The Patriot Act

anyone freaked out about this? i haven't been really been keepng up. i heard they did some revisions on the original but i'm not aware of how drastic the change is.

It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.LikeHaterade

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.LikeHaterade

fill me in on the changes because i've heard nothing but bad about this legislation.

Shoeman I LOOOOOOVE your avatar.

Fred Thompson 08'

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.shoeman12

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

[QUOTE="shoeman12"]

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.sca321

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

yeah, but your civil liberties are like basically worth nothing. that's basically like saying a person would rather live out the rest of their life caged in their homes then to spend it going out and venturing the world.

Anything with word Patriot is bad..hojobojo

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.shoeman12

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

Indeed. Ever since its inception the numerous Terrorist attacks that were taking place has gone down exponentially.

[QUOTE="sca321"][QUOTE="shoeman12"]

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.Boostinsane

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

yeah, but your civil liberties are like basically worth nothing. that's basically like saying a person would rather live out the rest of their life caged in their homes then to spend it going out and venturing the world.

[QUOTE="shoeman12"]

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.NecroKvltMuffin

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

Indeed. Ever since its inception the numerous Terrorist attacks that were taking place has gone down exponentially.

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..Xx_CYC756_xX

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

[QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..hojobojo

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..Xx_CYC756_xX

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

How is something evil when it was created to protect innocent lives? LikeHaterade

[QUOTE="shoeman12"]

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.NecroKvltMuffin

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

Indeed. Ever since its inception the numerous Terrorist attacks that were taking place has gone down exponentially.

more innocent people have been abused of their rights than terrorists been caught. in fact, i can't even think of a single terrorists that was caught through the patriot act.

[QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..deepdreamer256

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

How is that funny?

How is something evil when it was created to protect innocent lives? LikeHaterade

How do you know it will protect innocent lives? Things don't always work the way it's suppose to do.

How is something evil when it was created to protect innocent lives? LikeHaterade

it wasn't created to protect innocent lives. it was created by the governement at the wake of 9/11 as an excuse to spy on it's citizens w/out a warrent and sometimes even to imprison them for a certain amount of time w/out any evidence to justify their imprisonment. it's contents are vague and open for explotation and possible government coersion.

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]How is something evil when it was created to protect innocent lives? hojobojo

How do you know it will protect innocent lives? Things don't always work the way it's suppose to do.

And some things do. When you read the paper and see some bill that was passed by a president that you might hate, just remember that there is always a reason. It may not work out for the best, but the reasoning and timing for some type of act determines whether or not it's right or wrong and protecting innocent lives is right. If it dosen't work out, then you get rid of it. That is an example of the "timing" part that I mentioned.

[QUOTE="deepdreamer256"][QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..hojobojo

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

How is that funny?

why is nationalism bad?

why is nationalism bad?Boostinsane

Do you even know what Nationalism is?

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]How is something evil when it was created to protect innocent lives? LikeHaterade

How do you know it will protect innocent lives? Things don't always work the way it's suppose to do.

And some things do. When you read the paper and see some bill that was passed by a president that you might hate, just remember that there is always a reason. It may not work out for the best, but the reasoning and timing for some type of act determines whether or not it's right or wrong and protecting innocent lives is right. If it dosen't work out, then you get rid of it. That is an example of the "timing" part that I mentioned.

can you give one example when the bill has worked in our favor?

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]How is something evil when it was created to protect innocent lives? Boostinsane

it wasn't created to protect innocent lives. it was created by the governement at the wake of 9/11 as an excuse to spy on it's citizens w/out a warrent and sometimes even to imprison them for a certain amount of time w/out any evidence to justify their imprisonment. it's contents are vague and open for explotation and possible government coersion.

There's the crazy talk that I was refering to previously. The Patriot Act is not taking away your free will which wouldn't create government coersion. You shouldn't be against the Patriot Act unless you were a terrorist.

[QUOTE="NecroKvltMuffin"][QUOTE="shoeman12"]

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.Boostinsane

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

Indeed. Ever since its inception the numerous Terrorist attacks that were taking place has gone down exponentially.

more innocent people have been abused of their rights than terrorists been caught. in fact, i can't even think of a single terrorists that was caught through the patriot act.

[QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..hojobojo

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

[QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="deepdreamer256"][QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..Boostinsane

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

How is that funny?

why is nationalism bad?

Nationalism creates hate between people

It is nationalism's fault for all the racism that's out there

It creates wars, and conflict

Just because they're not from the same country...

Is that bad enough for you?

[QUOTE="deepdreamer256"][QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..hojobojo

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

How is that funny?

[QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..TheFlush

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

Look at my previsous post about why nationalism is bad..

