Another dev speaks out with negative criticism of the X1X, citing the poor CPU.

@kingtito: "EVERYONE is going to like game A because YOU/COWS like it?"

No, I'm saying the PS4 has more and higher quality games by the industry standard than the X1 by far. And since the gaming industry is about games, that pretty much destroys the X1. The PS4 has more games = FACT. The PS4 has a higher scoring and bigger library = FACT.

Wake up from your butthurt slumber lemming.

No you moron, the front page of SWs. Seriously? I needed to explain that to you?

Again being willfully ignorant. You're just a broken record. I'm done with you.

Once again that's an opinion. You could say it has higher scoring games in reviews but then reviews are opinions. Do you seriously not know what facts are? I'm thinking not.

More =/= better and THAT is what cows have maintained ALL last gen.

Oh so your proof is the frontpage of the forum? That's moronic, specially after I gave you a perfectly good explanation as to why there are more threads against the Xbox than against the PS: the PS is doing great this gen and its detractors have not much ammo while the Xbox is doing pathetic this gen which gives a lot of ammo to its detractors. It's just the natural cycle of the system wars since Nintendo vs Sega, no need to go and make up conspiracy theories without real evidence out of butthurt.

Higher number of games = not opinion

Higher average of professional industry reviews = not opinion.

The reviews themselves are opinions and most are a mixture of opinions and facts like game performance, but the consensus of the industry of the higher quality of the PS4 library is not an opinion, it is a fact.

"More =/= better"

Oh so more pixels =/= better? So I guess the X1X is not better in any way afterall then.

I think your butthurt is getting you confused lemming. You always make a mess with your arguments and end up sticking your foot up your mouth because of trying to rationalize irrationality.

El tormented? Your reading comprehension level is just as bad. More wasn't questioned but quality if subjective. Not very hard to understand but given how piss poor your reading is I guess it is.

Higher number of high reviews isn't and has never been in question. The actual review is an opinion however. Getting paid doesn't make your opinion more true than any other. Not rocket science cow.

As I said it's still a collection of opinions and no matter big that collection is nothing can change that fact. What one person finds entertaining doesn't mean everyone else will. What one person enjoys in a game isn't going to be the same for everyone else. That is why a better library is subjective. Once again this isn't rocket science.

More pixels doesn't make the game better or more enjoyable. Doesn't negate the fact that the X1X has better hardware over the Pro in almost every conceivable way. That's a fact and verifiable.

I think you're just a Sony shill, ignorant and blind.

@kingtito: "More wasn't questioned but quality if subjective."

It is a fact that there is a consensus of higher quality on the PS4 from the gaming industry. Stop spinning with your butthurt and playing semantics just because you can't handle reality.

"Doesn't negate the fact that the X1X has better hardware over the Pro"

And nobody is negating that, as nobody negates that the PS4 has better hardware than the X1. But nobody except butthurt lemmings like you negate that the PS4 has a better library of games this gen.

Really your butthurt is making you pathetically delusional.

X1X, LOL.

PS4 > XBOne hardware
X1X > PS4 Pro hardware
PS > MS for games

... sounds about right.

Collection of opinion is still a collection of opinion moron. One library isn't going to be better if that person likes the games better on the other system. What don't you understand you? I never questioned which system has the most games or the highest scoring games by reviewers. I'm saying the better library is entirely dependent on the individual. That means it's subjective and only pertains to that particular person. I know you're not the sharpest tool in the shed. Losing the most powerful console title has you shook and butthurt but use some common sense.

You are cow. It's the entire basis for your argument. You're trying to bring in a subjective point with your games argument. You're acting like your opinion on games is fact when it's not.

You're stuck on stupid right now going round and round. You sure you're not el tormenteds alt?

@kingtito: "I never questioned which system has the most games or the highest scoring games by reviewers."

That is what I'm saying but you're playing with semantics which is the lowest form of arguing. Not surprising that a butthurted mind as yours can't generate something more worthwhile.

"You're acting like your opinion on games is fact"

No, that there's is a higher consensus of opinions that PS4 games are better is a fact though.

Stop damage controlling in such a pathetic way lemming.

