What is abiogenesis?

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yoshi-lnex

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#251 yoshi-lnex
Member since 2007 • 5442 Posts
[QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"]It really seems that his version of logic requires evidence, while yours does not, you substitute assumption. That seems to be the patten there.

and what is your evidence that the chances of life happening has astronomical odds? Just more assumption based logic I guess.

123625

Well i beleive an intellegent creator, he made things how and what they are today. He designed the world so that everything in it has a unique purpose of some kind or another. I have no proof for this only beleif, just as the beleif that you seem to have about life being the result of random mutations from Dead non-living material. But its kind of where commonsense kicks in for me i guess.

You can beleive that some how we came from dead non living material (You insist on not calling it rock by the way). I will only say this, you have more faith than i do.

No.....faith is based upon a lack of evidence. The idea of a god cannot be proven, it is an assumption, so faith is used to justify a belief in it. Do you understand? Faith is a belief in something which has no evidence.

Evolution by contrast has evidence. Evidence that can be clearly demonstrated to be true does not require evidence.

The evidence is pretty overwhelming as has been explained to you many times, but you continue to ignore this.

Actually the ultamate irony is how while you require no evidence to believe in an unseen god, you requre mounds of evidence for any other idea, and when that evidence is presented, you ignore it.

Your idea of logic is

No evidence >> lots of evidence.

choosing evidence over faith does not require more faith than an assumption.

The thing that remains however is that Evolution is not a Fact, it has evidence for sure, i can accept that. But its not fact. This is abio genesis we're talking about to. Show me hard core FACT of evolution, not just explanation, theory or speculation. FACT ACTUAL FACT or don't bother.

Well, by definition, a fact is something that exists, and evolution exists, so it must be a fact by definition.

There you go FACT of evolution

Facepalm* your ignorence is astounding. We have never seen evolution this does not make it fact untill we have seen it. Scientific fact is observation we have never observed it. Do not tell me it is fact, it is the most ignorant thing you can do.

I've never seen an electron and never will, but that doesn't mean it's not real, I've never seen a gravaton (the thing responsible for gravity) but I know it causes gravity, I've never seen an atom, and nobody ever has but I know they are all real. Things don't need to be directly observed for us to reasonable conclude that they exist. A basic idea in science.

We have seen it in the fossil record though....

Evolution is not comparable to an atom, don't use other proven sciences to justify an unproven one, thats bad science. Evolution is a theory and speculation which needs to observed for it to be considered FACT! Atoms don't make it fact!

actually it's a perfect analogy. You seem to believe that the only way to verify somethings existance is to see it with our own eyes (Ironic considering you've never seen god, but that's another matter) but that's not true, we can figure out that things exist via different forms of observation than just what we can see with our eyes in the immediacty of time. Electrons demonstrate this very well because they are impossible to see directly with the human eye, like evolution, but through experimentation it was varified. The difference is that creationists don't believe electrons contradict their beliefs so they don't fight them using the same poor logic.

and as I've said many times, evolution has been observed in many ways, one example would be the fossil record.

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yoshi-lnex

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#252 yoshi-lnex
Member since 2007 • 5442 Posts
[QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="bman784"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"]It really seems that his version of logic requires evidence, while yours does not, you substitute assumption. That seems to be the patten there.

and what is your evidence that the chances of life happening has astronomical odds? Just more assumption based logic I guess.

123625

Well i beleive an intellegent creator, he made things how and what they are today. He designed the world so that everything in it has a unique purpose of some kind or another. I have no proof for this only beleif, just as the beleif that you seem to have about life being the result of random mutations from Dead non-living material. But its kind of where commonsense kicks in for me i guess.

You can beleive that some how we came from dead non living material (You insist on not calling it rock by the way). I will only say this, you have more faith than i do.


Do you have any idea of what is involved in atoms? Protons, neutrons, electrons? There is no such thing as "dead" material. Everything we percieve that exists in the universe has energy and is in prepetual motion. You continue to state misconceptions.

Sorry my mistake take Dead out then. I still said non living material. But either way you look at it, you have more faith than i do. Its the truth. I know a slight bit about atoms and etc, but hey you have your beleifs and i have mine. Its not a fact that we came from non living material. I will beleive what i best to see logical as will you, dont criticise my logic over yours however.

How does looking at evidence and drawing logical conclusions require more faith than just making the assumption that a god exists based off of nothing?

How is beleiving we are the result of random mutations that evolved from non living material by itself any better?

evidence, experimentation, observation, over and over again, that's why.

BUT ITS NOT FACT! We have never seen non living material give life. Nor can we replicate and test how it happened millions of years ago, because we don't know how it happened. It doesnt make Abiogenesis fact! get it?

Evolution does not explain how life came to be, that's a seperate theory, evolution is a theory which explains how species adapt to their environment based upon what genes are best favored.

Again, things don't have to be observed to be called fact, however we have been able to replicate several components of basic life notably.

You've also changed the subject, you asked how is believing random mutation drives change in species different than assuming a god exists, and like I've said, evidence, experimantation, observation, over and over agin.

by definition it is fact because it's existance has been varified.

No Evolution is not fact nor is Abiogenesis. Stop trying to tell me your beleifs are fact when they are not!

take it up with the people at dictionary.com if you don't like it, but by definition, evolution is fact.

