What's wrong with Sharia?

Considering that the majority of posters here are from Western society, is it really THAT hard to see why so many conservative Muslims actually support Sharia, especially women? Look at what they have to compare their culture to, OURS. What they see when looking at the Western world in a generalized view is the completely opposite, half naked women and a obssesion with sex and lust.

Personally I do not support Sharia and Islamic practices, but then again I do not support the rather liberal feminine practices of Western culture either. There is no cultural medium and I think that is more of the cross culture issue.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] I agree to an extent, however the fact is that the Middle Eastern culture and mindset IS different. I cannot blame many Middle Eastern individuals for wanting to come to Europe and the U.S., so I cannot support the xenophobic neo templars in Europe and the US. That being said, the "this is my culture so deal with it" attitude of immigrating Muslims is also a big issue with me, as multiculturism and non assimilation has pretty been proven around the globe to fail horribly. It is a sticky situation and definitely and interesting argument, but I still stand by my "cultural medium" solution, because as it stands, the issue is pretty much making no progess and even becoming volatile if you look at France.chandlerr_360

You have to understand though the m.o. of Islamic extremists is to blend in and act like a "normal" Muslim until the time comes to strike. There are an estimated 1.3 billion Muslims in the world and an estimated 1-10% are radicalized. Even at 1% that is a ton of people who want to kill "infidels." So you have no clue who they are, they could be your neighbor who brings you a welcome basket. It is real sir and a fact. After 9/11, the deadly attacks throughout Europe, and the thwarted attempts, can you blame anyone for being that way? Terrorism is what it is, and it is working as intended. Blame the people who would murder every living infidel on Earth in one blow if they could, don't blame their would be victims.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] I agree to an extent, however the fact is that the Middle Eastern culture and mindset IS different. I cannot blame many Middle Eastern individuals for wanting to come to Europe and the U.S., so I cannot support the xenophobic neo templars in Europe and the US. That being said, the "this is my culture so deal with it" attitude of immigrating Muslims is also a big issue with me, as multiculturism and non assimilation has pretty been proven around the globe to fail horribly. It is a sticky situation and definitely and interesting argument, but I still stand by my "cultural medium" solution, because as it stands, the issue is pretty much making no progess and even becoming volatile if you look at France.chandlerr_360

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"][QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] why do people lump the states in with europe as far as being xenophobic?

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] Because there is a rather large minority of Americans xenophobic towards Muslims and Middle Eastern individuals, as there is in Europe as well.chandlerr_360

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"][QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] maybe i am a bit bias and out of touch with the "common american" whatever that is, but i dont see the hate in my life.

surrealnumber5

Don't confuse them. If you are not liberal you are, of course, a member of the KKK or at least wish you could be. The issue is simple, if I express my concerns about radical Islam I am automatically labeled a bigot and thrown into the tea-party. Liberals do not allow such bigotry and to fear the fact that members of a certain group killed 3000 Americans within a few hours, and would love nothing more than to triple it the next time. How dare you! And how dare you state the fact they were 19 arab men that practiced a radical form of Islam! You bigot! This is considered "Islamiphobic" to many on the far left.

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"][QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] maybe i am a bit bias and out of touch with the "common american" whatever that is, but i dont see the hate in my life.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] Sorry but you are out of touch. May I reccomend Yahoo! news comments, Liveleak.com, any conservative Southern community, or a short google search on "American Islamophobia".chandlerr_360

You have to understand though the m.o. of Islamic extremists is to blend in and act like a "normal" Muslim until the time comes to strike. There are an estimated 1.3 billion Muslims in the world and an estimated 1-10% are radicalized. Even at 1% that is a ton of people who want to kill "infidels." So you have no clue who they are, they could be your neighbor who brings you a welcome basket. It is real sir and a fact. After 9/11, the deadly attacks throughout Europe, and the thwarted attempts, can you blame anyone for being that way? Terrorism is what it is, and it is working as intended. Blame the people who would murder every living infidel on Earth in one blow if they could, don't blame their would be victims.

vfibsux

Do you write for the Daily Mail?

