What makes a "good person?"
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Someone who tries their best not to harm other people for personal gain.
You sound like a victim of domestic abuse trying to defend her **** of a husbandtoast_burnerIf this is how I sound, it is not the intention. My intention is to say that I have been an unfaithful "wife" but my "husband" has forgiven me. Should he "divorce" me? Yes, but he would rather we reconcile because of his great love.
[QUOTE="toast_burner"]You sound like a victim of domestic abuse trying to defend her **** of a husbandmindstormIf this is how I sound, it is not the intention. My intention is to say that I have been an unfaithful "wife" but my "husband" has forgiven me. Should he "divorce" me? Yes, but he would rather we reconcile because of his great love.You were asked what good has he done for you and "he hasn't killed me" was your response. That is f***ed up
If this is how I sound, it is not the intention. My intention is to say that I have been an unfaithful "wife" but my "husband" has forgiven me. Should he "divorce" me? Yes, but he would rather we reconcile because of his great love.You were asked what good has he done for you and "he hasn't killed me" was your response. That is f***ed up lol, right.[QUOTE="mindstorm"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]You sound like a victim of domestic abuse trying to defend her **** of a husbandtoast_burner
If this is how I sound, it is not the intention. My intention is to say that I have been an unfaithful "wife" but my "husband" has forgiven me. Should he "divorce" me? Yes, but he would rather we reconcile because of his great love.You were asked what good has he done for you and "he hasn't killed me" was your response. That is f***ed up Don't forget the "and made me his son" part. I may not have done a great job at expressing it but the joy I receive in calling him my Abba, my Father, is incredible. I will, however, agree that I do have the tendency to focus on that part a little too much when I speak of these things. I need to learn how to vocalize other aspects better.[QUOTE="mindstorm"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]You sound like a victim of domestic abuse trying to defend her **** of a husbandtoast_burner
[QUOTE="toast_burner"]You were asked what good has he done for you and "he hasn't killed me" was your response. That is f***ed up Don't forget the "and made me his son" part. I may not have done a great job at expressing it but the joy I receive in calling him my Abba, my Father, is incredible. I will, however, agree that I do have the tendency to focus on that part a little too much when I speak of these things. I need to learn how to vocalize other aspects better.[QUOTE="mindstorm"] If this is how I sound, it is not the intention. My intention is to say that I have been an unfaithful "wife" but my "husband" has forgiven me. Should he "divorce" me? Yes, but he would rather we reconcile because of his great love.mindstorm
That's still not explaining what he's done for you.
Don't forget the "and made me his son" part. I may not have done a great job at expressing it but the joy I receive in calling him my Abba, my Father, is incredible. I will, however, agree that I do have the tendency to focus on that part a little too much when I speak of these things. I need to learn how to vocalize other aspects better.[QUOTE="mindstorm"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]You were asked what good has he done for you and "he hasn't killed me" was your response. That is f***ed up
toast_burner
That's still not explaining what he's done for you.
He has saved me. This is the simple reality of it. None who do not realize their peril will ever understand how absolutely fantastic this statement truly is. If we do not realize that we need to be saved from something then we can never even begin to comprehend what it means to be saved from the wrath we have established upon ourselves.[QUOTE="toast_burner"][QUOTE="mindstorm"] Don't forget the "and made me his son" part. I may not have done a great job at expressing it but the joy I receive in calling him my Abba, my Father, is incredible. I will, however, agree that I do have the tendency to focus on that part a little too much when I speak of these things. I need to learn how to vocalize other aspects better.mindstorm
That's still not explaining what he's done for you.
He has saved me. This is the simple reality of it. None who do not realize their peril will ever understand how absolutely fantastic this statement truly is. If we do not realize that we need to be saved from something then we can never even begin to comprehend what it means to be saved from the wrath we have established upon ourselves.And what exactly happens if I'm not "saved"?
What makes a "good" or "bad" person in your book?
hartsickdiscipl
It may seem trivial but besides major things like not being greedy and being able to admit they're wrong, I think a quick way to gauge whether someone will make my good or not so good book is whether they litter.
If you're going to treat your surroundings like your own personal garbage can, you're probably a douche.