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123625

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#253 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts

It is pointless talking to you all. You all want for Evolution and Abiogenesis to be real, so you criticise others saying they are illogical and irrational. This doesnt make Evolution FACT nor does it make ABIOGENESIS FACT!

I am done with this.

You seem to all forget the basica meaning of science and i will post this link, I suggest you read which you wont.

http://www.newgeology.us/presentation32.html

I swear if another of you try to tell me evolution is fact.

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bman784

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#254 bman784
Member since 2004 • 6755 Posts

No Evolution is not fact nor is Abiogenesis. Stop trying to tell me your beleifs are fact when they are not!

123625

If your criteria for the acceptance of fact is that rigid, you shouldn't be accepting most things. There is nothing that is absolutely proven. That's conceptually impossible. All we have to go on is the existence of favorable empirical evidence. We rely on this to explain, gravity, Newtonian physics, atomic theory, etc. and however much it conflicts with your belief, evolution falls well within that category. Almost every well educated scientist accepts evolution as a truth, becuase of that same favorable evidence. You are someone who doesn't have near the scientific perspective as one of those scientists. Why can't you at least acknowledge the legitimacy of the theory? The only reason is because your belief will never let you. But then I ask, why argue?
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yoshi-lnex

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#255 yoshi-lnex
Member since 2007 • 5442 Posts

It is pointless talking to you all. You all want for Evolution and Abiogenesis to be real, so you criticise others saying they are illogical and irrational. This doesnt make Evolution FACT nor does it make ABIOGENESIS FACT!

I am done with this.

You seem to all forget the basica meaning of science and i will post this link, I suggest you read which you wont.

http://www.newgeology.us/presentation32.html

I swear if another of you try to tell me evolution is fact.

123625

It's been proven....so I would call it real.

Creationists are criticised as illogical and irrational because they ignore mounds and mounds of evidence provided for evolution while providing none of their own. I these beliefs are simply a need of an education. Maybe that sounds harsh, but it's true, turning down evidence for favor of assumption is not the mark of a well educated person.

oh and by definition, evolution is fact, you can either accept that or live in denial, that's reality.

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notconspiracy

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#256 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts
[QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="yoshi-lnex"]It really seems that his version of logic requires evidence, while yours does not, you substitute assumption. That seems to be the patten there.

and what is your evidence that the chances of life happening has astronomical odds? Just more assumption based logic I guess.

123625

Well i beleive an intellegent creator, he made things how and what they are today. He designed the world so that everything in it has a unique purpose of some kind or another. I have no proof for this only beleif, just as the beleif that you seem to have about life being the result of random mutations from Dead non-living material. But its kind of where commonsense kicks in for me i guess.

You can beleive that some how we came from dead non living material (You insist on not calling it rock by the way). I will only say this, you have more faith than i do.

No.....faith is based upon a lack of evidence. The idea of a god cannot be proven, it is an assumption, so faith is used to justify a belief in it. Do you understand? Faith is a belief in something which has no evidence.

Evolution by contrast has evidence. Evidence that can be clearly demonstrated to be true does not require evidence.

The evidence is pretty overwhelming as has been explained to you many times, but you continue to ignore this.

Actually the ultamate irony is how while you require no evidence to believe in an unseen god, you requre mounds of evidence for any other idea, and when that evidence is presented, you ignore it.

Your idea of logic is

No evidence >> lots of evidence.

choosing evidence over faith does not require more faith than an assumption.

The thing that remains however is that Evolution is not a Fact, it has evidence for sure, i can accept that. But its not fact. This is abio genesis we're talking about to. Show me hard core FACT of evolution, not just explanation, theory or speculation. FACT ACTUAL FACT or don't bother.

Well, by definition, a fact is something that exists, and evolution exists, so it must be a fact by definition.

There you go FACT of evolution

Facepalm* your ignorence is astounding. We have never seen evolution this does not make it fact untill we have seen it. Scientific fact is observation and we have never observed it. Do not tell me it is fact, it is the most ignorant thing you can do. Then again read my sig Darwin started a trend.

atomic nuclei are not a fact. electrons are not a fact. relativity is not a fact. gravity is not a fact. your ignorance is astounding 123625
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notconspiracy

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#257 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts

It is pointless talking to you all. You all want for Evolution and Abiogenesis to be real, so you criticise others saying they are illogical and irrational. This doesnt make Evolution FACT nor does it make ABIOGENESIS FACT!

I am done with this.

You seem to all forget the basica meaning of science and i will post this link, I suggest you read which you wont.

http://www.newgeology.us/presentation32.html

I swear if another of you try to tell me evolution is fact.

123625
actually abiogenesis is a FACT. at one time there was no life on this planet, and then there was life. how it happened is the theory.
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notconspiracy

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#258 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts
about that article there, we've seen that before. but I'll debunk it anyway [spoiler]
blah article
[/spoiler]
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inoperativeRS

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#259 inoperativeRS
Member since 2004 • 8844 Posts

Matter CAN be destroyed. What do you think happens in Fission or Fusion reactions? Matter is converted into energy. br0kenrabbit

Energy conservation law. It's not destroyed, it only enters a different state.

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inoperativeRS

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#260 inoperativeRS
Member since 2004 • 8844 Posts

It is pointless talking to you all. You all want for Evolution and Abiogenesis to be real, so you criticise others saying they are illogical and irrational. This doesnt make Evolution FACT nor does it make ABIOGENESIS FACT!

