Why do we need proof to believe in god?

This topic is locked from further discussion.

Avatar image for 123625
123625

9035

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#201 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts

[QUOTE="blacktorn"]Son of god,not actually god. foxhound_fox

I'm pretty sure that there is the belief that Jesus is just a projection of God on earth and not a man at all. The whole "holy trinity" deal.

Jesus is the lord in the flesh sent down to die for our sins that was his whole purpose. Man sinned and we needed a sacrfice worthy enough of god. Jesus was that.

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#202 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts
[QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Something created your soul,did it not?

dsmccracken

If he asked what created God, you would probably say God is eternal and had no creator. Why can't he answer the same about his soul?

Mmm no i wouldn't question it at all,because i don't desire a need for that kind of knowledge,because it doesn't exist.There are many things we don't know about the afterlife,doesn't mean we have to start finding answers because your set on going against god,by not believing in him.

So if a person comes to you and claims to be God, you won't question it for the fear that if it's true, then you'll be questioning God?

God isn't a man.

Jesus.

Son of god,not actually god.

Doesn't the concept of the holy trinity make Jesus part of the God construct?

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

Avatar image for halo3-player
halo3-player

6036

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#203 halo3-player
Member since 2006 • 6036 Posts

If I told you I was an alien posting on GS from my spaceship, you would want proof, wouldn't you?

Some people believe that if they can touch it, feel it, smell it, or see it, that it's real. Anything else they would want concrete evidence to believe.

dog64
I would not want proof most people dont lie or they shouldnt
Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#204 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="dog64"]

If I told you I was an alien posting on GS from my spaceship, you would want proof, wouldn't you?

Some people believe that if they can touch it, feel it, smell it, or see it, that it's real. Anything else they would want concrete evidence to believe.

halo3-player

I would not want proof most people dont lie or they shouldnt

But maybe aliens do lie? How would you know?

Avatar image for dsmccracken
dsmccracken

7307

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#205 dsmccracken
Member since 2003 • 7307 Posts

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

blacktorn

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

Avatar image for dsmccracken
dsmccracken

7307

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#206 dsmccracken
Member since 2003 • 7307 Posts
[QUOTE="dog64"]

If I told you I was an alien posting on GS from my spaceship, you would want proof, wouldn't you?

Some people believe that if they can touch it, feel it, smell it, or see it, that it's real. Anything else they would want concrete evidence to believe.

halo3-player

I would not want proof most people dont lie or they shouldnt

Most people don't lie? I don't know about that. In any event, maybe most aliens from the planet Zelon do nothing BUT lie, it's like breathing to them.

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#207 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts
[QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

dsmccracken

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

Jesus sacrificed himself,god didn't,they are of two different entities.

Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#208 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

blacktorn

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

But if Jesus is a part of God, then Jesus is God, and so if God created Jesus, then that's the same as Jesus creating Himself, meaning that you could say that Jesus created God.

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#209 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts
[QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

Zagrius

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

But if Jesus is a part of God, then Jesus is God, and so if God created Jesus, then that's the same as Jesus creating Himself, meaning that you could say that Jesus created God.

Jesus is both man and god,god is god,not man.Man was created by god,nothing created god,because he created all.

Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#210 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

blacktorn

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

But if Jesus is a part of God, then Jesus is God, and so if God created Jesus, then that's the same as Jesus creating Himself, meaning that you could say that Jesus created God.

Jesus is both man and god,god is god,not man.Man was created by god,nothing created god.

But if God is all-powerful, He could create Himself. Why not?

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#211 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts
[QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

Zagrius

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

But if Jesus is a part of God, then Jesus is God, and so if God created Jesus, then that's the same as Jesus creating Himself, meaning that you could say that Jesus created God.

Jesus is both man and god,god is god,not man.Man was created by god,nothing created god.

But if God is all-powerful, He could create Himself. Why not?

Why would you create what's already there?

Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#212 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

blacktorn

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

But if Jesus is a part of God, then Jesus is God, and so if God created Jesus, then that's the same as Jesus creating Himself, meaning that you could say that Jesus created God.

Jesus is both man and god,god is god,not man.Man was created by god,nothing created god.

But if God is all-powerful, He could create Himself. Why not?

