Why can't we stop the Westboro Baptist Church?

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BigSexy63

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#1 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts

I live about 30 miles from Joplin, Mo. If you haven't heard, Joplin was just devestated by an EF-5 tornado last sunday. Anyway, the Westboro Baptist Church is coming to town tomorrow to protest and I don't understand how they can get away with this. Here is my reasoning...


"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion...

...or the right of the people PEACEABLY to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." ---The first amendment to the Constitution.


PEACEABLE; –adjective

1. inclined or disposed to avoid strife or dissension; not argumentative or hostile: a peaceable person; a peaceable disposition.


CONCLUSION: The protests by Westboro Baptist Church are unconstitutional. Why Can't we stop them from doing what they are doing?


What are your thoughs about this issue?

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IPWNDU2

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#2 IPWNDU2
Member since 2006 • 2535 Posts

You can stop them. Just do not get caught or tell anyone what you are going to do.

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groovdafied

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#3 groovdafied
Member since 2005 • 5012 Posts
Freedom of speech can have its negative effects too, and the law protects them as human beings if they are not committing any crimes..
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Theokhoth

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#4 Theokhoth
Member since 2008 • 36799 Posts
Because they haven't done anything legally wrong.
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BigSexy63

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#5 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts
Yeah, there are plas to stop them, but why can't Law enforcement do it? P.S. How do I make the text white?
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ImaPirate0202

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#6 ImaPirate0202
Member since 2005 • 4473 Posts

ignore them

It's the best thing anyone can do.

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chrisrooR

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#7 chrisrooR
Member since 2007 • 9027 Posts
Because they are also protected by the constitution through freedom of expression, religious freedoms, and freedom of speech; are they not? Besides, they are told to stay well away from the actual sites.
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groovdafied

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#8 groovdafied
Member since 2005 • 5012 Posts
Plus they are getting so much attention with their hate speech, it makes them do it more. If people just ignored them, they would get a clue that they aren't really doing anything and go back into their shell.
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BigSexy63

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#9 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts
Because they haven't done anything legally wrong. Theokhoth
But they are't peaceably assembling. There is nothing peaceful about what they do.
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Theokhoth

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#10 Theokhoth
Member since 2008 • 36799 Posts
[QUOTE="BigSexy63"]Yeah, there are plas to stop them, but why can't Law enforcement do it? P.S. How do I make the text white?

The Supreme Court recently ruled that they can preach their nonsense even at funerals, though they have to be a thousand (feet? Yards? I can't remember which) away.
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chrisrooR

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#11 chrisrooR
Member since 2007 • 9027 Posts
[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]Because they haven't done anything legally wrong. BigSexy63
But they are't peaceably assembling. There is nothing peaceful about what they do.

They haven't physically hurt anyone, as far as I know. It is a technicality that it IS peaceful assembly.
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Theokhoth

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#12 Theokhoth
Member since 2008 • 36799 Posts
[QUOTE="Theokhoth"]Because they haven't done anything legally wrong. BigSexy63
But they are't peaceably assembling. There is nothing peaceful about what they do.

They haven't assaulted anyone or rallied for battle. They've just made inflammatory protests. That is peaceable, in the eyes of the law.
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BigSexy63

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#13 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts

[QUOTE="BigSexy63"][QUOTE="Theokhoth"]Because they haven't done anything legally wrong. chrisrooR
But they are't peaceably assembling. There is nothing peaceful about what they do.

They haven't physically hurt anyone, as far as I know. It is a technicality that it IS peaceful assembly.

But the definition of peaceable doesn't say it must be physical violence.

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Theokhoth

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#14 Theokhoth
Member since 2008 • 36799 Posts
[QUOTE="BigSexy63"][QUOTE="chrisrooR"][QUOTE="BigSexy63"] But they are't peaceably assembling. There is nothing peaceful about what they do.

They haven't physically hurt anyone, as far as I know. It is a technicality that it IS peaceful assembly.

But the definition of peaceable don't say it must be physical violence.

The law does not use dictionary definitions. Nor does real life.
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BigSexy63

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#15 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts
[QUOTE="Theokhoth"][QUOTE="BigSexy63"][QUOTE="chrisrooR"] They haven't physically hurt anyone, as far as I know. It is a technicality that it IS peaceful assembly.

But the definition of peaceable don't say it must be physical violence.

The law does not use dictionary definitions. Nor does real life.

That's a good point I guess. But that doesn't make it any less bull****
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DroidPhysX

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#16 DroidPhysX
Member since 2010 • 17098 Posts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snyder_v._Phelps

I'll just leave it at that.

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BigSexy63

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#17 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snyder_v._Phelps

I'll just leave it at that.

DroidPhysX
Thanks.
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Serraph105

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#18 Serraph105
Member since 2007 • 36092 Posts

What are they protesting exactly? Tornadoes?