I am done with this.

You seem to all forget the basica meaning of science and i will post this link, I suggest you read which you wont.

http://www.newgeology.us/presentation32.html

I swear if another of you try to tell me evolution is fact.

123625

Do you consider Newton's laws of physics fact?

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luke1889

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#261 luke1889
Member since 2004 • 14617 Posts

When certain elements come into contact with each other, they react. Doing science at school will tell you this.

Let us not forget that every singleprocess that goes on in our bodies is just a chemical reactions, which occurs due to the presence of different elements. Most of these reaction, we have no control over, and the elements which are part of such reactions are, on their own, non-living entities.

How hard is that to grasp? Seriously? :roll:

Put another way, the fundamental building blocks on which all life is based are non-living. But arranged the right way, they fall under the definition of we call "life".

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MedicMike66

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#262 MedicMike66
Member since 2007 • 886 Posts
what about Frankenstein? I think we all sprung from eggplants.
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DeeJayInphinity

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#263 DeeJayInphinity
Member since 2004 • 13415 Posts

When certain elements come into contact with each other, they react. Doing science at school will tell you this.

Let us not forget that every singleprocess that goes on in our bodies is just a chemical reactions, which occurs due to the presence of different elements. Most of these reaction, we have no control over, and the elements which are part of such reactions are, on their own, non-living entities.

How hard is that to grasp? Seriously? :roll:

Put another way, the fundamental building blocks on which all life is based are non-living. But arranged the right way, they fall under the definition of we call "life".

luke1889
It's very easy to grasp actually, for most people.. :P
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notconspiracy

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#264 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts
about that article from new geology:

"Evolution" mixes two things together, one real, one imaginary. Variation is the real part. The types of bird beaks, the colors of moths, leg sizes, etc. are variation. article

This is called microevolution. Microevolution is change which can be observed DIRECTLY.

Each type and length of beak a finch can have is already in the gene pool for finches. Creationists have always agreed that there is variation within species. But what evolutionists do not want you to know is that there are strict limits to variation that are never crossed, something every breeder of animals or plants is aware of.article

Never in the history of genetics was a barrier to change ever observed. If such a mechanism were discovered, evolution would be falsified, and the discoverer would be VERY rich and VERY EXTREMELY famous for he/she has overturned a scientific paradigm that has reigned for over 150 years

Evolutionists want you to think that changes continue, merging gradually into new kinds of creatures. article

First, what is a "kind" care to define it? Second, mutations DO accumulate.

This is where the imaginary part of the theory of evolution comes in. It says that new information is added to the gene pool by mutation and natural selection to create frogs from fish, reptiles from frogs, and mammals from reptiles, to name a few.article

It is rather easy to add new information into the genome through gene and chromosome duplication. Oh, you will probably ask for some sort of feature that wasn't there before. Well, nylon metabolizing bacteria is a fine example. How can this be possible, if nylon didn't exist before the 20th century? The answer: EVOLUTION.

Do these big changes really happen? article

Not in historical times, but over millions and billions of years, "big" changes will certainly happen

Evolutionists tell us we cannot see evolution taking place because it happens too slowly.article

You cannot observe millions of years worth of time go by in historical times. Evolution has only been around for 150 years. To observe large changes over millions of years, we use fossil evidence. To establish phylogenetic relationships among animals, we use DNA, fossils, and cladistics, which is the science of cl@ssifying things based on derived characters (placenta, eucaryotic, hair present)

A human generation takes about 20 years from birth to parenthood. They say it took tens of thousands of generations to form man from a common ancestor with the ape, from populations of only hundreds or thousands. We do not have these problems with bacteria. A generation of bacteria grows in a matter of hours. There are more bacteria in the world than there are grains of sand on all of the beaches of the world (and many grains of sand are covered with bacteria). They exist in just about any environment: heat, cold, dry, wet, high pressure, low pressure, small groups, large colonies, isolated, much food, little food, much oxygen, no oxygen, in toxic chemicals, etc. There is much variation in bacteria. There are many mutations (in fact, evolutionists say that smaller organisms have a faster mutation rate than larger ones4). But they never turn into anything new. They always remain bacteria. article

You cannot possibly be asking for bacteria to change into Eucaryotes within historical times can you?

Fruit flies are much more complex than already complex single-cell bacteria. Scientists like to study them because a generation (from egg to adult) takes only 9 days. In the lab, fruit flies are studied under every conceivable condition. There is much variation in fruit flies. There are many mutations. But they never turn into anything new. They always remain fruit flies. article

"fruit flies" is a very subjective term. You cannot expect for a species to become a new genus within only a few years can you? Well not really. This takes far too long for people to observe. Science does not need direct observation to establish a theory.

Many years of study of countless generations of bacteria and fruit flies all over the world shows that evolution is not happening today.article

What? A new species of drosphila was produced in a laboratory! Speciation IS evolution.

This is how the imaginary part is supposed to happen: On rare occasions a mutation in DNA improves a creature's ability to survive, so it is more likely to reproduce (natural selection). That is evolution's only tool for making new creatures. article

That's how evolution works. Through mutation and natural selection.

