Does Microsoft even know what they're doing any more?

First they wanna screw gamers with the always-on DRM and spy features, then they do a complete 180. They talk about "the power of the cloud" to compensate for their engineering decisions. They pay for reviews and positive publicity, hire stand-ins to generate fake applause at live events.

Now they're monkeying around with their GPU reserve to fill the gaps and be competitive.

http://www.gamechup.com/industry-insider-xbox-one-10-reserved-gpu-getting-turned-into-2-soon/

What's next in this shady soap opera?

I'd say they either filled their x box division with people who are way out of touch with gamers or they simply took their fan base for granted, thinking we would jump in as long as a big X was on the box... They pulled a Gen 7 Sony.

That said... I think they'll come back strong.

Forcing people to pay to play online?

Oh wait, that already happened

Also, look at what they are doing with Windows.

They are pretty screwed.

At this point i would say yes they know what they are doing. They have the games and entertainment features that aren't close to being matched by Sony currently. PS4 has "better" specs but nothing to show for it if you ask me. What good is next gen on the ps4 atm with nothing but arcade games coming out that could be played on a computer or last gen? All the multiplats can be enjoyed elsewhere by definition.

With no Uncharted or TLOU this year, from what i've read recently, 2014 doesn't look to change that too much

Sony wasn't nearly as bad as MS with the Xbone reveal.

Gamers are not that smart you know, if Microsoft commited to their original plan I'm sure they wouldve been just Fine. Steam is proof that if you stay long enough people will put down their picket signs and give in.

Gamers have the spines of gummy bears, they can only hold out for so long.

I agree, Microsoft should have stuck to their guns and let the system they originally envisioned come to fruition. There are developers and gamers who actually wanted that stuff to happen, because it appeals to certain philosophies. As a result, they tried to change everything at the last second, so now they're stuck with a sup-par gaming system that's too expensive to appeal to the only group left that would have them otherwise, the casual gamers and family entertainment crowd.

No, they don't. Always online is the most stupid thing they could have possibly tried with their console and they rightfully got torn to pieces over it. The media focus is good but NOT at the cost of damaging the core gaming function. Hello, inferior 720P multiplats.

Now their console seems to lack identity. I know exactly what the PS4 is, the most high end core gaming console with the best multiplats and arguably best 1st party developers. I don't know what the Xbox One is supposed to be about. They went so nuts with apps and Skype and NFL and snapping and web browsing and christ knows what else that I just don't know.

I dunno..........I'm quite happy with my Xbox One. I kinda even like Windows 8.1

Believe it or not, there were groups out there that was severely pissed that Microsoft didn't go through with their original plans. They imagined a community that was only opened to a select group of people of the ideology that always-on internet, no used games and such would mean a higher class of consumers who wanted constant connectivity and a high-end online experience that was custom made for gamers who never leave XBL.

Have you made the jump to the new gen yet?

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

I'd say they either filled their x box division with people who are way out of touch with gamers or they simply took their fan base for granted, thinking we would jump in as long as a big X was on the box... They pulled a Gen 7 Sony.

That said... I think they'll come back strong.

Sony wasn't nearly as bad as MS with the Xbone reveal.

I don't know man... as much as I'll agree that MS had waaaay too many things wrongly aligned with consumer wishes, dat $600 price announcement coupled by incredibly weak games, was like dropping an Abomb of NO and the sales reflected that.

Don Mattrick, Albert Penello, Yusuf Mehdi.

Here's an article interviewing the second of the Three Shitsketeers, showing how much he still doesn't get it.

They tried to get their fingers in all the entertainment pies from just one hand. Little did they know that the stretch between fingers was going to be quite painful and it shows.

They knew what they wanted to do before the crowd reacted to what they wanted to do. Now, they just want to sell XBones but it has no message or direction.

That's why we get this bullshit PR like "PS4 and XBone are similar in power"

or the infamous "Power of the cloud".

It was all good to tell everyone beforehand that they look at themselves as an entertainment brand and all, but no one wants that. They tried to push gaming in a direction it will never go. Now they need to spin themselves out of the hole they dug and it won't be easy because the machine itself is architected and on shelves to do something completely different. In short, MSes goals were not aligned with their target market. Only the MS flag waving fanboys will tell you otherwise. Reality hasn't set in for them, yet.