You're the one that responded with this shit. I plainly said in my 1st post the hardware is above and beyond the Pro and don't bother bringing up games because which library is better is entirely subjective.

I never argued that point and in fact agreed with it.

Said the pot to the kettle.

@reduc_ab_: But still has unmatched performance from any other console. I love it.

@kingtito: "the hardware is above and beyond the Pro"

I have not once disputed that, if you claim I have then you're once again the hypocrite here

"don't bother bringing up games because which library is better is entirely subjective."

You cannot set the rules to argue on SW just because a solid argument makes you butthurt. This is not your safe space where you can shield yourself from facts that make you cry. The fact that there's a consensus on the industry that the PS4 has more and better games is just that, a fact, no matter how much you try to shield yourself from reality through denial.

Butthurt Cows, LOL.

Wait, I'm the hypocrite because you said the Pro is better than the X1X and I responded with not the hardware? El Tormented?

Why can't I set the rules for the argument I made? I said it's has better hardware. You implied the Pro was better not just in software but hardware as well. My entire argument is with regards to hardware. You're hell bent on having an argument and it doesn't matter what it's about. You're so sad and pathetic you have to manufacture one.

So you have to rely on what OTHERS tell you is better? Sorry cow but I'd rather form my own, especially since it comes out of my pockets. You should try it sometime. It's great having independent thought.

@kingtito: "You implied the Pro was better not just in software but hardware as well."

Don't lie lemming, you have fallen low enough already. Quote where I said the hardware is better. I said the PS4 beats the X1 where it more matters on a gaming industry: in games. You're a pathetic excuse for a debater you know that right?

"Why can't I set the rules"

Because that's not how argumentation works, you can't choose what's real or valid and what not. That's being a coward who can't deal with reality. SW has always used games as a way to argue against systems, you now want to change that because it makes you butthurt but your butthurt is not a good reason to change how things have worked since the beginning.

"So you have to rely on what OTHERS tell you is better"

No, I never said that, again putting words in my mouth because you're too much of a coward to tackle the actual argument you know you already lost. I can recognize when there's a consensus about the quality of the games being better on the PS4, that's not relying on others for my own assessments, that's just observing a fact of the real world. You on the other hand are too much of a chicken to even face reality and try to change reality in your delusional mind using semantics to avoid being hurt and crying more.

You have no independent thought, your mind is a slave of butthurt and denial which is the most pathetic state a fanboy mind can be at.

Lmao, no. Opinions aren't facts... even though you like to think they are. Who are you, Donald Trump?

Don't need to lie son, you prove with each ignorant post you put up.

Said the pot to the kettle. You do know you have nothing to argue about right? Games == subjective, hardware == X1X without question. What can you say other than sales. You're about as pathetic as one can get.

The argument was about hardware. The argument wasn't about games until you pathetically brought them in because you can't say anything about what I referenced. Your only choice was to manufacture one where one didn't exist. Yeah it is pathetic.

That is literally what you said. You constantly bring up reviews and talk about that determining which library is better for any one individual. So basically your entire argument is based on other peoples opinions. Like I said, form your own for once.

LOLOLOL using my argument now? Thanks for proving you can't think for yourself. I can't wait for Sony and the reviewers to tell me what you think of the next game or product to come out. No need to ask for your opinion any longer. Hahahaha damn you're pathetic.

I swear you remind of someone else that also couldn't think for himself. Used reviews and Sony to form his thoughts. You're definitely an alt.

Yeah, we established he was an alt ages ago... just wondering who. Dakur is my guess.

And another delusional lemming comes to help his butthurt comrade. I never said opinions are facts, learn to read. I said that the consensus of the reviewers is that the PS4 has better game and that consensus is a fact given by the highest scores, there's no way around that fact you butthurt lemmings.

@kingtito: "Games == subjective, hardware == X1X"

No, it is

Consensus on the quality of games from reviewers == PS4

Amount of games == PS4

Hardware == X1<PS4<Pro<1X

That's the real world lemming, everything else is your butthurt and denial talking.

