So guys, I'm going to hell because I dont have a religion.

What I'd like to say to that person is "Remember Surah Al-Kafiroon (the disbelievers, atheists)?"

Vesica_Prime

why?

Religion is just something humanity has created to have something to believe in. If that happens, god wanted it to happen.

That is my thoughts of religion. I'm and Atheist, at least I think i am. I don't believe in any religion expect Buddhism perhaps because I think everyone is reborn as something else. That sounds like the most logical religion.

Religion is just something humanity has created to have something to believe in. If that happens, god wanted it to happen.

That is my thoughts of religion. I'm and Atheist, at least I think i am. I don't believe in any religion expect Buddhism perhaps because I think everyone is reborn as something else. That sounds like the most logical religion.

SaPhIrX_lOl

you cant believe everyone is reborn as something else and be atheist at the same time.

Just because you don't believe in it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.Tetrarch9

[QUOTE="Tetrarch9"]Just because you don't believe in it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.testfactor888

proof that it does not exist would be better

[QUOTE="testfactor888"][QUOTE="Tetrarch9"]Just because you don't believe in it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.Harisemo

proof that it does not exist would be better

[QUOTE="testfactor888"][QUOTE="Tetrarch9"]Just because you don't believe in it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.Harisemo

proof that it does not exist would be better

Seriously testfactor? You didn't see this coming?

Anyways, as a christian, one of the things I never do is condemn someone to hell. It's not up to me to tell you whether you are going to hell or not.

I only talk to people about my faith if we are having a causal conversation, a debate and such.

'You are going to Hell!' just angers people. heck, I'd be angry if someone told me that.

How am i going to hell, when i dont believe in it? DroidPhysX

Well you have to believe it :twisted:

The pic: That's my friend not believing, so I don't want you to share the same fate with him :|

[QUOTE="Harisemo"]

[QUOTE="testfactor888"] Proof that it exists would be niceWii4Fun

proof that it does not exist would be better

Seriously testfactor? You didn't see this coming?

Anyways, as a christian, one of the things I never do is condemn someone to hell. It's not up to me to tell you whether you are going to hell or not.

I only talk to people about my faith if we are having a causal conversation, a debate and such.

'You are going to Hell!' just angers people. heck, I'd be angry if someone told me that.

[QUOTE="Wii4Fun"]

[QUOTE="Harisemo"]

proof that it does not exist would be better

testfactor888

Seriously testfactor? You didn't see this coming?

Anyways, as a christian, one of the things I never do is condemn someone to hell. It's not up to me to tell you whether you are going to hell or not.

I only talk to people about my faith if we are having a causal conversation, a debate and such.

'You are going to Hell!' just angers people. heck, I'd be angry if someone told me that.

The burden of proof lies with both sides. One side says he exist, the other says he doesn't and is imaginary. Neither side has the solid evidence to prove the other wrong.

No you're not, because you are one of the good guys.

'You are going to Hell!' just angers people. heck, I'd be angry if someone told me that.

Wii4Fun

dont think that should anger people who dont believe in hell at all

[QUOTE="testfactor888"][QUOTE="Wii4Fun"]

Seriously testfactor? You didn't see this coming?

Anyways, as a christian, one of the things I never do is condemn someone to hell. It's not up to me to tell you whether you are going to hell or not.

I only talk to people about my faith if we are having a causal conversation, a debate and such.

'You are going to Hell!' just angers people. heck, I'd be angry if someone told me that.

Wii4Fun

The burden of proof lies with both sides. One side says he exist, the other says he doesn't and is imaginary. Neither side has the solid evidence to prove the other wrong.

[QUOTE="Wii4Fun"]

[QUOTE="testfactor888"] What that religious people would start spewing their beliefs like its fact? Yeah thats what always happens. Prove it exists and maybe you will get somewhere. I don't have to prove it doesn't exist as I am not the one spouting off about an imaginary placetestfactor888

The burden of proof lies with both sides. One side says he exist, the other says he doesn't and is imaginary. Neither side has the solid evidence to prove the other wrong.

[QUOTE="testfactor888"]

[QUOTE="Wii4Fun"]

The burden of proof lies with both sides. One side says he exist, the other says he doesn't and is imaginary. Neither side has the solid evidence to prove the other wrong.

LJS9502_basic

[QUOTE="Harisemo"]

[QUOTE="testfactor888"] Proof that it exists would be nicetestfactor888

proof that it does not exist would be better

depends on why you think flying spaghetti monster is real. if you have reasons to believe its real then you would ask the non believer to prove its not real just as non believer would ask for a proof its real. the burden of proof is on both.