He has saved me. This is the simple reality of it. None who do not realize their peril will ever understand how absolutely fantastic this statement truly is. If we do not realize that we need to be saved from something then we can never even begin to comprehend what it means to be saved from the wrath we have established upon ourselves.And what exactly happens if I'm not "saved"? Then we condemn ourselves by our own actions. When we do not seek after God he allows us to seek after our own devices which ultimately destroy us in this life. This means we commit horrible atrocities against one another and against ourselves. This also means we in our selfish pride continue into eternity never acknowledging the goodness of God as we fall farther and farther away from his goodness. Within hell much of the wrath we receive is the wrath we establish upon ourselves.[QUOTE="mindstorm"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]
That's still not explaining what he's done for you.
toast_burner
[QUOTE="toast_burner"]And what exactly happens if I'm not "saved"? Then we condemn ourselves by our own actions. When we do not seek after God he allows us to seek after our own devices which ultimately destroy us in this life. This means we commit horrible atrocities against one another and against ourselves. This also means we in our selfish pride continue into eternity never acknowledging the goodness of God as we fall farther and farther away from his goodness. Within hell much of the wrath we receive is the wrath we establish upon ourselves.[QUOTE="mindstorm"] He has saved me. This is the simple reality of it. None who do not realize their peril will ever understand how absolutely fantastic this statement truly is. If we do not realize that we need to be saved from something then we can never even begin to comprehend what it means to be saved from the wrath we have established upon ourselves.mindstorm
How exactly are we destroying ourselves by not listening to/believing in god?
It's god that sends you to hell, so again he's only saving you from a danger he put you in (i.e he isn't saving you)
Then we condemn ourselves by our own actions. When we do not seek after God he allows us to seek after our own devices which ultimately destroy us in this life. This means we commit horrible atrocities against one another and against ourselves. This also means we in our selfish pride continue into eternity never acknowledging the goodness of God as we fall farther and farther away from his goodness. Within hell much of the wrath we receive is the wrath we establish upon ourselves.[QUOTE="mindstorm"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]And what exactly happens if I'm not "saved"?
toast_burner
How exactly are we destroying ourselves by not listening to/believing in god?
It's god that sends you to hell, so again he's only saving you from a danger he put you in (i.e he isn't saving you)
There is almost a sense in which I am not sure God even has to throw us in hell himself as many seem so willing to jump themselves. Just go to a topic on these forums that resemble the question "Where would you rather go, heaven or hell?" But to get to the point of the question, I am saying that when we do wrong there is a punishment we enforce upon ourselves. This punishment does not necessarily have to be from God but is something we establish upon ourselves. I am speaking of an idea hinted at in Romans 1, that when we do not seek after God and the things of God, God turns us over to our passions, allowing us to further fall into all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice, envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. When we do these things we bring harm to our own selves. The farther we fall from goodness, the father we can acknowledge what truly is good. As such, what could conceivably be the greatest punishment is not even being able to comprehend what goodness even is.[QUOTE="toast_burner"][QUOTE="mindstorm"] Then we condemn ourselves by our own actions. When we do not seek after God he allows us to seek after our own devices which ultimately destroy us in this life. This means we commit horrible atrocities against one another and against ourselves. This also means we in our selfish pride continue into eternity never acknowledging the goodness of God as we fall farther and farther away from his goodness. Within hell much of the wrath we receive is the wrath we establish upon ourselves.mindstorm
How exactly are we destroying ourselves by not listening to/believing in god?
It's god that sends you to hell, so again he's only saving you from a danger he put you in (i.e he isn't saving you)
There is almost a sense in which I am not sure God even has to throw us in hell himself as many seem so willing to jump themselves. Just go to a topic on these forums that resemble the question "Where would you rather go, heaven or hell?" But to get to the point of the question, I am saying that when we do wrong there is a punishment we enforce upon ourselves. This punishment does not necessarily have to be from God but is something we establish upon ourselves. I am speaking of an idea hinted at in Romans 1, that when we do not seek after God and the things of God, God turns us over to our passions, allowing us to further fall into all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice, envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. When we do these things we bring harm to our own selves. The farther we fall from goodness, the father we can acknowledge what truly is good. As such, what could conceivably be the greatest punishment is not even being able to comprehend what goodness even is.Right, but i'm not a murderer and I don't believe in god. What position does that leave me in?
