Prejudice still live and well in America

Gay Marriage is against the law! It's not a surprise. Several states in 2004 and 2006 passed ballot measures against Gay Marriage, including my home state of Michigan. And so others followed in 2008. I wonder what states are next. California is still very close, but it looks like it' will pass there too.

The most interesting thing about this is that in 2006 Arizona actualy voted down the the gay marriage ban proposal, but they just put it back on the ballot again in 2008. I guess that's the best way to pass descrimintive measures.. just keep putting them on the ballot untill you can win.

You might say that the will of the people makes it right to do this. Tell that too the Indians, tell that to the African Americans, tell that to all the oppressed people in the World.

This goes to show you discrimination in America is still live and well, despite the fact we have elected a multi-ethnic President.

This is not a blog. Some of you will say blog it. I could put it on a blog yes, but nobody will read it. I know there are many Gay Discussion threads on the forums putting this information at the end of one wont' do very good because most people dont read the last pages.

Gay Marriage Bans in 2008

Arizona(so they voted on it again) 56% Yes, 44% no

Florida 62% Yes, 38% no

California(still up for grabs, but over in my mind with 89% reporting) 52% Yes, 48% no

and here's the best one

Arkansas Initiative 1: Ban on Gay Couples Adopting Children: 57% Yes, 43% No

Gay Marriage Bans in 2006

Arizona(It didn't pass the first time, the only state not to pass it on the first go) 49% Yes, 51% No

Idaho 63% Yes, 37% No

South Carolina 78% Yes, 22% No

South Dakota 52% Yes, 48% No

Tennessee 81% Yes, 19% No

Virginia 57% Yes, 43% No

Wisconsin 59% Yes, 41% No

Gay Marriage Bans in 2004

Arkansas 75% Yes, 25% No

Georgia 76% Yes, 24% No

Kentucky 75% Yes, 25% No

Michigan 59% Yes, 41% No

Mississipi 86% Yes, 14% No

Montana 67% Yes, 33% No

North Dakota 73% Yes, 27% No

Ohio 62% Yes, 38% No

Oregon 57% Yes, 43% No

Utah 66% Yes, 34% No

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

DryvBy4Ever

See I think it's the wording where most people are lost on. I don't think the homosexual community is wanting the religious ceremony. They just want their rights as american citizens to be protected when they decide who they want to be with.

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

DryvBy4Ever

Wrong. Marriage did not orginate from religion it orginated from socio-economic status in cultures and promoted trade of cows, and other such objects among the various communities. Only later did relgiion adopt marriage. Basic anthropology. Marriage is not about religion it's about the community.

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

DryvBy4Ever

Agreed. How this ever became in a political issue is beyond me.

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

DryvBy4Ever

Nobody is in favour of forcing churches to recognize these marriages. That argument fails.

[QUOTE="DryvBy4Ever"]

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

effthat

Agreed. How this ever became in a political issue is beyond me.

Read the post above. Most people don't understand the origination of Marriage and it's true purpose.

[QUOTE="DryvBy4Ever"]

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

johnnyv2003

See I think it's the wording where most people are lost on. I don't think the homosexual community is wanting the religious ceremony. They just want their rights as american citizens to be protected when they decide who they want to be with.

Don't we have civil unions for this?

As far as the argument goes against separations of church and state show me a politician that isn't a christian, and doesn't vote based on it. More over the separation of church from states would mean there is no reason to make laws banning gay Marriage because it has nothing to do with religion to begin with, but apparently it does since they are voting on that precedence.

Like you said.. Church and State are separate therefor it's not the states job to ban Gay Marriage. It would become the churches but since marriage isn't about religion the church can't do that. ONLY, the state.

[QUOTE="johnnyv2003"][QUOTE="DryvBy4Ever"]

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

effthat

See I think it's the wording where most people are lost on. I don't think the homosexual community is wanting the religious ceremony. They just want their rights as american citizens to be protected when they decide who they want to be with.

Don't we have civil unions for this?

yes, and it offends me as a christian that so many people oppose gay civil unions. Jesus' #1 sermon was not to judge each other based on our sins. Therefore, even if i deem homosexuality wrong, it isn't my right as an American to keep people from engaging in it and trying to block their rights as Americans. Because to me that goes against the 'do unto others as you would have them do unto you' rule.

