Tired of every religion thinking they are right.

[QUOTE="Koalakommander"]If I wrote something as a religious book on top of a mountain with no witnesses but myself and "God." Would that be more believable?3eyedrazorback

Several people wrote several different accounts and they all came to be the EXACT same story. These people who wrote it had no way of communicating. They were written in different places. If they wanted to make a ficticious story for everyone to believe...wouldn't all accounts be exactly the same? The stories were from different points of view. Not all the exact same thing over and over.

Prove it.

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]I'm sick of know it alls in general. But the "I'm right and you're wrong!" atheists are far worse than any theist who preaches about his text.Theokhoth

Oh? Why? It's the same thing, but the theist who preaches about his text is basing it on blind faith.

And the atheist who preaches that he's right is basing it on immature arrogance. Faith >>> arrogance.

And no, it's not blind faith.

No the atheist should be discussing what can and can't be proven and how more reliant things that can be proven are versus what can't be proven.

If someone is simply saying "I'm right your wrong" they're automatically arrogant Theist or Atheist.

Okay maybe not perfectly blind but damn close :?

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]I'm sick of know it alls in general. But the "I'm right and you're wrong!" atheists are far worse than any theist who preaches about his text.Funky_Llama

Oh? Why? It's the same thing, but the theist who preaches about his text is basing it on blind faith.

And the atheist who preaches that he's right is basing it on immature arrogance. Faith >>> arrogance.

And no, it's not blind faith.

:lol: Yeah, that must be it. The atheist couldn't be basing it on reason, or evidence, or anything. It must be arrogance. Because apparently atheists use arrogance as an argument against God now.

Evidence for a negative? Reasonable people don't have to preach. Reasonable atheists don't have to be arrogant.

A theist can preach for a variety of reasons; their religion requires it, their family tells them to, arrogance, whatever. An atheist can only preach from shallow, narrow-minded arrogance, since he has no set belief system (regarding religion, anyway). When a person speaks reasonably, he's not preaching.

And quit pulling strawmen. I didn't say all atheists do. I said all preaching atheists do.

[QUOTE="Koalakommander"]If I wrote something as a religious book on top of a mountain with no witnesses but myself and "God." Would that be more believable?3eyedrazorback

Several people wrote several different accounts and they all came to be the EXACT same story. These people who wrote it had no way of communicating. They were written in different places. If they wanted to make a ficticious story for everyone to believe...wouldn't all accounts be exactly the same? The stories were from different points of view. Not all the exact same thing over and over.

A.) The highlited parts are contradicting to your argument

B.) Proof please.

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]

I never stated anything about landmarks in the passage. There are others that I can quote to you if you'd like me to quote landmarks.

Koalakommander

Please do. I'll wait patiently while you google things.
I'm very excited, something that proves the bible true!? I will convert instantly, but I wonder why the other 2/3 of the world hasnt....

Actually, I'm reading through my Bible. Judea. Sumeria. Lebanon. Isreal.

There is this guy named Sir William Ramsey of Oxford University, one of history's greatest archaeoligists. He was an athiest. He spent 25 years doing archaelogical digs to try and disprove the book of Acts. Instead of discrediting it, his discoveries kept supporting it. He concluded that the author, Luke, was one of the most accurate historians that had ever written. Influenced by this, he became a Christian.

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Koalakommander"]

So can I prove something false in the bible? No. Can you prove it true? No.

Theokhoth

Sodom and Gomorrah.

King Solomon.

The Hittites.

Jesus Christ.

Herod.

John the Baptist.

Pilate.

Caiaphas.

To name a few.

Tch. See, this is what I hate: somebody makes a claim (in this case, "nothing in the Bible can be proven to be true"), that claim is debunked, then the claimant pulls a strawman. The fact is, some things in the Bible can be and have been proven true beyond reasonable doubt. Sure, some other bits could be false, but the original claim was NOTHING in the Bible can be proven true.

Ah! Sorry, I didn't spot that.

I agree wholeheartedly.

[QUOTE="Koalakommander"][QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"][QUOTE="mechwarrior_bob"]Agreed but there's a difference between "I'm Right and your wrong" and pointing out serious problems within religions.

I'd just perfer sticking to what can be proven.3eyedrazorback

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]

[QUOTE="Koalakommander"]If I wrote something as a religious book on top of a mountain with no witnesses but myself and "God." Would that be more believable?Koalakommander

Several people wrote several different accounts and they all came to be the EXACT same story. These people who wrote it had no way of communicating. They were written in different places. If they wanted to make a ficticious story for everyone to believe...wouldn't all accounts be exactly the same? The stories were from different points of view. Not all the exact same thing over and over.

A.) The highlited parts are contradicting to your argument

B.) Proof please.

I meant accounts. They would all be the exact same. I'm meaning a generalization of the story. Why must you TRY to find faults?

A surprising discovery is that many historians consider minor variations to be evidence in favor of the truth of an account. The idea is that if the writers were lying, they'd make sure to get their story straight and agree in EVERY detail. What seems to be a contradiction, is often an event viewed from different perspectives.

[QUOTE="Funky_Llama"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]I'm sick of know it alls in general. But the "I'm right and you're wrong!" atheists are far worse than any theist who preaches about his text.Theokhoth

Oh? Why? It's the same thing, but the theist who preaches about his text is basing it on blind faith.

And the atheist who preaches that he's right is basing it on immature arrogance. Faith >>> arrogance.

And no, it's not blind faith.

:lol: Yeah, that must be it. The atheist couldn't be basing it on reason, or evidence, or anything. It must be arrogance. Because apparently atheists use arrogance as an argument against God now.

Evidence for a negative? Reasonable people don't have to preach. Reasonable atheists don't have to be arrogant.

A theist can preach for a variety of reasons. An atheist can only preach from shallow, narrow-minded arrogance. When a person speaks reasonably, he's not preaching.

And quit pulling strawmen. I didn't say all atheists do. I said all preaching atheists do.

I'd say that you were 'pulling a strawman', by throwing arrogance into the equation when it was unnessacary. You've created a hypothetical atheist with the negative attribute of arrogance so that you can criticise him. Thus, a straw man argument.

[QUOTE="Koalakommander"][QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]

I never stated anything about landmarks in the passage. There are others that I can quote to you if you'd like me to quote landmarks.

3eyedrazorback

Please do. I'll wait patiently while you google things.
I'm very excited, something that proves the bible true!? I will convert instantly, but I wonder why the other 2/3 of the world hasnt....

Actually, I'm reading through my Bible. Judea. Sumeria. Lebanon. Isreal.

There is this guy named Sir William Ramsey of Oxford University, one of history's greatest archaeoligists. He was an athiest. He spent 25 years doing archaelogical digs to try and disprove the book of Acts. Instead of discrediting it, his discoveries kept supporting it. He concluded that the author, Luke, was one of the most accurate historians that had ever written. Influenced by this, he became a Christian.

Athens was mentioned in Greek religion. By your logic Posideon controls the seas of our Earth.

"There is this guy..." Please. I want evidence. Just because a scientist is Christian doesn't prove anything you say right. I know scientists who are atheist because of the things they discover.

I am very dissapointed by your response.

Ok. This is where I have to step in. Atheists can preach for a variety of reasons, one is shallowness and arrogance. But Atheists want people to see the "truth" in their eyes just as Christians want everyone to see their "truth". I don't see why when a Christian preaches its called converting but when an Atheist does it he's being arrogant :? hamstergeddon

Because an atheist has nothing to convert to. Atheism isn't a religion, even if it is a belief, but when its adherents start treating atheism like a religion, they can have no reason to do so other than "I'm smarter than you; I'm better than you!" which is blind arrogance, even if they believe they have the truth, because the truth is nothing to arrogantly preach about.

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"][QUOTE="Koalakommander"][QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]

I never stated anything about landmarks in the passage. There are others that I can quote to you if you'd like me to quote landmarks.

Koalakommander

Please do. I'll wait patiently while you google things.
I'm very excited, something that proves the bible true!? I will convert instantly, but I wonder why the other 2/3 of the world hasnt....

Actually, I'm reading through my Bible. Judea. Sumeria. Lebanon. Isreal.

There is this guy named Sir William Ramsey of Oxford University, one of history's greatest archaeoligists. He was an athiest. He spent 25 years doing archaelogical digs to try and disprove the book of Acts. Instead of discrediting it, his discoveries kept supporting it. He concluded that the author, Luke, was one of the most accurate historians that had ever written. Influenced by this, he became a Christian.

Athens was mentioned in Greek religion. By your logic Posideon controls the seas of our Earth.

"There is this guy..." Please. I want evidence. Just because a scientist is Christian doesn't prove anything you say right. I know scientists who are atheist because of the things they discover.

I am very dissapointed by your response.

Did you miss that part?

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Funky_Llama"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="Funky_Llama"]

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]I'm sick of know it alls in general. But the "I'm right and you're wrong!" atheists are far worse than any theist who preaches about his text.Funky_Llama

Oh? Why? It's the same thing, but the theist who preaches about his text is basing it on blind faith.

And the atheist who preaches that he's right is basing it on immature arrogance. Faith >>> arrogance.

And no, it's not blind faith.

:lol: Yeah, that must be it. The atheist couldn't be basing it on reason, or evidence, or anything. It must be arrogance. Because apparently atheists use arrogance as an argument against God now.

Evidence for a negative? Reasonable people don't have to preach. Reasonable atheists don't have to be arrogant.

A theist can preach for a variety of reasons. An atheist can only preach from shallow, narrow-minded arrogance. When a person speaks reasonably, he's not preaching.

And quit pulling strawmen. I didn't say all atheists do. I said all preaching atheists do.

I'd say that you were 'pulling a strawman', by throwing arrogance into the equation when it was unnessacary. You've created a hypothetical atheist with the negative attribute of arrogance so that you can criticise him. Thus, a straw man argument.

Actually, I only brought him up because you brought up the theist who "only has blind faith." Then, you misstated my position, and made me look like I was generalising all atheists in my argument, which is a strawman.

[QUOTE="Koalakommander"][QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"][QUOTE="Koalakommander"][QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]

I never stated anything about landmarks in the passage. There are others that I can quote to you if you'd like me to quote landmarks.

3eyedrazorback

Please do. I'll wait patiently while you google things.
I'm very excited, something that proves the bible true!? I will convert instantly, but I wonder why the other 2/3 of the world hasnt....

Actually, I'm reading through my Bible. Judea. Sumeria. Lebanon. Isreal.

There is this guy named Sir William Ramsey of Oxford University, one of history's greatest archaeoligists. He was an athiest. He spent 25 years doing archaelogical digs to try and disprove the book of Acts. Instead of discrediting it, his discoveries kept supporting it. He concluded that the author, Luke, was one of the most accurate historians that had ever written. Influenced by this, he became a Christian.

Athens was mentioned in Greek religion. By your logic Posideon controls the seas of our Earth.

"There is this guy..." Please. I want evidence. Just because a scientist is Christian doesn't prove anything you say right. I know scientists who are atheist because of the things they discover.

I am very dissapointed by your response.

Did you miss that part?

Richard Dawkins aslo went there, he is the world's most famout atheist. He is also a scientist researching our past.

Here, maybe I'm not the certified man to ask about these questions, but you can go to this website and they'll answer your questions. Just humor me, and go to it. Link3eyedrazorback

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]Here, maybe I'm not the certified man to ask about these questions, but you can go to this website and they'll answer your questions. Just humor me, and go to it. Linkharashawn

Alright that's enough. Stop trying to convert everyone here. Get out of this thread and stay out. Don't even think about posting again, buddy.

Ok. Well, you have to make that final decision. I'm not here to convert you, I'm just defending my witness and my religion.

Richard Dawkins aslo went there, he is the world's most famout atheist. He is also a scientist researching our past.

Koalakommander

He's also a moron and the main instigator of the New Atheism movement. Any reasonable atheist should be ashamed to be associated with that pseudo-intellect.

He's a smart biologist, but when he starts writing books encouraging whole groups of people to badger other groups of people in the name of spreading a new Enlightenment, he's nothing in my eyes.

Here, maybe I'm not the certified man to ask about these questions, but you can go to this website and they'll answer your questions. Just humor me, and go to it. Link3eyedrazorback

You sent us to a obviously biased relgion site...bravo I could do that too :? why don't you find a site that sees both sides of the argument and attempts to reach a compromise between them as to what beliefs can be proven.

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"][QUOTE="mechwarrior_bob"]

Agreed but there's a difference between "I'm Right and your wrong" and pointing out serious problems within religions.

I'd just perfer sticking to what can be proven.

Funky_Llama

I like to stick to things that can't be proven wrong. Like say...the Bible.

I really don't think you understand the principle of the Burden of Proof.

Doesn't it ever occur to anyone that if everyone claims they're right, there's a good likelihood they are ALL wrong? :?JustPlainLucas

That pretty much sums it up for me.

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]Here, maybe I'm not the certified man to ask about these questions, but you can go to this website and they'll answer your questions. Just humor me, and go to it. Linkmechwarrior_bob

You sent us to a obviously biased relgion site...bravo I could do that too :? why don't you find a sight that sees both sides of the argument and attempts to reach a compromise between them as to what beliefs can be proven.

I asked you to humor me. Find ME a website that sees both sides. Then we can discuss in a PM. I'm not here to make enemies, that was not my intentions. I'm here to defend my creator, and yours whether you choose to see it that way or not. PM me if you'd like to discuss further.

[QUOTE="harashawn"]

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]Here, maybe I'm not the certified man to ask about these questions, but you can go to this website and they'll answer your questions. Just humor me, and go to it. Link3eyedrazorback

Alright that's enough. Stop trying to convert everyone here. Get out of this thread and stay out. Don't even think about posting again, buddy.

Ok. Well, you have to make that final decision. I'm not here to convert you, I'm just defending my witness and my religion.

People like you give Christians a bad name, leave.

Which ever side you choose to be more believable, have fun and keep it to yourself.

If you discovered somehing truly amazing and wonderful could you keep it to yourself and if you could what kind of person would that make you?

The thing I believe that ought to be focused upon is to be able to have an truly open dialog where people do not personally insult onae another for their beliefs but seek to understand one another and have a true respect for one another regardless of thier worldview. For it ais true that we all (inahabitants of Earth) are so very different, yet so remarkabley similar. Who is the Stranger, or your Nieghbor aand how do you regard him/her.

Doesn't it ever occur to anyone that if everyone claims they're right, there's a good likelihood they are ALL wrong? :?JustPlainLucas

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"][QUOTE="harashawn"]

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]Here, maybe I'm not the certified man to ask about these questions, but you can go to this website and they'll answer your questions. Just humor me, and go to it. Linkharashawn

Alright that's enough. Stop trying to convert everyone here. Get out of this thread and stay out. Don't even think about posting again, buddy.

Ok. Well, you have to make that final decision. I'm not here to convert you, I'm just defending my witness and my religion.

People like you give Christians a bad name, leave.

Fine. I'll respect your wishes. People like you, give ignorance it's name.

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"][QUOTE="harashawn"]

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]Here, maybe I'm not the certified man to ask about these questions, but you can go to this website and they'll answer your questions. Just humor me, and go to it. harashawn

Alright that's enough. Stop trying to convert everyone here. Get out of this thread and stay out. Don't even think about posting again, buddy.

Ok. Well, you have to make that final decision. I'm not here to convert you, I'm just defending my witness and my religion.

People like you give Christians a bad name, leave.

He can stay or leave. He has done nothing to give Christians a bad name.

[QUOTE="mechwarrior_bob"]

[QUOTE="3eyedrazorback"]Here, maybe I'm not the certified man to ask about these questions, but you can go to this website and they'll answer your questions. Just humor me, and go to it. Link3eyedrazorback

You sent us to a obviously biased relgion site...bravo I could do that too :? why don't you find a sight that sees both sides of the argument and attempts to reach a compromise between them as to what beliefs can be proven.

I asked you to humor me. Find ME a website that sees both sides. Then we can discuss in a PM. I'm not here to make enemies, that was not my intentions. I'm here to defend my creator, and yours whether you choose to see it that way or not. PM me if you'd like to discuss further.

Watch debates between Richard Dawkins and theologists. Your eyes will be opened. It's all on youtube.

The website you get all your proof from is a biased religious site. They offer no room for disputes, just "this is it."

[QUOTE="hamstergeddon"]Ok. This is where I have to step in. Atheists can preach for a variety of reasons, one is shallowness and arrogance. But Atheists want people to see the "truth" in their eyes just as Christians want everyone to see their "truth". I don't see why when a Christian preaches its called converting but when an Atheist does it he's being arrogant :? Theokhoth

Because an atheist has nothing to convert to. Atheism isn't a religion, even if it is a belief, but when its adherents start treating atheism like a religion, they can have no reason to do so other than "I'm smarter than you; I'm better than you!" which is blind arrogance, even if they believe they have the truth, because the truth is nothing to arrogantly preach about.

Watch debates between Richard Dawkins and theologists. Your eyes will be opened. It's all on youtube.

The website you get all your proof from is a biased religious site. They offer no room for disputes, just "this is it."

Koalakommander

Richard Dawkins refuses to debate anyone who isn't an idiot. And I can prove this.

William Lane Craig challenged Richard Dawkins to a debate. Dawkins refused on the grounds that Craig is an unknown, and Dawkins didn't want to further Craig's reputation by debating him.

Problem? Craig is the single most well-known Christian theologian and apologist ALIVE. There is nobody who displays an interest in theism vs. atheism debates who doesn't know who he is. When writing a paper on Christian philosophy, it's damn near impossible to not look up something he wrote.

Dawkins displays behavior very similar to a cult leader when he waves off any books or debate challenges written in response to him, and calls them "fleas." What are "fleas," you ask? Simple: Dawkins takes a theologian, all his works, brushes them aside, and tells his followers to not pay them any mind. He has done this many, many times (he even has a list on his own website).

In a cult, you have to push aside and ignore anything the leader tells you, especially if it conflicts with the views in that cult.

[QUOTE="JustPlainLucas"]Doesn't it ever occur to anyone that if everyone claims they're right, there's a good likelihood they are ALL wrong? :?Theokhoth

Does this mean Atheism doesn't claim to be right?

Nope. Atheists never claim absolute truth. We're perfectly happy to acknowledge that we don't know and continue researching.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

[QUOTE="hamstergeddon"]Ok. This is where I have to step in. Atheists can preach for a variety of reasons, one is shallowness and arrogance. But Atheists want people to see the "truth" in their eyes just as Christians want everyone to see their "truth". I don't see why when a Christian preaches its called converting but when an Atheist does it he's being arrogant :? hamstergeddon

Because an atheist has nothing to convert to. Atheism isn't a religion, even if it is a belief, but when its adherents start treating atheism like a religion, they can have no reason to do so other than "I'm smarter than you; I'm better than you!" which is blind arrogance, even if they believe they have the truth, because the truth is nothing to arrogantly preach about.

:? say wut? I don't want to convert people to atheism...and were not trying to show that we're better. We simple don't think that people should go around saying "The bible is the only truth" or "The Quran is the only truth" or telling us that "We'll burn in the fire pit of hell".

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

[QUOTE="hamstergeddon"]Ok. This is where I have to step in. Atheists can preach for a variety of reasons, one is shallowness and arrogance. But Atheists want people to see the "truth" in their eyes just as Christians want everyone to see their "truth". I don't see why when a Christian preaches its called converting but when an Atheist does it he's being arrogant :? hamstergeddon

Because an atheist has nothing to convert to. Atheism isn't a religion, even if it is a belief, but when its adherents start treating atheism like a religion, they can have no reason to do so other than "I'm smarter than you; I'm better than you!" which is blind arrogance, even if they believe they have the truth, because the truth is nothing to arrogantly preach about.

Exactly! But I'm talking about PREACHING "the truth." If it's the truth, and all you want is to guide people to the light, then why not just sit down and be reasonable? Why preach at all? Why not go "this is interesting, but what do you make of this?" or "I think that's wrong, because. . ."

Whenever I read about atheists from the past, such as Frederich Nietszche, I think, "why isn't it like that today?" Then I turn on the comp and get my answer. Neo atheism poisons everything around it, including reasonable, good atheism, which has become too hard to find today.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

[QUOTE="JustPlainLucas"]Doesn't it ever occur to anyone that if everyone claims they're right, there's a good likelihood they are ALL wrong? :?luke1889

Does this mean Atheism doesn't claim to be right?

Nope. Atheists never claim absolute truth. We're perfectly happy to acknowledge that we don't know and continue researching.

remember, every group has it's loudmouthed stubborn ignorants as well.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

[QUOTE="JustPlainLucas"]Doesn't it ever occur to anyone that if everyone claims they're right, there's a good likelihood they are ALL wrong? :?luke1889

Does this mean Atheism doesn't claim to be right?

Nope. Atheists never claim absolute truth. We're perfectly happy to acknowledge that we don't know and continue researching.

Then why should I be an atheist?

[QUOTE="luke1889"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

[QUOTE="JustPlainLucas"]Doesn't it ever occur to anyone that if everyone claims they're right, there's a good likelihood they are ALL wrong? :?harashawn

Does this mean Atheism doesn't claim to be right?

Nope. Atheists never claim absolute truth. We're perfectly happy to acknowledge that we don't know and continue researching.

remember, every group has it's loudmouthed stubborn ignorants as well.

Yes, but anomalies aside.

[QUOTE="Koalakommander"]

Watch debates between Richard Dawkins and theologists. Your eyes will be opened. It's all on youtube.

The website you get all your proof from is a biased religious site. They offer no room for disputes, just "this is it."

Theokhoth

Richard Dawkins refuses to debate anyone who isn't an idiot. And I can prove this.

William Lane Craig challenged Richard Dawkins to a debate. Dawkins refused on the grounds that Craig is an unknown, and Dawkins didn't want to further Craig's reputation by debating him.

Problem? Craig is the single most well-known Christian theologian and apologist ALIVE. There is nobody who displays an interest in theism vs. atheism debates who doesn't know who he is. When writing a paper on Christian philosophy, it's damn near impossible to not look up something he wrote.

Dawkins displays behavior very similar to a cult leader when he waves off any books or debate challenges written in response to him, and calls them "fleas." What are "fleas," you ask? Simple: Dawkins takes a theologian, all his works, brushes them aside, and tells his followers to not pay them any mind. He has done this many, many times (he even has a list on his own website).

In a cult, you have to push aside and ignore anything the leader tells you, especially if it conflicts with the views in that cult.

? Well then your saying all religions are cults because they disagree with other religions "proofs". "In a cult you have to push aside and ignore anything the leader tells you, espically if it conflicts with the views in that cult"...I distinctly remeber people in the Chirstian nation saying Harry Potter promoted Black Magic and that it should not be read...

[QUOTE="luke1889"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"]

[QUOTE="JustPlainLucas"]Doesn't it ever occur to anyone that if everyone claims they're right, there's a good likelihood they are ALL wrong? :?Theokhoth

Does this mean Atheism doesn't claim to be right?

Nope. Atheists never claim absolute truth. We're perfectly happy to acknowledge that we don't know and continue researching.

Then why should I be an atheist?

Because you want observable answers which do not require faith?

Personally, I'm just not satisfied with, essentially, taking someone's word for the truth when it is in no way verifiable. To me, that is a logical fallacy. I only assert what is proved to be true, and would never claim absolute truth regarding something which cannot be said to be so.

However, if you're looking for comfort or some sort of fancy inspiration, then you won't find much of it here. Just cold, hard reality.

? Well then your saying all religions are cults because they disagree with other religions "proofs". "In a cult you have to push aside and ignore anything the leader tells you, espically if it conflicts with the views in that cult"...I distinctly remeber people in the Chirstian nation saying Harry Potter promoted Black Magic and that it should not be read...

mechwarrior_bob

I distinctly remember that our leader is dead.:)

I can embrace and learn about other religions. I can read Harry Potter just as easily as I can read Pagan mythology, and I can even be gay and remain a Christian, simply because there are no cultish ideas to it. Sure, there are some cults within Christianity -- Christian Science comes to my mind.

Because you want observable answers which do not require faith?

I got that already.

Personally, I'm just not satisfied with, essentially, taking someone's word for the truth when it is in no way verifiable. To me, that is a logical fallacy. I only assert what is proved to be true, and would never claim absolute truth regarding something which cannot be said to be so.

Good for you.

However, if you're looking for comfort or some sort of fancy inspiration, then you won't find much of it here. Just cold, hard reality.

Got it.

luke1889

So, if atheism doesn't have the answers now, will it? What gives answers within atheism?

[QUOTE="mechwarrior_bob"]

? Well then your saying all religions are cults because they disagree with other religions "proofs". "In a cult you have to push aside and ignore anything the leader tells you, espically if it conflicts with the views in that cult"...I distinctly remeber people in the Chirstian nation saying Harry Potter promoted Black Magic and that it should not be read...

Theokhoth

I distinctly remember that our leader is dead.:)

I can embrace and learn about other religions. I can read Harry Potter just as easily as I can read Pagan mythology, and I can even be gay and remain a Christian, simply because there are no cultish ideas to it. Sure, there are some cults within Christianity -- Christian Science comes to my mind.

Well you did get me to lol at the first sentence. But the majority of religion says "we are the one and only truth" :(

That is a cultist idea and it's visible in every religion save one.

So, if atheism doesn't have the answers now, will it? What gives answers within atheism?

Theokhoth

We don't know whether the answers will come. That's why we keep looking.

And the answers are discovered by science. You may have heard of it. :roll:

[QUOTE="luke1889"]

Because you want observable answers which do not require faith?

Theokhoth

I got that already.

I'm just going to stop this debate here because this is outright incorrect. You are one of the blind followers.

[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="mechwarrior_bob"]

? Well then your saying all religions are cults because they disagree with other religions "proofs". "In a cult you have to push aside and ignore anything the leader tells you, espically if it conflicts with the views in that cult"...I distinctly remeber people in the Chirstian nation saying Harry Potter promoted Black Magic and that it should not be read...

mechwarrior_bob

I distinctly remember that our leader is dead.:)

I can embrace and learn about other religions. I can read Harry Potter just as easily as I can read Pagan mythology, and I can even be gay and remain a Christian, simply because there are no cultish ideas to it. Sure, there are some cults within Christianity -- Christian Science comes to my mind.

Well you did get me to lol at the first sentence. But the majority of religion says "we are the one and only truth" :(

That is a cultist idea and it's visible in every religion save one.

Actually, that's not a cultist idea. That's a truth claim. All truth claims logically exclude their opposite.

A cultist idea would be: "We are the one and only truth. All others claiming to be truth should be wiped out/ ostracised and hated. None of their works are to be possessed or read, and anything putting their doctrines in a positive light or our doctrines in a negative light is heresy."

We don't know whether the answers will come. That's why we keep looking.

And the answers are discovered by science. You may have heard of it. :roll:luke1889

So you're saying that atheism has no answers, and makes no promise to ever have answers, and in spite of this, anyone who thinks they have answers must be wrong, and I should be an atheist because of this? You also assume that theists don't look for answers, a horrible mistake.

And science gives nothing; it's logic that gives answers. Science is a by-product of the simple law of logic.

I'm just going to stop this debate here because this is outright incorrect. You are one of the blind followers.

A blind follower is someone who leaves without asking questions. You don't wonder why I say that I already have that? Why? It's because you assume I'm lying, or crazy, or whatever, from the start. You have no interest in the truth; all you want is to make your view truth by way of passive aggressive coercion.

The funny thing about blind people is they usually believe they can see better than anybody else. ;)

[QUOTE="mechwarrior_bob"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="mechwarrior_bob"]

? Well then your saying all religions are cults because they disagree with other religions "proofs". "In a cult you have to push aside and ignore anything the leader tells you, espically if it conflicts with the views in that cult"...I distinctly remeber people in the Chirstian nation saying Harry Potter promoted Black Magic and that it should not be read...

Theokhoth

I distinctly remember that our leader is dead.:)

I can embrace and learn about other religions. I can read Harry Potter just as easily as I can read Pagan mythology, and I can even be gay and remain a Christian, simply because there are no cultish ideas to it. Sure, there are some cults within Christianity -- Christian Science comes to my mind.

But, they have done that they burned/destroyed a large amount of gospels so that 4 would remain the strict basis of the religion...the inqustion destroyed Jewish Books and thesis(s) writtened by them. The crusaders would burn destroy Muslim texts and destroy/convert temples. Muslims would destroy churches and texts as well. Don't forgot both Crusaders and Muslims executed prisoners who would refuse to convert.

Well you did get me to lol at the first sentence. But the majority of religion says "we are the one and only truth" :(

That is a cultist idea and it's visible in every religion save one.

Actually, that's not a cultist idea. That's a truth claim. All truth claims logically exclude their opposite.

A cultist idea would be: "We are the one and only truth. All others claiming to be truth should be wiped out/ ostracised and hated. None of their works are to be possessed or read, and anything putting their doctrines in a positive light or our doctrines in a negative light is heresy."