There is almost a sense in which I am not sure God even has to throw us in hell himself as many seem so willing to jump themselves. Just go to a topic on these forums that resemble the question "Where would you rather go, heaven or hell?" But to get to the point of the question, I am saying that when we do wrong there is a punishment we enforce upon ourselves. This punishment does not necessarily have to be from God but is something we establish upon ourselves. I am speaking of an idea hinted at in Romans 1, that when we do not seek after God and the things of God, God turns us over to our passions, allowing us to further fall into all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice, envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. When we do these things we bring harm to our own selves. The farther we fall from goodness, the father we can acknowledge what truly is good. As such, what could conceivably be the greatest punishment is not even being able to comprehend what goodness even is.[QUOTE="mindstorm"][QUOTE="toast_burner"]
How exactly are we destroying ourselves by not listening to/believing in god?
It's god that sends you to hell, so again he's only saving you from a danger he put you in (i.e he isn't saving you)
toast_burner
Right, but i'm not a murderer and I don't believe in god. What position does that leave me in?
There is a sense in which I cannot answer the question without knowing you better. That is, I'd ask you what your passions might be. I'm not talking about what your hobbies are but what is it that truly motivates you and gives you passion to keep going. If these passions are not immoral in the sense of being guided by pride or another vain notion, then I'd warn you to be careful not to fall into such passions. There is very much a sense in which our passions will be for God or for self. As such, even if you are an extremely moral and upright individual according to social norms, I'd say to be careful about where your passions and motivations might be. If they are not for God and the things of God, be careful that you do not fall. That stated, the position I'd say that you are in at the very least would be on very unstable ground. You might be okay in a sense but be careful that you do not allow selfish conceit to take over. Personally, I think having Jesus Christ as the foundation for our passions and desires to be a much stronger place to stand.There is a sense in which I cannot answer the question without knowing you better. That is, I'd ask you what your passions might be. I'm not talking about what your hobbies are but what is it that truly motivates you and gives you passion to keep going. If these passions are not immoral in the sense of being guided by pride or another vain notion, then I'd warn you to be careful not to fall into such passions. There is very much a sense in which our passions will be for God or for self. As such, even if you are an extremely moral and upright individual according to social norms, I'd say to be careful about where your passions and motivations might be. If they are not for God and the things of God, be careful that you do not fall. That stated, the position I'd say that you are in at the very least would be on very unstable ground. You might be okay in a sense but be careful that you do not allow selfish conceit to take over. Personally, I think having Jesus Christ as the foundation for our passions and desires to be a much stronger place to stand.mindstorm
Why do you need Jesus?
Jesus was alive many years ago, the teachings he gave then may not stand up today. His words have also been lost and changed, his "moral" lessons are put together in a book full of some of the most heinous things in literature which makes it hard to understand what good and bad even are. How does religion help at all to make somebody a better person?
[QUOTE="mindstorm"]There is a sense in which I cannot answer the question without knowing you better. That is, I'd ask you what your passions might be. I'm not talking about what your hobbies are but what is it that truly motivates you and gives you passion to keep going. If these passions are not immoral in the sense of being guided by pride or another vain notion, then I'd warn you to be careful not to fall into such passions. There is very much a sense in which our passions will be for God or for self. As such, even if you are an extremely moral and upright individual according to social norms, I'd say to be careful about where your passions and motivations might be. If they are not for God and the things of God, be careful that you do not fall. That stated, the position I'd say that you are in at the very least would be on very unstable ground. You might be okay in a sense but be careful that you do not allow selfish conceit to take over. Personally, I think having Jesus Christ as the foundation for our passions and desires to be a much stronger place to stand.toast_burner
Why do you need Jesus?
Jesus was alive many years ago, the teachings he gave then may not stand up today. His words have also been lost and changed, his "moral" lessons are put together in a book full of some of the most heinous things in literature which makes it hard to understand what good and bad even are. How does religion help at all to make somebody a better person?