It might even work if it took just one gene to make and control one part. But parts of living creatures are constructed of intricate components with connections that all need to be in place for the thing to work, controlled by many genes that have to act in the proper sequence.article

Irredcuible complexity is nothing more than an argument from personal incredulity. Once a structure or system is declared "irreducibly complex" then scientific investigation is stopped. Thats not how science works

Natural selection would not choose parts that did not have all their components existing, in place, connected, and regulated because the parts would not work. article

The system ancestral to the extant system need not have the same function

Thus all the right mutations (and none of the destructive ones) must happen at the same time by pure chance. article

Ehh, sorry, but that is not true. Natural selection selects the beneficial traits and discards the deleterious ones. Mutations are actually fairly common. Each human zygote actually has over 100 mutations.

That is physically impossible. To illustrate just how impossible it is, imagine this: on the ground are all the materials needed to build a house (nails, boards, shingles, windows, etc.). We tie a hammer to the wagging tail of a dog and let him wander about the work site for as long as you please, even millions of years. The swinging hammer on the dog is as likely to build a house as mutation-natural selection is to make a single new working part in an animal, let alone a new creature.

article

wow. The makers of this article sure are stupid. They have just lost every ounce of credibility they ever had. They have just demonstrated that they lack even the most basic understanding of evolution. But lets just continue with the pwnage and slaughter by debunking the rest of the bull**** presented in this article. But anyway, about the hose, if you threw in natural selection, reproduction, and mutation, you know, if the house was alive, then you might end up with something.

Only mutations in the reproductive (germ) cells of an animal or plant would be passed on. Mutations in the eye or skin of an animal would not matter. Mutations in DNA happen fairly often, but most are repaired or destroyed by mechanisms in animals and plants. All known mutations in animal and plant germ cells are neutral, harmful, or fatal. article

That was a complete lie. Beneficial mutations (lactase anyone? Lactase is a chemical made by your digestive system to break down lactose, or milk sugars. 2/3 of the world is lactose intolerant) have been observed in mammals

But evolutionists are eternally optimistic. They believe that many beneficial mutations were passed on to every species that ever existed, since that is the only way evolutionists think different species are made.article

Well, speciation has been observed many times. I for one cannot forgive the makers of this article for their complete lack of even basic principles of evolution. If you deny evolution in the age of the Internet, ignorance is no longer an excuse

There are two versions of evolution. The first (neo-Darwinism) proposed that many tiny changes made new creatures. They could not find these tiny changes between one type of creature and another in the fossil record, so a few evolutionists proposed instead that change occurred by occasional leaps (punctuated equilibrium).article

This is supported by evidence. And transitional fossils (archaeoptryx anyone?) do exist

Each hypothetical beneficial mutation could only make a slight change. Any more than that would be so disruptive as to cause death. So punctuated equilibrium is not really one leap at a time. It envisions a lot of slight changes over thousands of years, then nothing happens for millions of years. article

This is due to a force called "natural selection". Natural selection stabilizes the population.

Evolutionists say with a straight face that no fossils have been found from a leap because thousands of years is too fast in the billions of years of "geologic time" to leave any. article

Fossilization is an EXTREMELY rare event, and not every square inch of the earth has been dug up.

On the other hand, without fossils there is no evidence that any leaps ever happened, and of course there is no evidence that leaps or gradual changes are happening today in any of the millions of species that still exist.article

Speciation has been observed.

Evolution is all about constant change, whether gradual or in leaps. Consider a cloud in the sky: it is constantly changing shape due to natural forces. It might look like, say, a rabbit now, and a few minutes later appear to be, say, a horse. In between, the whole mass is shifting about. In a few more minutes it may look like a bird. The problem for evolution is that we never see the shifting between shapes in the fossil record. All fossils are of complete animals and plants, not works in progress "under construction". article

Evolution is not some sort of retirement plan. Natural selection is blind, and thus does not predict "works in progress".

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notconspiracy

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#265 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts

why does it say whenver I try to post the rest "your HTML is not well-formed-no valid tags were found"

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The_Ish

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#266 The_Ish
Member since 2006 • 13913 Posts

It is pointless talking to you all. You all want for Evolution and Abiogenesis to be real, so you criticise others saying they are illogical and irrational. This doesnt make Evolution FACT nor does it make ABIOGENESIS FACT!

I am done with this.

You seem to all forget the basica meaning of science and i will post this link, I suggest you read which you wont.

http://www.newgeology.us/presentation32.html

I swear if another of you try to tell me evolution is fact.

123625

You're the one coming in here trying to disprove abiogenesis without reasonable explanation out of faith rather than out of reasonable doubt.

Also, you should know, that article is largely discredited. The writer does not use any real emperical evidence to back up his claims, and does not understand evolution.

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thehandsread730

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#267 thehandsread730
Member since 2004 • 415 Posts
There's no one concrete theory for how life originated. The explanation I like best is the primordial ocean theory, where chemicals from volcanic ejecta and extra-terresrial matter (asteroid bombardment) floated at the surface eventually formed simple amino and fatty acids which in turn, eventually formed single cellular life. It's not a completely airtight theory, but I'm sure that within the next few years, biologists will have a better handle on what may have been the kickstarter for life on Earth.
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Fireball2500

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#268 Fireball2500
Member since 2004 • 3421 Posts

Why were my posts completely ignored? Wait, this reminds me of a time, when someone was argueing with a user named meandmywii. He(the one argueing) said that Christians once said that science was made by the devil. I was completely shocked by this post, so I asked for evidence for this, and what did he did? He completely ignored what I said, saying nothing about it, and went on to argue with meandmywii, who tended to show more arrogance than logic. I will not point the finger at a particular person here to avoid a 20-page flame war, but I at least want to know some replies to my points, so I don't get the feeling that I'm being ignored so they can attack the weaker user. And I'm not saying this with a full head of steam, I'm saying this because I felt like this before, and I'm feeling it here.