[QUOTE="mayceV"][QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] in the states the state tries its damnedest to keep church out of state schools.... it does not matter how important the islamic faith is to you it should not be taught in the schools. neither should any other faith including christian and atheistic beliefs

surrealnumber5

EDIT: also don't say that it punishes people that insult Islam because it punishes people that insult any religion.

[QUOTE="vfibsux"]

You have to understand though the m.o. of Islamic extremists is to blend in and act like a "normal" Muslim until the time comes to strike. There are an estimated 1.3 billion Muslims in the world and an estimated 1-10% are radicalized. Even at 1% that is a ton of people who want to kill "infidels." So you have no clue who they are, they could be your neighbor who brings you a welcome basket. It is real sir and a fact. After 9/11, the deadly attacks throughout Europe, and the thwarted attempts, can you blame anyone for being that way? Terrorism is what it is, and it is working as intended. Blame the people who would murder every living infidel on Earth in one blow if they could, don't blame their would be victims.

tenaka2

Do you write for the Daily Mail?

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] Sorry but you are out of touch. May I reccomend Yahoo! news comments, Liveleak.com, any conservative Southern community, or a short google search on "American Islamophobia".chandlerr_360

[QUOTE="tenaka2"]

[QUOTE="vfibsux"]

You have to understand though the m.o. of Islamic extremists is to blend in and act like a "normal" Muslim until the time comes to strike. There are an estimated 1.3 billion Muslims in the world and an estimated 1-10% are radicalized. Even at 1% that is a ton of people who want to kill "infidels." So you have no clue who they are, they could be your neighbor who brings you a welcome basket. It is real sir and a fact. After 9/11, the deadly attacks throughout Europe, and the thwarted attempts, can you blame anyone for being that way? Terrorism is what it is, and it is working as intended. Blame the people who would murder every living infidel on Earth in one blow if they could, don't blame their would be victims.

vfibsux

Do you write for the Daily Mail?

your posts read as typical fear mongering, the percentage estimate is a joke and you also don't point out the locations of these extremists the majority of which would be in countries currently at war with and hardly likely to be your 'neighbor'.

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"][QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] i dont look for problems, if you look hard enough you will find people angry at wet water, that does not prove your point. if this hate is not overt in daily life it is not a problem, and as my extended family is compiled of "brown people" i think i'd have caught wind of it by now.

surrealnumber5

Look man, all I am trying to say is that xenophobia does exist in America (which it does, I know this from personal as well as inpersonal experience) because for some reason you questioned that it did. You are trying to make the argument that just because it does not affect you (or your 'extended family'), means that it does not matter, which is a pointless argument. Your whole argument is rather juvenile and illogical to be blunt.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] Xenophobes cannot express their xenophobia in public because of political correctness most of the time, but it does not mean it is not there. Like I pointed out, the internet is filled with anonymous bigotry and most of it is directed towards "them", not so much American Muslims/Arabs. But yeah...I am in no way saying that all of America is xenophobic at all, just pointing out rather large minorities do exist.chandlerr_360

Look man, all I am trying to say is that xenophobia does exist in America (which it does, I know this from personal as well as inpersonal experience) because for some reason you questioned that it did. You are trying to make the argument that just because it does not affect you (or your 'extended family'), means that it does not matter, which is a pointless argument. Your whole argument is rather juvenile and illogical to be blunt.

I'd say xenophobia exists in every country. I'd also bet that the U.S. is one of the least xenophobic.

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] if people hate others and never cause harm what is the problem? why must others agree with you? attempting to force people to accept others only tends to radicalize both parties being forced.

Look man, all I am trying to say is that xenophobia does exist in America (which it does, I know this from personal as well as inpersonal experience) because for some reason you questioned that it did. You are trying to make the argument that just because it does not affect you (or your 'extended family'), means that it does not matter, which is a pointless argument. Your whole argument is rather juvenile and illogical to be blunt.

I'd say xenophobia exists in every country. I'd also bet that the U.S. is one of the least xenophobic.

[QUOTE="vfibsux"][QUOTE="tenaka2"]

Do you write for the Daily Mail?

tenaka2

your posts read as typical fear mongering, the percentage estimate is a joke and you also don't point out the locations of these extremists the majority of which would be in countries currently at war with and hardly likely to be your 'neighbor'.