I would not say so much that Christianity is designed to make a person better but that it is designed to bring people into a right relationship with God. That is, it presupposes that we are not perfect and guides us to the one who is perfect. Certainly this does mean we better understand what is right and wrong but that is not so much the goal as the side effect. Why do I need Jesus? Because only through him can I be made into right relationship with God the Father. I have turned from God by my own effort and power and by his grace I can be brought back. Certainly there are other reasons why I need Jesus as he is the one through whom the creation itself holds together. Because of this and other reasons, Jesus is absolutely essential for me to not only be able to commune with God but he is essential for me to have breath itself.I would not say so much that Christianity is designed to make a person better but that it is designed to bring people into a right relationship with God. That is, it presupposes that we are not perfect and guides us to the one who is perfect. Certainly this does mean we better understand what is right and wrong but that is not so much the goal as the side effect. Why do I need Jesus? Because only through him can I be made into right relationship with God the Father. I have turned from God by my own effort and power and by his grace I can be brought back. Certainly there are other reasons why I need Jesus as he is the one through whom the creation itself holds together. Because of this and other reasons, Jesus is absolutely essential for me to not only be able to commune with God but he is essential for me to have breath itself.mindstorm
So religion doesn't make you a better person and hell is caused by your own faluts, then why do I or any one else need religion? What purpose does this relationship with a guy I've never met have?
[QUOTE="mindstorm"]I would not say so much that Christianity is designed to make a person better but that it is designed to bring people into a right relationship with God. That is, it presupposes that we are not perfect and guides us to the one who is perfect. Certainly this does mean we better understand what is right and wrong but that is not so much the goal as the side effect. Why do I need Jesus? Because only through him can I be made into right relationship with God the Father. I have turned from God by my own effort and power and by his grace I can be brought back. Certainly there are other reasons why I need Jesus as he is the one through whom the creation itself holds together. Because of this and other reasons, Jesus is absolutely essential for me to not only be able to commune with God but he is essential for me to have breath itself.toast_burner
So religion doesn't make you a better person and hell is caused by your own faluts, then why do I or any one else need religion? What purpose does this relationship with a guy I've never met have?
Seems like mindstorm got this handled, but I will add my answer. None on this earth is good, not one. We are all born in sin and despise God since the fall. We all deserve punishment for the enmity against a perfect holy and just God. If God wanted o destroy everyone on the earth to Hell he would be perfectly just to do so. I know many people dont like hearing that, God is love but that does not negate the fact that he is just. The only thing that will make us "good" in God's eyes is to be justified by the blood of Jesus Christ. Hear the gospel and believe in Jesus. He came to this earth to save us from death, he took the punishment that we all sinners justly deserve and took it upon himself, that is just crazy.[QUOTE="mindstorm"]I would not say so much that Christianity is designed to make a person better but that it is designed to bring people into a right relationship with God. That is, it presupposes that we are not perfect and guides us to the one who is perfect. Certainly this does mean we better understand what is right and wrong but that is not so much the goal as the side effect. Why do I need Jesus? Because only through him can I be made into right relationship with God the Father. I have turned from God by my own effort and power and by his grace I can be brought back. Certainly there are other reasons why I need Jesus as he is the one through whom the creation itself holds together. Because of this and other reasons, Jesus is absolutely essential for me to not only be able to commune with God but he is essential for me to have breath itself.toast_burner
So religion doesn't make you a better person and hell is caused by your own faluts, then why do I or any one else need religion? What purpose does this relationship with a guy I've never met have?
The last part of your last question is your answer - you have never met him. Without having never comprehended his goodness, his holiness, and his majesty then none of this makes any sense. If one has never been a witness to his glory then he can never comprehend how far he has fallen. If we do not understand God's goodness, we cannot understand our depravity. Before we can ever acknowledge our broken relationship with God we must acknowledge who God is to begin with. I am reminded of Isaiah 6. Within this passage Isaiah sees the very throne of God - and Jesus himself according to John 12:41. The passage speaks of his great majesty and how the angels declared of his holiness and grandeur. Only after seeing who God is was Isaiah able understand who he is. He responds, "Woe is me! For I am lost; for I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips; for my eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts!" Only after this was Isaiah able to have his guilt taken away and his sin atoned for. I am inclined to believe that the ordering here is intentional.[QUOTE="toast_burner"][QUOTE="mindstorm"]I would not say so much that Christianity is designed to make a person better but that it is designed to bring people into a right relationship with God. That is, it presupposes that we are not perfect and guides us to the one who is perfect. Certainly this does mean we better understand what is right and wrong but that is not so much the goal as the side effect. Why do I need Jesus? Because only through him can I be made into right relationship with God the Father. I have turned from God by my own effort and power and by his grace I can be brought back. Certainly there are other reasons why I need Jesus as he is the one through whom the creation itself holds together. Because of this and other reasons, Jesus is absolutely essential for me to not only be able to commune with God but he is essential for me to have breath itself.GameGuy642003
So religion doesn't make you a better person and hell is caused by your own faluts, then why do I or any one else need religion? What purpose does this relationship with a guy I've never met have?
