World War 3: Poland vs. Russia

Conflict is "settling down" in Georgia since the treaty has been signed, but they aren't the ones we should be watching. I'll give you a short history lesson:

Poland was an ally of France in WWII. Poland gets invaded, France comes to the rescue...France gets steam-rolled and then the U.S. joins in to protect France, our ally. WWII.

Okay. Now, any of you remember that not-very-well publicized event where Poland accepted the U.S. deal of installing an anti-missile system in the region? Well, we're telling everyone that it's because of Iran. Russia is claiming that it's because of their own country. So, if Russia feels threatened by this they could invade Poland (which wouldn't be difficult). The main reason Poland signed this contract is because, as part of the contract, if Poland is ever attacked we MUST come to their aid/rescue/assitance whatever you want to call it. That would mean fighting Russia. That's a possible WWIII.

It sounds unlikely, but all Russia has to do is send troops into Poland. THAT'S IT. Then we're stuck fighting in Iraq, which is sucking up most of our military equipment and funds AND we'd be fighting Russia who is a much more formidable enemy than a few Iraqi's with bombs strapped to their chests. Don't put it past Russia...but I'll let you form your own conclusions.

All Russia is trying to do is defend themselves. It's up to the west if they really want that war. Russia is right now making clear it really doesn't want the missile system there, and that it'll go to great lengths to prevent it from being built. I personally don't think it should be built either. This will just mean a new arms race will begin. Next up china is going to build these installations. 11Marcel

but you yourself said Russia is only trying to defend themselves, but what are we and other countries doing putting up the missile defense systems? Its there for defense, and by Russia attacking they would be the ones who are make the aggressive move, the unnecessary move,not us or Poland.

While that is very possible, it is also very unlikely. An invasion of Poland would not only spark a war with the US, but the rest of Europe would also go against Russia. Russia would be greatly outnumbered.surferdude17

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Cooperation_Organisation

What was that you were saying about "outnumbered"

All Russia is trying to do is defend themselves. It's up to the west if they really want that war. Russia is right now making clear it really doesn't want the missile system there, and that it'll go to great lengths to prevent it from being built. I personally don't think it should be built either. This will just mean a new arms race will begin. Next up china is going to build these installations. 11Marcel

[QUOTE="surferdude17"]While that is very possible, it is also very unlikely. An invasion of Poland would not only spark a war with the US, but the rest of Europe would also go against Russia. Russia would be greatly outnumbered.argetlam00

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Cooperation_Organisation

What was that you were saying about "outnumbered"

I just remebered that alliance which is why I took it out of my original post. I still believe that China would break that promise though. They are experiencing an economic boom while breaking ground in their political place in the world. Joining an aggresive Russia would destroy all the ground they achieved in the last 5 to 10 years.

[QUOTE="11Marcel"]All Russia is trying to do is defend themselves. It's up to the west if they really want that war. Russia is right now making clear it really doesn't want the missile system there, and that it'll go to great lengths to prevent it from being built. I personally don't think it should be built either. This will just mean a new arms race will begin. Next up china is going to build these installations. LJS9502_basic

Well the thing is, Russia is afraid that the US is surrounding it with missles and military bases. Just imagine what the US would feel like if the Russians put bases in Canada, Mexico and Cuba and said they are for "defense" even though that "defense" can be transformed into an offensive base within an hours time.

I doubt WWIII will happen because of something like thisAndYOU

who knows, all it takes is one more move by Russia and you get many nations up in arms againest them, and then what better time for Iran to make a move, next thing you know its the world vs. Russia and Iran, we can only hope Russia doesnt do anything stupid because at this point they are the ones who will decided what happens.

[QUOTE="11Marcel"]All Russia is trying to do is defend themselves. It's up to the west if they really want that war. Russia is right now making clear it really doesn't want the missile system there, and that it'll go to great lengths to prevent it from being built. I personally don't think it should be built either. This will just mean a new arms race will begin. Next up china is going to build these installations. SaintLeonidas

but you yourself said Russia is only trying to defend themselves, but what are we and other countries doing putting up the missile defense systems? Its there for defense, and by Russia attacking they would be the ones who are make the aggressive move, the unnecessary move,not us or Poland.

[QUOTE="argetlam00"]

[QUOTE="surferdude17"]While that is very possible, it is also very unlikely. An invasion of Poland would not only spark a war with the US, but the rest of Europe would also go against Russia. Russia would be greatly outnumbered.surferdude17

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Cooperation_Organisation

What was that you were saying about "outnumbered"

I just remebered that alliance which is why I took it out of my original post. I still believe that China would break that promise though. They are experiencing an economic boom while breaking ground in their political place in the world. Joining an aggresive Russia would destroy all the ground they achieved in the last 5 to 10 years.

