Rate this band: Amon Amarth

[QUOTE="jubino"][QUOTE="black_cat19"]

It's called dissonance, genious. I thought it was all the rage with you music elitists ever since the 20th century? I guess not... :roll:

Anyway, growling takes just as much skill as clean vocals. If you don't believe, try doing it for more than a couple minutes without proper training and see what it does to your vocal chords. How do you think metal vocalists manage to growl for hours on end and still be able to speak afterwards? Because they have the skill not to **** their vocal chords up while doing it; it's not just mindless screaming. Same goes for clean singing.

Mcspanky37

I can also flick on my throat and create notes. I can even play the William Tell Overture doing it, but you don't see me selling albums trying to pass it off as music. I know better.jubino

How can you be arguing that metal with groweled vocals isn't music? You don't like it. Fine, I don't care, I probably think the music you like is **** too, but that doens't mean it's not music. :|

Call it what you will, but using an argument like "it's dissonance" is essentially saying "it's good because it's bad". Argument fail.

jubino

It's absolutely nothing like saying "it's good because it's bad." Again, you may not like it, but that doesn't make it bad.

[QUOTE="jubino"]I can also flick on my throat and create notes. I can even play the William Tell Overture doing it, but you don't see me selling albums trying to pass it off as music. I know better.Guppy507

How can you be arguing that metal with groweled vocals isn't music? You don't like it. Fine, I don't care, I probably think the music you like is **** too, but that doens't mean it's not music. :|

2/5

1 point for With Oden On Our Side and 1 point for Versus The World.

There's music in there somewhere, I'm referring mainly to the vocals. I can't understand the words, and it doesn't strike me as anything that would merit listening to. Kinda like nails on a chalkboard to me. You could play the most beautiful song in the world but run your fingers down a blackboard while playing it and I'll walk out.jubino

As much as I agree, growling is teetering on the edge of "not even a form of singing", it fits AA's music. I can't imagine them having a different vocalist. Pavoratti sure as hell wouldn't fit :POblivionfan10

[QUOTE="Mcspanky37"][QUOTE="jubino"] I can also flick on my throat and create notes. I can even play the William Tell Overture doing it, but you don't see me selling albums trying to pass it off as music. I know better.jubino

Dissonance

Go ahead, just TRY telling me it's only good "because it's bad". :|

[QUOTE="jubino"]There's music in there somewhere, I'm referring mainly to the vocals. I can't understand the words, and it doesn't strike me as anything that would merit listening to. Kinda like nails on a chalkboard to me. You could play the most beautiful song in the world but run your fingers down a blackboard while playing it and I'll walk out.Guppy507

[QUOTE="Guppy507"]

[QUOTE="jubino"]I can also flick on my throat and create notes. I can even play the William Tell Overture doing it, but you don't see me selling albums trying to pass it off as music. I know better.jubino

How can you be arguing that metal with groweled vocals isn't music? You don't like it. Fine, I don't care, I probably think the music you like is **** too, but that doens't mean it's not music. :|

That's the whole point of dissonance, two sounds that "clash" with one another... :|

It's an incoherent mess and not even music Just kidding :POblivionfan10

How is saying our music is complete incoherent garbage, and not even music NOT trolling? :|

Guppy507

It's called dissonance, genious. I thought it was all the rage with you music elitists ever since the 20th century? I guess not... :roll:

Anyway, growling takes just as much skill as clean vocals. If you don't believe me, try doing it for more than a couple minutes without proper training and see what it does to your vocal chords. How do you think metal vocalists manage to growl for hours on end at concerts and still be able to speak afterwards? Because they have the skill not to **** their vocal chords up while doing it; it's not just mindless screaming. Same goes for clean singing.

black_cat19

A part of me nowadays would mostly agree with that, not kiddingOblivionfan10

[QUOTE="Oblivionfan10"]A part of me nowadays would mostly agree with that, not kiddingGuppy507

[QUOTE="Guppy507"] How is saying our music is complete incoherent garbage, and not even music NOT trolling? :|

Dystopian-X

It's called dissonance, genious. I thought it was all the rage with you music elitists ever since the 20th century? I guess not... :roll:

Anyway, growling takes just as much skill as clean vocals. If you don't believe me, try doing it for more than a couple minutes without proper training and see what it does to your vocal chords. How do you think metal vocalists manage to growl for hours on end at concerts and still be able to speak afterwards? Because they have the skill not to **** their vocal chords up while doing it; it's not just mindless screaming. Same goes for clean singing.

black_cat19

Vocal versatility? Oh, you mean this?