[QUOTE="effthat"][QUOTE="DryvBy4Ever"]

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

EMOEVOLUTION

Agreed. How this ever became in a political issue is beyond me.

Read the post above. Most people don't understand the origination of Marriage and it's true purpose.

It's original purpose is a moot point to it's application in today's society. We'll never agree on this and it's unlikely that we'll agree elsewhere. I agree with civil unions because they're essentialy granted by the state and keep the church out of this. It's disgusting that this is an issue. Religious nuts need to back out of peoples lives and the government needs to start protecting individual rights. This shouldn't be the huge issue that it's grown into.

[QUOTE="EMOEVOLUTION"][QUOTE="effthat"][QUOTE="DryvBy4Ever"]

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

effthat

Agreed. How this ever became in a political issue is beyond me.

Read the post above. Most people don't understand the origination of Marriage and it's true purpose.

It's original purpose is a moot point to it's application in today's society. We'll never agree on this and it's unlikely that we'll agree elsewhere. I agree with civil unions because they're essentialy granted by the state and keep the church out of this. It's disgusting that this is an issue. Religious nuts need to back out of peoples lives and the government needs to start protecting individual rights. This shouldn't be the huge issue that it's grown into.

The nature of humanity has not changed.

The state has the right to create laws regarding Marriage. And since the State is Seperate from Church. You there for have to assume Marriage is Seperate from Church. end of story.

[QUOTE="EMOEVOLUTION"][QUOTE="effthat"][QUOTE="DryvBy4Ever"]

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

effthat

Agreed. How this ever became in a political issue is beyond me.

Read the post above. Most people don't understand the origination of Marriage and it's true purpose.

It's original purpose is a moot point to it's application in today's society. We'll never agree on this and it's unlikely that we'll agree elsewhere. I agree with civil unions because they're essentialy granted by the state and keep the church out of this. It's disgusting that this is an issue. Religious nuts need to back out of peoples lives and the government needs to start protecting individual rights. This shouldn't be the huge issue that it's grown into.

But it's not really religious anymore either. Plenty of atheists get married. I know you're not making this argument in this post, but lots of others are saying "but it's a religious institution so the government shouldn't interfere." No it's not.

I don't really care enough one way or the other enough to make an issue out of it. If I was forced to choose, I'd legalize it, just because I can't think of a real reason not to. But you won't see me actively campaigning for it. It's already legal here, anyway.

[QUOTE="effthat"][QUOTE="EMOEVOLUTION"][QUOTE="effthat"][QUOTE="DryvBy4Ever"]

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

EMOEVOLUTION

Agreed. How this ever became in a political issue is beyond me.

Read the post above. Most people don't understand the origination of Marriage and it's true purpose.

It's original purpose is a moot point to it's application in today's society. We'll never agree on this and it's unlikely that we'll agree elsewhere. I agree with civil unions because they're essentialy granted by the state and keep the church out of this. It's disgusting that this is an issue. Religious nuts need to back out of peoples lives and the government needs to start protecting individual rights. This shouldn't be the huge issue that it's grown into.

The nature of humanity has not changed.

The state has the right to create laws regarding Marriage. And since the State is Seperate from Church. You there for have to assume Marriage is Seperate from Church. end of story.

The nature of marriage HAS changed. The nature of trade has changed as well. Marriage is not the economic decision that it once was (in most cases). You may not completely understand because of your background with socialism, but the state is made up of the people and a certain amount of the people feel strongly about the church. In a way it can't be seperated and was never really intended to be seperated.

However, I don't agree with the unfair treatment of ANY citizens. It is beyond me why this has become an issue because I don't understand why states aren't recognizing civil unions and the gay community feels it's ok to strong arm the churches. It should be a moot point. If you're gay and go to church, shouldn't you go to a church that is ok with gay people? That let's them get married?!

We have troops in at least 2 different nations THAT WE KNOW OF. We have a set of economic dominos just waiting to collapse completely. We have bigger problems than whether a gay couple can claim each other on tax forms.