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Fireball2500

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#269 Fireball2500
Member since 2004 • 3421 Posts
[QUOTE="123625"]

It is pointless talking to you all. You all want for Evolution and Abiogenesis to be real, so you criticise others saying they are illogical and irrational. This doesnt make Evolution FACT nor does it make ABIOGENESIS FACT!

I am done with this.

You seem to all forget the basica meaning of science and i will post this link, I suggest you read which you wont.

http://www.newgeology.us/presentation32.html

I swear if another of you try to tell me evolution is fact.

The_Ish

You're the one coming in here trying to disprove abiogenesis without reasonable explanation out of faith rather than out of reasonable doubt.

Also, you should know, that article is largely discredited. The writer does not use any real emperical evidence to back up his claims, and does not understand evolution.

Even though I don't agree with evolution and abiogenesis, 123625 seems to remind me of meandmywii, because he says things with complete arrogance, like saying, for example, "You don't understand me because you're too stupid."

Kind of like how meandmywii said we couldn't understand God's creation because we have peabrains, while I would have said that understanding it covers topics we may never fully understand.

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DeeJayInphinity

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#270 DeeJayInphinity
Member since 2004 • 13415 Posts

Why were my posts completely ignored? Wait, this reminds me of a time, when someone was argueing with a user named meandmywii. He(the one argueing) said that Christians once said that science was made by the devil. I was completely shocked by this post, so I asked for evidence for this, and what did he did? He completely ignored what I said, saying nothing about it, and went on to argue with meandmywii, who tended to show more arrogance than logic. I will not point the finger at a particular person here to avoid a 20-page flame war, but I at least want to know some replies to my points, so I don't get the feeling that I'm being ignored so they can attack the weaker user. And I'm not saying this with a full head of steam, I'm saying this because I felt like this before, and I'm feeling it here.

Fireball2500
Your posts start 3 pages back (I have 50 posts per page) so yeah it's kind of hard to see them when they are buried under dozens of other posts.
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#271 Fireball2500
Member since 2004 • 3421 Posts
[QUOTE="Fireball2500"]

Why were my posts completely ignored? Wait, this reminds me of a time, when someone was argueing with a user named meandmywii. He(the one argueing) said that Christians once said that science was made by the devil. I was completely shocked by this post, so I asked for evidence for this, and what did he did? He completely ignored what I said, saying nothing about it, and went on to argue with meandmywii, who tended to show more arrogance than logic. I will not point the finger at a particular person here to avoid a 20-page flame war, but I at least want to know some replies to my points, so I don't get the feeling that I'm being ignored so they can attack the weaker user. And I'm not saying this with a full head of steam, I'm saying this because I felt like this before, and I'm feeling it here.

DeeJayInphinity
Your posts start 3 pages back (I have 50 posts per page) so yeah it's kind of hard to see them when they are buried under dozens of other posts.

It felt like they were ignored before the dozens of posts were put on this topic though.
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#272 Fireball2500
Member since 2004 • 3421 Posts
Then again, I felt like many people agreed with what I said as I logged off, so if that's the case, I'll at least feel a little better about people here in OT.
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The_Ish

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#273 The_Ish
Member since 2006 • 13913 Posts

Then again, I felt like many people agreed with what I said as I logged off, so if that's the case, I'll at least feel a little better about people here in OT.Fireball2500

Pfft, whatever, newb. :P

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DeeJayInphinity

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#274 DeeJayInphinity
Member since 2004 • 13415 Posts
It felt like they were ignored before the dozens of posts were put on this topic though.Fireball2500
Not having people comment on every single post you make is normal here.
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Revinh

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#275 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts

abiogenesis - the right chemicals somehow came together and then somehow came to life

Whoever believes that, you might as well believe that a house gets built without a constructor. And a house isn't even anything compared to the complexity of even the simplest cell.

Even if a cell has been created just building it won't make it come to life. So how do you suppose to make it come to life and get it working?

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.

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#276 The_Ish
Member since 2006 • 13913 Posts

abiogenesis - the right chemicals somehow came together and then somehow came to life

Whoever believes that, you might as well believe that a house gets built without a constructor. And a house isn't even anything compared to the complexity of even the simplest cell.

Even if a cell has been created just building it won't make it come to life. So how do you suppose to make it come to life and get it working?

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.

Revinh

At this point, you are pretty much just spamming/trolling because you are still using the same arguments as from before, even though there are people who have shot down your arguments and analogies.

Whoever believes that, you might as well believe that a house gets built without a constructor. And a house isn't even anything compared to the complexity of even the simplest cell.

Even if a cell has been created just building it won't make it come to life. So how do you suppose to make it come to life and get it working?

Revinh

You might have had an argument - if the house could replicate itself somehow. It can't. Thats why your analogy fails.

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.

Revinh

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

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notconspiracy

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#277 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts

abiogenesis - the right chemicals somehow came together and then somehow came to life

Whoever believes that, you might as well believe that a house gets built without a constructor. And a house isn't even anything compared to the complexity of even the simplest cell.