The Marketed the Xbone as an All-in-One machine, hence the name Xbox One. Their focus on those non-gaming apps seemed more like a HTPC over a game console. The same can be said about the PS3 last gen.

They´ve been fucking up in many ways but they´re still not as bad or as clueless as nintendo is these days.

Nintendo is pretty much the one that doesn´t seem to know what they´re doing anymore in the home console market.

@TheEroica said:

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

I'd say they either filled their x box division with people who are way out of touch with gamers or they simply took their fan base for granted, thinking we would jump in as long as a big X was on the box... They pulled a Gen 7 Sony.

That said... I think they'll come back strong.

Sony wasn't nearly as bad as MS with the Xbone reveal.

I don't know man... as much as I'll agree that MS had waaaay too many things wrongly aligned with consumer wishes, dat $600 price announcement coupled by incredibly weak games, was like dropping an Abomb of NO and the sales reflected that.

The only thing that Sony did wrong was being (very) arrogant and the 599 US dollars. That's it.

Now compare it to the Xbone reveal, I mean the gif says it all. If MS continued with their original Xbone plans, they could (partially) ruin the industry. Look at all the protest MS had after the announcement, I've never seen so many gamers fighting for the same cause. And with success, MS did a 180.

Xbone reveal >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sony E3 2006

I don't understand the thought process of you guys, I'm not seeing a problem with any of that.

Why is recognizing an issue and resolving it seen as a negative? You guys bitch about how gamers aren't taken seriously and then when someone listens to you it's seen as backpedaling. I don't give a shit what MS's reasoning is for wanting the always on DRM in their machine, they didn't do it and it's really annoying to see them (or anybody for that matter) being judged by shit they were about to or DIDN'T do. If they didn't give a shit they would have went ahead and did it anyway.

I think it's the concept that they could come back around and do it with the next XBox. They even branded the thing as the XBox One, because it was supposed to mark a new beginning for the XBox brand. It was the very embodiment of their ideals and goals with the XBox all along. What we saw was the antithesis of what we want in a console and a platform leader.

Is it really that hard to understand? MS showed their final form and then was like "oops kidding" when every gamer in the planet that wasn't a complete Microsoft ball washing douchebag lined up with a sword in hand like they were the boss in a Final Fantasy game and swung for the neck.

By keeping them around, it's just a matter of time before two things happen:

A. Microsoft gets tired of the console market because they really aren't able to be the all-in-one media content hydra machine they want to be in the living rooms of the world

or

B. They pull the same shit off again and actually get what they want and cause a 1980's game crash as a result of taking market leadership.

This is the only route for things to go from here.

I don't think they know what they're doing.

Hell, i'm half-expecting them to ragequit the console market, but not before auctioning off all their gaming IPs to different companies. (Sony will most likely get out of their way to purchase Halo out of disrespect towards the Xbox brand)

Are you happy with the result of them caving in to pressure and changing their focus, which resulted in a system not playing to its strengths, and now means they can't compete with a system more powerful and cheaper?

I'm actually saying they're wishy-washy and untrustworthy, and that they should have gone with what they wanted to do from the beginning. At least that would have given them a chance to compete, by doing something nobody else was doing.

Trying to achieve parity while being decisively inferior is a recipe for sure disaster.

What I don't understand is what are they supposed to do? They had a vision, people bitched about it and they caved to public pressure. Not much wiggle room there. They were damned if they did, damned if they didn't and I don't think they ever had a fair shot. I'm not on anyone's side here as it was abundantly clear that MS made some serious missteps, but I think that they should be allowed a course correction because if they didn't do anything about their situation, then THAT would have been majestically stupid.

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

I'd say they either filled their x box division with people who are way out of touch with gamers or they simply took their fan base for granted, thinking we would jump in as long as a big X was on the box... They pulled a Gen 7 Sony.

That said... I think they'll come back strong.

Sony wasn't nearly as bad as MS with the Xbone reveal.

I don't know man... as much as I'll agree that MS had waaaay too many things wrongly aligned with consumer wishes, dat $600 price announcement coupled by incredibly weak games, was like dropping an Abomb of NO and the sales reflected that.