Why would you create what's already there?

Because you can, and maybe God created Himself out of nothingness before creating the universe. You don't know what happened.

Avatar image for 123625
123625

9035

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#213 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts
[QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

Zagrius

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

But if Jesus is a part of God, then Jesus is God, and so if God created Jesus, then that's the same as Jesus creating Himself, meaning that you could say that Jesus created God.

Jesus is both man and god,god is god,not man.Man was created by god,nothing created god.

But if God is all-powerful, He could create Himself. Why not?

Why would you create what's already there?

Because you can, and maybe God created Himself out of nothingness before creating the universe. You don't know what happened.

True we don't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#214 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

123625

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#215 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts
[QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

Zagrius

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

But if Jesus is a part of God, then Jesus is God, and so if God created Jesus, then that's the same as Jesus creating Himself, meaning that you could say that Jesus created God.

Jesus is both man and god,god is god,not man.Man was created by god,nothing created god.

But if God is all-powerful, He could create Himself. Why not?

Why would you create what's already there?

Because you can, and maybe God created Himself out of nothingness before creating the universe. You don't know what happened.

I didn't ask,i don't care for that kind of knowledge that you desire.

Avatar image for 123625
123625

9035

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#216 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts
[QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

Zagrius

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

Avatar image for dsmccracken
dsmccracken

7307

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#217 dsmccracken
Member since 2003 • 7307 Posts
[QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

blacktorn

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

Jesus sacrificed himself,god didn't,they are of two different entities.

You sure about that? If those previous bible quotes weren't enough, how about this:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. ...The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. (John 1:1,14)

In Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form. (Colossians 2:9)

If they are two different entities as you say, why is Jesus quoted by John as saying they are one?

Avatar image for bradleybhoy
bradleybhoy

6501

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#218 bradleybhoy
Member since 2005 • 6501 Posts
You don't have proof. That's what faith is all about... :|
Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#219 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

123625

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

As long as He created Himself before time, He'd still be eternal.

Avatar image for Judza
Judza

4637

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#220 Judza
Member since 2004 • 4637 Posts

Because they believe faith is reason enough.

Yet, faith is merely a belief without any evidence to support it.

Avatar image for dsmccracken
dsmccracken

7307

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#221 dsmccracken
Member since 2003 • 7307 Posts

I didn't ask,i don't care for that kind of knowledge that you desire.

blacktorn

And that's fine. You don't want/need to know these things, we do.

Avatar image for 123625
123625

9035

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#222 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts
[QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

Zagrius

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

As long as He created Himself before time, He'd still be eternal.

See he didnt create himself.

Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#223 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

123625

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

As long as He created Himself before time, He'd still be eternal.

See he didnt create himself.

... Could you repeat that in make-sense-ese?

Avatar image for 123625
123625

9035

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#224 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts
[QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

Zagrius

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

As long as He created Himself before time, He'd still be eternal.

See he didnt create himself.

... Could you repeat that in make-sense-ese?

How you can you create yourself if you have always existed?

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#225 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts
[QUOTE="blacktorn"][QUOTE="dsmccracken"][QUOTE="blacktorn"]

Why he's called the son of god...used by god to change the world,god himself,the one who creates every person on this planet,he doesn't have a physical presence,hence why Jesus was born,why god needed to use people such as Moses.

dsmccracken

I'm pretty sure that Jesus is God as conceived by the holy trinity. "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58 ), "The Father and I are one" (John 10:31), and "Anyone who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9).

He was a part of god yes,but he is not THE god,god created Jesus,Jesus didn't create god.

Jesus sacrificed himself,god didn't,they are of two different entities.

You sure about that? If those previous bible quotes weren't enough, how about this:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. ...The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. (John 1:1,14)

In Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form. (Colossians 2:9)

If they are two different entities as you say, why is Jesus quoted by John as saying they are one?

There is god and there is Jesus,if they were one,one wouldn't exist with another,one =one not two.God was within Jesus,using him as a physical body for his doings.

Avatar image for WSGRandomPerson
WSGRandomPerson

13697

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 18

User Lists: 0

#226 WSGRandomPerson
Member since 2007 • 13697 Posts
because if there isn't any proof of god, then that means you are beliving in nothing.
Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#227 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

123625

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

As long as He created Himself before time, He'd still be eternal.