Just stay until the chorus, I'm sure it won't kill you; it's the same vocalist, AND he's one of the band's guitarists to boot. This may come as a shock to you, but these are real musicians we're talking about.

Oh, and just so you don't have an excuse to not watch it, the chorus starts at 3:12. ;)

I don't recall ever labelling it as garbage. Incoherent? Yes. Can't take some criticism? In fact, I was the one being accused and called names.

Dystopian-X

"*list of generic rock bands*

You know, Real Music."

>Implying that AA isn't music

"Yeah, because listening to musically oblivious ppl banging incoherently on some drums like monkeys is that much better."

>Saying AA is musically oblivious and they bang on drums like monkeys isn't calling them garbage, or insulting to the person you were talking too?

Also, how are they incoherant? They follow a very basic song structure, each instrument is defined and easy to hear, they have very clean production, etc.

Dare I say that it is, in fact, you that's musically oblivious? :o

Vocal versatility? Oh, you mean this?

Just stay until the chorus, I'm sure it won't kill you; it's the same vocalist, AND he's one of the band's guitarists to boot. This may come as a shock to you, but these are real musicians we're talking about.

Oh, and just so you don't have an excuse to not watch it, the chorus starts at 3:12. ;)

black_cat19

Thank you for proving my point. This only gets decent once the dog burping stops. ^_^

[QUOTE="black_cat19"]

Vocal versatility? Oh, you mean this?

Just stay until the chorus, I'm sure it won't kill you; it's the same vocalist, AND he's one of the band's guitarists to boot. This may come as a shock to you, but these are real musicians we're talking about.

Oh, and just so you don't have an excuse to not watch it, the chorus starts at 3:12. ;)

Dystopian-X

Thank you for proving my point. This only gets decent once the dog burping stops. ^_^

Me: Metal vocals take skill

You: It's not skill because they're not versatile and don't sing in tune

Me: *posts a song where the vocalist growls first and then does clean singing perfectly in tune, all while playing guitar*

You: Hey, that guy is versatile and sings in tune, I like it! ^_^

Who's point was proven, again? :roll:

"*list of generic rock bands*

You know, Real Music."

>Implying that AA isn't musicGuppy507

Not calling it garbage.

"Yeah, because listening to musically oblivious ppl banging incoherently on some drums like monkeys is that much better."

>Saying AA is musically oblivious and they bang on drums like monkeys isn't calling them garbage, or insulting to the person you were talking too?Guppy507

It's only a fair comparison. Still not calling garbage. Monkeys need some lovin' too

; o

Also, how are they incoherant? They follow a very basic song structure, each instrument is defined and easy to hear, they have very clean production, etc.

Dare I say that it is, in fact, you that's musically oblivious? :o

Guppy507

How can people even refer to Amon Amarth as even remotely dissonant? They primarily write euphonic music...

Here's some dissonant metal for you.

Really though most metal is far from truly dissonant. If you want some musical cacophony check out expressionist stuff like Stravinsky, Ginastera, Stockhausen, Bartók or Scelsi; Miles Davis' piece Biches (+t) Brew is also a highlight, which is inspired by Stockhausen's work.

Growling is something that takes a lot of skill and is definitely not just "random vocal noises". Some growlers especially in the pornogrind and goregrind scene are just terrible and are definitely just singing random garbage, but real growling is used for effect. It's not because of a lack of vocal diversity, because there are plenty of clean vocalists that are also excellent growlers... Truth is growling, especially in doom and death metal, is used to create an atmosphere most of the time.

All that being said, I rate Amon Amarth 2/5 because their work is really not that original and I think most of their albums are overrated.

Me: Metal vocals take skill

You: It's not skill because they're not versatile and don't sing in tune

Me: *posts a song where the vocalist growls first and then does clean singing perfectly in tune, all while playing guitar*

You: Hey, that guy is versatile and sings in tune, I like it! ^_^

Who's point was proven, again? :roll:

black_cat19

I wasn't referring to the ability/inability of these vocalists to pull some actual singing off. My lack of versatility comment is directed towards the growling itself and the supposed "skill" behind it.

How can people even refer to Amon Amarth as even remotely dissonant? They primarily write euphonic music...

Here's some dissonant metal for you.

Really though most metal is far from truly dissonant. If you want some musical cacophony check out expressionist stuff like Stravinsky, Ginastera, Stockhausen, Bartók or Scelsi; Miles Davis' piece Biches (+t) Brew is also a highlight, which is inspired by Stockhausen's work.

