Future Consoles 1200p? (My thoughts and predictions)

When you look back at the PS2, or Xbox, none of them even supported 720p, 480i/p was the norm and max, nowadays 720p HD is the norm, 1080p HD is the max (for consoles anyway) so wouldn't it be logical to think that Consoles in the future would have 1080p as the norm and 1200p as the max? Also why is it that many people (mostly Hermits) say that "hopefully next-gen console games look as good as Crysis" when they should far exceed Crysis. When the PS3 and 360 came out they were in the same league as PC's (graphically) but now they are way behind. The leap between PS2 and PS3 is pretty big (compare GOW1 and 2 to Uncharted 2 and GOW 3 or GT4 to GT5) so if the leap is that big, wouldn't we see games that look even better than Crysis with mods?

They'll be in 1080p for sure but I doubt anything will visually exceed Crysis at the launch of next-gen consoles. It's been 3 years and its still the best looking game out there, even Crysis 2 doesn't look as good in my opinion though its probably just the setting.

So we can all view them on our 1200p televisons?

I think that consoles still haven't mastered HD yet.... since most games are sub-hdKGB32

Not most, but alot

PS2 did 1080i with GT4 and Xbox had some 720p games like Soul Calibur 2.

But other than that, I agree, though 1080p should be the standard next gen.

As to the crysis and next gen comments, it matters alot more than just raw power, it is extremely costly and complicated to make a top of the line graphics engine and assests now, and next get it will just cause even more problems.

According to valve a next gen graphics engine will be 10x harder to code for than a current gen ones.http://www.pcgamer.com/2010/09/13/gabe-newell-next-gen-game-engines-will-be-ten-times-harder/

1080p plize because I don't want to buy another tv.

1080p will be the standard, mostly due to the large amount of 1080p TV's on the market (Full HD and all that funky wording). I also expect less of a graphical leap, due to costs of production. Not quite a Wii, but not quite a PS2/XBOX to PS3/360 jump.

1200 as in 1900x1200? No... If anything it'll be 2560x1600... Thats the kind of jump 480 is to 720p... JohnF111

Wouldn't you need an ATI card to run that resolution?

*eyefininity

1080P w/ 60fps should be the standard, nothing less...

As to the crysis and next gen comments, it matters alot more than just raw power, it is extremely costly and complicated to make a top of the line graphics engine and assests now, and next get it will just cause even more problems.

According to valve a next gen graphics engine will be 10x harder to code for than a current gen ones.http://www.pcgamer.com/2010/09/13/gabe-newell-next-gen-game-engines-will-be-ten-times-harder/

ferret-gamer

hmm...very interesting read, thanks ferret.

Go much above 1080p and you reach the point of diminishing returns. Basically, unless resolutions increased to something crazy like 2000p, you wouldn't see much difference with improved resolutions. It's almost impossible totell the difference between 720 and 1080 as it is (except for large tvs).

No, movies are in 16:9 ratio so 1080p will stay.

[QUOTE="JohnF111"]1200 as in 1900x1200? No... If anything it'll be 2560x1600... Thats the kind of jump 480 is to 720p... Fightingfan

Wouldn't you need an ATI card to run that resolution?

*eyefininity

Nope, single monitors display 2560x1600. You may need a newer gen card (5870/GTX 480) or run SLI/Crossfire to be able to pump games out at that resolution though.

No, movies are in 16:9 ratio so 1080p will stay.

erglesmergle

[QUOTE="erglesmergle"]

No, movies are in 16:9 ratio so 1080p will stay.

ferret-gamer

Give me some 1080p games then talk about moving up to 1152p.

televisions only go to 1080p... unless you are playing on a computer monitor it won't do you any good.

and read up on HDTV on Cnet- unless the TV is 50" + its very, very difficult to discern the difference between 720 and 1080 progressive.

The next jump in TV resolution will probably be 4096x2160 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luRy6sTHsrw

But this wont happen any time soon I think... 1080p will be here for a while.

The issue with consoles is that there are 2 important limits that must be in place:

• Consoles must have a small form factor.
• Consoles must not cost their parent companies TOO much at their launch, and must eventually become profitable.

These two limits do not exist on the PC world. There is no one company on PC that is willing to throw BILLIONS of dollars away on PC hardware. Everything on the PC side, makes companies money. The end user is the limiting factor in the PC world. If you can afford a $1,000 gaming beast, then all you need ot do is buy it.

Think about what a high end modern PC can do, what it costs, and what it looks like. Take my rig for example:

• Specs are an i7 920 @ 4 Ghz, 1 TB of space and an SSD, 6 gigs of RAM and an HD 5870.
• It's housed in a nice Antec case with plenty of cooling.
• Costs about $1,000.
• Can max out Crysis at 1080p 2x AA, 16x AF.

Think about that. For a console to achieve the same amount of performance, it would have to be around as big as my full tower antec case, for proper cooling, and Microsoft/Sony would be willing to eat $600 PER machine sold for the forseeable future.

Unless the technology improves by leaps and bounds within the next couple of years, you can expect performance that's much better than what the consoles can do now, but not even up to par to what a modern high end PC can do, nevermind what a high PC can do 3 years from now.

My guess is games on console will look a bit better, but they will run a lot better. 60 fps, at 1080p. In the meantime, PC games will be running at ever higher resolutions, higher fps and look even better :)

The next jump in TV resolution will probably be 4096x2160 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luRy6sTHsrw

GTSaiyanjin2

a jump to a resolution that high would only do you any good on a screen that large

The next jump in TV resolution will probably be 4096x2160 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luRy6sTHsrw

GTSaiyanjin2

Yeah, I've seen many Ultra HD tv's on Youtube, but I doubt we'll see anything like that for next gen which is what I'm focusing on. The only thing holding back technology (higher res tv's going to the market and cables switching to 1080p for all channels, 1080p gaming, etc.) is people not switching to 1080p HDTV's, and the only thing holding them back from that, is money. But that's the way it is for everything I guess :).