See he didnt create himself.

... Could you repeat that in make-sense-ese?

How you can you create yourself if you have always existed?

Because you're God, and you can do anything. And perhaps as happens a lot in the Bible, God was taking our puny and limited understanding in mind when saying He is eternal.

Avatar image for Insane00
Insane00

1267

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#228 Insane00
Member since 2003 • 1267 Posts

So I came into this one late, Oh well.

You don't need proof, but some people refuse to believe in anything that doesn't have conclusive evidence. The problem with God is that there is no conclusive evidence either for his/its existence or non-existance. As a result I think many people will refuse to believe in God or make a decision on the matter. Unfortunately, since there is no conclusive evidence for God's existence, most people that need proot to believe in something take this as evidence he doesn't exist.

Another way to look at it comes from one of my old phil teachers. He described belief in God (aka. faith) as like a cold, though I think that using genetic code as an analogy works better. He said faith is either something you have or you don't. If you get it you will believe in a thing despite lacking evidence, whereas without it you cannot. But he specifically pointed out that faith is not something you can force yourself to have, and I think he is right on this point. I think most poeple require proof. For example, try to believe, right now, that there is an elephant sharing your chair with you. You can't do it, no matter how much you may want to you will always refuse to believe an elephant is in the chair with you. Even if everyone in the room was staring, shocked at the elephant next to you, if you didn't see it you would be looking back confused.

To really show one's geekiness, one can use the example of the episode of Next Gen where Picard is caught by Cardasians and the guy holding him prisoner keeps telling Picard that there are 5 lights above his head when in reality there are 4. Picard is tortured until he admits there are 5 lights, which he never does. Yet at the end of the episode he admits to Troy that near the end he began to see 5 lights rather than 4.

Either way, I see faith as something you have or you don't. You can try to force it upon someone, or create an environment that makes those with faith go overboard, but if someone without it tries to believe in something he has no reason to, he will not be able to. On the other hand, people can take things to the extreme and refuse to believe anything not proven to them, but that is just as harmful as blind faith. For instance, I would want to be a single hermit for the rest of my life if I just believed what I saw from the women I have dated, but I have to have faith that somewhere out there is a girl worth being with. Or I could take the evidence that people are horrible, nasty, cruel, unloving, selfish jerks whose only goal in life is to get as much as he can at another's expence, but I believe and know, despite all the evidence to the contrary that people really aren't that bad, they simply get caught up in the lives they know and forget that everyone else is just a free, just as able, and just as deserving of respect as they are. So I think having some faith of some kind is important to living a full life.

Yea, my two cents.

Avatar image for 123625
123625

9035

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#229 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts
[QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

Zagrius

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

As long as He created Himself before time, He'd still be eternal.

See he didnt create himself.

... Could you repeat that in make-sense-ese?

How you can you create yourself if you have always existed?

Because you're God, and you can do anything. And perhaps as happens a lot in the Bible, God was taking our puny and limited understanding in mind when saying He is eternal.

What is your point?

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#230 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts
[QUOTE="blacktorn"]

I didn't ask,i don't care for that kind of knowledge that you desire.

dsmccracken

And that's fine. You don't want/need to know these things, we do.

Do you really? You can live without knowing,you are lusting for knowledge,lust is a sin,your ignoring your own sins for sake of arrogant reasoning.

You going to spend your whole life trying to unearth knowledge that never was or will be?

Knowledge is the gateway to sin,it's how original sin was formed.Adam and eve couldn't keep they temptations at bay and decided to fall to the devil and feed of the tree of knowledge.

Avatar image for ShadowtheDark
ShadowtheDark

305

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#231 ShadowtheDark
Member since 2003 • 305 Posts
Well there is actually proof of God. All fossil records show that verything was created at once the prehistoric animals in the past just appeared. So for something to do that it has to be created by some kind of higher intelligence or supreme being.
Avatar image for notconspiracy
notconspiracy

2225

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#232 notconspiracy
Member since 2007 • 2225 Posts

Whenever I talk to people about religion, they always ask me "what proof is there that god does exist?" Why do I need proof to say "I believe in god?"monkeytoes61
because blind faith is unreasonable, which is why I dont base my belief in god on irrational faith

Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#233 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

123625

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

As long as He created Himself before time, He'd still be eternal.

