So Christians, What's Your Rationale In Your Belief Of God?

First off, let me get this straight: I am not trying to prove anyone wrong by going into some big debate with you guys. I do this only for research purposes. I'm merely wondering what you guys believe backs up your theory of god. That is all.

Hmm...this exact same topic was posted...yesterday was it not? But it wasn't by you...

From past experiences, to be honest. I always believed in God, and still pray to Him.

This isn't meant to be part of a debate, but just because you can't see God doesn't mean he isn't there. You can't see atoms but most people believe in them. I'm not saying atoms aren't real, but really, they're just the results of hypotheses. C exists because of A, and therefore it must be the result of B. There is no, true, physical proof. I do think atoms exist, though.

God exists. I have seen His miracles.

PS: I really don't want to get in a debate. I try to stay out of political and religious debates.

From past experiences, to be honest. I always believed in God, and still pray to Him.

This isn't meant to be part of a debate, but just because you can't see God doesn't mean he isn't there. You can't see atoms but most people believe in them. I'm not saying atoms aren't real, but really, they're just the results of hypotheses. C exists because of A, and therefore it must be the result of B. There is no, true, physical proof. I do think atoms exist, though.

God exists. I have seen His miracles.

PS: I really don't want to get in a debate. I try to stay out of political and religious debates.

JediXMan7

[QUOTE="JediXMan7"]

From past experiences, to be honest. I always believed in God, and still pray to Him.

This isn't meant to be part of a debate, but just because you can't see God doesn't mean he isn't there. You can't see atoms but most people believe in them. I'm not saying atoms aren't real, but really, they're just the results of hypotheses. C exists because of A, and therefore it must be the result of B. There is no, true, physical proof. I do think atoms exist, though.

God exists. I have seen His miracles.

PS: I really don't want to get in a debate. I try to stay out of political and religious debates.

comp_atkins

I believe. I just don't go to church.

Sorry if I'm nitpicking, but I don't think you should specifically target christians with your question. You would get much better and more interesting answers if you asked all theists. I am interested to see more answers, though.

[QUOTE="comp_atkins"][QUOTE="JediXMan7"]

From past experiences, to be honest. I always believed in God, and still pray to Him.

This isn't meant to be part of a debate, but just because you can't see God doesn't mean he isn't there. You can't see atoms but most people believe in them. I'm not saying atoms aren't real, but really, they're just the results of hypotheses. C exists because of A, and therefore it must be the result of B. There is no, true, physical proof. I do think atoms exist, though.

God exists. I have seen His miracles.

PS: I really don't want to get in a debate. I try to stay out of political and religious debates.

Democratik

Man. I never said they didn't exist. :roll:

Yes, the topic title would should say "theists".

And since I'm half-half regardless, I'll say that people sometimes need something to believe in to keep them going from day to day. If life is not part of a plan or purpose, than we're just here for no good reason.

[QUOTE="Democratik"][QUOTE="comp_atkins"] atoms exist. man has seen them.JediXMan7

Man. I never said they didn't exist. :roll:

But you said one can't see atoms and that there's no true, physical proof of atoms, just hypotheses, which isn't true. :P

[QUOTE="Democratik"][QUOTE="comp_atkins"] atoms exist. man has seen them.JediXMan7

Man. I never said they didn't exist. :roll:

I studied advanced apologetics, archeology, Philosophy, ancient history, and finally Bible prophecy. It lead me to my belief in

God. It took allot of questioning my agnosticism, and feeling there might be more than I had orignially thought.

Norman Geisler's Christian Apologetics, or Josh McDowells Evidence That Demands A verdict are good places to start if

one is at all interested. If not, peace out!

I studied advanced apologetics, archeology, Philosophy, ancient history, and finally Bible prophecy. It lead me to my belief in

God. It took allot of questioning my agnosticism, and feeling there might be more than I had orignially thought.

Norman Geisler's Christian Apologetics, or Josh McDowells Evidence That Demands A verdict are good places to start if

one is at all interested. If not, peace out!

eatdrums

Well it's not rational, but then again neither is everything in life. Without God, then beauty seems to have little meaning. In a more pragmatic sense, without my belief in God I would be a total hedonist who doesn't care about others. That just how my mind works. But God's love has taught me a much better way to live and think, and how much better it is to share that love with the world.Acemaster27

I seriously mean no disrespect to you, but I truly feel sorry for you if the only thing keeping you from hedonism is an outside force (whether that force is real or not is irrelevant, you believe it's real)...