The only thing that Sony did wrong was being (very) arrogant and the 599 US dollars. That's it.

Now compare it to the Xbone reveal, I mean the gif says it all. If MS continued with their original Xbone plans, they could (partially) ruin the industry. Look at all the protest MS had after the announcement, I've never seen so many gamers fighting for the same cause. And with success, MS did a 180.

Xbone reveal >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sony E3 2006

Well yes, if you're looking at it from 2014 eyes, the only thing wrong was the price... from 2006 eyes however, it was not a far stretch to see the incorporation of a bluray drive, in a still predominantly SD TV world along with very risky and dev unfriendly tech like the cell processor being major detractors to the ps3... couple that with the fact that we never really saw a true advantage to those two pieces of tech in terms of GAMES and you can point at more than price.

Yes....They...Were.....

Why should they be allowed a course correction? Atari wasn't allowed a course correction. Sega wasn't allowed a course correction. 3DO wasn't allowed one and neither was CD-i. They are beholden to market forces the same as everyone else and they are failing. With Steambox just over the horizon, now, it's not like if MS dropped out that there wouldn't be a third contender to take their place.

Good riddance to old rubbish. I'm sure MS investors will be happy, too. Why do we act like we (the gamers) need them when it is completely the other way around?

@TheEroica said:

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

I'd say they either filled their x box division with people who are way out of touch with gamers or they simply took their fan base for granted, thinking we would jump in as long as a big X was on the box... They pulled a Gen 7 Sony.

That said... I think they'll come back strong.

Sony wasn't nearly as bad as MS with the Xbone reveal.

I don't know man... as much as I'll agree that MS had waaaay too many things wrongly aligned with consumer wishes, dat $600 price announcement coupled by incredibly weak games, was like dropping an Abomb of NO and the sales reflected that.

The only thing that Sony did wrong was being (very) arrogant and the 599 US dollars. That's it.

Now compare it to the Xbone reveal, I mean the gif says it all. If MS continued with their original Xbone plans, they could (partially) ruin the industry. Look at all the protest MS had after the announcement, I've never seen so many gamers fighting for the same cause. And with success, MS did a 180.

Xbone reveal >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sony E3 2006

Well yes, if you're looking at it from 2014 eyes, the only thing wrong was the price... from 2006 eyes however, it was not a far stretch to see the incorporation of a bluray drive, in a still predominantly SD TV world along with very risky and dev unfriendly tech like the cell processor being major detractors to the ps3... couple that with the fact that we never really saw a true advantage to those two pieces of tech in terms of GAMES and you can point at more than price.

Yes but did they harm the industry in anyway? No, Sony only hurt themselves. Like I said, if MS went through with their original plans it had potential to hurt the industry. What if other major players in the industry went along with the plans of MS? Do you think gamers would benefit? As you know, they wouldn't.

MS supported DRM and other crap. There was a HUGE protest of gamers, even the gaming press was going hard against MS.

If you look at the facts, the Xbone reveal is just on another level than the SONY E3 2006 conference.

It's hilarious that we're even debating something so obvious.

Spy features? You're on that bandwagon too, bigboi? I expect better from you.

As expected, coming from a lemming.

So, Giant enemy crab, arrogance, 599 US dollars and RIIIDGEE RAACCCER are worse than MS potentially endangering the whole gaming industry with DRM and other crap?

LOL

Come on the whole internet went ape-sh*t when MS announced their plans. That's why MS did a 180, Sony did not.

LMFAO! You act like that's some kind of tinfoil hat craziness, but it is a FACT that MS was one of PRISMs biggest data gatherers.

Apologize to that poster

You don't get to point fingers when you are the one in the wrong.

MS WILL bring back always online DRM but only when XBL is a complete necessity. The 360 was a shell of a console w/o XBL, which is why they initially wanted the XO to be always online. It would have allowed them to heavily invest in new online features as everyone will be connected.

That being said, Microsoft did **** big time in their execution. Microsoft told people what they didn't want to hear in the worst possible way. They thought Xbox was strong enough to persuade gamers but they obviously forgot that the Sony hasn't only built a reputation of being for gamers over the past few years but they also owned two entire generations.