"The argument was about hardware"

Not mine, you said the 1X was superior from every angle. I educated you in that it wasn't superior on the most important one: games

"you pathetically brought them in"

You think bringing up games on a gaming forum is pathetic? lol I've never heard something more pathetic to avoid ownage lemming. Talking about games on a gaming forum is not manufacturing anything. Trying to pretend gaming is not about games like you pathetic lems have done this gen all the time is what is sad and pathetic.

"You constantly bring up reviews and talk about that determining which library is better"

Well according to the consensus of the gaming industry the PS4 has better games by far, there's no denying that fact. I know it makes you butthurt but it is what it is.

"using my argument now?"

lol what argument, you have no argument, I only read butthurt, denial and damage control to the point where you need to escape reality like the coward you are.

XBO's hardware power has affected games like Scalebound (open world UE4)'s creativity with unresolved performance issues. Hardware power gives certain level of creative freedom.

X1X's FLOPS gap with XBO is like a jump from X360 to XBO and X1X is effectively a rebooted XBO with a better memory model.

The focus on maximum optimization for XBO will probably drop as X1X progressively takes over Xbox platform.

Cows like Tormented or Pinkyanimal/dakur can argue against MS's balance TFLOPS vs memory bandwidth arguments for X1X but Nvidia's GTX 980 Ti has shown a proven balance for 6 TFLOPS class GPU vs memory bandwidth. Any machine with 6 TFLOPS class GPU that follows Nvidia's GTX 980 Ti balance approach, then this machine has the superior 6 TFLOPS class GPU. IF Sony hasn't learn any lessons from NVidia's Maxwell V2 balance approach, they will repeat the same mistakes and PS4 Pro shows the same mistakes.

When Nvidia is king, it's wise to follow dear leader's arguments. My GPU memory bandwidth arguments are based on Nvidia's GTX 980 Ti balance arguments.

PS4 Pro could have followed NVidia's GTX 980 4 TFLOPS class balance arguments.

IF PS5 has something like Vega 64's balance with NAVI 11, it's another bottlenecked box. GTX 1080 Ti's memory bandwidth with it's 100 percent DCC boost vs it's 12.9 TFLOPS is a better balance box.

PS DF has memory over clocked Vega 56 (210 watts) with Vega 64's 484 GB/s memory bandwidth and the result is closer to GTX 1080's TDP and performance. AMD has executed poor craftsmanship with Vega. Vega needs additional tweaking to make it polished like GTX 1080, but AMD brute force the problem with Vega 64 with 295 watts results. AMD needs to fix their DCC problems.

You're really going all in with the fascists

And what does this have to do with anything I said spambot? your brain is glitching again.

lol I really think ron is suffering from some mental condition, who the hell talks like this?

....dear......leader's? Huh?

@ronvalenciasaid: The focus on maximum optimization for XBO will probably drop as X1X progressively takes over Xbox platform.

Yeah that's not gonna happen. Everything will still need to be optimized for XBO. Do you really think they'd release X1X exclusive titles and alienate like 90% of their user base?

Lack of ESRAM related optimizations doesn't equal no game for XBO. A game programmer can treat XBO's slow 68 GB/s flat memory model machine like X1X's 326 GB/s flat memory model machine.

XBO's recent SDK has an API that sets up a frame buffer surface that uses both ESRAM and DDR3 in a split format. The same API on X1X would be running on GDDR5 memory pool.

XBO's DDR3 handles the spill over from 32 MB ESRAM.

Without using PRT with ESRAM as per Forza's example, XBO's split render workaround doesn't address the initial texture fetch memory bandwidth bottleneck.

You talk about library quality and as an example, XBO lost Scalebound mostly due to unresolved performance problems. Hardware performance can influence creativity.

You haven't addressed the system war argument.

PS; Most corporate governance has dictatorship format.

What argument? I was just pointing out your weird love of fascism

@ronvalencia: You can spout technical mumbo jumbo all you want, but games will still be built and optimized for the lowest common denominator. IE: XBO.

Whatever tweaks they do to improve image quality for the X1X would be considered optimizing for X1X, not the other way around.