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zoraluv

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#19 zoraluv
Member since 2010 • 8319 Posts

I Hope you do the protest against them,

there's supposed to be a rally against WBC church.

truthfully thats the only way to stop them, I wish you and the town of joplin all the best

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BigSexy63

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#20 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts
I also feel the need to post this. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6GpJmYDQCk&feature=share
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BigSexy63

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#21 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts

I Hope you do the protest against them,

there's supposed to be a rally against WBC church.

truthfully thats the only way to stop them, I wish you and the town of joplin all the best

zoraluv
Well technically we are having a Pro-Joplin rally, Not an Anti-WBC Rally. There is an event on facebook for it and there are over 3,000 people attending this rally.
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zoraluv

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#22 zoraluv
Member since 2010 • 8319 Posts

[QUOTE="zoraluv"]

I Hope you do the protest against them,

there's supposed to be a rally against WBC church.

truthfully thats the only way to stop them, I wish you and the town of joplin all the best

BigSexy63

Well technically we are having a Pro-Joplin rally, Not an Anti-WBC Rally. There is an event on facebook for it and there are over 3,000 people attending this rally.

thats amazing, if I were anywhere near there I would go, But I'm clear across the states :(

3,000 wow,

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BigSexy63

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#23 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts

[QUOTE="BigSexy63"][QUOTE="zoraluv"]

I Hope you do the protest against them,

there's supposed to be a rally against WBC church.

truthfully thats the only way to stop them, I wish you and the town of joplin all the best

zoraluv

Well technically we are having a Pro-Joplin rally, Not an Anti-WBC Rally. There is an event on facebook for it and there are over 3,000 people attending this rally.

thats amazing, if I were anywhere near there I would go, But I'm clear across the states :(

3,000 wow,

I just looked and now it's above 4,000.

Here's a link.

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branketra

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#24 branketra
Member since 2006 • 51726 Posts
When speaking about potentially hostile situations, you could call many things that. A Muslim protest of unfair treatment in the U.S., A KKK march, a gay pride rally, and Westboro Baptist. As much as I don't agree with them, it's probably better to keep this sort of meaning as loose as it is, rather than tightening the boundaries.
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Teenaged

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#25 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

I actually dont want them to be stopped.

Let them lead the example of how "ugly" homophobia and religious extremism can be.

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BigSexy63

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#26 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts

I actually dont want them to be stopped.

Let them lead the example of how "ugly" homophobia and religious extremism can be.

Teenaged
I never thought of it that way. Maybe homophobs will see what the WBC is doing ad not want to be like that.
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tenaka2

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#27 tenaka2
Member since 2004 • 17958 Posts

I actually dont want them to be stopped.

Let them lead the example of how "ugly" homophobia and religious extremism can be.

Teenaged

That is a good point, a lot of fundie religious groups have similiar values to those guys but are just not vocal about it.

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Hexagon_777

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#28 Hexagon_777
Member since 2007 • 20348 Posts
Only Anonymous can stop them.
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Serraph105

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#29 Serraph105
Member since 2007 • 36092 Posts

when Fred Phelps dies can I go protest at his funeral with a sign saying, "Thank God for the death of Fred Phelps!"

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mattbbpl

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#30 mattbbpl
Member since 2006 • 23333 Posts

I actually dont want them to be stopped.

Let them lead the example of how "ugly" homophobia and religious extremism can be.

Teenaged

The only bad thing about thatmentality is that people generalize too much. They won't just see it as the ugly side of religious extremism, some will see it as the ugly side of Christianity. Others will even generalize it across religion in general. We even see those types of generalizations in OT on a regular basis.

And they can be just as damaging as the original cause of the generalization.

But no, I'm not advocating that they should be stopped. I'm a firm believer in free speech.

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TentacleMayor

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#31 TentacleMayor
Member since 2008 • 1469 Posts
Freedom of speech. No, it's not just for YOUR opinions.
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Treflis

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#32 Treflis
Member since 2004 • 13757 Posts
They have the freedom of speech and all they are doing are shouting and holding signs, nor do they go onto private property. As much as I dislike them, they aren't breaking any laws as there's no laws for being obnoxious.
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194197844077667059316682358889

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#33 194197844077667059316682358889
Member since 2003 • 49173 Posts
If free speech only protects expression that no one finds offensive, it is kind of pointless.
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ad1x2

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#34 ad1x2
Member since 2005 • 8430 Posts

Seeing this thread made me think about this video and the top comment for it.

Seriously, there's not much you can do. Best thing to do is ignore them because they're so into their beliefs that nothing you can legally do or say to them will make a difference. Too bad people like them make all religions have a bad name, especially with the people who try to act like they represent ALL Christians.

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Wilfred_Owen

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#35 Wilfred_Owen
Member since 2005 • 20964 Posts
[QUOTE="BigSexy63"]Yeah, there are plas to stop them, but why can't Law enforcement do it? P.S. How do I make the text white?Theokhoth
The Supreme Court recently ruled that they can preach their nonsense even at funerals, though they have to be a thousand (feet? Yards? I can't remember which) away.

I believe its whatever county law would mandate. Besides, they are mostly ignored now.
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HexedPelican

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#36 HexedPelican
Member since 2011 • 590 Posts
Well you got Freedom of Speech to thank for this.
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Teenaged

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#37 Teenaged
Member since 2007 • 31764 Posts

[QUOTE="Teenaged"]

I actually dont want them to be stopped.