Nintendo is pretty much out of the picture for most gamers and Xbox has dropped the ball. Sony is obviously the other choice and their execution has been flawless. The PS4 is literally still riding on hype and once Sony beings to pump out great exclusive content and "superior" multiplats, it's pretty much a wrap - they'll own the core gamer.

It's obviously not game over for MS and the Xbox One but they have a lot of work ahead of them. They'll need exclusives, good ones, and large tangible improvements to XBL.

Ummm...

What positive would have come out of them NOT changing their stance? The games would be the same, the hardware would still be lacking... just that it would also have "always on" DRM and probably one time key-codes to prevent used game sales.

It's not like their change of focus somehow reduced the hardware, or had any impact at all on the games that are in the pipeline. At least them changing their stance prevented a total revolt of gamers against them. If the sales are 60/40 in favor of Sony now, if Microsoft "stayed the course" most likely the sales would have been 80/20 or worse. It was basically the only thing they could do.

Basically the Xbox One failed on both it's "hardware and design" phase, AND it's business model. After E3 was too late to change the hardware drastically, but at least they were able to fix the business model (or at least not make it highly destructive).

They corrected a lot of problems people had with the system, and went on to have the most successful launch in Xbox history.

They didn't pull a Wii u or a PS3

I know there's some who'd like it (I can certainly see some advantages to an always on, streaming based device. But it's not for me, nor the vast majority of gamers. I'd imagine folks who want that can get it on PC already? Be always online with Steam?

I bought a WiiU a week ago, believe it or not :P You know how much I bitch about Nintendo and how much their consoles annoy me but am I gonna miss out on playing Mario 3D World? No sir, I am not :D The fact that I got it for 180 euros with a Pro Controller and ZombiU sure helped.

My roommate also has a PS4 that I have occasional access to. Played some meh stuff like Fifa and Killzone, though Resogun and Assassin's Creed 4 are amazing fun.

@Suppaman100:

What about the $500 launch PS3 that still didn't use AA batteries? It also had HDMI.

Anyone who believes Kinect is spying on you is wearing a tinfoil hat.

and by that, you mean a quarter of them didn't sell.

Almost 1Million unsold XBones in 2013

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

I'd say they either filled their x box division with people who are way out of touch with gamers or they simply took their fan base for granted, thinking we would jump in as long as a big X was on the box... They pulled a Gen 7 Sony.

That said... I think they'll come back strong.

Sony wasn't nearly as bad as MS with the Xbone reveal.

I don't know man... as much as I'll agree that MS had waaaay too many things wrongly aligned with consumer wishes, dat $600 price announcement coupled by incredibly weak games, was like dropping an Abomb of NO and the sales reflected that.

The only thing that Sony did wrong was being (very) arrogant and the 599 US dollars. That's it.

Now compare it to the Xbone reveal, I mean the gif says it all. If MS continued with their original Xbone plans, they could (partially) ruin the industry. Look at all the protest MS had after the announcement, I've never seen so many gamers fighting for the same cause. And with success, MS did a 180.

Xbone reveal >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sony E3 2006

Well yes, if you're looking at it from 2014 eyes, the only thing wrong was the price... from 2006 eyes however, it was not a far stretch to see the incorporation of a bluray drive, in a still predominantly SD TV world along with very risky and dev unfriendly tech like the cell processor being major detractors to the ps3... couple that with the fact that we never really saw a true advantage to those two pieces of tech in terms of GAMES and you can point at more than price.

Yes but did they harm the industry in anyway? No, Sony only hurt themselves. Like I said, if MS went through with their original plans it had potential to hurt the industry. What if other major players in the industry went along with the plans of MS? Do you think gamers would benefit? As you know, they wouldn't.

MS supported DRM and other crap. There was a HUGE protest of gamers, even the gaming press was going hard against MS.

If you look at the facts, the Xbone reveal is just on another level than the SONY E3 2006 conference.