I think people shouldn't need a god to tell them what is good and bad, I don't do good for fear of being punished if I don't, I do good simply because it seems like the right thing to do.

Because creation is too well-balanced and intricate to be mere chance. Penguinchow

I studied advanced apologetics, archeology, Philosophy, ancient history, and finally Bible prophecy. It lead me to my belief in

God. It took allot of questioning my agnosticism, and feeling there might be more than I had orignially thought.

Norman Geisler's Christian Apologetics, or Josh McDowells Evidence That Demands A verdict are good places to start if

one is at all interested. If not, peace out!

[QUOTE="eatdrums"]

I studied advanced apologetics, archeology, Philosophy, ancient history, and finally Bible prophecy. It lead me to my belief in

God. It took allot of questioning my agnosticism, and feeling there might be more than I had orignially thought.

Norman Geisler's Christian Apologetics, or Josh McDowells Evidence That Demands A verdict are good places to start if

one is at all interested. If not, peace out!

Penguinchow

Ya, I read that one as well. Great book. I love the works of CS Lewis. The Great Divorce, and Screwtape letters are worthy reads

as well.

All the best!

[QUOTE="JediXMan7"]

[QUOTE="Democratik"] man has split them.black_cat19

Man. I never said they didn't exist. :roll:

But you said one can't see atoms and that there's no true, physical proof of atoms, just hypotheses, which isn't true. :P

They are the result of hypotheses. Electron microscopes don't produce an optical image. Instead they send charged probes across a surface and measure slight changes electronically that flow through the probe. It sends the information into a computer which uses a complex set of mathematics called "quantum mechanics" to calulate what the surface should look like. The computer graphs the results of that calulation, and you get an electronic image. Again, it is the result of mathematics that, while correct, are still not physical.

[QUOTE="Acemaster27"]Well it's not rational, but then again neither is everything in life. Without God, then beauty seems to have little meaning. In a more pragmatic sense, without my belief in God I would be a total hedonist who doesn't care about others. That just how my mind works. But God's love has taught me a much better way to live and think, and how much better it is to share that love with the world.black_cat19

I seriously mean no disrespect to you, but I truly feel sorry for you if the only thing keeping you from hedonism is an outside force (whether that force is real or not is irrelevant, you believe it's real)...

I think people shouldn't need a god to tell them what is good and bad, I don't do good for fear of being punished if I don't, I do good simply because it seems like the right thing to do.

[QUOTE="Penguinchow"][QUOTE="eatdrums"]

I studied advanced apologetics, archeology, Philosophy, ancient history, and finally Bible prophecy. It lead me to my belief in

God. It took allot of questioning my agnosticism, and feeling there might be more than I had orignially thought.

Norman Geisler's Christian Apologetics, or Josh McDowells Evidence That Demands A verdict are good places to start if

one is at all interested. If not, peace out!

alphamale1989

Evidence That Demands a Verdict is a good read; and yes, C.S. Lewis has excellent works.

Science has said two things: first, that the universe as we know it effectively began with the Big Bang, and that the universe's expansion is accelerating, rather than decelerating. This would seem to rule out, at least with what we know right now, the idea that our universe is perpetual and has always existed.

Of course, that does not mean that whatever created our universe is intelligent. But there are other pieces of less scientific evidence that have led me to that belief, such as the existence of love and happiness that would seem to go beyond what is evolutionarily beneficial.

Existence to me just doesn't make any sense without some sort of being like God. But, then again, the existence of God doesn't make much sense either. But at least that passes the buck to God. :P

(Yes, that last bit was facetious, ha ha ha and all that.)

Science has said two things: first, that the universe as we know it effectively began with the Big Bang, and that the universe's expansion is accelerating, rather than decelerating. This would seem to rule out, at least with what we know right now, the idea that our universe is perpetual and has always existed.

Of course, that does not mean that whatever created our universe is intelligent. But there are other pieces of less scientific evidence that have led me to that belief, such as the existence of love and happiness that would seem to go beyond what is evolutionarily beneficial.

Existence to me just doesn't make any sense without some sort of being like God. But, then again, the existence of God doesn't make much sense either. But at least that passes the buck to God. :P

(Yes, that last bit was facetious, ha ha ha and all that.)

