Pope Francis: Children are never a mistake

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whipassmt

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#1 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

So in America it seems like we have a penchant for sometimes referring to some people as "accidents" or we talk of "unintended pregnancies". But Pope Francis apparently doesn't agree with the flippant use of these terms.

At today's general audience the Supreme Pontiff pontificated about how no child is a "mistake" and referred to children as "the greatest blessing which God has bestowed on man and woman".

Here is the English section of the address, given by a speaker, which is basically a condensed version of the Italian address given by the pope:

Speaker:

Dear Brothers and Sisters: Today we continue our reflection on children, the greatest blessing which God has bestowed on man and woman. I wish to focus our attention on the suffering which many children are experiencing. From the first moments of their lives, some are rejected, abandoned, and robbed of their infancy and future. There are those who say it is a mistake to bring these children into the world, due to their fragility, and the hunger and poverty they suffer. But children are never a mistake, and their sufferings are only reasons for us to love them even more. Every child who begs on the streets, who is denied an education or medical care, is a cry to God. Too often, these children become prey to criminals, who exploit them for commerce or violence. Even in wealthy countries, they suffer due to family crises and living conditions which are at times inhumane. In every case, their childhood is violated in body and soul. How did Jesus respond to the children and their parents who brought them to him: “Let the children come to me… for to such belongs the kingdom of heaven” (Mt 19:14). How beautiful the trust of these parents, and the response of Jesus! And there are many extraordinary parents who daily make sacrifices for their children. The Church offers her maternal care to all children and their families, and she brings them the blessing of Jesus. May we always care for our children, not counting the cost, so that they may never believe themselves to be mistakes, but always know their infinite worth.

Holy Father:

Saluto cordialmente i pellegrini di lingua inglese presenti a questa Udienza, specialmente quelli provenienti da Inghilterra, Irlanda, Svezia, Nigeria, Giappone, Thailandia, Canada e Stati Uniti. Il Signore Risorto vi confermi nella fede e vi renda testimoni del suo amore e della sua misericordia per tutti. Dio vi benedica!

Speaker:

I offer an affectionate greeting to all the English-speaking pilgrims and visitors present at today’s Audience, including those from England, Ireland, Sweden, Nigeria, Japan, Thailand, Canada and the United States. May the Risen Lord confirm you in faith and make you witnesses of his love and mercy to all people. May God bless you!

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#2 deactivated-5b797108c254e
Member since 2013 • 11245 Posts

@whipassmt: How else would you call a unplanned pregnancy? A lot of unintended pregnancies turn into very loved children; the fact that they weren't planned doesn't mean the parents aren't happy. I don't see how that's a bad term. Accident on the other hand, even if technically accurate, is an unkind term that you should never say to your child. My father loved reminding me that I was an accident and a mistake he wished he never made; he'd also tell me that I was a burden and that he hoped I'd die soon; on the other hand my sister never planned her pregnancies (which is not very wise) but she loves every single one of her children =)

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whipassmt

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#3 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

@korvus: whoa, your father said those things to you? Not very nice.

I guess I would call them "surprise pregnancies", that's more positive sounding, right?

Also, do you like my new Avy?

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Master_Live

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#4 Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20550 Posts

If I use a condom and it breaks and my girlfriend becomes pregnant that is an unintended pregnancy.

That aside from the fact that God doesn't exist and we waste to much time paying attention to this dude which happens to have too much influence.

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deactivated-5b797108c254e

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#5  Edited By deactivated-5b797108c254e
Member since 2013 • 11245 Posts

@whipassmt: That's not even close to all he did; I used to get really bad asthma attacks every night and he'd refuse to take me to the hospital...he'd just say "f*** off and let me sleep, I hope you die". Oh well, he died a painful death and I'm still here despite his best efforts...what goes around...

As for "surprise pregnancies"...it actually sounds like quite an adorable way to answer your child should they ever ask if they were planned. Well done!

EDIT: As for your avy, nice 'stash.

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whipassmt

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#6  Edited By whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

"Thailandia" - I think today is the first time I'v seen this word.

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Catalli

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#7  Edited By Catalli  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 3453 Posts

If my girlfriend accidentally gets pregnant with me, it's an accident, it's an unintended pregnancy and to have the child would be a mistake at my age. Does that mean that once born the child deserves to have never been born or that one should treat him or her as less? No. But it's still an accident.

Edit: Also, I don't give a flying **** what God has "intended" for me. What I care about are my intentions. So yeah, even blessings can be unintended.

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whipassmt

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#8  Edited By whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

@korvus: I'm sorry you had to go through that. At least your sister is good to her kids. I know its easier said than done, but I hope you have forgiven your father or will do so in the future, it would be hard, but good for you.