See he didnt create himself.

... Could you repeat that in make-sense-ese?

How you can you create yourself if you have always existed?

Because you're God, and you can do anything. And perhaps as happens a lot in the Bible, God was taking our puny and limited understanding in mind when saying He is eternal.

What is your point?

That God could have created Himself? I don't know, I was kind of side-tracked from 'Jesus is God' to 'God could create Himself' somehow.

Avatar image for Insane00
Insane00

1267

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#234 Insane00
Member since 2003 • 1267 Posts

That God could have created Himself? I don't know, I was kind of side-tracked from 'Jesus is God' to 'God could create Himself' somehow.

Zagrius

That is, can God create a rock so big that he can't lift it? ;)

Avatar image for 123625
123625

9035

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#235 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts
[QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

Zagrius

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

As long as He created Himself before time, He'd still be eternal.

See he didnt create himself.

... Could you repeat that in make-sense-ese?

How you can you create yourself if you have always existed?

Because you're God, and you can do anything. And perhaps as happens a lot in the Bible, God was taking our puny and limited understanding in mind when saying He is eternal.

What is your point?

That God could have created Himself? I don't know, I was kind of side-tracked from 'Jesus is God' to 'God could create Himself' somehow.

God didnt create himself he always was. Why would god want to create somthign more powerful than himself anyway? to prove a point to you? what does he have to gain nothing.

Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#236 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="Zagrius"]

That God could have created Himself? I don't know, I was kind of side-tracked from 'Jesus is God' to 'God could create Himself' somehow.

Insane00

That is, can God create a rock so big that he can't lift it? ;)

Well, I'd say God could create a rock that He couldn't lift, and then lift it anyway. My view is that omnipotence means that He could do everything, including things that contradict logic.

And if you want to take the cop-out omnipotence view of being able to do anything that doesn't contradict logic, then He could just create a spec of a rock in space. You can't lift something if there's no gravity.

But just to clarify, I don't believe God exists.

Avatar image for james28893
james28893

3252

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 5

User Lists: 0

#237 james28893
Member since 2007 • 3252 Posts

God didnt create himself he always was. Why would god want to create somthign more powerful than himself anyway? to prove a point to you? what does he have to gain nothing.

123625

How can something "always be"?

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#238 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts
[QUOTE="Insane00"][QUOTE="Zagrius"]

That God could have created Himself? I don't know, I was kind of side-tracked from 'Jesus is God' to 'God could create Himself' somehow.

Zagrius

That is, can God create a rock so big that he can't lift it? ;)

Well, I'd say God could create a rock that He couldn't lift, and then lift it anyway. My view is that omnipotence means that He could do everything, including things that contradict logic.

And if you want to take the cop-out omnipotence view of being able to do anything that doesn't contradict logic, then He could just create a spec of a rock in space. You can't lift something if there's no gravity.

But just to clarify, I don't believe God exists.

Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#240 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="Insane00"][QUOTE="Zagrius"]

That God could have created Himself? I don't know, I was kind of side-tracked from 'Jesus is God' to 'God could create Himself' somehow.

blacktorn

That is, can God create a rock so big that he can't lift it? ;)

Well, I'd say God could create a rock that He couldn't lift, and then lift it anyway. My view is that omnipotence means that He could do everything, including things that contradict logic.

And if you want to take the cop-out omnipotence view of being able to do anything that doesn't contradict logic, then He could just create a spec of a rock in space. You can't lift something if there's no gravity.

But just to clarify, I don't believe God exists.

Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

That has little-to-nothing to do with what I wrote.

Avatar image for james28893
james28893

3252

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 5

User Lists: 0

#242 james28893
Member since 2007 • 3252 Posts

When you create something you have a begining. In a beginining you have time. God didnt create himself because he wasnt made with in time. He always existed.123625

How can something always exist?

Avatar image for 123625
123625

9035

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#243 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts

[QUOTE="123625"]

When you create something you have a begining. In a beginining you have time. God didnt create himself because he wasnt made with in time. He always existed.james28893

How can something always exist?

To be honest i dont know.