[QUOTE="testfactor888"][QUOTE="Harisemo"]

proof that it does not exist would be better

Harisemo

depends on why you think flying spaghetti monster is real. if you have reasons to believe its real then you would ask the non believer to prove its not real just as non believer would ask for a proof its real. the burden of proof is on both.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="testfactor888"] No the burden of proof solely lies on the person or persons who say it exists. I can say anything exists that doesn't mean that people need to go out and find proof that it doesn't to prove me wrong. If you want to say something is real than you need to provide real evidence to back it up

testfactor888

I'd rather not bring pop culture jokes into this as it's not worth the discussion. Anyway I have to head out to work.

It's feeding time... *throws troll bait*

sAndroid17

I disagree again. Saying something is real means you have proof that it is otherwise you are just making things up as you go along. Just because a book says its real is not proof. I won't change my mind on this so there really is no debating it. You and apparently a couple other people think that non-believers need to have proof that it doesn't exist. I don't feel that way. The people saying its real should either provide proof or expect to be criticized in life by people who choose not to have "faith"testfactor888

i have reasons to believe in God but noconcrete evidence can be given that he does exist and if others believe he does not exist then they must provide evidence or they'll be in the same position as me and have their reasons not to believe in God but no concrete proof. the burden of concrete evidence is on both.

[QUOTE="testfactor888"] I disagree again. Saying something is real means you have proof that it is otherwise you are just making things up as you go along. Just because a book says its real is not proof. I won't change my mind on this so there really is no debating it. You and apparently a couple other people think that non-believers need to have proof that it doesn't exist. I don't feel that way. The people saying its real should either provide proof or expect to be criticized in life by people who choose not to have "faith"Harisemo

i have reasons to believe in God but noconcrete evidence can be given that he does exist and if others believe he does not exist then they must provide evidence or they'll be in the same position as me and have their reasons not to believe in God but no concrete proof. the burden of concrete evidence is on both.

Cool story bro. You ask how you can go to hell without believing in it? Well, if it exists (the existential debate of this argument is irrelevant to the point I am making), then it doesn't matter if you believe it is there or not. You may not believe in oxygen, but if you go to space you may find it hard to breath.

I always go old school and tell them:

"You're going to Hades."

Eh, don't worry about it. If there actually was a Hell, she would be going there long before you would. Respect and tolerance is something I could see "God" wishing more for his creations than blind faith in something they barely understand.

Heaven and Hell are states of mind, not actual places. Just like "God" is also a recess of the human of mind, and not an actual being. We've come up with these very imaginative means of explaining our complex, subconscious psychological processes over the millennia, but in reality, it all stems from our minds and our interaction with the objective and subjective worlds. The varying degrees in which they manifest is why religion exists. That "presence" someone feels when praying is their subjective self manifesting outside the bounds of their objective reasoning.

But I digress. Tell her that she is probably going to go to Hell (if it exists) long before you for being intolerant and disrespectful of other people and non-compassionate about your situation. It'll probably shut her up real quick.

[QUOTE="Harisemo"]

[QUOTE="testfactor888"] I disagree again. Saying something is real means you have proof that it is otherwise you are just making things up as you go along. Just because a book says its real is not proof. I won't change my mind on this so there really is no debating it. You and apparently a couple other people think that non-believers need to have proof that it doesn't exist. I don't feel that way. The people saying its real should either provide proof or expect to be criticized in life by people who choose not to have "faith"testfactor888

i have reasons to believe in God but noconcrete evidence can be given that he does exist and if others believe he does not exist then they must provide evidence or they'll be in the same position as me and have their reasons not to believe in God but no concrete proof. the burden of concrete evidence is on both.

[QUOTE="testfactor888"][QUOTE="Harisemo"]

i have reasons to believe in God but noconcrete evidence can be given that he does exist and if others believe he does not exist then they must provide evidence or they'll be in the same position as me and have their reasons not to believe in God but no concrete proof. the burden of concrete evidence is on both.

SkyWard20

[QUOTE="SkyWard20"][QUOTE="testfactor888"] Yet again I disagree and feel the only burden of proof is on the person saying it exists. I won't change my mind on that as I see no reason to nor do I feel I am wrong on that. I know many people will disagree with me as you and LJS did but that doesn't really bother me. I will continue to feel this way and as I said there is no real use debating it. Your point has been made clear as has mine. We can continue to go back and forth but it will just be repeating the same posts over and over which is pretty pointless.testfactor888

By the first and second law of thermodynamics hell, cannot exist. Besides hell is something made up to alienate children into religion and not an actual belief of god, just the fear of hell; see how I totally said the same thing twice?