GabuEx

[QUOTE="black_cat19"]

[QUOTE="Acemaster27"]Well it's not rational, but then again neither is everything in life. Without God, then beauty seems to have little meaning. In a more pragmatic sense, without my belief in God I would be a total hedonist who doesn't care about others. That just how my mind works. But God's love has taught me a much better way to live and think, and how much better it is to share that love with the world.clayron

I seriously mean no disrespect to you, but I truly feel sorry for you if the only thing keeping you from hedonism is an outside force (whether that force is real or not is irrelevant, you believe it's real)...

I think people shouldn't need a god to tell them what is good and bad, I don't do good for fear of being punished if I don't, I do good simply because it seems like the right thing to do.

. And if you talk to any of my friends, they can tell you that I am one of the best people that they know, in terms of morals. Acemaster27

Well, I can clearly see you arent afraid of the christian god.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_deadly_sins#Pride

It's not that I'm a good person because I'm afraid of God or anything like that. It's that I have felt his love, and through that I have learned of a better way to live. Even if I learned for a fact that God did not exist, I would still live like I do now. And if you talk to any of my friends, they can tell you that I am one of the best people that they know, in terms of morals. But that doesn't change the fact that before I came to know God's love (in my early teens), ideas were forming in my head that the joys or sufferings of others did not matter because I did not experience them. Such ideas are only logical. Without God I might still have those cold, lonely beliefs. My mind operates on cold logic.Acemaster27

Mine does, too, and even as a child it only seemed natural to me that helping, or at the very least not harming others, was the way to go. I never needed a god or religion to tell me that; back then I was supposedly raised a catholic, but even then I didn't really buy any of it. It just didn't make sense, I didn't really believe it, but the part about being a good person just seemed logical to me, not because of the religion I was supposed to practice but didn't really believe in, but simply because it FELT right, and it still feels right to this day.

What exactly is love? Monogamy? Well, certain species have that, others dont. Some birds are monogamous Seems that love is evolutionary. We humans are great at making things seem like more than they really are.

What is parental love? a biological necessity in order to survive.
What is romantic love? Whether we admit it or not, we have hierarchy. Alpha males breed with Alpha women. early in human evolution, we all mostly stayed in tribes with our family, and we found a mate. Since it doesnt make biological sense to reproduce with your siblings and other family members, you tend to stay with that one person. Im not trying to make this seem like fact, its just a hypothesis (different than a theory....) that I drew up before humans started to communicate on a regular basis with non family(tribe) members

Men constantly try to prove their worth to women, and women tend to just take it. You never see these roles reversed in anything other than the immediate short term.Democratik

Love is... well, love. Of course love and happiness bears a certain degree of evolutionary benefit, which is why I specifically said "love and happiness that would seem to go beyond what is evolutionarily beneficial". There is a certain sense of transcendant peace and happiness that I have felt at times in life, and which has become more common as time has passed, that would seem to be entirely disconnected from any evolutionary drive, especially considering that I don't particularly want children. Even Richard Dawkins has acknowledged and celebrated this phenomenon of seemingly un-evolutionarily beneficial kindness and benevolence, although he, of course, does not find God in it.

Does it have a purely physical explanation? Perhaps. But, to be honest, I don't really care.

This seems to clearly be a response to the whole "To atheists, what is your rationale for not believing in god" thread.

And both of those threads are annoying.

WHAT DOES IT MATTER?

I mean, seriously.

Can we both agree that both atheists and theists are smart rational people? Can we both agree that both atheists and theists both truly BELIEVE what they believe, and that asking them to simply "believe the other thing" would be tantamount to asking them to make a lie that goes against ever fiber of their being? Can we believe that atheists and theists are BOTH good? That they're BOTH evil? That they BOTH get along with you, and that they BOTH piss you off?

Why is there SO much of an attempt here to categorize people by their beliefs?

In real life, when the cashier at the supermarket seems like a nice and funny guy, do you ask him what his religious beliefs are and then make an assessment of him based on his religious beliefs?

My mom is a Christian, and she thinks I'm going to hell. I am an atheist, and I think my mom is stupid. Thing is, at a certain point, we both realized that this kind of fighting wasn't getting us anywhere, that we both got along pretty well before we started trying to define our relationship based on our beliefs in a deity, and we STOPPED DOING THAT, in order to save our relationship. My mom can still go to church and buy dumb-ass religious books, and I can simply not have a single damn thing to do with organized religion. Fine. She'll stop trying to force her religion on me, I'll stop making fun of her because she loves Jesus, and that's it. Suddenly, without being able to resort to such false dichotomies as "godly vs evil" or "republican vs democrat", we actually got to appreciate each other as actual people.