Let them lead the example of how "ugly" homophobia and religious extremism can be.

mattbbpl

The only bad thing about thatmentality is that people generalize too much. They won't just see it as the ugly side of religious extremism, some will see it as the ugly side of Christianity. Others will even generalize it across religion in general. We even see those types of generalizations in OT on a regular basis.

And they can be just as damaging as the original cause of the generalization.

But no, I'm not advocating that they should be stopped. I'm a firm believer in free speech.

You are right but being biased on this issue, I find the positive of them being like that being far better than the negative of generalising Christians. But who knows what side-effects I cant think of could come out of this that I wont like, sure. I also think that they are so extreme that most people realise that other Christians (the majority) do not like them and are not like them. Even here on OT I see several christians (some of which are quite conservative) condemn them for what they are doing.
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DJ419

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#38 DJ419
Member since 2005 • 1016 Posts

I Hope you do the protest against them,

there's supposed to be a rally against WBC church.

truthfully thats the only way to stop them, I wish you and the town of joplin all the best

zoraluv

Counter protesting them doesn't stop them. It's giving them what they want, which is attention. The WBC doesn't protest to look for acceptance from people, they do it for attention. Even acknowledging them is what they want.

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deactivated-59913425220eb

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#39 deactivated-59913425220eb
Member since 2002 • 1772 Posts
[QUOTE="Treflis"]They have the freedom of speech and all they are doing are shouting and holding signs, nor do they go onto private property. As much as I dislike them, they aren't breaking any laws as there's no laws for being obnoxious.

ya thats true, they are just taking advantage of our laws of free speech. But there is one way to stop them and it is this......... IGNORE THEM if they received no press and everyone ignored them then I am sure they would disappear into there caves or wherever they live.
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fueled-system

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#40 fueled-system
Member since 2008 • 6529 Posts

most of them are lawyers just a little warning...

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Alex3796

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#41 Alex3796
Member since 2009 • 2669 Posts
Are they're acts ridiculous and offensive? Yes. Are they constitutional? Yes. You get used to seeing Fred Phelps and his little gang when you live in the city of WBC. Everyone just ignores them here.
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BigSexy63

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#42 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts
You know I don't believe that Fred Phelps even believes in what he's preaching. Read this. It's a scam. He's in it for the money... http://kanewj.com/wbc/
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subox224

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#43 subox224
Member since 2011 • 25 Posts
We'll never stop them because they get too much media attention. There are laws now keeping them from getting too close to funerals/disasters and things like that in many states. We need to completely ignore them to stop them, and they need to stop getting on the news. If this happens, noone will even know about them, and they won't be able to spread they're hate and lies
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snakes_codec

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#44 snakes_codec
Member since 2008 • 2754 Posts
dont worry people like that always get whats coming to them one day some crazy is going to shoot them all dead probably cant see anyone missing them and even tho the guy would spend the rest of his life in jail he would likely be viewed as a hero by most .
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Mordred19

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#45 Mordred19
Member since 2007 • 8259 Posts

ignore them. if there's a chance that giving them attention gives them satisfaction, don't risk feeding their egos.

it is a hard path to tolerate speech and expressions that we don't like and find objectionable. but I think it's the right path.

"if you were to break down every law in England to catch the devil, what would you turn to, to protect yourself, when the devil came after you?": paraphrased from a source I'm too lazy to look up right now.

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BigSexy63

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#46 BigSexy63
Member since 2010 • 415 Posts
dont worry people like that always get whats coming to them one day some crazy is going to shoot them all dead probably cant see anyone missing them and even tho the guy would spend the rest of his life in jail he would likely be viewed as a hero by most .snakes_codec
Honestly I would not be surprised if that was tomorrow with as many people that will be there. 4,000 people and counting and many of them have lost everything and have nothing to live for.
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tenaka2

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#47 tenaka2
Member since 2004 • 17958 Posts

They spout hate, the incite trouble, they hate everyone, they go to funerals and laugh at the people.

But america supports that. Go America.

At least in the Uk there is a law to supress lunatics like this.

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chrisrooR

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#48 chrisrooR
Member since 2007 • 9027 Posts

They spout hate, the incite trouble, they hate everyone, they go to funerals and laugh at the people.

But america supports that. Go America.

At least in the Uk there is a law to supress lunatics like this.

tenaka2
Free speech should be exactly that. I don't agree with what they say, but I fully agree with their right to say it.
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nocoolnamejim

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#49 nocoolnamejim
Member since 2003 • 15136 Posts
It's basically the same reason why I can't arbitrarily ban a few folks that I think are complete tools here on Gamespot. What makes certain rights meaningful is that they exist even for people who are utter dicks.
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Inconsistancy

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#50 Inconsistancy
Member since 2004 • 8094 Posts
[QUOTE="BigSexy63"]Yeah, there are plas to stop them, but why can't Law enforcement do it? P.S. How do I make the text white?

P.S. = Highlight the incorrectly colored text, then go to the colors, select the black in the top left, and it'll go to default color for the sight.