It's hilarious that we're even debating something so obvious.

sure, theres a definite argument to be made there... and I, for one, wrote off the x1 at launch because microsoft has seemingly veered away from the more gamercentric approach they had with 360. I think our first mistake would be comparing the launches between x1 and ps3 at all, other than the fact they were expected to be great and still had big question marks post launch... and not that im disagreeing with your point, but don't be short sighted to the tune of chatter, articles, web talk and a very apprehensive buzz among gamers in 2006 that were very concerned about a future with incredibly expensive hardware being the norm.... this happened, and many of us looked at it as a major hit to our hobby....

all things considered, what MS was trying to do worried me more.

Yeah I wouldn't be fond of always-on DRM either, and even had they continued that route, the sales would have been horrendous either way. They just didn't think things through all the way back at the drawing board.

They're always changing what they want to do in the console bizz, and the greed of wanting the Wii consumers clouded their judgement.

The Wii U is very good at up scaling to 1080p, and SM3DW looks marvelous in it. Hope you enjoy it.

I'm curious if the Kinect crowd will abandon them the way the Wii crowd did Nintendo.

Also if their new CEO will decide the downplay the Xbox side of the business (seeing that MS usually fail badly at consumer products)

I am so far! Still waiting for Mario to arrive but I've been playing ZombiU. Don't know how the heck GS gave that a 4, it's some good spooky fun. I even like the WiiU remote usage in it!

You had better thank your stars that there are people like him willing to challenge MS. They had to make a 180 on doing precisely that because of people like us.

Again, you are dead wrong. Apologize.

They would have gotten away with it, too, if it weren't for you punk tinfoil hat wearing teenagers and your dog.. Of course, given Snowden's report, what comes out of a Microsoft PR directors mouth has about as much gravitas as a nerf gun.

Microsoft has always assumed you're stupid. That seem to the be gist.

I still want an xbox one down the road I just had to choose sony for now and it looks like I made the right choice. I love the controller it is in every way better than the DS3 which I hate with a passion.

This.

I made a thread about this but it was locked right away.

Xbox fans have been the victim of so much abuse.

It's a wonder they still sell any consoles after all the crap they (wanted to do) did.

...looks like MS assumed right it seems.

Gamers are such a crybabies.

You're insane if you think the reversal was a bad thing. Great that they're trying to clean up the shit storm that they made as best they can, too little too late though. They're still focused on bro gamers. If I ever get one, it'll be near the end of the generation and it better be cheap with no kinect, and with lots of worthwhile exclusives. Don't see that happening.

Not that Ps4 isn't for bro gamers too, but it's also for everyone else. MS caters to a very specific crowd that like their shooters and forza, Sony has something for everyone and on top of that it's by far the go to console for multiplats (which considering the gap and amount of 3rd party games this is the bigger advantage) this gen. MS has to do some serious exclusive game funding, drop kinect and the price below Ps4 for it even to be considered worthwhile.

180 on spying on people? Kinect was never a spy device.

What exactly in that article states that Kinect spies on consumers, or was going to spy on consumers?

http://www.zdnet.com/microsoft-patent-spies-on-consumers-to-enforce-drm-7000007102/

http://wccftech.com/microsoft-spying-kinect/

http://www.videogamer.com/news/xbox_one_kinect_spying_wont_concern_the_majority_of_consumers_says_survey.html

http://www.theverge.com/2013/7/16/4526770/will-the-nsa-use-the-xbox-one-to-spy-on-your-family

These articles and many, many more, all talk about how it could, and those patents and surveys show real intent. Doesn't mean it ever will happen, but as it was before the Microsoft change, it was a real possibility.

@TheEroica said:

@Suppaman100 said:

@TheEroica said:

I'd say they either filled their x box division with people who are way out of touch with gamers or they simply took their fan base for granted, thinking we would jump in as long as a big X was on the box... They pulled a Gen 7 Sony.

That said... I think they'll come back strong.

Sony wasn't nearly as bad as MS with the Xbone reveal.

I don't know man... as much as I'll agree that MS had waaaay too many things wrongly aligned with consumer wishes, dat $600 price announcement coupled by incredibly weak games, was like dropping an Abomb of NO and the sales reflected that.

Dont forget how much worse PSN was than XBL for like the first 5 years

Well, at least they got Killer Instinct right and that's all I needed.