China doesn't have much allies. Very few countries actually get along well with them. Russia and India are big allies to China and they do military training together.

I don't think Russia would go to war over Poland, they are just talking big.

[QUOTE="surferdude17"]While that is very possible, it is also very unlikely. An invasion of Poland would not only spark a war with the US, but the rest of Europe would also go against Russia. Russia would be greatly outnumbered.argetlam00

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Cooperation_Organisation

What was that you were saying about "outnumbered"

If Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

I don't think Russia would go to war over Poland, they are just talking big.

[QUOTE="argetlam00"]

[QUOTE="surferdude17"]While that is very possible, it is also very unlikely. An invasion of Poland would not only spark a war with the US, but the rest of Europe would also go against Russia. Russia would be greatly outnumbered.Chaos_HL21

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Cooperation_Organisation

What was that you were saying about "outnumbered"

If Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

Agreed, but the Russian oil, Natural gas, lumber, etc are also important to the world economy and the west. Without them, the economy can go to hell as well.

[QUOTE="11Marcel"]All Russia is trying to do is defend themselves. It's up to the west if they really want that war. Russia is right now making clear it really doesn't want the missile system there, and that it'll go to great lengths to prevent it from being built. I personally don't think it should be built either. This will just mean a new arms race will begin. Next up china is going to build these installations. LJS9502_basic

Just compare it to Russia building such a missile system on cuba. Suddenly, America can't attack its enemies with nukes anymore, but they can nuke America. Wouldn't that scare the crap out of people? Do you think it's realistic for the USA to NOT threaten Cuba?

IIf Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

Chaos_HL21

I don't think Russia would go to war over Poland, they are just talking big.

[QUOTE="argetlam00"]

[QUOTE="surferdude17"]While that is very possible, it is also very unlikely. An invasion of Poland would not only spark a war with the US, but the rest of Europe would also go against Russia. Russia would be greatly outnumbered.Chaos_HL21

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Cooperation_Organisation

What was that you were saying about "outnumbered"

If Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

Exactly correct. China is loving this economic boom and would not throw it away over Russian aggression.

[If that installation is built, the west could theoratically nuke russia down, without russia being able to do anything back. Would you feel comfortable in that position? Russia would mean nothing internationally anymore, because if they would do anything that the west doesnt like, they have to retreat because of the threat from the west.

Just compare it to Russia building such a missile system on cuba. Suddenly, America can't attack its enemies with nukes anymore, but they can nuke America. Wouldn't that scare the crap out of people? Do you think it's realistic for the USA to NOT threaten Cuba?

11Marcel

[QUOTE="Chaos_HL21"]

IIf Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

LJS9502_basic

Yes, but the world economy would also be in ruins without Russian oil, natural gas, etc. Also if Russia is destroyed (which it enver will be since it would nuke before its destroyed, China has absolutely NO allies). They get along very well with Russia and would probably join if Russia is attacked or needs help. Im just speculating though.

[QUOTE="SaintLeonidas"]

[QUOTE="11Marcel"]All Russia is trying to do is defend themselves. It's up to the west if they really want that war. Russia is right now making clear it really doesn't want the missile system there, and that it'll go to great lengths to prevent it from being built. I personally don't think it should be built either. This will just mean a new arms race will begin. Next up china is going to build these installations. 11Marcel

but you yourself said Russia is only trying to defend themselves, but what are we and other countries doing putting up the missile defense systems? Its there for defense, and by Russia attacking they would be the ones who are make the aggressive move, the unnecessary move,not us or Poland.

You are overestimating the shield. There will be about 20 counter rockets placed in Poland. Russian Nuclear potential is far greater than 20 nukes.

[QUOTE="11Marcel"]

[If that installation is built, the west could theoratically nuke russia down, without russia being able to do anything back. Would you feel comfortable in that position? Russia would mean nothing internationally anymore, because if they would do anything that the west doesnt like, they have to retreat because of the threat from the west.

Just compare it to Russia building such a missile system on cuba. Suddenly, America can't attack its enemies with nukes anymore, but they can nuke America. Wouldn't that scare the crap out of people? Do you think it's realistic for the USA to NOT threaten Cuba?