I'm glad it's going to pass, but gay couples should have civil unions that give them all the same rights and benefits as married couples.

I see marriage here as a religious event, so I can't honestly say I'd want them to be able to "Marry."

And I feel bad for that Arkansas Prop. In a case like that, even though I'm against gay marriages that is a silly law that really just hurts the children waiting for parents.

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

DryvBy4Ever

Marriage is not a religious ceremony. That's ridiculous.

What you call Prejudice I call common sense and morally right. I am against gay marriage 100% and I could not be happier that the majority of America has voted against the corruption of marriage and what it stands for.

Well done America. And mods should lock this topic as you are calling the majority of people in America prejudice, that's highly offensive. Do your whining in your blog where people don't have to read your drivel.

[QUOTE="effthat"][QUOTE="EMOEVOLUTION"][QUOTE="effthat"][QUOTE="DryvBy4Ever"]

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

Torftw

Agreed. How this ever became in a political issue is beyond me.

Read the post above. Most people don't understand the origination of Marriage and it's true purpose.

It's original purpose is a moot point to it's application in today's society. We'll never agree on this and it's unlikely that we'll agree elsewhere. I agree with civil unions because they're essentialy granted by the state and keep the church out of this. It's disgusting that this is an issue. Religious nuts need to back out of peoples lives and the government needs to start protecting individual rights. This shouldn't be the huge issue that it's grown into.

But it's not really religious anymore either. Plenty of atheists get married. I know you're not making this argument in this post, but lots of others are saying "but it's a religious institution so the government shouldn't interfere." No it's not.

I don't really care enough one way or the other enough to make an issue out of it. If I was forced to choose, I'd legalize it, just because I can't think of a real reason not to. But you won't see me actively campaigning for it. It's already legal here, anyway.

The difference is that athiests don't try to force religious institutions to recognize and administer the event. However, you make a great point. My feelings are that you can't strong arm the church and you can't treat citizens differently based on sexual preference. There is an easy fix, but we're too hard headed to find it.

What you call Prejudice I call common sense and morally right. I am against gay marriage 100% and I could not be happier that the majority of America has voted against the corruption of marriage and what it stands for.

Well done America. And mods should lock this topic as you are calling the majority of people in America prejudice, that's highly offensive. Do your whining in your blog where people don't have to read your drivel.

FalloutZombie

8.5 out of 10, easy. That's gonna get tons of bites. Well done.

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

DryvBy4Ever

[QUOTE="Torftw"][QUOTE="effthat"][QUOTE="EMOEVOLUTION"][QUOTE="effthat"][QUOTE="DryvBy4Ever"]

Separation of Church and State, man. Quit pushing your State on the Church and they'll quit pushing their Church on your state. Marriage was started as a religious ceremony. Just drop it. Come up with your own term for whatever you people do.

Can't have it one sided...

effthat

Agreed. How this ever became in a political issue is beyond me.

Read the post above. Most people don't understand the origination of Marriage and it's true purpose.

It's original purpose is a moot point to it's application in today's society. We'll never agree on this and it's unlikely that we'll agree elsewhere. I agree with civil unions because they're essentialy granted by the state and keep the church out of this. It's disgusting that this is an issue. Religious nuts need to back out of peoples lives and the government needs to start protecting individual rights. This shouldn't be the huge issue that it's grown into.

But it's not really religious anymore either. Plenty of atheists get married. I know you're not making this argument in this post, but lots of others are saying "but it's a religious institution so the government shouldn't interfere." No it's not.

I don't really care enough one way or the other enough to make an issue out of it. If I was forced to choose, I'd legalize it, just because I can't think of a real reason not to. But you won't see me actively campaigning for it. It's already legal here, anyway.

The difference is that athiests don't try to force religious institutions to recognize and administer the event. However, you make a great point. My feelings are that you can't strong arm the church and you can't treat citizens differently based on sexual preference. There is an easy fix, but we're too hard headed to find it.

The way it is in Canada works. They can get married, but the church isn't forced to recognize it. Simple.

What you call Prejudice I call common sense and morally right. I am against gay marriage 100% and I could not be happier that the majority of America has voted against the corruption of marriage and what it stands for.

