Why are people who are pro-life demonized?

[QUOTE="theone86"]

[QUOTE="BMD004"]How would society as a whole... from a macro perspective... be affected by murder not being a crime?

 

It seems as if you are arguing that murder is wrong not from a moral perspective, but from a perspective of practicality. Murder is wrong because it negatively impacts society by doing this, this, and this.

 

Is that correct?

BMD004

Morality is practicality.  If the practical consequences of murder did not exist then the moral sanction against murder never would have developed.

I told you how society suffers.  One lacks security.  Every individual in society is fearful of murder because there are no sanctions against it.  One's life can be terminated in an instant by anyone quite easily because the perpatrator can do it anywhere at any time and simply walk away.

you need to stop the foreplay and get to the point.

The benefit of killing homeless people is basically non existent. The cost of determining and regulating who is eligible to be killed and meets all the required criteria to be deemed as having no value is virtually impossible from a logistics standpoint. What are we going to do run a cost benefit analysis and conduct interviews with family and friends for every member of society then run a statistical analysis on the possibility of future contributions?

the longer you draw this out, the more stupid whatever point you are going to make is gonna look.

[QUOTE="toast_burner"]

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"] She gave up her 'bodily autonomy' when she decided to let a man put his genetic material into it. A woman shouuld only be able to make such a decision unilaterally when she had no choice in the matter(rape) or when the man isn't involved in the first place(sperm donor).El_Zo1212o

Why does it matter what she did before? It's still her body. 

And what if both sides can't come to a resolution? What then?

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"] Maybe back in the 'fifties, but if that's the measure of parenthood, then most kids mothers nowadays are underpaid undocumented women. Moron.El_Zo1212o

Uh-huh. Because hiring people to raise you children is such a common thing amoung the general population. Idiot.

No, I do not think that familes with two working parents are in the minority. But that's not what I said now is it?

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"][QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

No. He should not have the right to stop a woman from getting an abortion under any circumstance. While the fetus is still attached to the woman's body, she must be the one to make the decision. Otherwise, her bodily autonomy is being limited by somebody who is not even carrying the fetus, which makes no sense.

GreySeal9

Um, no. If there is a dispute between the mother and father on whether or not as abortion should take place, someone is going to have to get their way. There is no reason that the person that doesn't have the fetus attached their body should make the decision. 

That's not to say that the mother shouldn't take the father's wishes into consideration. But disputes have to be settled and the only sensible way of doing so is to let the mother make the decision because of her unique qualities (carrying the fetus).

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"] She gave up her 'bodily autonomy' when she decided to let a man put his genetic material into it. A woman shouuld only be able to make such a decision unilaterally when she had no choice in the matter(rape) or when the man isn't involved in the first place(sperm donor).El_Zo1212o

Um, no. If there is a dispute between the mother and father on whether or not as abortion should take place, someone is going to have to get their way. There is no reason that the person that doesn't have the fetus attached their body should make the decision. 

That's not to say that the mother shouldn't take the father's wishes into consideration. But disputes have to be settled and the only sensible way of doing so is to let the mother make the decision because of her unique qualities (carrying the fetus).

Why?

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"][QUOTE="worlock77"]

Uh-huh. Because hiring people to raise you children is such a common thing amoung the general population. Idiot.

worlock77

No, I do not think that familes with two working parents are in the minority. But that's not what I said now is it?

[QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"] She gave up her 'bodily autonomy' when she decided to let a man put his genetic material into it. A woman shouuld only be able to make such a decision unilaterally when she had no choice in the matter(rape) or when the man isn't involved in the first place(sperm donor).El_Zo1212o

Um, no. If there is a dispute between the mother and father on whether or not as abortion should take place, someone is going to have to get their way. There is no reason that the person that doesn't have the fetus attached their body should make the decision. 

That's not to say that the mother shouldn't take the father's wishes into consideration. But disputes have to be settled and the only sensible way of doing so is to let the mother make the decision because of her unique qualities (carrying the fetus).

This is emotional reasoning, not practical reasoning.

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"][QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

Um, no. If there is a dispute between the mother and father on whether or not as abortion should take place, someone is going to have to get their way. There is no reason that the person that doesn't have the fetus attached their body should make the decision. 

That's not to say that the mother shouldn't take the father's wishes into consideration. But disputes have to be settled and the only sensible way of doing so is to let the mother make the decision because of her unique qualities (carrying the fetus).

worlock77

Why?

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"][QUOTE="GreySeal9"]

Um, no. If there is a dispute between the mother and father on whether or not as abortion should take place, someone is going to have to get their way. There is no reason that the person that doesn't have the fetus attached their body should make the decision. 

That's not to say that the mother shouldn't take the father's wishes into consideration. But disputes have to be settled and the only sensible way of doing so is to let the mother make the decision because of her unique qualities (carrying the fetus).

GreySeal9

This is emotional reasoning, not practical reasoning.

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"] Are you honestly suggesting this isn't the case? You think that families with two working parents is in the minority? Wow.El_Zo1212o

No, I do not think that familes with two working parents are in the minority. But that's not what I said now is it?