Let me add here do not take offense to people speaking of Islamic extremists unless you are one or support them. If you are not for Islamic extremism you should not take offense to anyone bringing up the fact it exists and in the forms it does so. Talking about Islamic extremism is not condemning Islam or Muslims, please stop taking these topics personally. The fact you fight against these talks is part of what makes some Americans skeptical of moderates.

Okay first off don't point fingers at iran and Saudia they aren't a good representitive of Sharia because 1: Iran is Shiite and Shiites changed the rules of sharia. ( added thngs like timed marriges, changed the Quran and ECT.)

So people of off topic basically what did you hear about sharia that is so crazy?

mayceV

So what country is a good representation of Sharia? If there is none, then what is "true sharia" according to you? How do you know that other Muslims will not come along and say that mayceV's Sharia is not "true Sharia"?

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] Xenophobes cannot express their xenophobia in public because of political correctness most of the time, but it does not mean it is not there. Like I pointed out, the internet is filled with anonymous bigotry and most of it is directed towards "them", not so much American Muslims/Arabs. But yeah...I am in no way saying that all of America is xenophobic at all, just pointing out rather large minorities do exist.chandlerr_360

Look man, all I am trying to say is that xenophobia does exist in America (which it does, I know this from personal as well as inpersonal experience) because for some reason you questioned that it did. You are trying to make the argument that just because it does not affect you (or your 'extended family'), means that it does not matter, which is a pointless argument. Your whole argument is rather juvenile and illogical to be blunt.

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"]

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"] if people hate others and never cause harm what is the problem? why must others agree with you? attempting to force people to accept others only tends to radicalize both parties being forced.

surrealnumber5

Look man, all I am trying to say is that xenophobia does exist in America (which it does, I know this from personal as well as inpersonal experience) because for some reason you questioned that it did. You are trying to make the argument that just because it does not affect you (or your 'extended family'), means that it does not matter, which is a pointless argument. Your whole argument is rather juvenile and illogical to be blunt.

And BTW, I never asked you or even expected you to agree with me on anything because I was never trying to argue with you in the first place. I was simply trying to INFORM you, since clearly you were not well informed if you denied that the US was notxenophobic at all.

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] You believe hatred does not cause harm? Huh?

Look man, all I am trying to say is that xenophobia does exist in America (which it does, I know this from personal as well as inpersonal experience) because for some reason you questioned that it did. You are trying to make the argument that just because it does not affect you (or your 'extended family'), means that it does not matter, which is a pointless argument. Your whole argument is rather juvenile and illogical to be blunt.

chandlerr_360

how is the argument of no punishment before damage juvenile? especially in comparison to your view?

[QUOTE="surrealnumber5"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] I agree to an extent, however the fact is that the Middle Eastern culture and mindset IS different. I cannot blame many Middle Eastern individuals for wanting to come to Europe and the U.S., so I cannot support the xenophobic neo templars in Europe and the US. That being said, the "this is my culture so deal with it" attitude of immigrating Muslims is also a big issue with me, as multiculturism and non assimilation has pretty been proven around the globe to fail horribly. It is a sticky situation and definitely and interesting argument, but I still stand by my "cultural medium" solution, because as it stands, the issue is pretty much making no progess and even becoming volatile if you look at France.chandlerr_360

There ARE some nutballs in this country, and people who just-plain dilsike anything that isn't evangelical Christian, that's true. Our constitution means that they get to talk about their views too, so small groups can seem bigger than they are, but remember how HUUUUGE the USA is. In this very large country, most people live as neighbours with, work with, go to school with, etc... Muslims, Hindus, Christians, Jews, Atheists, and more. If you go to a major metropolitan area from the east coast to the west, you'll see a fairly international group. More importantly, most of these groups are just, "American". Yeah, it takes a couple of generations to go from living in Mexico, or Pakistan, or France to integrate, but it happens and in the process American culture gains something too. This country, and I don't mean to say it's been a smooth process, has been built by and for immigrants. According to human nature, after intregration each group wants to be the LAST group, but our laws hold and that is never the case. We grow, and we do it because people would rather be free of a few thousand years of conflict and preconceptions than not.

Heck, where I live in the space of a 10 minute drive I often see African immigrants, black americans who have roots here going back hundreds of years, white people of various backgrounds, women in Hijab, when schools let out ther is ALWAYS this one women in full Niqab, and the other day I saw someone in Tibetan robes.