Growling is something that takes a lot of skill and is definitely not just "random vocal noises". Some growlers especially in the pornogrind and goregrind scene are just terrible and are definitely just singing random garbage, but real growling is used for effect. It's not because of a lack of vocal diversity, because there are plenty of clean vocalists that are also excellent growlers... Truth is growling, especially in doom and death metal, is used to create an atmosphere most of the time.

All that being said, I rate Amon Amarth 2/5 because their work is really not that original and I think most of their albums are overrated.

ex-mortis

I agree with pretty much everything you just said, but I wasn't talking about the actual music when I said metal was dissonant, I was referring only to the growling vocals. Come to think of it, growling is more like atonality, not dissonance, but whatever...

[QUOTE="black_cat19"]

Me: Metal vocals take skill

You: It's not skill because they're not versatile and don't sing in tune

Me: *posts a song where the vocalist growls first and then does clean singing perfectly in tune, all while playing guitar*

You: Hey, that guy is versatile and sings in tune, I like it! ^_^

Who's point was proven, again? :roll:

Dystopian-X

I wasn't referring to the ability/inability of these vocalists to pull some actual singing off. My lack of versatility comment is directed towards the growling itself and the supposed "skill" behind it.

How about some apathy towards the growling, instead of hate? You come off as someone who really has not listened to that much growling. After listening to all sorts of growling I have grown used to the vocal style; now when I listen I either like it a lot or I don't care because it's not in the foreground. Usually my favorite vocalists are clean singers, but that doesn't mean I can't keep an open mind. Also, you should adopt selective listening habits; I really don't understand getting absolutely immobilized by a single element of the music. It's not impossible to ignore it and focus on the other instruments.

I agree with pretty much everything you just said, but I wasn't talking about the actual music when I said metal was dissonant, I was referring only to the growling vocals. Come to think of it, growling is more like atonality, not dissonance, but whatever...black_cat19

Ah I see, I must have skipped over that part of the thread then sorry. But still, growling can't really be atonal. Metal is almost always within some key and the growling isn't an exception. If the growler is just singing in any specific key (all of them), then his own melody will clash with the rest. Depends on what time of growler it is how melodic or how percussive or ambient the growling is, but in spite of all of the dissonance the notes will harmonize and it can create some really ugly sounding harmonies if the singer is out of tune with the music. But growling definitely doesn't follow any strict musical rules most of the time no, which essentially makes it dissonant like that.

[QUOTE="black_cat19"]I agree with pretty much everything you just said, but I wasn't talking about the actual music when I said metal was dissonant, I was referring only to the growling vocals. Come to think of it, growling is more like atonality, not dissonance, but whatever...ex-mortis

Ah I see, I must have skipped over that part of the thread then sorry. But still, growling can't really be atonal. Metal is almost always within some key and the growling isn't an exception. If the growler is just singing in any specific key (all of them), then his own melody will clash with the rest. Depends on what time of growler it is how melodic or how percussive or ambient the growling is, but in spite of all of the dissonance the notes will harmonize and it can create some really ugly sounding harmonies if the singer is out of tune with the music. But growling definitely doesn't follow any strict musical rules most of the time no, which essentially makes it dissonant like that.

So I was right to call it dissonance after all...? You made me doubt myself for a second there. :P

[QUOTE="ex-mortis"]

[QUOTE="black_cat19"]I agree with pretty much everything you just said, but I wasn't talking about the actual music when I said metal was dissonant, I was referring only to the growling vocals. Come to think of it, growling is more like atonality, not dissonance, but whatever...black_cat19

Ah I see, I must have skipped over that part of the thread then sorry. But still, growling can't really be atonal. Metal is almost always within some key and the growling isn't an exception. If the growler is just singing in any specific key (all of them), then his own melody will clash with the rest. Depends on what time of growler it is how melodic or how percussive or ambient the growling is, but in spite of all of the dissonance the notes will harmonize and it can create some really ugly sounding harmonies if the singer is out of tune with the music. But growling definitely doesn't follow any strict musical rules most of the time no, which essentially makes it dissonant like that.

So I was right to call it dissonance after all...? You made me doubt myself for a second there. :P

Yeah I wasn't exactly sure what you were talking about before you posted but then again it really depends on the growler like I said. The growling can be melodic like this or it can be ambient like this. The difference between those two is that Chuck is singing an actual melody while growling/screaming. The vocals really aren't a melodic instrument anymore, but just taking on an ambient stance in the foreground. A special emphasis is put on the actual growling technique instead of what notes are being sung. It's similar to how some percussive instruments generally have no key. But growlers that actively partake in the music and are singing actual notes are not just singing "whatever" and it can't really be considered atonality. But it's dissonant in how its notes have no real theoretical correlation is what I'm getting at.