Well done America. And mods should lock this topic as you are calling the majority of people in America prejudice, that's highly offensive. Do your whining in your blog where people don't have to read your drivel.

FalloutZombie

I for one fail to see how allowing gay couples to form a union and recieve marriage benefits corrupts marriage.

[QUOTE="FalloutZombie"]

What you call Prejudice I call common sense and morally right. I am against gay marriage 100% and I could not be happier that the majority of America has voted against the corruption of marriage and what it stands for.

Well done America. And mods should lock this topic as you are calling the majority of people in America prejudice, that's highly offensive. Do your whining in your blog where people don't have to read your drivel.

princeofshapeir

I for one fail to see how allowing gay couples to form a union and recieve marriage benefits corrupts marriage.

It doesn't. The issue is that a lot of gay couples aren't content with just that. I have heard arguements that gay marriage causes a breakdown in the nuclear family which inadvertantly stifles the economy. Right after the idea was presented a kid in my economics class clamoured on about how the professor couldn't make that statement and how it was wrong and stormed out of the class. As such, I don't remember all of the variables in the arguement, but it was quite well formed.

I think that homosexuality is less of a cause than the huge failure rate of marriage though. We destroyed the nuclear family all on our own.

Marriage is a legal institution, not a religious one: In the US it's entirely possible to get married in a magistrate's office without setting foot near a church, mosque, synagogue, etc.

Proposition 8's imminent passage won't represent protection of a religious institution, as its supporters would have you believe. Rather, it will represent one set of taxpayers voting to deny another set of taxpayers a privilege that they themselves take for granted. It's quite obscene, really.

Worse still, Proposition 8 will rescind a privelege that has already been granted, because California's Supreme Court voted to allow same-gender marriages earlier this year. It will be interesting to see what happens when the state declares thousands of months-long marriages null-and-void. I wonder if the conservative Christians and Mormons will actually dance in the streets. :roll:

Marriage is a legal institution, not a religious one: In the US it's entirely possible to get married in a magistrate's office without setting foot near a church, mosque, synagogue, etc.

Proposition 8's imminent passage won't represent protection of a religious institution, as its supporters would have you believe. Rather, it will represent one set of taxpayers voting to deny another set of taxpayers a privilege that they themselves take for granted. It's quite obscene, really.

Worse still, Proposition 8 will rescind a privelege that has already been granted, because California's Supreme Court voted to allow same-gender marriages earlier this year. It will be interesting to see what happens when the state declares thousands of months-long marriages null-and-void. I wonder if the conservative Christians and Mormons will actually dance in the streets. :roll:

Stesilaus

They will probaly have a parade LOL

What you call Prejudice I call common sense and morally right. I am against gay marriage 100% and I could not be happier that the majority of America has voted against the corruption of marriage and what it stands for.

Well done America. And mods should lock this topic as you are calling the majority of people in America prejudice, that's highly offensive. Do your whining in your blog where people don't have to read your drivel.

FalloutZombie

This is true. Every time a gay couple gets married, you better go out and get married to your spouse again, because your marriage was just marred by that gay couple marrying. Your previous marriage becomes worthless and meaningless because of that marriage between two people who love each other. Can you imagine letting those people who love eachother get married? That's totally corrupt and against the spirit of marriage, and states shouldn't allow those gay couples to be able to see the people they love in the hospital or enter into a state recognized bond with the people they love. That'd just be silly.

why are people so uppity about gay people needing to be married

people sure have strong feeligns, I mean if you're not gay then why do you care LOL

why are people so uppity about black people needing to be free.

people sure have strong feeligns, I mean if you're not black then why do you care LOL

I_Am_Sexy

I say leave it up to the individual states. That was people who like gay marriage can live in a state that allows it and those that don't like gay marriage can live in one that has banned it. It's quite simple really. It's unfair to make the whole country pro-gay marriage or anti-gay marriage. Mor-GanX

[QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"]

why are people so uppity about black people needing to be free.

people sure have strong feeligns, I mean if you're not black then why do you care LOL

DJ_Novakain

stupid

not even close to being the same

[QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"]

why are people so uppity about black people needing to be free.

people sure have strong feeligns, I mean if you're not black then why do you care LOL