Consider that after 9/11 there wasn't much anti-Muslim/Saudi/Middle Eastern violence in this country. Yes, some ******s did go off the rails, but in a large country the reaction was milder than a day in Tottenham. I'm about to go to North Carolina for a project, and it's a state that is definitely part of the US south, it's conservative, and it has a HUGE Muslim and Muslim immigrant community. I don't mean some nasty little hole seperated from the state, I mean a place where people came as groups, and it grew into some towns that began to spread. Far from being shunned, it's a matter of mutual integration.

Now think about most of the Middle East... how much of what I said about living together in peace, even after major events, integration and mutual respect is true? I don't just mean a couple of places either, but a constant flux of immigration and people living together MOSTLY without conflict.

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] Because there is a rather large minority of Americans xenophobic towards Muslims and Middle Eastern individuals, as there is in Europe as well.vfibsux

There ARE some nutballs in this country, and people who just-plain dilsike anything that isn't evangelical Christian, that's true. Our constitution means that they get to talk about their views too, so small groups can seem bigger than they are, but remember how HUUUUGE the USA is. In this very large country, most people live as neighbours with, work with, go to school with, etc... Muslims, Hindus, Christians, Jews, Atheists, and more. If you go to a major metropolitan area from the east coast to the west, you'll see a fairly international group. More importantly, most of these groups are just, "American". Yeah, it takes a couple of generations to go from living in Mexico, or Pakistan, or France to integrate, but it happens and in the process American culture gains something too. This country, and I don't mean to say it's been a smooth process, has been built by and for immigrants. According to human nature, after intregration each group wants to be the LAST group, but our laws hold and that is never the case. We grow, and we do it because people would rather be free of a few thousand years of conflict and preconceptions than not.

Heck, where I live in the space of a 10 minute drive I often see African immigrants, black americans who have roots here going back hundreds of years, white people of various backgrounds, women in Hijab, when schools let out ther is ALWAYS this one women in full Niqab, and the other day I saw someone in Tibetan robes.

Consider that after 9/11 there wasn't much anti-Muslim/Saudi/Middle Eastern violence in this country. Yes, some ******s did go off the rails, but in a large country the reaction was milder than a day in Tottenham. I'm about to go to North Carolina for a project, and it's a state that is definitely part of the US south, it's conservative, and it has a HUGE Muslim and Muslim immigrant community. I don't mean some nasty little hole seperated from the state, I mean a place where people came as groups, and it grew into some towns that began to spread. Far from being shunned, it's a matter of mutual integration.

Now think about most of the Middle East... how much of what I said about living together in peace, even after major events, integration and mutual respect is true? I don't just mean a couple of places either, but a constant flux of immigration and people living together MOSTLY without conflict.

Seriously? You are saying America is not accepting of non-white Christians and then compare it to the Middle East and say they are all cool with each other? Do you realize you will DIE in most of those countries for not being Muslim? Please, just stop.

edit: I've read my post a few time and I think the only way you reach the conclusion that you did is you skimmed JUST the last paragraph, literally. That's... I don't know, but it's making me laugh even harder.

edit2: Ran away... and without even correcting yourself! My heart... it's-ah breakin' *weep*... :D

Shariiiiiiaaaaaaaaa! I follow a religious code called Shariaaaaaaaa!xaos

*looks at thread recently*

I guess what's wrong wiith Sharia are people who don't bother to extend their awareness beyond their own limited view of what should be, yet feel the need to impose this on others. You have the basis of arguments for Sharia evaporating under scrutiny, along with their supporters, and finally people who don't bother to read likewise running.

Why should anyone submit themselves to a law that is so dreadfully inconsistant, based in religion which (and i know this won't go over well) is internally inconsistant, and would be enforced by people who can't be bothered to read much? For this thread, that seems to be enough reason to say what is wrong with Sharia is that people would be involved in it.