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#9  Edited By deactivated-5b797108c254e
Member since 2013 • 11245 Posts

@ianhh6 said:

If my girlfriend accidentally gets pregnant with me, it's an accident

If your girlfriend gets pregnant with you, you went way too deep.

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Catalli

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#10 Catalli  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 3453 Posts

@korvus said:

@ianhh6 said:

If my girlfriend accidentally gets pregnant with me, it's an accident

If your girlfriend gets pregnant with you, you went way too deep.

Wait is this a pun...? Or something?

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KHAndAnime

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#11 KHAndAnime
Member since 2009 • 17565 Posts

@ianhh6 said:

If my girlfriend accidentally gets pregnant with me, it's an accident, it's an unintended pregnancy and to have the child would be a mistake at my age. Does that mean that once born the child deserves to have never been born or that one should treat him or her as less? No. But it's still an accident.

Word. Uber Christians are too busy focusing on overpopulating the planet to realize how detrimental it is for a child to grow up under conditions where there are extremely poor and feel unwanted. Anyone who wants that for a child is fucked up.

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whipassmt

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#12  Edited By whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

If my imaginary girlfriend get's pregnant by me...then the kid can end up being a superhero. And if she accidentally gets me pregnant... well then that would be odd.

"I'm leaving you Whip, found myself another man"

"No, Becky you can't do that"

"why not"

"please, I'm with child"

"what?"

"we're going to be a family"

"oh. I'm sorry, we should get married"

*I hang up the phone* and say "boy, maybe I should'v let her leave me, the girl's dumber than I thought".

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#13 deactivated-5b797108c254e
Member since 2013 • 11245 Posts

@ianhh6: Yep XD No offense intended though, sorry.

@whipassmt: I have no love for him but I bear him no ill feelings either. Other than sexually, both my parents abused me in every way possible. After a few years I realised I had 2 choices: become bitter and angry at everything and everyone or I could pay attention to who my parents were and make sure I would never repeat their mistakes. In a way, my parents were the best role-models I could ever asked for, because they gave me an invaluable display of the consequences of their actions...I wouldn't be the person I am today if it weren't for them so in the end there's really nothing to forgive; I'm quite thankful actually.

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#14  Edited By Catalli  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 3453 Posts

@korvus said:

@ianhh6: Yep XD No offense intended though, sorry.

Nono, I'm still trying to understand it XD dear god I feel slow today

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LJS9502_basic

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#15  Edited By LJS9502_basic
Member since 2003 • 180189 Posts

@korvus said:

@whipassmt: How else would you call a unplanned pregnancy? A lot of unintended pregnancies turn into very loved children; the fact that they weren't planned doesn't mean the parents aren't happy. I don't see how that's a bad term. Accident on the other hand, even if technically accurate, is an unkind term that you should never say to your child. My father loved reminding me that I was an accident and a mistake he wished he never made; he'd also tell me that I was a burden and that he hoped I'd die soon; on the other hand my sister never planned her pregnancies (which is not very wise) but she loves every single one of her children =)

If one is having sex......the possibility of children does exist...so how can we use the term accident? I mean that is how children come about. ;p

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#16  Edited By deactivated-5b797108c254e
Member since 2013 • 11245 Posts

@ianhh6: Maybe it's just the way I learned English but I would say "if she was pregnant with my child"; if I said "if she was pregnant with me" I'd feel like I was saying I was the one in her belly =P

@LJS9502_basic: When you drive a car there's a chance you'll crash it, that's how car crashes happen and you still call it an accident unless you ram that pole on purpose (that sounded like a dirty pun =P)

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whipassmt

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#17 whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

@korvus: You are handling this very maturely. I'm glad to see how you have risen above this, and allowed this crucible to refine you rather than destroy you.

@ianhh6 said:

@korvus said:

@ianhh6 said:

If my girlfriend accidentally gets pregnant with me, it's an accident

If your girlfriend gets pregnant with you, you went way too deep.

Wait is this a pun...? Or something?

Plunge into this moment, go deep like a scuba,

hold onto this moment, grip it like a tsuba.

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Catalli

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#18 Catalli  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 3453 Posts

@korvus: Oooooooh I see now! Yeah I'm not one to stick more than one body part in at a time

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#19  Edited By deactivated-5b797108c254e
Member since 2013 • 11245 Posts

@whipassmt: Thank you, that's very kind of you to say =)

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Catalli

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#20 Catalli  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 3453 Posts

@whipassmt said:

Plunge into this moment, go deep like a scuba,

hold onto this moment, grip it like a tsuba.

wrapping and all hehe

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whipassmt

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#21  Edited By whipassmt
Member since 2007 • 15375 Posts

@korvus: your welcome. To quote John Diggle "we're getting dangerously close to hug territory". Good thing we're in separate countries and communicating via internet. lol.