That's actually not true of game development especially when PC's are involved, that's a shitty myth. When they create assets, textures, models and so on and so forth they are of a higher spec and are scaled down for specific functionality. This is the exact reason Microsoft's development kit for the Xbox One X is higher spec'd than the actual consumer model.

It's much easier to build something with excess and then scale down and refine than it is to build something lesser and then have to rework everything to scale up. Take a game like Battlefront 2 for example, the baseline build of that game will be its highest end PC configuration, everything will be scaled down from that build to lesser configuration settings which allow you to toggle settings and subsequently console builds based upon custom configurations.

If this is the Xbox One

|-------------------|

This is an Xbox One X

|------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|

And this is a high end PC

|-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|

The game will be designed to this PC spec or beyond and then scaled back and fined tune accordingly to lesser platforms.

Texture resolution perhaps, anti-aliasing effects, anisotropic filtering, sure. Not so sure what you mean by "models". Are you talking polygon count now? Because even if it's true that they could build higher poly count models specifically for the X1X, then scale them down for the XBO, how many developers do you think will actually do that? Why would any dev put in the effort for such a small user base?

Games will still be designed with the lowest common denominator in mind. No developer wants to do all that work twice.

I predict that the vast majority of games on X1X will have the exact same polygon count, but just render in checkerboard 4K. Maybe some higher resolution textures here and there, and some forced AF effects. That's it.

@ronvalencia: "You talk about library quality and as an example, XBO lost Scalebound mostly due to unresolved performance problems. Hardware performance can influence creativity."

No, they probably canceled it because they are incompetent managers for game development. MS has a history of being a lousy manager with game companies they cooperate with so it wasn't surprising. And if you plan to make a game that goes beyond the capabilities of the system you have then that's also a managerial incompetence.

Level of detail, sub surface scattering and geometry complexity which can easily be scaled. As Phil Specer said most developers these days are building games with high spec PC's in mind, these games scale from top to bottom to begin with so absolutely nothing new is going on here.

Developers can disable and scale systems back in their games to flat shaded 3D if they wanted, they're not working twice, they're mostly disabling systems in place for lower spec'd machines. Building a game around the lowest common denominator is a stupid way to go about things and no one really does it.

It involves far more work as you build to a spec and then have to rework and further design everything to go beyond that point, as I said they develop upwards and then configure downward, not develop downward and configure upward.

Lol, what? That's all Platinum Games... You really are a buffoon.

@FastRobby: "Lol, what? That's all Platinum Games... You really are a buffoon"

Nope, MS kept changing the requirements for the game and expecting PG to deliver something that was not possible on the weak XO hardware. PG has never had problems like that with any other company while we have seen the same shitty management from MS several times to the point of destroying a company from within. This simply looks like another case of MS incompetence and lack of compromise.

What a biased, hack job attempt at gaming journalism. For those that actually read the article. He said: “The Xbox One X is closer in specs to the PC gaming rigs right now, which will always benefit developers releasing their games on multiple platforms.

Hack job writer attempted to turn this into a negative when they actually are praising it and comparing it to most gaming PCs.

Fake news, click bait, your site will be dead soon.

@pinkanimal: If I was MS I would have someone go break platinum games legs for stealing my money to fund other projects and have the nerve to ask me for more!

Lets say you take a old Ford Mustang in to get fixed up and pay the mechanic up front, you wait and wait and Joe down the block has his car back , and Tom the plumber has his car back but you were there first and now he wants more money?! And now he is working on a project car of his own?! I would take my damn car back! And if I had a crooked nose would bust that A-holes hands.

It's obvious Platinum Games used the money for other projects, were understaffed, could not deliver and screwed MS.

Phil Spencer is too nice of a guy, and really needs to take the gloves off publicly once in a while.

BS, there's no proof for that. My conclusion is also based on mostly speculation but at least it has a history that supports it. If PG works in such a way how come it is the first time that happens to them? Why hasn't the same happened to their cooperation with other companies? On the other hand MS has a history of being a shitty manager, like I said, destroying even the culture of companies from within thanks to a toxic corporate management like the head of FASA put it back in the day when MS rode the company to the ground.