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"]

[QUOTE="chandlerr_360"] Because there is a rather large minority of Americans xenophobic towards Muslims and Middle Eastern individuals, as there is in Europe as well.vfibsux

There ARE some nutballs in this country, and people who just-plain dilsike anything that isn't evangelical Christian, that's true. Our constitution means that they get to talk about their views too, so small groups can seem bigger than they are, but remember how HUUUUGE the USA is. In this very large country, most people live as neighbours with, work with, go to school with, etc... Muslims, Hindus, Christians, Jews, Atheists, and more. If you go to a major metropolitan area from the east coast to the west, you'll see a fairly international group. More importantly, most of these groups are just, "American". Yeah, it takes a couple of generations to go from living in Mexico, or Pakistan, or France to integrate, but it happens and in the process American culture gains something too. This country, and I don't mean to say it's been a smooth process, has been built by and for immigrants. According to human nature, after intregration each group wants to be the LAST group, but our laws hold and that is never the case. We grow, and we do it because people would rather be free of a few thousand years of conflict and preconceptions than not.

Heck, where I live in the space of a 10 minute drive I often see African immigrants, black americans who have roots here going back hundreds of years, white people of various backgrounds, women in Hijab, when schools let out ther is ALWAYS this one women in full Niqab, and the other day I saw someone in Tibetan robes.

Consider that after 9/11 there wasn't much anti-Muslim/Saudi/Middle Eastern violence in this country. Yes, some ******s did go off the rails, but in a large country the reaction was milder than a day in Tottenham. I'm about to go to North Carolina for a project, and it's a state that is definitely part of the US south, it's conservative, and it has a HUGE Muslim and Muslim immigrant community. I don't mean some nasty little hole seperated from the state, I mean a place where people came as groups, and it grew into some towns that began to spread. Far from being shunned, it's a matter of mutual integration.

Now think about most of the Middle East... how much of what I said about living together in peace, even after major events, integration and mutual respect is true? I don't just mean a couple of places either, but a constant flux of immigration and people living together MOSTLY without conflict.

[QUOTE="vfibsux"][QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"]

There ARE some nutballs in this country, and people who just-plain dilsike anything that isn't evangelical Christian, that's true. Our constitution means that they get to talk about their views too, so small groups can seem bigger than they are, but remember how HUUUUGE the USA is. In this very large country, most people live as neighbours with, work with, go to school with, etc... Muslims, Hindus, Christians, Jews, Atheists, and more. If you go to a major metropolitan area from the east coast to the west, you'll see a fairly international group. More importantly, most of these groups are just, "American". Yeah, it takes a couple of generations to go from living in Mexico, or Pakistan, or France to integrate, but it happens and in the process American culture gains something too. This country, and I don't mean to say it's been a smooth process, has been built by and for immigrants. According to human nature, after intregration each group wants to be the LAST group, but our laws hold and that is never the case. We grow, and we do it because people would rather be free of a few thousand years of conflict and preconceptions than not.

Heck, where I live in the space of a 10 minute drive I often see African immigrants, black americans who have roots here going back hundreds of years, white people of various backgrounds, women in Hijab, when schools let out ther is ALWAYS this one women in full Niqab, and the other day I saw someone in Tibetan robes.

Consider that after 9/11 there wasn't much anti-Muslim/Saudi/Middle Eastern violence in this country. Yes, some ******s did go off the rails, but in a large country the reaction was milder than a day in Tottenham. I'm about to go to North Carolina for a project, and it's a state that is definitely part of the US south, it's conservative, and it has a HUGE Muslim and Muslim immigrant community. I don't mean some nasty little hole seperated from the state, I mean a place where people came as groups, and it grew into some towns that began to spread. Far from being shunned, it's a matter of mutual integration.

Now think about most of the Middle East... how much of what I said about living together in peace, even after major events, integration and mutual respect is true? I don't just mean a couple of places either, but a constant flux of immigration and people living together MOSTLY without conflict.

Frame_Dragger

Seriously? You are saying America is not accepting of non-white Christians and then compare it to the Middle East and say they are all cool with each other? Do you realize you will DIE in most of those countries for not being Muslim? Please, just stop.

edit: I've read my post a few time and I think the only way you reach the conclusion that you did is you skimmed JUST the last paragraph, literally. That's... I don't know, but it's making me laugh even harder.

edit2: Ran away... and without even correcting yourself! My heart... it's-ah breakin' *weep*... :D

But of course seeing as though someone who does not reply to you in your timeframe is a running coward.......let's see how long it takes you to reply to this.