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..Xx_CYC756_xX

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Because its a common tactic for politicians to use when they want to gain more power. By putting words like "Patriot", "Freedom", "People's", "Democracy", etc. in a bill's title you ensure that the opposition you face will be much smaller than if you named it something else. For example, few legislators would be willing to vote against something called "The People's Freedom Act" because they know that even if its the worst bill to ever grace the house that most people are too lazy to look into it and will be stupid enough to believe that it's actually good because of the name.

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.shoeman12

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

You realize that these types of bills work against you too right? They're worded in a way that allows the government to put innocent civillians under the same scrutiny. Furthermore, even if the bill doesn't seem terribly harmful, the precedent it sets is very dangerous. For example, first we had the Patriot Act that bypassed the parts of the constitution regarding reasonable search and seizure and right to privacy. Then a few years later we got the Military Commisions Act of 2006 which borders on facism. For those who don't know, the MCA allows the government to void constitutional rights, namely due process of law, as well as use "alternative interrogating techniques" when dealing with "enemy combatants". Aside from the fact that that by itself is already uncontitutional, its made even worse by the fact that the bill never defines what an "enemy combatant" is. In fact, its left up to the government to decide who can be classified as an "enemy combatant". As a result, it is possible that Bush could call a critic or political opponent of his an "enemy combatant" and then have them jailed for life with no trial.

You have to realize that with these bills you're merely replacing the threat to your wellbeing by terrorists with the governemnt. Its a shame that no one has learned a lesson from McCarthism. Most people laugh today when they look back at all the anti-communist propaganda the government spewed in the 1950's because they wonder how people could have been so stupid. Then those same people talk about how we need to up security in order to protect oursevles from the terriorist threat.

[QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="deepdreamer256"][QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..deepdreamer256

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

How is that funny?

Hmm Patriotism = Nationalism = Nazism..

Basically Nazis were Nationalists... get the idea?

Nationalism creates hate between people

It is nationalism's fault for all the racism that's out there

It creates wars, and conflict

Just because they're not from the same country...

Is that bad enough for you?

hojobojo

but how do you know that thinking you're better than someone creates hate?

i mean, you can think you're better than someone in street fighter but you don't have to hate them.

[QUOTE="deepdreamer256"][QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="deepdreamer256"][QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..hojobojo

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

How is that funny?

Hmm Patriotism = Nationalism = Nazism..

[QUOTE="TheFlush"][QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..hojobojo

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

Look at my previsous post about why nationalism is bad..

[QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..gameguy6700

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Because its a common tactic for politicians to use when they want to gain more power. By putting words like "Patriot", "Freedom", "People's", "Democracy", etc. in a bill's title you ensure that the opposition you face will be much smaller than if you named it something else. For example, few legislators would be willing to vote against something called "The People's Freedom Act" because they know that even if its the worst bill to ever grace the house that most people are too lazy to look into it and will be stupid enough to believe that it's actually good because of the name.

Please remember that I was refering to the original (and seemingly hypocritical) poster taht said:

Anything with word Patriot is bad...

I am against the propagandal name of the Patriot Act, and the rights it offends. However, blantly stating that Patriotism is bad is incorrect.

[QUOTE="Boostinsane"][QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="deepdreamer256"][QUOTE="hojobojo"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..hojobojo

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.... nationalism is bad

How is that funny?

why is nationalism bad?

Nationalism creates hate between people

It is nationalism's fault for all the racism that's out there

It creates wars, and conflict

Just because they're not from the same country...

Is that bad enough for you?

Not all patriots are racist scumbags who want to start wars, as you are saying, very few are. You can shoot down an entire belief because people fight over it and it creates war. That'd be like saying, well all communists are EVIL, because Joesph Stalin is responsible for the death of over 10 million people.

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]
Basically Nazis were Nationalists... get the idea?

Nationalism creates hate between people

It is nationalism's fault for all the racism that's out there

It creates wars, and conflict

Just because they're not from the same country...

Is that bad enough for you?

Boostinsane

but how do you know that thinking you're better than someone creates hate?

i mean, you can think you're better than someone in street fighter but you don't have to hate them.

Why do you think people fight wars? Wars like WW1 and WW2 was caused by nationalism.. and do you think they loved each other? The racist people.. do you think they love the people they're abusing? No, they're racist because they hate them.

But I don't know if comparing Patriots and Nazis was a good example. I know what you're saying. They both devote their lives to their country. But the motives of each country were completely different. LikeHaterade

I'm not really saying that all Patriotic people are Nazis and racist, I'm saying that Nationalism creates both and that some Patriotic people are no better than Nazis.

[QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..gameguy6700

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Because its a common tactic for politicians to use when they want to gain more power. By putting words like "Patriot", "Freedom", "People's", "Democracy", etc. in a bill's title you ensure that the opposition you face will be much smaller than if you named it something else. For example, few legislators would be willing to vote against something called "The People's Freedom Act" because they know that even if its the worst bill to ever grace the house that most people are too lazy to look into it and will be stupid enough to believe that it's actually good because of the name.

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.shoeman12

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

You realize that these types of bills work against you too right? They're worded in a way that allows the government to put innocent civillians under the same scrutiny. Furthermore, even if the bill doesn't seem terribly harmful, the precedent it sets is very dangerous. For example, first we had the Patriot Act that bypassed the parts of the constitution regarding reasonable search and seizure and right to privacy. Then a few years later we got the Military Commisions Act of 2006 which borders on facism. For those who don't know, the MCA allows the government to void constitutional rights, namely due process of law, as well as use "alternative interrogating techniques" when dealing with "enemy combatants". Aside from the fact that that by itself is already uncontitutional, its made even worse by the fact that the bill never defines what an "enemy combatant" is. In fact, its left up to the government to decide who can be classified as an "enemy combatant". As a result, it is possible that Bush could call a critic or political opponent of his an "enemy combatant" and then have them jailed for life with no trial.

You have to realize that with these bills you're merely replacing the threat to your wellbeing by terrorists with the governemnt. Its a shame that no one has learned a lesson from McCarthism. Most people laugh today when they look back at all the anti-communist propaganda the government spewed in the 1950's because they wonder how people could have been so stupid. Then those same people talk about how we need to up security in order to protect oursevles from the terriorist threat.

wow. *claps hands*

I think this country needs a revolution, The people have no say , no control. We lost our freeedom the same time we became afraid and completely dominated by the government. We'll be a free people when the government fears us, not the other way around.

Most americans forgot where the words "We the people" came from. And Premier Dictator Bush and his legacy of lies has done a good job of hiding that.

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]How is something evil when it was created to protect innocent lives? Boostinsane

it wasn't created to protect innocent lives. it was created by the governement at the wake of 9/11 as an excuse to spy on it's citizens w/out a warrent and sometimes even to imprison them for a certain amount of time w/out any evidence to justify their imprisonment. it's contents are vague and open for explotation and possible government coersion.

bull ****. no one has been arrested under the patriot act except suspected terrorists. it is not used to arrest political enemies, it is used to arrest terrorists and save american lives.

[QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..gameguy6700

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Because its a common tactic for politicians to use when they want to gain more power. By putting words like "Patriot", "Freedom", "People's", "Democracy", etc. in a bill's title you ensure that the opposition you face will be much smaller than if you named it something else. For example, few legislators would be willing to vote against something called "The People's Freedom Act" because they know that even if its the worst bill to ever grace the house that most people are too lazy to look into it and will be stupid enough to believe that it's actually good because of the name.

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.shoeman12

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

You realize that these types of bills work against you too right? They're worded in a way that allows the government to put innocent civillians under the same scrutiny. Furthermore, even if the bill doesn't seem terribly harmful, the precedent it sets is very dangerous. For example, first we had the Patriot Act that bypassed the parts of the constitution regarding reasonable search and seizure and right to privacy. Then a few years later we got the Military Commisions Act of 2006 which borders on facism. For those who don't know, the MCA allows the government to void constitutional rights, namely due process of law, as well as use "alternative interrogating techniques" when dealing with "enemy combatants". Aside from the fact that that by itself is already uncontitutional, its made even worse by the fact that the bill never defines what an "enemy combatant" is. In fact, its left up to the government to decide who can be classified as an "enemy combatant". As a result, it is possible that Bush could call a critic or political opponent of his an "enemy combatant" and then have them jailed for life with no trial.

You have to realize that with these bills you're merely replacing the threat to your wellbeing by terrorists with the governemnt. Its a shame that no one has learned a lesson from McCarthism. Most people laugh today when they look back at all the anti-communist propaganda the government spewed in the 1950's because they wonder how people could have been so stupid. Then those same people talk about how we need to up security in order to protect oursevles from the terriorist threat.

You make a good point. However, McCarthyism in my opinion was not entirely a bad thing. It wasn't all good, but we went on the notion of the innocent people within communist countries trying to get the hell out of there. I mean, buddhist monks were using immolation just to say "Hey! Please get rid of communism!". The overall principal of communism is not a bad thing, but it just dosent work out for the good of the people and I believe that countries are supposed to be all about the people. In retrospect, I'm sure people like Stalin were hitting themselves in the head for how long they tried to stick with it.