[QUOTE="testfactor888"]

[QUOTE="SkyWard20"] so any negative claim must not be proven i.e. 'life does not exist anywhere'?ferrari2001

[QUOTE="ferrari2001"][QUOTE="testfactor888"] A claim that life doesn't exist anywhere can easily be proven false by us being here and all the life we see around us.

testfactor888

[QUOTE="SkyWard20"][QUOTE="testfactor888"] Yet again I disagree and feel the only burden of proof is on the person saying it exists. I won't change my mind on that as I see no reason to nor do I feel I am wrong on that. I know many people will disagree with me as you and LJS did but that doesn't really bother me. I will continue to feel this way and as I said there is no real use debating it. Your point has been made clear as has mine. We can continue to go back and forth but it will just be repeating the same posts over and over which is pretty pointless.testfactor888

I am not getting into this debate with you as you are basically just trying to blow it up into some philosophical debate which really has no meaning on the current thread issues. For me evidence is clear cut, in your face, scientific proof. Since there is none of that dealing with heaven or hell I see no reason in believing in any of it. Provide some physical evidence and perhaps I will feel differentlytestfactor888

[QUOTE="Harisemo"]

[QUOTE="testfactor888"] I disagree again. Saying something is real means you have proof that it is otherwise you are just making things up as you go along. Just because a book says its real is not proof. I won't change my mind on this so there really is no debating it. You and apparently a couple other people think that non-believers need to have proof that it doesn't exist. I don't feel that way. The people saying its real should either provide proof or expect to be criticized in life by people who choose not to have "faith"testfactor888

i have reasons to believe in God but noconcrete evidence can be given that he does exist and if others believe he does not exist then they must provide evidence or they'll be in the same position as me and have their reasons not to believe in God but no concrete proof. the burden of concrete evidence is on both.

You have to have faith that what you are walking on will support your weight or that food from a stranger is safe for example. Everybody has faith so it is not my place to try to destroy the faith of another person.

[QUOTE="testfactor888"][QUOTE="ferrari2001"] Could that not simply be an illusion of the mind? All we see is merely an abstract personification of our subconscious thought? I don't believe that, but it's worth considering. (In fact many philosophers have argued this point). And what is existence. How "real" does something need to be in order to exist?ferrari2001

[QUOTE="testfactor888"]I am not getting into this debate with you as you are basically just trying to blow it up into some philosophical debate which really has no meaning on the current thread issues. For me evidence is clear cut, in your face, scientific proof. Since there is none of that dealing with heaven or hell I see no reason in believing in any of it. Provide some physical evidence and perhaps I will feel differentlyfoxhound_fox

Doesn't really matter to me as I made my point quite clear. If you disagree with it again that doesn't matter to me. I am absolutely sure that there is no god, no heaven, no hell. For me the lack of proof of its existence is all the proof I need. I am someone who hates everything religious and anything to do with god so there is no way I would concede the idea that he exists even in the slightest probability. I am not trying to change opinions and I get what you are trying to say. For me though I feel absolute in my claim. As I said the lack of evidence of existence is all the evidence I need.

testfactor888

[QUOTE="testfactor888"]I am not getting into this debate with you as you are basically just trying to blow it up into some philosophical debate which really has no meaning on the current thread issues. For me evidence is clear cut, in your face, scientific proof. Since there is none of that dealing with heaven or hell I see no reason in believing in any of it. Provide some physical evidence and perhaps I will feel differentlyfoxhound_fox

the claim 'hell does not exist' is one dependant on factual accuracy. so is 'there is no [non-relative] evidence in favour of the existence of hell', but 'so it most likely doesn't exist' is a claim based on reasoning and reasoning is entirely subjective i'm afraid.

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]

[QUOTE="testfactor888"]I am not getting into this debate with you as you are basically just trying to blow it up into some philosophical debate which really has no meaning on the current thread issues. For me evidence is clear cut, in your face, scientific proof. Since there is none of that dealing with heaven or hell I see no reason in believing in any of it. Provide some physical evidence and perhaps I will feel differentlytestfactor888

The Absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence.

Anyways, I still stand by my claim that the burden of proof lies on both sides and not just one one of them. Neither can really prove the other wrong. If you're going tell me that you know for sure there is no God for instance, you're going to have to give me some solid proof.

Why is it those who says God exist are the only ones who are required to have proof of it, but those who says he doesn't are not required to have any proof? That doesn't make any sense. You would need facts to back up your claim.

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]

[QUOTE="testfactor888"]I am not getting into this debate with you as you are basically just trying to blow it up into some philosophical debate which really has no meaning on the current thread issues. For me evidence is clear cut, in your face, scientific proof. Since there is none of that dealing with heaven or hell I see no reason in believing in any of it. Provide some physical evidence and perhaps I will feel differentlytestfactor888

would not the latter claim imply that all things for which we don't have evidence 'most likely do not exist', a claim which has been proven wrong in the past?

the claim 'hell does not exist' is one dependant on factual accuracy. so is 'there is no [non-relative] evidence in favour of the existence of hell', but 'so it most likely doesn't exist' is a claim based on reasoning and reasoning is entirely subjective i'm afraid.

SkyWard20