay home and clean house, take care of children etc etc.. This is completely the wrong way to go about it.sSubZerOo

Storm? Are you ******* kidding me? What happend to Joe and Bob?metallica_fan42

Hmm.

Why would she want to hide their gender again? Freedom? So... Is this real freedom for her child? confuzzled

I don't really get what the point of this is...chessmaster1989

I hate it when people ask what gender a baby is. Next thing you know, they're gonna start makin' assumptions about the baby without actually getting to know it for its personality or intelligence.zakkro

quite strange.

Hey what do you know. I looked up an article I had read months ago called "Top 10 Boneheaded Parenting tips from the left" (I didn't remember top ten I just googled "boneheaded parenting tips from the left") to see if this "genderless children" was one of them. And sure enough, it's the first one listed!

by the way if you're interested here are all ten of the "boneheaded" tips:

1. Genderless Children

2. Bottomless babies (it's more enviromentally friendly to just let the crap fall out rather than using a diaper is the rationale for this idea)

3. Be your child's best friend

4. Teacup parenting (i.e. treating kids like their fragile)

5. Giving your child everything they want without earning it

6. No "exposure" to religion until they're over 18 (China actually requires that children under 18 cannot be taught about religion by their parents, though I doubt China has any trouble with letting the kids learn about Marxism and Communism and similar ideologies)

7. No restraints when it comes to sexuality

8. Allowing others to raise your kids because they must know better

9. Self-esteem is supreme

10. Corporal punishment should be outlawed.

whipassmt

I dont get it, does the baby have some disorder of some kind or are the parents just dumba***s?

Jolt_counter119

modern parents are weird..