To use your metaphor it would be like a person taking their old Mustang and asking the mechanic to fix it, then the mechanic is in the middle of fixing it and the person comes and tells the mechanic that it now wants the Ford Mustang converted to a BMW, the mechanic loses his motivation because the task suddenly became harder but still keeps trying. Suddenly again the person comes and tells the mechanic that they also want their new BMW to fly at which point the mechanic starts losing his mind and starts sending everyone to hell. MS kept changing the goals including adding multiplayer to a game that was clearly meant as a single player experience from the start. What MS required was simply unrealistic and their management sucked.

@pinkanimal: That's BS! Look at all the other projects they were working on. That last game saved their A#*

All from money they stole from MS after they knew they could not finish the job they pitched in the time frame promised. Let's get something straight here. Platinum is the one that went to MS with the idea, told them they would meet benchmarks and was not holding up their end. Japanese titles realistically only do so well, it was a money pit. I have been there personally on cars and houses. Sometimes you have to cash out at a loss before it gets worse. Do you want to lose 10k or 20k? Now put that into game Dev numbers.

Bottom line. stop blaming Scalebound all on MS. As you said you are speculating. Stop derailing the original topic, which was a blatant media biased, click bait, hack job and good day.

@the-a-baum: "All from money they stole from MS after they knew they could not finish the job they pitched in the time frame promised."

Again, that's complete BS and speculation on your part. If that were true MS could have sued them to oblivion since stealing funds is against the law. The most probable situation is that MS is a lousy manager like they have proven to be in other game projects. Stop shilling for MS and shitting on companies that are actually doing good to gaming.

This is how it works, MS hired them to do a job, they didn't do it, so they got fired, end of story!

That's a very stupid and simplistic way to look into the situation, if the job requirements keep changing and become unattainable then the fault lies on the one who hires for the job not the ones who are supposed to do the job. The employer has to be realistic and responsible too.

Both cpus in the PS4 Pro and Xbox one x are crap. The jaguar architecture is too slow. Hopefully both use ryzen cpus in their next systems.

No, you are AzatiS!!! Owning of many you have done. Cower in fear they is

How do you know what system I play more? I own a PS4 but how do you know what I put more time into?

You is AzatiS!!!!!

Yeah Opinions MS and Sony use on their ads because they are a weight,the same opinions who make Halo gears and Forza greats games over other less scoring games hypocrite.

Don't make me quote you defending this site Opinion over Metacritic opinion because it served you best on Forza 5 review thread.

Scores is what the industry use to determine quality deal with it.

Is 43% more powerful hypocrite when it was the PS4 having 40% advantage you claim it was minimal now is abode and beyond the Pro because it is the xbox one...lol

Hahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa...

Subjective...hahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaa

The PS4 has more and higher scoring game is not subjective is a FACT,you can't claim Forza is better than DriveClub without scores backing you up,so stop your bullshit and hypocrisy scores is what determine how good or bad a line up is,this year the xbox one has been totally abysmal,there has been only 1 game on xbox one not on PS4 with 90 or better score FH3,the xbox 360 by comparison by 2007 its second year it had like 8 or 9 games not on PS3 with 90 or better score.

Which is why the xbox 360 was consider superior back them.

Without scores Halo is no better than killzone and any argument you make is subjective because it would be based on your opinion vs mine,not over a industry standard,so yeah the PS4 is factually a better console game wise than the xbox one,more and higher rated games do prove it.

The only reason you stopped riding score is because the xbox one sucked so much,but on 2013 you were defending this site giving Forza 5 a 9 score over Metacritic which actually had the game with 79 because most of the industry didn't think F5 was a 9.

@kingtito said:

That's such BS. The 360 had more games, more higher scoring games and just as much diversity. It wasn't just Gear, Forza and Halo though they were MSs biggest hitters.

https://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/anyone-else-happy-tomb-raider-flopped-in-sales-32829895/?page=14

Time to hide on reading comprehension again hypocrite like you always do when i own you ass...hahahahaaaa

I don't see you using the word subjective there to claim the 360 had more games and higher scoring games..

You got that hypocrite good.