Seems like mindstorm got this handled, but I will add my answer. None on this earth is good, not one. We are all born in sin and despise God since the fall. We all deserve punishment for the enmity against a perfect holy and just God. If God wanted o destroy everyone on the earth to Hell he would be perfectly just to do so. I know many people dont like hearing that, God is love but that does not negate the fact that he is just. The only thing that will make us "good" in God's eyes is to be justified by the blood of Jesus Christ. Hear the gospel and believe in Jesus. He came to this earth to save us from death, he took the punishment that we all sinners justly deserve and took it upon himself, that is just crazy.You're saying what we should do but not why we should do it.
Why should I follow Jesus? Because some old book told me to. The same book that calls for the death of millions of people. A book that is full of inaccuracies, contradictions and stuff that just doesn't make any sense what so ever.
Surely an intelligent being like god would understand that it is more than logical to not follow the joke that is the bible and with my greatly inferior intelligence to his own it is rather understandable.
You're saying what we should do but not why we should do it.While it seems the answer most here would seem to expect me to say is that we ought to follow Jesus because we will receive wrath if not. I agree that this is a reason but should not be the primary reason. I am inclined to believe that we should even worship Jesus even if we did receive his wrath. Why is that? He is worthy of the worship. We ought to worship Jesus not merely to turn us from hell but to turn us toward his goodness. We should follow Jesus because he is worthy of following. Through him every good thing that exists exists because of him. He is the author over every good and perfect gift.Why should I follow Jesus? Because some old book told me to. The same book that calls for the death of millions of people. A book that is full of inaccuracies, contradictions and stuff that just doesn't make any sense what so ever.
Surely an intelligent being like god would understand that it is more than logical to not follow the joke that is the bible and with my greatly inferior intelligence to his own it is rather understandable.
toast_burner
no one is a good person,except jesus, everyone has sinned therefore we are all bad people
Good: Doesn't talk behind someone's back, if they have feelings toward someone, negative or positive, they shouldn't be voicing those feelings to others.
Open-mindedness, my favourite line "All rap music is about hoes, cars, money, and killing" I hear morons say that all the time, and if I ever hear a woman say something like that, I'am immediately no longer attracted to that woman. All music has good artists, and good songs. If you don't like it, its not because the music is poor, its because your taste in music is poor.
People who are honest with themselves.
People with self control.
People who take action, and don't sit around talking about what they are going to do.
Bad: People who think they are more intelligent than others, when they are most certainly not.
People who believe education = intelligence.
People who believe they are most attractive thing that is currently walking the earth.
People who constantly beat themselves up.
People who blame other people/things for their problems. In another thread I read some guy say he doesn't have a girlfriend because he is fat and poor. Many women are fat and poor, it has nothing to do with that guy having a girlfriend or not.
Women who pretend like they don't like sex.
People who are stupid
People who are afraid to be honest.
There are two types of realities in this world, Fear, and Love. I think a bad person is someone who lets fear become their reality.
Anyone who believes in any religion.
People who think they can just tell people what to do.
People with ego's.
People who believe and accept the world around them.
People who conform.
People who believe a relationship can be defined, and have rules. "We have to say I love you to eachother because we've been dating for ---" "you've been dating for 5 years now, why hasn't he asked you to marry him"
People who vote in elections.
People who believe government works.
People who don't do their research, on top of that, people who talk about things they know absolutely nothing about.
People who believe they are a nice person (they don't exist).
Women who pretend like they aren't a whore when they ask every guy at a party if they can suck them off, or get banged.
People who believe racism only applies to certain races, genders, and sexual preferences.
People who think marijuana is worse for you than caffeine.
People who are against legalization of marijuana (if you know anything about marijuana, you want to legalized, no stoner on earth loves smoking it, but doesn't want it legalized, don't bother try and troll me, I'll make you look like a moron)
People who completely change themselves to be more like me.
People who are obsessed with me.
People who assumes anyonewho smokes weed, doesn't smoke it medicinally.
It doesn't make someone a bad person, but I can't stand women who have a stinky vag (intentionally misspelled that to dodge the censor) Like what are you afraid to touch your own vag? SOAP AND WATER PLEASE THANK YOU.
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