[QUOTE="black_cat19"]

[QUOTE="ex-mortis"]

Ah I see, I must have skipped over that part of the thread then sorry. But still, growling can't really be atonal. Metal is almost always within some key and the growling isn't an exception. If the growler is just singing in any specific key (all of them), then his own melody will clash with the rest. Depends on what time of growler it is how melodic or how percussive or ambient the growling is, but in spite of all of the dissonance the notes will harmonize and it can create some really ugly sounding harmonies if the singer is out of tune with the music. But growling definitely doesn't follow any strict musical rules most of the time no, which essentially makes it dissonant like that.

ex-mortis

So I was right to call it dissonance after all...? You made me doubt myself for a second there. :P

Yeah I wasn't exactly sure what you were talking about before you posted but then again it really depends on the growler like I said. The growling can be melodic like this or it can be ambient like this. The difference between those two is that Chuck is singing an actual melody while growling/screaming. The vocals really aren't a melodic instrument anymore, but just taking on an ambient stance in the foreground. A special emphasis is put on the actual growling technique instead of what notes are being sung. It's similar to how some percussive instruments generally have no key. But growlers that actively partake in the music and are singing actual notes are not just singing "whatever" and it can't really be considered atonality. But it's dissonant in how its notes have no real theoretical correlation is what I'm getting at.

Yup, that's pretty much what I was getting at, as well.

Death Metal is amazing, forget all the naysayers, that's what I'm getting at.

1/5 not that great.

Well, their songs tend to kick my arse in Tap Tap Revenge, (and they are sorta catchy), so I'll give them a 3.5 or 4 out of 5.

Believe it or not, I sometimes find the singers in death metal bands hilarious... (Cookie monster's mating call, perhaps?)

5/5. One of my favorites.

Wow... this thread is something else. :| 3.5/5 is my rating, though.MistressMinako

What's wrong with it? :?

It turned out much better than the "Alcohol is wrong" one, wouldn't you agree? :P

3/5 the cookie monster singing.. ughh...

Espada12

[QUOTE="MistressMinako"]Wow... this thread is something else. :| 3.5/5 is my rating, though.black_cat19

What's wrong with it? :P

It turned out much better than the "Alcohol is wrong" one, wouldn't you agree? :D

[QUOTE="black_cat19"]

[QUOTE="MistressMinako"]Wow... this thread is something else. :| 3.5/5 is my rating, though.MistressMinako

What's wrong with it? :P

It turned out much better than the "Alcohol is wrong" one, wouldn't you agree? :D

It's on the first page right now, still going on. The atmosphere over there got... "dense", to say the least. >_>

Its catchy and I can dance to it... I'l give it a four.

In all seriousness, the instruments are awesome, but not a big fan of the vocal style. I'll still give them a four though.

4/5. I really like the music, but I don't care for the singing.

And I'm pretty sure these guys are Black Metal, not Death Metal?

[QUOTE="Guppy507"] How is saying our music is complete incoherent garbage, and not even music NOT trolling? :|

It's called dissonance, genious. I thought it was all the rage with you music elitists ever since the 20th century? I guess not... :roll:

Anyway, growling takes just as much skill as clean vocals. If you don't believe me, try doing it for more than a couple minutes without proper training and see what it does to your vocal chords. How do you think metal vocalists manage to growl for hours on end at concerts and still be able to speak afterwards? Because they have the skill not to **** their vocal chords up while doing it; it's not just mindless screaming. Same goes for clean singing.

The insttrumentals are pretty intense but I don't like the growling. I wouldn't mind screaming though.

[QUOTE="Guppy507"] I don't recall ever labelling it as garbage. Incoherent? Yes. Can't take some criticism? In fact, I was the one being accused and called names :V[QUOTE="black_cat19"]

It's called dissonance, genious. I thought it was all the rage with you music elitists ever since the 20th century? I guess not... :roll:

Anyway, growling takes just as much skill as clean vocals. If you don't believe me, try doing it for more than a couple minutes without proper training and see what it does to your vocal chords. How do you think metal vocalists manage to growl for hours on end at concerts and still be able to speak afterwards? Because they have the skill not to **** their vocal chords up while doing it; it's not just mindless screaming. Same goes for clean singing.

I didn't listen, but gave them a 3 just because their name comes from Tolkien.