So you really think the majority of families, working or not, are hiring illegals to raise their children for them?

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"] I disagree. I think if there is any dispute the decision should fall on the side of life rather than convenience.El_Zo1212o

Why?

I don't think life in itself is valuable. It depends on the type of life you're talking about.

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"] I disagree. I think if there is any dispute the decision should fall on the side of life rather than convenience.El_Zo1212o

Why?

Life isn't inherently valuable. By your own posts you render it valueless. If you did value life so highly then you should be against abortion in all cases. Since you seem to view abortion as ok if both parents decide it's the convenient route then you do not seem to value life all that highly.

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"][QUOTE="worlock77"]

No, I do not think that familes with two working parents are in the minority. But that's not what I said now is it?

worlock77

So you really think the majority of families, working or not, are hiring illegals to raise their children for them?

because 90% of the time, they are not pro life

I don't think life in itself is valuable. It defends on the type of life you're talking about.

GreySeal9

Life isn't inherently valuable. By your own posts you render it valueless. If you did value life so highly then you should be against abortion in all cases. Since you seem to view abortion as ok if both parents decide it's the convenient route then you do not seem to value life all that highly.

worlock77

You pro-fetus-slaughterers must enjoying sexing women without protection too often.SolidSnake35

-Unless the woman was raped or might die or whatever, it's not even up for debate. Give birth and put the child up for adoption. You pro-fetus-slaughterers must enjoying sexing women without protection too often.SolidSnake35

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]-Unless the woman was raped or might die or whatever, it's not even up for debate. Give birth and put the child up for adoption. You pro-fetus-slaughterers must enjoying sexing women without protection too often.Engrish_Major

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"]Fortunately, you don't have the power to do that.Engrish_Major

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

[QUOTE="El_Zo1212o"] So... "because hiring people to raise your children is such a common thing among the general population." WASN'T a sarcastic reply? I don't understand what you're getting at.El_Zo1212o

So you really think the majority of families, working or not, are hiring illegals to raise their children for them?

Hardly. Generally speaking working families have a hard enough time making ends meet without paying for nannies. Regardless, even if the mother works 4, 6 even 8 hours a day that still leaves a lot of hours out of the day where they're the ones taking care of their children.

I don't have time for the "right to do whatever you like with your own body" brigade.SolidSnake35

[QUOTE="worlock77"]

Life isn't inherently valuable. By your own posts you render it valueless. If you did value life so highly then you should be against abortion in all cases. Since you seem to view abortion as ok if both parents decide it's the convenient route then you do not seem to value life all that highly.

El_Zo1212o

When the man is putting his body and his health on the line to carry the child then he can have an equal say so.

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"]Yes, I do.El_Zo1212o

When I say it's not up for debate, I'm putting an end to the debate.SolidSnake35

:lol:

Keep dreaming pal.

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"]Or, more accurately... medical procedure. I support it because I personally find it hard to get worked up over the death of unborn humans.Engrish_Major

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]I don't have time for the "right to do whatever you like with your own body" brigade.ghoklebutter

[QUOTE="ghoklebutter"][QUOTE="SolidSnake35"]I don't have time for the "right to do whatever you like with your own body" brigade.SolidSnake35

why? It is pretty simple: they are the only group out of the whole debate that wants to force people to their way of thinking.  Not just that, but force you to make a choice that goes against what you want to do.

[QUOTE="Engrish_Major"][QUOTE="SolidSnake35"] When I say it's not up for debate, I'm putting an end to the debate.SolidSnake35

thousands of 'potential people' die every time you spew your man juice.  50% of all conceptions fail as well.  Think of the children!

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"]Because when it's something that I'm not passionately against, I have no reason to keep other people from being free to make the decision.Engrish_Major

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="Engrish_Major"]Fortunately, you don't have the power to do that.wis3boi

thousands of 'potential people' die every time you spew your man juice.  50% of all conceptions fail as well.  Think of the children!

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"] You support the slaughter of fetuses and future people without good reason?SolidSnake35

thousands of 'potential people' die every time you spew your man juice.  50% of all conceptions fail as well.  Think of the children!

a cluster of ~100 cells isn't a person...unless your image of abortion is doing it with a knife in the 9th month of pregnancy

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"][QUOTE="wis3boi"]

thousands of 'potential people' die every time you spew your man juice.  50% of all conceptions fail as well.  Think of the children!

wis3boi

a cluster of ~100 cells isn't a person...unless your image of abortion is doing it with a knife in the 9th month of pregnancy

Because who are they to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her body. 

Chris_Williams

[QUOTE="wis3boi"]

[QUOTE="SolidSnake35"] There are an infinite number of "potential people". They don't exist to die until they are conceived of..SolidSnake35

a cluster of ~100 cells isn't a person...unless your image of abortion is doing it with a knife in the 9th month of pregnancy

you might have a sperm rattling around in your shaft right now that could eventually create the cure for cancer... get off your baby murdering ass and go make it happen.

[QUOTE="Chris_Williams"]

Because who are they to tell a woman what she can or can't do with her body. 

Chutebox