Do we WANT Nintendo to win?

oh god, there is so much ignorance in this thread....

why do ppl act like nintendo will destroy gaming??

dirty_diaz

Imagine that the game industry has 2 billion to play with.  Imagine that right now 1 billion is for casual games, and 1 billion for hardcore games (just using random numbers, i know the proportions aren't right).  Then imagin that the casual games do better than the hardcore games because of the Wii (which they are).  All of a sudden, there is a shift in supply to coincide with the shift in demand, and since casual and hardcore games are substitutes, the amount of money spent towards casual games goes up and hardcore games goes down.  Say 1.5 for casual and .5 for hardcore.  That means fewer and more cheaply made hardcore games, and more minigames.  We suffer.  This is a fact, it's basic economic theory.

[QUOTE="dirty_diaz"]

oh god, there is so much ignorance in this thread....

why do ppl act like nintendo will destroy gaming??

osirisomeomi

Imagine that the game industry has 2 billion to play with.  Imagine that right now 1 billion is for casual games, and 1 billion for hardcore games (just using random numbers, i know the proportions aren't right).  Then imagin that the casual games do better than the hardcore games because of the Wii (which they are).  All of a sudden, there is a shift in supply to coincide with the shift in demand, and since casual and hardcore games are substitutes, the amount of money spent towards casual games goes up and hardcore games goes down.  Say 1.5 for casual and .5 for hardcore.  That means fewer and more cheaply made hardcore games, and more minigames.  We suffer.  This is a fact, it's basic economic theory.

You assume a constant unchanging amount of funds to work with.  If the industry expands there will be more funds available to fuel more game development of all types. 

Yeah, I wanted to keep things simple.  If the industry expands towards casua gamest though, there is a distinct possibility that there will still be a net loss from the hardcore side of things.  say this scenario:

2 billion, 1 billion each

casual games: market grows by .3 billion, shift of .2 billion towards casual games.

1.45 billion for casuals, .95 billion for hardcore games.

That's a plausible scenario. 

Before: "Wii will never win!"

After: "If Wii wins, it will destroy gaming!"

I'm getting pretty tired of this. "Oh no! It has a few party games that are actually good!" 

>_>

[QUOTE="dirty_diaz"]

oh god, there is so much ignorance in this thread....

why do ppl act like nintendo will destroy gaming??

osirisomeomi

Imagine that the game industry has 2 billion to play with. Imagine that right now 1 billion is for casual games, and 1 billion for hardcore games (just using random numbers, i know the proportions aren't right). Then imagin that the casual games do better than the hardcore games because of the Wii (which they are). All of a sudden, there is a shift in supply to coincide with the shift in demand, and since casual and hardcore games are substitutes, the amount of money spent towards casual games goes up and hardcore games goes down. Say 1.5 for casual and .5 for hardcore. That means fewer and more cheaply made hardcore games, and more minigames. We suffer. This is a fact, it's basic economic theory.

Umm right now that context on the 360 fits more like 1.9 billion casuals and .1 billion hardcore. 

Yeah, I wanted to keep things simple. If the industry expands towards casua gamest though, there is a distinct possibility that there will still be a net loss from the hardcore side of things. say this scenario:

2 billion, 1 billion each

casual games: market grows by .3 billion, shift of .2 billion towards casual games.

1.45 billion for casuals, .95 billion for hardcore games.

That's a plausible scenario.

osirisomeomi

you're complicating this, games are games, and the bigger the market the better

You think just because of all the new styles of games that are coming and what Nintendo is doing the old ones will die out?

the market will expand as a whole and the old games will stay true with it, look at manhunt coming to the wii. 

Yeah, I wanted to keep things simple.  If the industry expands towards casua gamest though, there is a distinct possibility that there will still be a net loss from the hardcore side of things.  say this scenario:

2 billion, 1 billion each

casual games: market grows by .3 billion, shift of .2 billion towards casual games.

1.45 billion for casuals, .95 billion for hardcore games.

That's a plausible scenario. 

osirisomeomi

Pulling numbers out of the air and pointing to them doesn't really qualify as a plausible scenario.  There's more to it than just a type of game selling well. 

[QUOTE="osirisomeomi"]

Yeah, I wanted to keep things simple. If the industry expands towards casua gamest though, there is a distinct possibility that there will still be a net loss from the hardcore side of things. say this scenario:

2 billion, 1 billion each

casual games: market grows by .3 billion, shift of .2 billion towards casual games.

1.45 billion for casuals, .95 billion for hardcore games.

That's a plausible scenario.

DarkStar_109

you're complicating this, games are games, and the bigger the market the better

You think just because of all the new styles of games that are coming and what Nintendo is doing the old ones will die out?

the market will expand as a whole and the old games will stay true with it, look at manhunt coming to the wii.

No, I'm saying that if the market shifts more towards casual games (which is happening), then the number nd quality of hardcore games will suffer.  it's just logic. 