LJS9502_basic

How can you be sure of that? If the west makes Russian nukes obselete, they can destroy China and Russia completely without any risk of retaliation. The balance of the world is that countries aren't encouraged to go to war because each one fears nucleur annhiliation.

Yes, but the world economy would also be in ruins without Russian oil, natural gas, etc. Also if Russia is destroyed (which it enver will be since it would nuke before its destroyed, China has absolutely NO allies). They get along very well with Russia and would probably join if Russia is attacked or needs help. Im just speculating though.

argetlam00

[QUOTE="Chaos_HL21"]

I don't think Russia would go to war over Poland, they are just talking big.

[QUOTE="argetlam00"]

[QUOTE="surferdude17"]While that is very possible, it is also very unlikely. An invasion of Poland would not only spark a war with the US, but the rest of Europe would also go against Russia. Russia would be greatly outnumbered.argetlam00

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Cooperation_Organisation

What was that you were saying about "outnumbered"

If Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

Agreed, but the Russian oil, Natural gas, lumber, etc are also important to the world economy and the west. Without them, the economy can go to hell as well.

There are other places for them. the US is a major place for Natural Gas for one (I also think it is for Lumber too). With the Trade deficit the US has with China, it wouldn't be in China's best interest in joining a war with Russia.

[QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Chaos_HL21"]

IIf Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

argetlam00

Yes, but the world economy would also be in ruins without Russian oil, natural gas, etc. Also if Russia is destroyed (which it enver will be since it would nuke before its destroyed, China has absolutely NO allies). They get along very well with Russia and would probably join if Russia is attacked or needs help. Im just speculating though.

China and Russia are in no way "friends". They were not during the Cold War and they are not now. They have always been extremely competitive and I don't see China rushing to help out Russia. Just think of it this way; if Russia is gone that only leaves two world powers left.

How can you be sure of that? If the west makes Russian nukes obselete, they can destroy China and Russia completely without any risk of retaliation. The balance of the world is that countries aren't encouraged to go to war because each one fears nucleur annhiliation.

argetlam00

[QUOTE="argetlam00"]

How can you be sure of that? If the west makes Russian nukes obselete, they can destroy China and Russia completely without any risk of retaliation. The balance of the world is that countries aren't encouraged to go to war because each one fears nucleur annhiliation.

LJS9502_basic

Yes, but Russia is completely at American mercy if this shield is made. The US pretty much rules the world. They can force Russia to sell everything to them for free or be destroyed if they wanted to. And it doesn't matter if they would be nuked harsher, Russia has 6 thousand nukes operational, thats enough to destroy this planet multiple times.

If it were between these two countries Russia would easily win. Wouldn't be a WWIII.North-North

[QUOTE="argetlam00"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Chaos_HL21"]

IIf Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

surferdude17

Yes, but the world economy would also be in ruins without Russian oil, natural gas, etc. Also if Russia is destroyed (which it enver will be since it would nuke before its destroyed, China has absolutely NO allies). They get along very well with Russia and would probably join if Russia is attacked or needs help. Im just speculating though.

China and Russia are in no way "friends". They were not during the Cold War and they are not now. They have always been extremely competitive and I don't see China rushing to help out Russia. Just think of it this way; if Russia is gone that only leaves two world powers left.

Their relations are quite strong..And how you described China feeling at Russia is exactly how China feels at the United States.

Part of the agreement was for a US base to be established in Poland.

Russia is trying to gobble up thier old block countries again. The Wall Street journal has a fantastic story on the circumstances that brought about the conflict.

Yes, but Russia is completely at American mercy if this shield is made. The US pretty much rules the world. They can force Russia to sell everything to them for free or be destroyed if they wanted to. And it doesn't matter if they would be nuked harsher, Russia has 6 thousand nukes operational, thats enough to destroy this planet multiple times.

argetlam00

[QUOTE="surferdude17"][QUOTE="argetlam00"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Chaos_HL21"]

IIf Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

argetlam00

Yes, but the world economy would also be in ruins without Russian oil, natural gas, etc. Also if Russia is destroyed (which it enver will be since it would nuke before its destroyed, China has absolutely NO allies). They get along very well with Russia and would probably join if Russia is attacked or needs help. Im just speculating though.

China and Russia are in no way "friends". They were not during the Cold War and they are not now. They have always been extremely competitive and I don't see China rushing to help out Russia. Just think of it this way; if Russia is gone that only leaves two world powers left.

Their relations are quite strong..And how you described China feeling at Russia is exactly how China feels at the United States.

I agree that China sees the US the same way which is why I don't think they would get involved. I mean the Chinese can sit back and let the US and Russia destroy each other.