*looks at thread recently*

I guess what's wrong wiith Sharia are people who don't bother to extend their awareness beyond their own limited view of what should be, yet feel the need to impose this on others. You have the basis of arguments for Sharia evaporating under scrutiny, along with their supporters, and finally people who don't bother to read likewise running.

Why should anyone submit themselves to a law that is so dreadfully inconsistant, based in religion which (and i know this won't go over well) is internally inconsistant, and would be enforced by people who can't be bothered to read much? For this thread, that seems to be enough reason to say what is wrong with Sharia is that people would be involved in it.

Frame_Dragger

[QUOTE="vfibsux"][QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"]

There ARE some nutballs in this country, and people who just-plain dilsike anything that isn't evangelical Christian, that's true. Our constitution means that they get to talk about their views too, so small groups can seem bigger than they are, but remember how HUUUUGE the USA is. In this very large country, most people live as neighbours with, work with, go to school with, etc... Muslims, Hindus, Christians, Jews, Atheists, and more. If you go to a major metropolitan area from the east coast to the west, you'll see a fairly international group. More importantly, most of these groups are just, "American". Yeah, it takes a couple of generations to go from living in Mexico, or Pakistan, or France to integrate, but it happens and in the process American culture gains something too. This country, and I don't mean to say it's been a smooth process, has been built by and for immigrants. According to human nature, after intregration each group wants to be the LAST group, but our laws hold and that is never the case. We grow, and we do it because people would rather be free of a few thousand years of conflict and preconceptions than not.

Heck, where I live in the space of a 10 minute drive I often see African immigrants, black americans who have roots here going back hundreds of years, white people of various backgrounds, women in Hijab, when schools let out ther is ALWAYS this one women in full Niqab, and the other day I saw someone in Tibetan robes.

Consider that after 9/11 there wasn't much anti-Muslim/Saudi/Middle Eastern violence in this country. Yes, some ******s did go off the rails, but in a large country the reaction was milder than a day in Tottenham. I'm about to go to North Carolina for a project, and it's a state that is definitely part of the US south, it's conservative, and it has a HUGE Muslim and Muslim immigrant community. I don't mean some nasty little hole seperated from the state, I mean a place where people came as groups, and it grew into some towns that began to spread. Far from being shunned, it's a matter of mutual integration.

Now think about most of the Middle East... how much of what I said about living together in peace, even after major events, integration and mutual respect is true? I don't just mean a couple of places either, but a constant flux of immigration and people living together MOSTLY without conflict.

mayceV

I did not say ALL countries. You are in one of THE most western friendly countries in the Middle East. My only point was Middle Eastern countries are typically far less tolerant than America is.

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"]

[QUOTE="vfibsux"]

Seriously? You are saying America is not accepting of non-white Christians and then compare it to the Middle East and say they are all cool with each other? Do you realize you will DIE in most of those countries for not being Muslim? Please, just stop.

edit: I've read my post a few time and I think the only way you reach the conclusion that you did is you skimmed JUST the last paragraph, literally. That's... I don't know, but it's making me laugh even harder.

edit2: Ran away... and without even correcting yourself! My heart... it's-ah breakin' *weep*... :D

But of course seeing as though someone who does not reply to you in your timeframe is a running coward.......let's see how long it takes you to reply to this.

....no man only Iran hates america and the west the rest are trying to be friendly towards america to get access to the market. people all around the middle east are like that. no Joke. a place Middle Easterners hate is Israel- not America. mayceV

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"] Sorry, I was too busy basking in being right about precisely which portion you read to respond.... petty I know, but it's moments like these that really hit the spot.vfibsux

[QUOTE="vfibsux"][QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"] Sorry, I was too busy basking in being right about precisely which portion you read to respond.... petty I know, but it's moments like these that really hit the spot.Frame_Dragger

Her music is a bit poppy at times, but she has got great outfits.

[QUOTE="Frame_Dragger"][QUOTE="vfibsux"] Sorry I ruined your plans by manning up and admitting my mistake, hopefully you can learn from that someday. vfibsux

Her music is a bit poppy at times, but she has got great outfits.

tenaka2

whats wrong with sharia?

Whats right with it?