Avatar image for Insane00
Insane00

1267

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 0

#244 Insane00
Member since 2003 • 1267 Posts
[QUOTE="Insane00"][QUOTE="Zagrius"]

That God could have created Himself? I don't know, I was kind of side-tracked from 'Jesus is God' to 'God could create Himself' somehow.

Zagrius

That is, can God create a rock so big that he can't lift it? ;)

Well, I'd say God could create a rock that He couldn't lift, and then lift it anyway. My view is that omnipotence means that He could do everything, including things that contradict logic.

And if you want to take the cop-out omnipotence view of being able to do anything that doesn't contradict logic, then He could just create a spec of a rock in space. You can't lift something if there's no gravity.

But just to clarify, I don't believe God exists.

That's pretty good! Personally, I always thought this was a dumb logical conundrum anyways. God would exist outside of humanities rules and physics so to speak of anything in terms of too big to lift is kinda silly.

And I agree with you, God could contradict logic, but I think one of the important things is that if he is God, he probably wouldn't, at least not except in that his very existence is a logical contradiction. I mean essentially, the Judeo-Christian-Muslim God is all powerful, all knowing, all loving, and yet only does what falls within the 'rules' he has set up for himself. What is more interesting however is the fact that if God exists, A) how does he convince us, without killing us all and B) What sort of interactions with us is he physically limited to by A simply because of the invariable differences between our states of being?

Avatar image for Zagrius
Zagrius

3820

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#245 Zagrius
Member since 2002 • 3820 Posts
[QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="Zagrius"][QUOTE="123625"]

on't know what happened i beleive in my scriptyre god is eternal the first and the last. God wouldnt create someone of equal standing to him because he wouldnt be the most powerful.

123625

Maybe there was nothing before He created Himself.

How? my god states he's eternal. He always existed. He wasnt createed he always was.

As long as He created Himself before time, He'd still be eternal.

See he didnt create himself.

... Could you repeat that in make-sense-ese?

How you can you create yourself if you have always existed?

Because you're God, and you can do anything. And perhaps as happens a lot in the Bible, God was taking our puny and limited understanding in mind when saying He is eternal.

What is your point?

That God could have created Himself? I don't know, I was kind of side-tracked from 'Jesus is God' to 'God could create Himself' somehow.

God didnt create himself he always was. Why would god want to create somthign more powerful than himself anyway? to prove a point to you? what does he have to gain nothing.

1. How would God be more powerful than Himself?

2. As long as God created Himself before creating time, He'd still be eternal from our point of view.

When you create something you have a begining. In a beginining you have time. God didnt create himself because he wasnt created within time. He always existed.

Being God, He could create Himself outside of time.

Anywho, constrainted by the limits of time, being a lowly human, I must go to sleep.

Avatar image for james28893
james28893

3252

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 5

User Lists: 0

#246 james28893
Member since 2007 • 3252 Posts
[QUOTE="james28893"]

[QUOTE="123625"]

When you create something you have a begining. In a beginining you have time. God didnt create himself because he wasnt made with in time. He always existed.123625

How can something always exist?

To be honest i dont know.

That's where everything ends up.

Avatar image for 123625
123625

9035

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 0

#248 123625
Member since 2006 • 9035 Posts
[QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="james28893"]

[QUOTE="123625"]

When you create something you have a begining. In a beginining you have time. God didnt create himself because he wasnt made with in time. He always existed.james28893

How can something always exist?

To be honest i dont know.

That's where everything ends up.

Do you know how everything began? I simply choose to beleive in god because its the most logical thing to do to me.

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#249 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts

[QUOTE="123625"]

When you create something you have a begining. In a beginining you have time. God didnt create himself because he wasnt made with in time. He always existed.james28893

How can something always exist?

That is something that will never be revealed.

Avatar image for blacktorn
blacktorn

8299

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 7

User Lists: 0

#250 blacktorn
Member since 2004 • 8299 Posts
[QUOTE="123625"][QUOTE="james28893"]

[QUOTE="123625"]

When you create something you have a begining. In a beginining you have time. God didnt create himself because he wasnt made with in time. He always existed.james28893

How can something always exist?

To be honest i dont know.

That's where everything ends up.

and it's where ones search for knowledge begins,this is where you must choose knowledge or religion.