Even if a cell has been created just building it won't make it come to life. So how do you suppose to make it come to life and get it working?

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.

Revinh

that is a violation of the philosophy of science

oh, and the first life may have evolved from protobionts

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Revinh

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#278 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts
[QUOTE="Revinh"]abiogenesis - the right chemicals somehow came together and then somehow came to lifeThe_Ish

At this point, you are pretty much just spamming/trolling because you are still using the same arguments as from before, even though there are people who have shot down your arguments and analogies.

Uh, no I don't remember it being shot down.

[QUOTE="Revinh"]

Whoever believes that, you might as well believe that a house gets built without a constructor. And a house isn't even anything compared to the complexity of even the simplest cell.

Even if a cell has been created just building it won't make it come to life. So how do you suppose to make it come to life and get it working?The_Ish

You might have had an argument - if the house could replicate itself somehow. It can't. Thats why your analogy fails.

How does it fail? Do nonliving things replicate?

[QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.The_Ish

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

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notconspiracy

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#279 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts

[QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.the_ish

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity
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Revinh

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#280 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts
[QUOTE="Revinh"]

abiogenesis - the right chemicals somehow came together and then somehow came to life

Whoever believes that, you might as well believe that a house gets built without a constructor. And a house isn't even anything compared to the complexity of even the simplest cell.

Even if a cell has been created just building it won't make it come to life. So how do you suppose to make it come to life and get it working?

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.

notconspiracy

that is a violation of the philosophy of science

oh, and the first life may have evolved from protobionts

EXPLAIN how it's violation of "the philosophy of science." Violation because it makes sense?

SolidSnake said it himself that it's either one or the other, so if life can only come preexisting life, then there must be a Life-Giver.

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Revinh

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#281 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts
[QUOTE="Revinh"]

[QUOTE="the_ish"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.notconspiracy

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity

1. Did you even understand what I meant? It wasn't even really an argument.

2. Do you even know what's "personal incredulity"? It doesn't make sense how you're using it.

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notconspiracy

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#282 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts
[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

abiogenesis - the right chemicals somehow came together and then somehow came to life

Whoever believes that, you might as well believe that a house gets built without a constructor. And a house isn't even anything compared to the complexity of even the simplest cell.

Even if a cell has been created just building it won't make it come to life. So how do you suppose to make it come to life and get it working?

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.

Revinh

that is a violation of the philosophy of science

oh, and the first life may have evolved from protobionts

EXPLAIN how it's violation of "the philosophy of science." Violation because it makes sense?

SolidSnake said it himself that it's either one or the other, so if life can only come preexisting life, then there must be a Life-Giver.

its a violation of the philosophy of science because science cannot comment on the supernatural.

and all you're saying is that "I cannot concieve of a natural cause, therefore God did it". that is not how science works

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notconspiracy

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#283 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts
[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

[QUOTE="the_ish"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.Revinh

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity

1. Did you even understand what I meant? It wasn't even really an argument.

2. Do you even know what's "personal incredulity"? It doesn't make how you're using it.

this is how it went: we gave you a hypothesis of how life originated. you respond by saying something along the lines of this: "that makes no sense, therefore god did it" no evidence, just your own assertions
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SolidSnake35

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#284 SolidSnake35
Member since 2005 • 58971 Posts
SolidSnake said it himself that it's either one or the other, so if life can only come preexisting life, then there must be a Life-Giver.Revinh
I've seen evidence showing how life can come from non life without a god. I don't believe you have the scientific knowledge to dismiss that theory, so please stop arguing as though you know the facts. Accept that none of us truly know the answer and we might actually get somewhere.
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Revinh

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#285 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts
[QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

abiogenesis - the right chemicals somehow came together and then somehow came to life

Whoever believes that, you might as well believe that a house gets built without a constructor. And a house isn't even anything compared to the complexity of even the simplest cell.

Even if a cell has been created just building it won't make it come to life. So how do you suppose to make it come to life and get it working?

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.

notconspiracy

that is a violation of the philosophy of science

oh, and the first life may have evolved from protobionts

EXPLAIN how it's violation of "the philosophy of science." Violation because it makes sense?

SolidSnake said it himself that it's either one or the other, so if life can only come preexisting life, then there must be a Life-Giver.

its a violation of the philosophy of science because science cannot comment on the supernatural.

and all you're saying is that "I cannot concieve of a natural cause, therefore God did it". that is not how science works

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Revinh

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#286 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts
[QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

[QUOTE="the_ish"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.notconspiracy

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity

1. Did you even understand what I meant? It wasn't even really an argument.

2. Do you even know what's "personal incredulity"? It doesn't make how you're using it.

this is how it went: we gave you a hypothesis of how life originated. you respond by saying something along the lines of this: "that makes no sense, therefore god did it" no evidence, just your own assertions

No, I said it couldn't have happened without a conscious Creator and a Life-Giver.