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TheFlush

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#22 TheFlush
Member since 2002 • 5965 Posts

The pope is completely irrelevant, so whatever

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#23 deactivated-5b797108c254e
Member since 2013 • 11245 Posts

@whipassmt: I can already see the feels in the horizon =P

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#24  Edited By deactivated-598fc45371265
Member since 2008 • 13247 Posts

@TheFlush said:

The pope is completely irrelevant,

hardly

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#25 Catalli  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 3453 Posts

@TheFlush said:

The pope is completely irrelevant, so whatever

That's... extreme. There's finally a pope doing some good in the world. Let's not be so quick to hate and dismiss.

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deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d

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#26 deactivated-5acfa3a8bc51d
Member since 2005 • 7914 Posts

unwanted babies should be used for stem cells

With all the unwanted babies in the world we could be saving lives and growing organs in a lab

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#27 Riverwolf007
Member since 2005 • 26023 Posts

also said by various popes.

"it's never a mistake to use the mob to launder your money."

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Bigboi500

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#28  Edited By Bigboi500
Member since 2007 • 35550 Posts

Disagree your Popeness, over-population is already a problem.

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#29 branketra
Member since 2006 • 51726 Posts

@korvus said:

@whipassmt: How else would you call a unplanned pregnancy? A lot of unintended pregnancies turn into very loved children; the fact that they weren't planned doesn't mean the parents aren't happy. I don't see how that's a bad term. Accident on the other hand, even if technically accurate, is an unkind term that you should never say to your child. My father loved reminding me that I was an accident and a mistake he wished he never made; he'd also tell me that I was a burden and that he hoped I'd die soon; on the other hand my sister never planned her pregnancies (which is not very wise) but she loves every single one of her children =)

I am really sorry you went through that.

I think Pope Francis spoke of an extremely nice, comforting sentiment. It may be too general for some, but it does justice for those who would be mistreated by those in society who are ill-advised.

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#30 MakeMeaSammitch
Member since 2012 • 4889 Posts

Meh, fetus aren't people.

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#31 deactivated-5b797108c254e
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@BranKetra: Thank you Bran, it was difficult but very educational...I was raised as a bigoted, racist homophobe...thankfully when I started getting "out there" I was able to overcome the brainwashing but it really showed me how severe people's shortcomings can be and ever since then I always try to improve myself a little bit more and help someone in need. As I said before I'm a physical therapist, a blood/plasma/organ donor, and I work in charities with elderly, children and homeless people...it's a bit ironic to think that without the abuse I suffered at the hands of my parents a lot of people's lives could now be much worse than it is (I know this sounds arrogant but I don't intend it to be so...merely saying that a lot of the help I provided was due to wanting to give others a better life than I had myself)

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#32 branketra
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@korvus: Going through situations that question our beliefs can make us stronger because they surprise us. I would very much like to get out of the southern United States and see what else the world and the United States, for that matter, has to offer because there are people who shall question my beliefs in person with logical arguments and I shall need to answer them in order to better address the issues facing our world. It is fascinating to know that there are people out there, right now, questioning the nature of morality and virtue, good and ill, and answering questions about how to best apply their theories to improve society.

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#33 deactivated-5b797108c254e
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@BranKetra: Yep, the more places you visit, the more people you interact with, the more times your answers come short of the questions the more you grow. And every time the step you take is larger than your legs allow you get to rediscover what you're made of and if needed redefine yourself; the first time is scary but after that first victory it's quite hard not to want to do it again.

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#34  Edited By Serraph105
Member since 2007 • 36092 Posts

Not to speak poorly of the Pope, particularly this pope as I generally think he has been spreading good messages for people to follow, but perhaps people shouldn't take their sex/parenting advice from a man who has no first hand experience with either.

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#35 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

A child can very much be an accident when the parents aren't properly educated about what sex is, what causes pregnancy and how to prevent it.

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#36 Edo-Tensei_
Member since 2015 • 173 Posts

That's true. Children are always innocent of any mistakes of the parents. However it's silly when a religious person has a hard time understanding why a woman who was raped would reject her child after all the psychological implications that come along with it by just strictly reading the words of the bible.

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#37 lamprey263
Member since 2006 • 45462 Posts

more alter boys and orphans for bored priests to sow their oats with

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#38 foxhound_fox
Member since 2005 • 98532 Posts

@edo-tensei_ said:

That's true. Children are always innocent of any mistakes of the parents. However it's silly when a religious person has a hard time understanding why a woman who was raped would reject her child after all the psychological implications that come along with it by just strictly reading the words of the bible.