[QUOTE="gameguy6700"][QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..LikeHaterade

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Because its a common tactic for politicians to use when they want to gain more power. By putting words like "Patriot", "Freedom", "People's", "Democracy", etc. in a bill's title you ensure that the opposition you face will be much smaller than if you named it something else. For example, few legislators would be willing to vote against something called "The People's Freedom Act" because they know that even if its the worst bill to ever grace the house that most people are too lazy to look into it and will be stupid enough to believe that it's actually good because of the name.

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.shoeman12

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

You realize that these types of bills work against you too right? They're worded in a way that allows the government to put innocent civillians under the same scrutiny. Furthermore, even if the bill doesn't seem terribly harmful, the precedent it sets is very dangerous. For example, first we had the Patriot Act that bypassed the parts of the constitution regarding reasonable search and seizure and right to privacy. Then a few years later we got the Military Commisions Act of 2006 which borders on facism. For those who don't know, the MCA allows the government to void constitutional rights, namely due process of law, as well as use "alternative interrogating techniques" when dealing with "enemy combatants". Aside from the fact that that by itself is already uncontitutional, its made even worse by the fact that the bill never defines what an "enemy combatant" is. In fact, its left up to the government to decide who can be classified as an "enemy combatant". As a result, it is possible that Bush could call a critic or political opponent of his an "enemy combatant" and then have them jailed for life with no trial.

You have to realize that with these bills you're merely replacing the threat to your wellbeing by terrorists with the governemnt. Its a shame that no one has learned a lesson from McCarthism. Most people laugh today when they look back at all the anti-communist propaganda the government spewed in the 1950's because they wonder how people could have been so stupid. Then those same people talk about how we need to up security in order to protect oursevles from the terriorist threat.

You make a good point. However, McCarthyism in my opinion was not entirely a bad thing. It wasn't all good, but we went on the notion of the innocent people within communist countries trying to get the hell out of there. I mean, buddhist monks were using immolation just to say "Hey! Please get rid of communism!". The overall principal of communism is not a bad thing, but it just dosent work out for the good of the people and I believe that countries are supposed to be all about the people. In retrospect, I'm sure people like Stalin were hitting themselves in the head for how long they tried to stick with it.

Are you referring to the famous picture of Buddhist monk setting himself alight in Vietnam?
He was actually saying 'Hey! Please get rid of the capitalist dictator backed by Americans'

[QUOTE="Xx_CYC756_xX"]

[QUOTE="hojobojo"]Anything with word Patriot is bad..gameguy6700

Patriot - a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.

Remind me, how is this bad?

Because its a common tactic for politicians to use when they want to gain more power. By putting words like "Patriot", "Freedom", "People's", "Democracy", etc. in a bill's title you ensure that the opposition you face will be much smaller than if you named it something else. For example, few legislators would be willing to vote against something called "The People's Freedom Act" because they know that even if its the worst bill to ever grace the house that most people are too lazy to look into it and will be stupid enough to believe that it's actually good because of the name.

[QUOTE="LikeHaterade"]It's not a drastic change and I fully support it. Anyone that believes that the Patriot Act would turn America into some type of coersive, totalitariaism is crazy in my opinion. And believe me, there are some out there.shoeman12

i agree. if it will prevent terrorist attacks and save lives i'm all for it.

You realize that these types of bills work against you too right? They're worded in a way that allows the government to put innocent civillians under the same scrutiny. Furthermore, even if the bill doesn't seem terribly harmful, the precedent it sets is very dangerous. For example, first we had the Patriot Act that bypassed the parts of the constitution regarding reasonable search and seizure and right to privacy. Then a few years later we got the Military Commisions Act of 2006 which borders on facism. For those who don't know, the MCA allows the government to void constitutional rights, namely due process of law, as well as use "alternative interrogating techniques" when dealing with "enemy combatants". Aside from the fact that that by itself is already uncontitutional, its made even worse by the fact that the bill never defines what an "enemy combatant" is. In fact, its left up to the government to decide who can be classified as an "enemy combatant". As a result, it is possible that Bush could call a critic or political opponent of his an "enemy combatant" and then have them jailed for life with no trial.

You have to realize that with these bills you're merely replacing the threat to your wellbeing by terrorists with the governemnt. Its a shame that no one has learned a lesson from McCarthism. Most people laugh today when they look back at all the anti-communist propaganda the government spewed in the 1950's because they wonder how people could have been so stupid. Then those same people talk about how we need to up security in order to protect oursevles from the terriorist threat.

do you really believe this or are you just spewing what the far left says? if this was true wouldn't cindy sheehan or hillary clinton be in jail? no political opponetn of bush's has ever been arrested under the patriot act.