And my dad? Well, he never even factored into the equation, since he always refused to even TELL me about his beliefs concerning God. NEVER. Not one single goddamn mention. He has ALWAYS simply REFUSED to even discuss this with me or my siblings, and "god bless him" for that. He might be an atheist, he might be a Muslim, he might be a Christian, he might be a Wiccan. I don't KNOW. And more importantly, as far as my relationship with him, it does not matter.

People divide themselves along these kinds of arbitrary lines, and often for not a singlle good ****ing reason.

How about we stop trying to define ourselves by our religion/sex/race/music preferences? How about us all trying to just plain get along based on PERSONALITY?

This seems to clearly be a response to the whole "To atheists, what is your rationale for not believing in god" thread.

And both of those threads are annoying.

WHAT DOES IT MATTER?

I mean, seriously.

Can we both agree that both atheists and theists are smart rational people? Can we both agree that both atheists and theists both truly BELIEVE what they believe, and that asking them to simply "believe the other thing" would be tantamount to asking them to make a lie that goes against ever fiber of their being? Can we believe that atheists and theists are BOTH good? That they're BOTH evil? That they BOTH get along with you, and that they BOTH piss you off?

Why is there SO much of an attempt here to categorize people by their beliefs?

In real life, when the cashier at the supermarket seems like a nice and funny guy, do you ask him what his religious beliefs are and then make an assessment of him based on his religious beliefs?

My mom is a Christian, and she thinks I'm going to hell. I am an atheist, and I think my mom is stupid. Thing is, at a certain point, we both realized that this kind of fighting wasn't getting us anywhere, that we both got along pretty well before we started trying to define our relationship based on our beliefs in a deity, and we STOPPED DOING THAT, in order to save our relationship. My mom can still go to church and buy dumb-ass religious books, and I can simply not have a single damn thing to do with organized religion. Fine. She'll stop trying to force her religion on me, I'll stop making fun of her because she loves Jesus, and that's it. Suddenly, without being able to resort to such false dichotomies as "godly vs evil" or "republican vs democrat", we actually got to appreciate each other as actual people.

And my dad? Well, he never even factored into the equation, since he always refused to even TELL me about his beliefs concerning God. NEVER. Not one single goddamn mention. He has ALWAYS simply REFUSED to even discuss this with me or my siblings, and "god bless him" for that. He might be an atheist, he might be a Muslim, he might be a Christian, he might be a Wiccan. I don't KNOW. And more importantly, as far as my relationship with him, it does not matter.

People divide themselves along these kinds of arbitrary lines, and often for not a singlle good ****ing reason.

How about we stop trying to define ourselves by our religion/sex/race/music preferences? How about us all trying to just plain get along based on PERSONALITY?

MrGeezer

Hear! Hear!

Now THIS is what I call Good News!

There is nothing rational about it: its called faith. And faith is a powerful thing.

[QUOTE="Democratik"]What exactly is love? Monogamy? Well, certain species have that, others dont. Some birds are monogamous Seems that love is evolutionary. We humans are great at making things seem like more than they really are.

What is parental love? a biological necessity in order to survive.
What is romantic love? Whether we admit it or not, we have hierarchy. Alpha males breed with Alpha women. early in human evolution, we all mostly stayed in tribes with our family, and we found a mate. Since it doesnt make biological sense to reproduce with your siblings and other family members, you tend to stay with that one person. Im not trying to make this seem like fact, its just a hypothesis (different than a theory....) that I drew up before humans started to communicate on a regular basis with non family(tribe) members

Men constantly try to prove their worth to women, and women tend to just take it. You never see these roles reversed in anything other than the immediate short term.GabuEx

Love is... well, love. Of course love and happiness bears a certain degree of evolutionary benefit, which is why I specifically said "love and happiness that would seem to go beyond what is evolutionarily beneficial". There is a certain sense of transcendant peace and happiness that I have felt at times in life, and which has become more common as time has passed, that would seem to be entirely disconnected from any evolutionary drive, especially considering that I don't particularly want children. Even Richard Dawkins has acknowledged and celebrated this phenomenon of seemingly un-evolutionarily beneficial kindness and benevolence, although he, of course, does not find God in it.

Does it have a purely physical explanation? Perhaps. But, to be honest, I don't really care.

Emotions are nothing more than chemicals reacting in your brain.