But it's God's plan! *rolls eyes*

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deactivated-5b1e62582e305

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#39 deactivated-5b1e62582e305
Member since 2004 • 30778 Posts

Sorry, don't really care what a harbourer of pedophiles and money launderer thinks.

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#40 deactivated-5f9e3c6a83e51
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@Aljosa23 said:

Sorry, don't really care what a harbourer of pedophiles and money launderer thinks.

This was about pope, not Rob Ford.

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#41 deactivated-5b1e62582e305
Member since 2004 • 30778 Posts
@sonicare said:

@Aljosa23 said:

Sorry, don't really care what a harbourer of pedophiles and money launderer thinks.

This was about pope, not Rob Ford.

As far as I know he has no connections with child molestation rings but money laundering... perhaps.

He's also a drug addict and a cancer patient so... making fun of him is out of bounds for me now lol.

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#42 gamerguru100
Member since 2009 • 12718 Posts

@KHAndAnime said:

@ianhh6 said:

If my girlfriend accidentally gets pregnant with me, it's an accident, it's an unintended pregnancy and to have the child would be a mistake at my age. Does that mean that once born the child deserves to have never been born or that one should treat him or her as less? No. But it's still an accident.

Word. Uber Christians are too busy focusing on overpopulating the planet to realize how detrimental it is for a child to grow up under conditions where there are extremely poor and feel unwanted. Anyone who wants that for a child is fucked up.

Sub-Saharan Africa is a great example of this. People there are having too many kids, and in a place as poor as Africa, I just see having kids there as bringing more human suffering into the world.

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#43 GazaAli
Member since 2007 • 25216 Posts

Leave it to OT to take one big dump on something positive. I'm a fan of neither the Catholic Church nor the Pope for a number of reasons, yet in this instance the message he's delivering is actually a pretty decent one. If a child opens his eyes to the world then what good does it serve to label him from the get-go unwanted, a mistake and a flop?

Liberals are becoming awfully selective with their political correctness. You may not call a Jew a kike, a retard retarded or a homosexual a *** yet it is ok to refer to an infant as unwanted and a mistake. Can't wait for the liberal utopia to come full-circle already.

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#44 dylandr
Member since 2015 • 4940 Posts

The pope is a good guy but really sometimes a child can be a mistake, it's better to abort a child as having it live in child unfriendly conditions... (or you need to get a hella good adoption)

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#45 MrGeezer
Member since 2002 • 59765 Posts

Am I the only atheist here who doesn't really have a problem with the pope's comments? Sure, TECHNICALLY a lot of children are ABSOLUTELY "a mistake", but I feel like harping on that would be like focusing on semantics at the expense of missing the point. Seems like a pretty positive and non-controversial message to me.

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#46  Edited By deactivated-5b797108c254e
Member since 2013 • 11245 Posts

@MrGeezer: You are definitely not. To be honest I don't think many people will have a problem with what he said but it's OT, the "OMG religion!" knee-jerk reaction is always to be expected. Unless the pope says he's going to abolish Christianity some people will not be happy with anything he says.

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Catalli

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#47  Edited By Catalli  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 3453 Posts

@GazaAli said:

Leave it to OT to take one big dump on something positive. I'm a fan of neither the Catholic Church nor the Pope for a number of reasons, yet in this instance the message he's delivering is actually a pretty decent one. If a child opens his eyes to the world then what good does it serve to label him from the get-go unwanted, a mistake and a flop?

Liberals are becoming awfully selective with their political correctness. You may not call a Jew a kike, a retard retarded or a homosexual a *** yet it is ok to refer to an infant as unwanted and a mistake. Can't wait for the liberal utopia to come full-circle already.

We aren't using derrogative terms. To say a child is unwanted or was a mistake isn't derrogative, it's a sad truth.

Besides, the Pope is one of the better things to happen to society in recent years.

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#48  Edited By wis3boi
Member since 2005 • 32507 Posts

@ianhh6 said:

@TheFlush said:

The pope is completely irrelevant, so whatever

That's... extreme. There's finally a pope doing some good in the world. Let's not be so quick to hate and dismiss.

Meet the new pope....same as the old pope, but with better PR

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Catalli

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#49 Catalli  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 3453 Posts

@wis3boi: I'd hardly claim he's the same as the old Pope. I believe he has a genuine interest in the quality of the lives of people both christian and not. Hell even the Vatican hates the Pope, so he's got to be doing something right.

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Master_Live

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#50 Master_Live
Member since 2004 • 20550 Posts

@wis3boi said:

@ianhh6 said:

@TheFlush said:

The pope is completely irrelevant, so whatever

That's... extreme. There's finally a pope doing some good in the world. Let's not be so quick to hate and dismiss.

Meet the new pope....same as the old pope, but with better PR