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#287 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts
[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

[QUOTE="the_ish"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.Revinh

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity

1. Did you even understand what I meant? It wasn't even really an argument.

2. Do you even know what's "personal incredulity"? It doesn't make how you're using it.

this is how it went: we gave you a hypothesis of how life originated. you respond by saying something along the lines of this: "that makes no sense, therefore god did it" no evidence, just your own assertions

No, I said it couldn't have happened without a conscious Creator and a Life-Giver.

might I ask, HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT?
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Revinh

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#288 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts

[QUOTE="Revinh"]SolidSnake said it himself that it's either one or the other, so if life can only come preexisting life, then there must be a Life-Giver.SolidSnake35
I've seen evidence showing how life can come from non life without a god. I don't believe you have the scientific knowledge to dismiss that theory, so please stop arguing as though you know the facts. Accept that none of us truly know the answer and we might actually get somewhere.

Let's say you can be able to create a human being. You've created cells, tissues, organs, the entire body. How do you suppose to make it come to life?

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SolidSnake35

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#290 SolidSnake35
Member since 2005 • 58971 Posts

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="Revinh"]SolidSnake said it himself that it's either one or the other, so if life can only come preexisting life, then there must be a Life-Giver.Revinh

I've seen evidence showing how life can come from non life without a god. I don't believe you have the scientific knowledge to dismiss that theory, so please stop arguing as though you know the facts. Accept that none of us truly know the answer and we might actually get somewhere.

Let's say you can be able to create a human being. You've created cells, tissues, organs, the entire body. How do you suppose to make it come to life?

That's not how these things work though. We gradually develop in the womb. After a certain amount of time, the brain begins to function. I suppose that's where life begins, depending on your view. I'm not sure what it is that makes me alive. A soul perhaps? I'm not sure. Just because we don't know doesn't mean we should accredit it to God though. Man has done that for centuries, but later we've found a more natural cause of things. People used to think God caused disease, for example... now we know better.
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#291 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts
[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

[QUOTE="the_ish"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.Revinh

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity

1. Did you even understand what I meant? It wasn't even really an argument.

2. Do you even know what's "personal incredulity"? It doesn't make how you're using it.

this is how it went: we gave you a hypothesis of how life originated. you respond by saying something along the lines of this: "that makes no sense, therefore god did it" no evidence, just your own assertions

No, I said it couldn't have happened without a conscious Creator and a Life-Giver.

might I ask, HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT?

BECAUSE A COMPLICATED HOUSE DOESN'T GET BUILT WITHOUT A CONSTRUCTOR, AND NEITHER WOULD A MUCH MORE COMPLEX CELL.

LIFE PRODUCE LIFE. NONLIFE PRODUCE NONLIFE.

why does a cell need to be constructed?
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SolidSnake35

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#292 SolidSnake35
Member since 2005 • 58971 Posts
[QUOTE="Revinh"]BECAUSE A COMPLICATED HOUSE DOESN'T GET BUILT WITHOUT A CONSTRUCTOR, AND NEITHER WOULD A MUCH MORE COMPLEX CELL. LIFE PRODUCE LIFE. NONLIFE PRODUCE NONLIFE.

And you've seen the videos posted that shows how certain cells form to make more complex structures? This you know to be false?
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Revinh

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#293 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts
[QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

[QUOTE="the_ish"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.notconspiracy

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity

1. Did you even understand what I meant? It wasn't even really an argument.

2. Do you even know what's "personal incredulity"? It doesn't make how you're using it.

this is how it went: we gave you a hypothesis of how life originated. you respond by saying something along the lines of this: "that makes no sense, therefore god did it" no evidence, just your own assertions

No, I said it couldn't have happened without a conscious Creator and a Life-Giver.

might I ask, HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT?

BECAUSE A COMPLICATED HOUSE DOESN'T GET BUILT WITHOUT A CONSTRUCTOR, AND NEITHER WOULD A MUCH MORE COMPLEX CELL.

LIFE PRODUCE LIFE. NONLIFE PRODUCE NONLIFE.

why does a cell need to be constructed?

Do you expect it to just pop out of nowhere?

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Red-XIII

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#294 Red-XIII
Member since 2003 • 2739 Posts

BUT ITS NOT FACT! We have never seen non living material give life. Nor can we replicate and test how it happened millions of years ago, because we don't know how it happened. It doesnt make Abiogenesis fact! get it?123625

Yes we have seen inanimate material form very basic cells. It has been replicated and tested that is how they know that this hypothesis has truth behind it.

Abiogenesis is about chemistry. Chemicals will naturally bond to certain types of other chemicals and accumulate. Since chemistry is bound by specific laws, the manner in which these chemical chains form is constant and predictable. It has been tested and shown that when organic chemicals compound, they naturally form cell-like formations. Here is a very basic explanation http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozbFerzjkz4
Take note, this video also dismisses the 'houses require a builder so life requires a creator'. When he says 'better adapted molecules survive' he means that certain molecules didn't break down in the environment whilst others did.

Likewise, evolution has been observed in fast producing, short lived organisms like flies and bacteria. Bacteria constantly mutate and develop immunities to vaccines, so scientists rely on this to keep one step ahead.

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Revinh

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#295 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts

[QUOTE="Revinh"]BECAUSE A COMPLICATED HOUSE DOESN'T GET BUILT WITHOUT A CONSTRUCTOR, AND NEITHER WOULD A MUCH MORE COMPLEX CELL. LIFE PRODUCE LIFE. NONLIFE PRODUCE NONLIFE.SolidSnake35
And you've seen the videos posted that shows how certain cells form to make more complex structures? This you know to be false?