[QUOTE="argetlam00"]

Yes, but Russia is completely at American mercy if this shield is made. The US pretty much rules the world. They can force Russia to sell everything to them for free or be destroyed if they wanted to. And it doesn't matter if they would be nuked harsher, Russia has 6 thousand nukes operational, thats enough to destroy this planet multiple times.

LJS9502_basic

Nukes save the world from WW3....Without them we would probably have saw 2 more World Wars since World War 2. The Cold War would ahve been World War 3 easily. Without nucleur weapons, it leaves countries completely without worry to engage in conventional warfare. Nukes are a huge peace keeping weapon IMO. The US would be nuts to try and attack RUssia when it has nukes, visa-verca. Without them, not so much.

Part of the agreement was for a US base to be established in Poland.

Russia is trying to gobble up thier old block countries again. The Wall Street journal has a fantastic story on the circumstances that brought about the conflict.

fillini

But if that were true, wouldn;tRussia have gone to Tbilisi days ago and taken over Georgia? Everyone knows that none of the old block countries want to be in a union with Russia again, most of them are extremely pro-western. This whole mess in Georgia is being overblown and Poland is just adding fuel to an unnecessary fire.

[QUOTE="argetlam00"][QUOTE="surferdude17"][QUOTE="argetlam00"][QUOTE="LJS9502_basic"][QUOTE="Chaos_HL21"]

IIf Russia started a war with Poland and the west China wouldn't join the war. China has too many trade agreements with the US and other western nations, and joining the Russian's war would be a major hit to their economy. That is suppose to be a defensive pact, it would only work if Russia was attacked.

surferdude17

Yes, but the world economy would also be in ruins without Russian oil, natural gas, etc. Also if Russia is destroyed (which it enver will be since it would nuke before its destroyed, China has absolutely NO allies). They get along very well with Russia and would probably join if Russia is attacked or needs help. Im just speculating though.

China and Russia are in no way "friends". They were not during the Cold War and they are not now. They have always been extremely competitive and I don't see China rushing to help out Russia. Just think of it this way; if Russia is gone that only leaves two world powers left.

Their relations are quite strong..And how you described China feeling at Russia is exactly how China feels at the United States.

I agree that China sees the US the same way which is why I don't think they would get involved. I mean the Chinese can sit back and let the US and Russia destroy each other.

You are just speculating. I can say the same thing about NATO. They wouldn't want to be destroyed by nukes, so they'll stay out.

Nukes save the world from WW3....Without them we would probably have saw 2 more World Wars since World War 2. The Cold War would ahve been World War 3 easily. Without nucleur weapons, it leaves countries completely without worry to engage in conventional warfare. Nukes are a huge peace keeping weapon IMO. The US would be nuts to try and attack RUssia when it has nukes, visa-verca. Without them, not so much.

argetlam00

[QUOTE="argetlam00"]

Nukes save the world from WW3....Without them we would probably have saw 2 more World Wars since World War 2. The Cold War would ahve been World War 3 easily. Without nucleur weapons, it leaves countries completely without worry to engage in conventional warfare. Nukes are a huge peace keeping weapon IMO. The US would be nuts to try and attack RUssia when it has nukes, visa-verca. Without them, not so much.

LJS9502_basic

Yes they are...During the Cold War, only nukes kept the USSR and US from destroying each other. They came severely close to it, even with them.

[QUOTE="11Marcel"]All Russia is trying to do is defend themselves. It's up to the west if they really want that war. Russia is right now making clear it really doesn't want the missile system there, and that it'll go to great lengths to prevent it from being built. I personally don't think it should be built either. This will just mean a new arms race will begin. Next up china is going to build these installations. SaintLeonidas

but you yourself said Russia is only trying to defend themselves, but what are we and other countries doing putting up the missile defense systems? Its there for defense, and by Russia attacking they would be the ones who are make the aggressive move, the unnecessary move,not us or Poland.

Think about it, is it there for Iran? Iran can't do ****. All they are good at is at threatening Israel with photoshopped missiles. lol

Yes they are...During the Cold War, only nukes kept the USSR and US from destroying each other. They came severely close to it, even with them.

argetlam00

[QUOTE="surferdude17"]While that is very possible, it is also very unlikely. An invasion of Poland would not only spark a war with the US, but the rest of Europe would also go against Russia. Russia would be greatly outnumbered.argetlam00

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Cooperation_Organisation

What was that you were saying about "outnumbered"

The Chinese hate Russia.