[QUOTE="yoshi_64"]

 

If MS wins, it means we'll be seeing more behind the times format for gaming, shoddy hardware

spinecaton

And if Nintendo wins, we will be seeing outdated hardware.

So you prefer excellent hardware, like the 3D0, the Gizmondo, the Gamecube, the X-Box, and the PSP?

[QUOTE="dirty_diaz"]

oh god, there is so much ignorance in this thread....

why do ppl act like nintendo will destroy gaming??

osirisomeomi

Imagine that the game industry has 2 billion to play with. Imagine that right now 1 billion is for casual games, and 1 billion for hardcore games (just using random numbers, i know the proportions aren't right). Then imagin that the casual games do better than the hardcore games because of the Wii (which they are). All of a sudden, there is a shift in supply to coincide with the shift in demand, and since casual and hardcore games are substitutes, the amount of money spent towards casual games goes up and hardcore games goes down. Say 1.5 for casual and .5 for hardcore. That means fewer and more cheaply made hardcore games, and more minigames. We suffer. This is a fact, it's basic economic theory.

You assume Hardcore gamers are a majority, or at least equal.  Hardcores have always been a minority, yet we still see games like SMG, MP3, GTA4, MGS4, Halo3, and Gears of War. 

The thing that gets me is how people associate this "shift" with Nintendo. What, the Wii is somehow magically making games less complex? I'd put far more blame on GTA and its clones. >_>PannicAtack

Look at the games coming out on it. Super Paper Mario, Rayman, Pokemon, Mario Party, Super Mario Galaxy. Where's games like Ninja Gaiden, Metal Gear Solid, Final Fantasy, Unreal Tournament, etc. The only adult oriented game I've seen so far is Manhunt 2. The console itself and it's games are aimed towards casual and young gamers. Games like Manhunt 2 are the exception, not the rule.

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"]The thing that gets me is how people associate this "shift" with Nintendo. What, the Wii is somehow magically making games less complex? I'd put far more blame on GTA and its clones. >_>Thompsonwhore

Look at the games coming out on it. Super Paper Mario, Rayman, Pokemon, Mario Party, Super Mario Galaxy. Where's games like Ninja Gaiden, Metal Gear Solid, Final Fantasy, Unreal Tournament, etc. The only adult oriented game I've seen so far is Manhunt 2. The console itself and it's games are aimed towards casual and young gamers. Games like Manhunt 2 are the exception, not the rule.

[QUOTE="osirisomeomi"][QUOTE="dirty_diaz"]

oh god, there is so much ignorance in this thread....

why do ppl act like nintendo will destroy gaming??

Tylendal

Imagine that the game industry has 2 billion to play with. Imagine that right now 1 billion is for casual games, and 1 billion for hardcore games (just using random numbers, i know the proportions aren't right). Then imagin that the casual games do better than the hardcore games because of the Wii (which they are). All of a sudden, there is a shift in supply to coincide with the shift in demand, and since casual and hardcore games are substitutes, the amount of money spent towards casual games goes up and hardcore games goes down. Say 1.5 for casual and .5 for hardcore. That means fewer and more cheaply made hardcore games, and more minigames. We suffer. This is a fact, it's basic economic theory.

You assume Hardcore gamers are a majority, or at least equal. Hardcores have always been a minority, yet we still see games like SMG, MP3, GTA4, MGS4, Halo3, and Gears of War.

Just making up some numbers to prove the point.  And some of those games are big sellers, it's true, but they are the exceptions to the rule.  And who knows, maybe in ten years some of these name won't be popular anymore.

I'd prefer the PS3 to win because I think it has the best lineup.

If Wii manages to get better games than the PS3 then I'd be fine with it winning the console war. 

I'd prefer the PS3 to win because I think it has the best lineup.

If Wii manages to get better games than the PS3 then I'd be fine with it winning the console war. 

the-very-best

Thank you!!! At least someone has some common sense.

[QUOTE="PannicAtack"]The thing that gets me is how people associate this "shift" with Nintendo. What, the Wii is somehow magically making games less complex? I'd put far more blame on GTA and its clones. >_>Thompsonwhore

Look at the games coming out on it. Super Paper Mario, Rayman, Pokemon, Mario Party, Super Mario Galaxy. Where's games like Ninja Gaiden, Metal Gear Solid, Final Fantasy, Unreal Tournament, etc. The only adult oriented game I've seen so far is Manhunt 2. The console itself and it's games are aimed towards casual and young gamers. Games like Manhunt 2 are the exception, not the rule.

First of all Final Fantasy is the casual of the casual when it comes to JRPG's.

Second of all every game you named is a quality title so I see no wrong in it. 

[QUOTE="the-very-best"]

I'd prefer the PS3 to win because I think it has the best lineup.

If Wii manages to get better games than the PS3 then I'd be fine with it winning the console war.

magiciandude

Thank you!!! At least someone has some common sense.

None of you have common sense. I mean video games have absolutly nothing to do with gaming.