Democratik

Perhaps they are. The supernatural is, of course, a rather hard thing to quantify or observe, given that it is by its very definition it is not part of the purview of science.

At the end of the day, though, I'm not even sure if it matters. We can have all the botanical classifications and physiological explanations in the world, but they don't change the way in which a rose smells, nor the sensation one receives when smelling it. An entire textbook about the color red and the physical reactions it causes when light waves of the appropriate frequency make contact with the human retina will not provide you with the experience of seeing it.

The fact that you dont turn off you sex drive despiute your view towards children should show you how strong our nature is.

Democratik

Well, considering that I'm a virgin, too...

You really cant go around believing whatever you feel like while disregarding facts. Imagine if everyone did that.

Democratik

You'll have to forgive me if I don't see what crime I have committed, or what pain I have caused, or in what way I have sinned against my neighbor simply by being led to an intuitive personal belief in something out there through my experiences in life. The question posed in this thread was what theists' reasons were for their belief in God. I don't expect anyone to be convinced of anything through what I have to say, nor would I like anyone to be so convinced; faith simply on the say-so of another is hardly faith at all.

Emotions are nothing more than chemicals reacting in your brain. The fact that you dont turn off you sex drive despiute your view towards children should show you how strong our nature is. You really cant go around believing whatever you feel like while disregarding facts. Imagine if everyone did that.

Democratik

Funny, I totally had the impression everyone does that to some extent...

[QUOTE="Democratik"]

Perhaps they are. The supernatural is, of course, a rather hard thing to quantify or observe, given that it is by its very definition it is not part of the purview of science.

At the end of the day, though, I'm not even sure if it matters. We can have all the botanical classifications and physiological explanations in the world, but they don't change the way in which a rose smells, nor the sensation one receives when smelling it. An entire textbook about the color red and the physical reactions it causes when light waves of the appropriate frequency make contact with the human retina will not provide you with the experience of seeing it.

[QUOTE="Democratik"]

The fact that you dont turn off you sex drive despiute your view towards children should show you how strong our nature is.

GabuEx

Well, considering that I'm a virgin, too...

You really cant go around believing whatever you feel like while disregarding facts. Imagine if everyone did that.

Democratik

You'll have to forgive me if I don't see what crime I have committed, or what pain I have caused, or in what way I have sinned against my neighbor simply by being led to an intuitive personal belief in something out there through my experiences in life. The question posed in this thread was what theists' reasons were for their belief in God. I don't expect anyone to be convinced of anything through what I have to say, nor would I like anyone to be so convinced; faith simply on the say-so of another is hardly faith at all.

I would say............faith.

[QUOTE="Democratik"][QUOTE="comp_atkins"] atoms exist. man has seen them.JediXMan7

Man. I never said they didn't exist. :roll:

dec 25 is actually a pagen holliday adopted by christians in order to convert pagens and make christianity more palatable

for me it's not rationale reasoning, but a deep gut feeling that just can't be swayed. I've listened to multiple reasoning's for both sides of this discussion, but at the end of the day my inner sanctity just believes that he is the Lord of all, and the Son of God. I've had times in my life that it was hard for me to believe that if He does exist than why would certain things happen and what not, but I still place my faith in Him. to each his own I suppose.

Plenty of reasons why I Know God is Real.

Science has proved that the shroud of Turin is in Fact From the TIme Period of Jesus, with the imprint of Jesus on It. Not to mention all the unexplained Miracles and such that have happened throughout the years.

http://www.shroud.com/

Plenty of reasons why I Know God is Real.

Science has proved that the shroud of Turin is in Fact From the TIme Period of Jesus, with the imprint of Jesus on It. Not to mention all the unexplained Miracles and such that have happened throughout the years.

http://www.shroud.com/

Snipes_2

and I can't think of a single "unexplained mircale" which has occurred.

[QUOTE="Snipes_2"]

Plenty of reasons why I Know God is Real.

Science has proved that the shroud of Turin is in Fact From the TIme Period of Jesus, with the imprint of Jesus on It. Not to mention all the unexplained Miracles and such that have happened throughout the years.

http://www.shroud.com/

Brainkiller05

and I can't think of a single "unexplained mircale" which has occurred.

Like I said in other posts, There's no point in debating with someone who doesn't believe.

Here's one Unexplained thing though. Caught on Tape.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqsRDD6kXWY

[QUOTE="Democratik"][QUOTE="comp_atkins"] atoms exist. man has seen them.JediXMan7

Man. I never said they didn't exist. :roll: