What are the chances of Jesus...

what are the chances we find out he was real?Premier1101

We already found out he existed, but the other thing...uhhhh not so much.

being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?Ilived

what are the chances we find out he was real?Premier1101

1/10

to teh first post

3/10

what are the chances we find out he was real?Premier1101

[QUOTE="Ilived"]being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?notconspiracy

This is only shown through testimony of blind followers.. There were alot of messiahs then, some believers claimed they can heal wounds and diease as well.. Penn and Teller go into depth with this.. This is not to say Jesus may or may not be the messiah.. I just find the reasoning behind why you think so to be flawed. You make it sound like you saw it your self.

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]what are the chances we find out he was real?notconspiracy

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]what are the chances we find out he was real?Ilived

We already found out he existed, but the other thing...uhhhh not so much.

Wheres the proof, Ive never seen it...

Although it is often considered absolute fact that Jesus existed and was real, there is still not that much evidence of him being real. Check wikipedia for more information. So if there is a chance that he wasn't even real, then there is a possibility that he was just a normal man who was able to rally disciples together by offering a good afterlife.

show me proof other than word of mouth..... then yeah definetly.. has to approved by scientists as well as religious heads as well...Premier1101

:lol: Human scientists to explain the supernatural.....

What are the chances this will turn into a religious debate.Proobie44

10/10

[QUOTE="Ilived"]

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]what are the chances we find out he was real?Premier1101

We already found out he existed, but the other thing...uhhhh not so much.

Wheres the proof, Ive never seen it...

What are the chances this will turn into a religious debate.Proobie44

0 to none.

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Ilived"]being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?sSubZerOo

This is only shown through testimony of blind followers.. There were alot of messiahs then, some believers claimed they can heal wounds and diease as well.. Penn and Teller go into depth with this.. This is not to say Jesus may or may not be the messiah.. I just find the reasoning behind why you think so to be flawed. You make it sound like you saw it your self.

1: Jesus was crucified

2: Jesus was entombed. This tomb was later found to be empty

3: Jesus appeared to the 12

4: Jesus appeared to James, who was a skeptic

5: Jesus appeared to Paul

6: The disciples believed the resurrection

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]show me proof other than word of mouth..... then yeah definetly.. has to approved by scientists as well as religious heads as well...LJS9502_basic

:lol: Human scientists to explain the supernatural.....

Religious heads explaining they've never touched little boys :lol: x5

[QUOTE="Proobie44"]What are the chances this will turn into a religious debate.Ilived

0 to none.

Did from the fist post...:|

[QUOTE="Premier1101"][QUOTE="Ilived"]

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]what are the chances we find out he was real?Lobster_Ear

We already found out he existed, but the other thing...uhhhh not so much.

Wheres the proof, Ive never seen it...

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Ilived"]being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?notconspiracy

This is only shown through testimony of blind followers.. There were alot of messiahs then, some believers claimed they can heal wounds and diease as well.. Penn and Teller go into depth with this.. This is not to say Jesus may or may not be the messiah.. I just find the reasoning behind why you think so to be flawed. You make it sound like you saw it your self.

1: Jesus was crucified

2: Jesus was entombed. This tomb was later found to be empty

3: Jesus appeared to the 12

4: Jesus appeared to James, who was a skeptic

5: Jesus appeared to Paul

6: The disciples believed the resurrection

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

What about tomb robbing?

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Ilived"]being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?notconspiracy

This is only shown through testimony of blind followers.. There were alot of messiahs then, some believers claimed they can heal wounds and diease as well.. Penn and Teller go into depth with this.. This is not to say Jesus may or may not be the messiah.. I just find the reasoning behind why you think so to be flawed. You make it sound like you saw it your self.

1: Jesus was crucified

2: Jesus was entombed. This tomb was later found to be empty

3: Jesus appeared to the 12

4: Jesus appeared to James, who was a skeptic

5: Jesus appeared to Paul

6: The disciples believed the resurrection

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

notconspiracy

first, I don't really want to do this, so I'll just make this post and leave. regarding issue #7, if a leader converts to a specific religion or sect he usually carries the rest of the people with him (see: Henry VIII).

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]show me proof other than word of mouth..... then yeah definetly.. has to approved by scientists as well as religious heads as well...LJS9502_basic

:lol: Human scientists to explain the supernatural.....

what are the chances we find out he was real?Premier1101

The 4 canonized Gospels

the heretical gospels

the Pauline epistles

The 1 Corinthians 15 creed

Tacitus

Josephus

Suetonius

Mara Bar Saropian

Pliny the Younger

Early church fathers including (that I can name off the top of my head) Tertullian

Clement of Rome

Papias

Eusebius

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"]

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

Hewkii

first, I don't really want to do this, so I'll just make this post and leave. regarding issue #7, if a leader converts to a specific religion or sect he usually carries the rest of the people with him (see: Henry VIII).

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Ilived"]being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?notconspiracy

This is only shown through testimony of blind followers.. There were alot of messiahs then, some believers claimed they can heal wounds and diease as well.. Penn and Teller go into depth with this.. This is not to say Jesus may or may not be the messiah.. I just find the reasoning behind why you think so to be flawed. You make it sound like you saw it your self.

1: Jesus was crucified

2: Jesus was entombed. This tomb was later found to be empty

3: Jesus appeared to the 12

4: Jesus appeared to James, who was a skeptic

5: Jesus appeared to Paul

6: The disciples believed the resurrection

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

All of this except the last point you got direclty from the bible.. There is no historical evidence what so ever.. Thus why FAITH TAKES in and why your points are FLAWED. Because you think there is some fact or evidence to prove Jesus's divinity when there is not.. THUS why FAITH is in place, and why the SCIENTIFIC community and many people other then that do not agree with this conclusion. I am by no means saying you are wrong.. I personally couldn't care either way.. My point is the way your going about it is your trying to state belief and faith based writings as garenteed fact and actuallity when they are certainly not.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]show me proof other than word of mouth..... then yeah definetly.. has to approved by scientists as well as religious heads as well...Lobster_Ear

:lol: Human scientists to explain the supernatural.....

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]show me proof other than word of mouth..... then yeah definetly.. has to approved by scientists as well as religious heads as well...Lobster_Ear

:lol: Human scientists to explain the supernatural.....

Ah...no. They can't. Human knowledge is finite.

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Ilived"]being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?sSubZerOo

This is only shown through testimony of blind followers.. There were alot of messiahs then, some believers claimed they can heal wounds and diease as well.. Penn and Teller go into depth with this.. This is not to say Jesus may or may not be the messiah.. I just find the reasoning behind why you think so to be flawed. You make it sound like you saw it your self.

1: Jesus was crucified

2: Jesus was entombed. This tomb was later found to be empty

3: Jesus appeared to the 12

4: Jesus appeared to James, who was a skeptic

5: Jesus appeared to Paul

6: The disciples believed the resurrection

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

All of this except the last point you got direclty from the bible.. There is no historical evidence what so ever.. Thus why FAITH TAKES in and why your points are FLAWED. Because you think there is some fact or evidence to prove Jesus's divinity when there is not.. THUS why FAITH is in place, and why the SCIENTIFIC community and many people other then that do not agree with this conclusion. I am by no means saying you are wrong.. I personally couldn't care either way.. My point is the way your going about it is your trying to state belief and faith based writings as garenteed fact and actuallity when they are certainly not.

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]what are the chances we find out he was real?notconspiracy

The 4 canonized Gospels

the heretical gospels

the Pauline epistles

The 1 Corinthians 15 creed

Tacitus

Josephus

Suetonius

Mara Bar Saropian

Pliny the Younger

Early church fathers including (that I can name off the top of my head) Tertullian

Clement of Rome

Papias

Eusebius

Those are people, not DNA, clothes, hard evidence, anything concrete, sorry bud, word of mouth=fail

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Ilived"]being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?notconspiracy

This is only shown through testimony of blind followers.. There were alot of messiahs then, some believers claimed they can heal wounds and diease as well.. Penn and Teller go into depth with this.. This is not to say Jesus may or may not be the messiah.. I just find the reasoning behind why you think so to be flawed. You make it sound like you saw it your self.

1: Jesus was crucified

2: Jesus was entombed. This tomb was later found to be empty

3: Jesus appeared to the 12

4: Jesus appeared to James, who was a skeptic

5: Jesus appeared to Paul

6: The disciples believed the resurrection

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

All of this except the last point you got direclty from the bible.. There is no historical evidence what so ever.. Thus why FAITH TAKES in and why your points are FLAWED. Because you think there is some fact or evidence to prove Jesus's divinity when there is not.. THUS why FAITH is in place, and why the SCIENTIFIC community and many people other then that do not agree with this conclusion. I am by no means saying you are wrong.. I personally couldn't care either way.. My point is the way your going about it is your trying to state belief and faith based writings as garenteed fact and actuallity when they are certainly not.

No I am pointing out that you are basically saying that Jesus's divinity was proven fact (even though it defies physics, something we can actually repeat over and over agan and have evidence on), through the writings of holy scripture.. :roll:

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"]

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]what are the chances we find out he was real?Premier1101

The 4 canonized Gospels

the heretical gospels

the Pauline epistles

The 1 Corinthians 15 creed

Tacitus

Josephus

Suetonius

Mara Bar Saropian

Pliny the Younger

Early church fathers including (that I can name off the top of my head) Tertullian

Clement of Rome

Papias

Eusebius

Those are people, not DNA, clothes, hard evidence, anything concrete, sorry bud, word of mouth=fail

Those are people, not DNA, clothes, hard evidence, anything concrete, sorry bud, word of mouth=fail

Premier1101

Then I guess we have a lot of history to throw out....

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Ilived"]being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?sSubZerOo

This is only shown through testimony of blind followers.. There were alot of messiahs then, some believers claimed they can heal wounds and diease as well.. Penn and Teller go into depth with this.. This is not to say Jesus may or may not be the messiah.. I just find the reasoning behind why you think so to be flawed. You make it sound like you saw it your self.

1: Jesus was crucified

2: Jesus was entombed. This tomb was later found to be empty

3: Jesus appeared to the 12

4: Jesus appeared to James, who was a skeptic

5: Jesus appeared to Paul

6: The disciples believed the resurrection

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

All of this except the last point you got direclty from the bible.. There is no historical evidence what so ever.. Thus why FAITH TAKES in and why your points are FLAWED. Because you think there is some fact or evidence to prove Jesus's divinity when there is not.. THUS why FAITH is in place, and why the SCIENTIFIC community and many people other then that do not agree with this conclusion. I am by no means saying you are wrong.. I personally couldn't care either way.. My point is the way your going about it is your trying to state belief and faith based writings as garenteed fact and actuallity when they are certainly not.

No I am pointing out that you are basically saying that Jesus's divinity was proven fact (even though it defies physics, something we can actually repeat over and over agan and have evidence on), through the writings of holy scripture.. :roll:

[QUOTE="Lobster_Ear"][QUOTE="Premier1101"][QUOTE="Ilived"]

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]what are the chances we find out he was real?notconspiracy

We already found out he existed, but the other thing...uhhhh not so much.

Wheres the proof, Ive never seen it...

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Lobster_Ear"][QUOTE="Premier1101"][QUOTE="Ilived"]

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]what are the chances we find out he was real?Lobster_Ear

We already found out he existed, but the other thing...uhhhh not so much.

Wheres the proof, Ive never seen it...

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]

Those are people, not DNA, clothes, hard evidence, anything concrete, sorry bud, word of mouth=fail

LJS9502_basic

Then I guess we have a lot of history to throw out....

I take it we are suppose to believe Greek mythology then? It has just as much evidence or lack of to things such as the divinity of Jesus. I am by no means argueing that Jesus was a messiah then.. Just that there is no hardcore evidence that he was devine.. And yes you can't take all anicent history seriouslly..

Are we suppose to take the battle of thermoplae (spelling) seriouslly when the writer who saw it said the Persians number in the millions? When every researcher believes that was not true because there was not enough water sources near by to support such a army?

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Premier1101"]

Those are people, not DNA, clothes, hard evidence, anything concrete, sorry bud, word of mouth=fail

sSubZerOo

Then I guess we have a lot of history to throw out....

I take it we are suppose to believe Greek mythology then? It has just as much evidence or lack of to things such as the divinity of Jesus. I am by no means argueing that Jesus was a messiah then.. Just that there is no hardcore evidence that he was devine.. And yes you can't take all anicent history seriouslly..

Are we suppose to take the battle of thermoplae (spelling) seriouslly when the writer who saw it said the Persians number in the millions? When every researcher believes that was not true because there was not enough water sources near by to support such a army?

second, I just submitted evidence for the resurrection. If you wish to build a case for Greek mythology, then Im all ears

show me proof other than word of mouth..... then yeah definetly.. has to approved by scientists as well as religious heads as well...Premier1101

How do you propose we scientifically prove an individual is the Messiah?

[QUOTE="Lobster_Ear"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]show me proof other than word of mouth..... then yeah definetly.. has to approved by scientists as well as religious heads as well...notconspiracy

:lol: Human scientists to explain the supernatural.....

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]

Those are people, not DNA, clothes, hard evidence, anything concrete, sorry bud, word of mouth=fail

LJS9502_basic

Then I guess we have a lot of history to throw out....

Is it me but isnt history what we can define as what has happened back then through proof? Since jesus is a sensitive subject, I'm requiring physical proof, that's it. Lots of history is defined by geological and historical finding and documentation(I am taking Western civ ancient to early modern) what history would you mean?

[QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="sSubZerOo"]

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Ilived"]being another one of those crazy paranoid people who claimed to be the messiah?notconspiracy

This is only shown through testimony of blind followers.. There were alot of messiahs then, some believers claimed they can heal wounds and diease as well.. Penn and Teller go into depth with this.. This is not to say Jesus may or may not be the messiah.. I just find the reasoning behind why you think so to be flawed. You make it sound like you saw it your self.

1: Jesus was crucified

2: Jesus was entombed. This tomb was later found to be empty

3: Jesus appeared to the 12

4: Jesus appeared to James, who was a skeptic

5: Jesus appeared to Paul

6: The disciples believed the resurrection

7: Christianity rapidly spread throughout the Roman empire

These 7 facts, well 6 facts the 1st is just a necessary prerequisite, need to be explained. I submit the resurrection as an explanation. do you have any other?

All of this except the last point you got direclty from the bible.. There is no historical evidence what so ever.. Thus why FAITH TAKES in and why your points are FLAWED. Because you think there is some fact or evidence to prove Jesus's divinity when there is not.. THUS why FAITH is in place, and why the SCIENTIFIC community and many people other then that do not agree with this conclusion. I am by no means saying you are wrong.. I personally couldn't care either way.. My point is the way your going about it is your trying to state belief and faith based writings as garenteed fact and actuallity when they are certainly not.

No I am pointing out that you are basically saying that Jesus's divinity was proven fact (even though it defies physics, something we can actually repeat over and over agan and have evidence on), through the writings of holy scripture.. :roll:

Early Christian literature.. The Gospels for instance are about the life of Jesus Christ... Yet again why are these books fact again? Oh thats right they arn't because its still a highly debated topic to this day.. If it were as fact as you claim it was.. There wouldn't be numerous religions other then christianity nor would there be a huge debate about it.. Yet again they are holy scriptures..

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Premier1101"]

Those are people, not DNA, clothes, hard evidence, anything concrete, sorry bud, word of mouth=fail

sSubZerOo

Then I guess we have a lot of history to throw out....

I take it we are suppose to believe Greek mythology then? It has just as much evidence or lack of to things such as the divinity of Jesus. I am by no means argueing that Jesus was a messiah then.. Just that there is no hardcore evidence that he was devine.. And yes you can't take all anicent history seriouslly..

Are we suppose to take the battle of thermoplae (spelling) seriouslly when the writer who saw it said the Persians number in the millions? When every researcher believes that was not true because there was not enough water sources near by to support such a army?

I said history.....;)

[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Lobster_Ear"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"]

[QUOTE="Premier1101"]show me proof other than word of mouth..... then yeah definetly.. has to approved by scientists as well as religious heads as well...Lobster_Ear

:lol: Human scientists to explain the supernatural.....