If a cell could've been formed without a conscious Designer, it must be VERY easy for that to be done artificially, yet no one has been able to bring nonliving things to life.

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deactivated-5901ac91d8e33

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#296 deactivated-5901ac91d8e33
Member since 2004 • 17092 Posts
[QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

[QUOTE="the_ish"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.Revinh

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity

1. Did you even understand what I meant? It wasn't even really an argument.

2. Do you even know what's "personal incredulity"? It doesn't make how you're using it.

this is how it went: we gave you a hypothesis of how life originated. you respond by saying something along the lines of this: "that makes no sense, therefore god did it" no evidence, just your own assertions

No, I said it couldn't have happened without a conscious Creator and a Life-Giver.

might I ask, HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT?

BECAUSE A COMPLICATED HOUSE DOESN'T GET BUILT WITHOUT A CONSTRUCTOR, AND NEITHER WOULD A MUCH MORE COMPLEX CELL.

LIFE PRODUCE LIFE. NONLIFE PRODUCE NONLIFE.

why does a cell need to be constructed?

Do you expect it to just pop out of nowhere?

I suggest you watch this, since you obviously don't know what you're talking about. It kind of gives you an idea of what scientists believe.

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xxDustmanxx

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#297 xxDustmanxx
Member since 2007 • 2598 Posts
[QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

[QUOTE="the_ish"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.jointed

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity

1. Did you even understand what I meant? It wasn't even really an argument.

2. Do you even know what's "personal incredulity"? It doesn't make how you're using it.

this is how it went: we gave you a hypothesis of how life originated. you respond by saying something along the lines of this: "that makes no sense, therefore god did it" no evidence, just your own assertions

No, I said it couldn't have happened without a conscious Creator and a Life-Giver.

might I ask, HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT?

BECAUSE A COMPLICATED HOUSE DOESN'T GET BUILT WITHOUT A CONSTRUCTOR, AND NEITHER WOULD A MUCH MORE COMPLEX CELL.

LIFE PRODUCE LIFE. NONLIFE PRODUCE NONLIFE.

why does a cell need to be constructed?

Do you expect it to just pop out of nowhere?

I suggest you watch this, since you obviously don't know what you're talking about. It kind of gives you an idea of what scientists believe.

Excelent videos.I tried posting it for 123625 but he refused to watch it and ignored the video completely.They wont watch,as i said before,they're delusional.

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Red-XIII

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#298 Red-XIII
Member since 2003 • 2739 Posts

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="Revinh"]BECAUSE A COMPLICATED HOUSE DOESN'T GET BUILT WITHOUT A CONSTRUCTOR, AND NEITHER WOULD A MUCH MORE COMPLEX CELL. LIFE PRODUCE LIFE. NONLIFE PRODUCE NONLIFE.Revinh

And you've seen the videos posted that shows how certain cells form to make more complex structures? This you know to be false?

If a cell could've been formed without a conscious Designer, it must be VERY easy for that to be done artificially, yet no one has been able to bring nonliving things to life.

Scientists have formed the basic building blocks of life in the lab. If you watch the video above that I posted, it explains how naturally occuring elements form chemicals which compound to form the basics of cells.

Scientists have also tried to replicate the conditions in which life formed on primordial earth and adenine (a base of DNA) naturally formed in this mixture.

Also, Revinh, you are completely ignoring the fact that for life to have formed in such a manner it took a few billion years. So while scientists can create the basic building blocks of life, it's going to be extremely difficult for them to produce a living, breathing organism in a matter of weeks, months, or even years. If you want to argue these scientific theories, then you have to consider every factor that the scientists do. Keep that in mind.

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#299 deactivated-5901ac91d8e33
Member since 2004 • 17092 Posts
[QUOTE="jointed"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"][QUOTE="notconspiracy"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

[QUOTE="the_ish"][QUOTE="Revinh"]

"And Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul." -Genesis 2:7

Obviously, creation makes sense, the former is impossible and illogical.xxDustmanxx

The Bible is not a viable evidence for creation - or pretty much anything scientific.

I wasn't using the book as an evidence. I just brought up the Genesis account and how it makes sense.

that was an argument from personal incredulity

1. Did you even understand what I meant? It wasn't even really an argument.

2. Do you even know what's "personal incredulity"? It doesn't make how you're using it.

this is how it went: we gave you a hypothesis of how life originated. you respond by saying something along the lines of this: "that makes no sense, therefore god did it" no evidence, just your own assertions

No, I said it couldn't have happened without a conscious Creator and a Life-Giver.

might I ask, HOW DO YOU KNOW THAT?

BECAUSE A COMPLICATED HOUSE DOESN'T GET BUILT WITHOUT A CONSTRUCTOR, AND NEITHER WOULD A MUCH MORE COMPLEX CELL.

LIFE PRODUCE LIFE. NONLIFE PRODUCE NONLIFE.

why does a cell need to be constructed?

Do you expect it to just pop out of nowhere?

I suggest you watch this, since you obviously don't know what you're talking about. It kind of gives you an idea of what scientists believe.

Excelent videos.I tried posting it for 123625 but he refused to watch it and ignored the video completely.They wont watch,as i said before,they're delusional.

Yeah, this is unfortunately a common tendency amongst Christians and creationists...

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#300 Revinh
Member since 2005 • 1957 Posts

No, you are, if you think nonliving things can come to life even if essential elements has come together.

I've seen the video before.