I_Am_Sexy

stupid

not even close to being the same

[QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"][QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"]

why are people so uppity about black people needing to be free.

people sure have strong feeligns, I mean if you're not black then why do you care LOL

DJ_Novakain

stupid

not even close to being the same

marriage isn't necessary

freedom is crucial

not the same thing, lesson over

LOL WTF

[QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"][QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"]

why are people so uppity about black people needing to be free.

people sure have strong feeligns, I mean if you're not black then why do you care LOL

I_Am_Sexy

stupid

not even close to being the same

marriage isn't necessary

freedom is crucial

not the same thing, lesson over

LOL WTF

[QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"][QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"][QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"]

why are people so uppity about black people needing to be free.

people sure have strong feeligns, I mean if you're not black then why do you care LOL

DJ_Novakain

stupid

not even close to being the same

marriage isn't necessary

freedom is crucial

not the same thing, lesson over

LOL WTF

I just made my point! LOL!

do I have to spell it out for you WTF

use your own brain figure it out LOL

People need to be open and accepting of different groups of people within their own culture. We are not one culture we are many separate cultures. We don't live in small tribal communities.

My whole reasoning is that we don't need laws that define Marriage, other than what's it's functional economic purpose. After that it's defined by who ever is married to each other.

We need less laws, not more. My state just passed a law that allows medical Marijuana. I voted no, not because I dont support Medical Marijuana but because I believe we don't need a law allowing it so people can use it for medical reasons. I feel very much the same about all those gay Marriage bans, they are uncessary and just a representation of fear.

I think it's stupid that the United States, the leader of freedom and equality in the world, is having an issue with gay rights... The country was settled by people who wanted to escape persecution and follow their own beliefs.. Seems strange that everyone's rights aren't equal over there.. Just because someone has different beliefs and views than you doesn't mean they should be stopped from believing or practicing them..

I believe that homosexuality is wrong, but I'm sure many gay people believe that my religion is wrong (I'm Muslim).. But I don't stop others from doing what they think is right, because I would hate if people stopped me from practicing what I believe in.. Everyone should just stick to their own beliefs and leave other people alone..

yeah slavery and gay marriage are not comparable issues...not in the least :lol:fat_rob

I know WTF

I thought it was obvious LOL

this shouldn't be an issue, what's with the confusion DJ

I think it's stupid that the United States, the leader of freedom and equality in the world, is having an issue with gay rights... The country was settled by people who wanted to escape persecution and follow their own beliefs.. Seems strange that everyone's rights aren't equal over there.. Just because someone has different beliefs and views than you doesn't mean they should be stopped from believing or practicing them..

I believe that homosexuality is wrong, but I'm sure many gay people believe that my religion is wrong (I'm Muslim).. But I don't stop others from doing what they think is right, because I would hate if people stopped me from practicing what I believe in.. Everyone should just stick to their own beliefs and leave other people alone..

well_wicked4578

Two party system is not free, the United States who is acting under the guise of freedom is misleading.

[QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"][QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"][QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"]

why are people so uppity about black people needing to be free.

people sure have strong feeligns, I mean if you're not black then why do you care LOL

I_Am_Sexy

stupid

not even close to being the same

marriage isn't necessary

freedom is crucial

not the same thing, lesson over

LOL WTF

I just made my point! LOL!

do I have to spell it out for you WTF

use your own brain figure it out LOL

[QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"][QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"][QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"][QUOTE="DJ_Novakain"][QUOTE="I_Am_Sexy"]

why are people so uppity about black people needing to be free.

people sure have strong feeligns, I mean if you're not black then why do you care LOL

DJ_Novakain

stupid

not even close to being the same

marriage isn't necessary

freedom is crucial

not the same thing, lesson over

LOL WTF

I just made my point! LOL!

do I have to spell it out for you WTF

use your own brain figure it out LOL

where did I misspell a word? LOL you've gone off the deep end now LOL!!!!

man I won't argue with you, you're obviously too stubborn to admit a mistake

we'll just leave it here with everyone noticing you're wrong and you with your fingers in your ears saying nu-uh, I'm right!

LOL internet tough guys LOL