HDTVs are the best they can be at 1080 progressive... that is unless you get to ridiculous 80" screens or whatnot

what they need to do now are perfect black levels down to .001... i just ordered a 60" plasma which produces blacks at .012 (which is nothing to sneeze at, but still...) oh, and LCD screens need to fix their hilariously bad off-angle issues...

thus why the Pioneer Kuro Elite is still the best market on the television, and its been discontinued for a little while now.

There's too many 720p tvs in circulation for a major jump to occur in the next few years. I expect 1080p to be standard in five or so years, and 10 years after that 1440p will emerge as the final resolution on 2d televisions before another form of producing images is found.

1200 as in 1900x1200? No... If anything it'll be 2560x1600... Thats the kind of jump 480 is to 720p... JohnF111

There's too many 720p tvs in circulation for a major jump to occur in the next few years. I expect 1080p to be standard in five or so years, and 10 years after that 1440p will emerge as the final resolution on 2d televisions before another form of producing images is found.

2-10-08

lol - if home TVs get to a resolution that high it will just be a marketing gimmick.. won't show any real world difference...

source: Cnet, AVS Forums

The issue with consoles is that there are 2 important limits that must be in place:

• Consoles must have a small form factor.
• Consoles must not cost their parent companies TOO much at their launch, and must eventually become profitable.

These two limits do not exist on the PC world. There is no one company on PC that is willing to throw BILLIONS of dollars away on PC hardware. Everything on the PC side, makes companies money. The end user is the limiting factor in the PC world. If you can afford a $1,000 gaming beast, then all you need ot do is buy it.

Think about what a high end modern PC can do, what it costs, and what it looks like. Take my rig for example:

• Specs are an i7 920 @ 4 Ghz, 1 TB of space and an SSD, 6 gigs of RAM and an HD 5870.
• It's housed in a nice Antec case with plenty of cooling.
• Costs about $1,000.
• Can max out Crysis at 1080p 2x AA, 16x AF.

Think about that. For a console to achieve the same amount of performance, it would have to be around as big as my full tower antec case, for proper cooling, and Microsoft/Sony would be willing to eat $600 PER machine sold for the forseeable future.

Unless the technology improves by leaps and bounds within the next couple of years, you can expect performance that's much better than what the consoles can do now, but not even up to par to what a modern high end PC can do, nevermind what a high PC can do 3 years from now.

My guess is games on console will look a bit better, but they will run a lot better. 60 fps, at 1080p. In the meantime, PC games will be running at ever higher resolutions, higher fps and look even better :)

Kinthalis

And by the next year, they had cut manufacturing costs by 40% to a mere $323 [link].

It wouldn't have to be that large either - even a relatively snug SG07 mini-ITX case can use a Radeon 5970 and i7. Computer cases are much larger than they really need to be.

So we can all view them on our 1200p televisons?

davidkamayor

good point.

hopefully we will all have full 3D,panoramic view,Motion control, Internet connectionand extreme ultra high contrast, bright super TVs in the future.

My technology is amazing!!

No, movies are in 16:9 ratio so 1080p will stay.

erglesmergle

1200 as in 1900x1200? No... If anything it'll be 2560x1600... Thats the kind of jump 480 is to 720p... JohnF111

The issue with consoles is that there are 2 important limits that must be in place:

• Consoles must have a small form factor.
• Consoles must not cost their parent companies TOO much at their launch, and must eventually become profitable.

These two limits do not exist on the PC world. There is no one company on PC that is willing to throw BILLIONS of dollars away on PC hardware. Everything on the PC side, makes companies money. The end user is the limiting factor in the PC world. If you can afford a $1,000 gaming beast, then all you need ot do is buy it.

Think about what a high end modern PC can do, what it costs, and what it looks like. Take my rig for example:

• Specs are an i7 920 @ 4 Ghz, 1 TB of space and an SSD, 6 gigs of RAM and an HD 5870.
• It's housed in a nice Antec case with plenty of cooling.
• Costs about $1,000.
• Can max out Crysis at 1080p 2x AA, 16x AF.

Think about that. For a console to achieve the same amount of performance, it would have to be around as big as my full tower antec case, for proper cooling, and Microsoft/Sony would be willing to eat $600 PER machine sold for the forseeable future.

Unless the technology improves by leaps and bounds within the next couple of years, you can expect performance that's much better than what the consoles can do now, but not even up to par to what a modern high end PC can do, nevermind what a high PC can do 3 years from now.

My guess is games on console will look a bit better, but they will run a lot better. 60 fps, at 1080p. In the meantime, PC games will be running at ever higher resolutions, higher fps and look even better :)

Kinthalis

well gee guess what. People said the same thing before the start of this gen and they ate their words :/ it cost microsoft 700+ dollars to make a 360 and 800+ for sony to make a ps3. Guess what? they'll do it again :/ Also since there will be one type of gpu and cpu they can max airflow, and still keep them compact. Anyways graphics are so good now so next gen I think they will be close to the max.

[QUOTE="Kinthalis"]

The issue with consoles is that there are 2 important limits that must be in place:

• Consoles must have a small form factor.
• Consoles must not cost their parent companies TOO much at their launch, and must eventually become profitable.

These two limits do not exist on the PC world. There is no one company on PC that is willing to throw BILLIONS of dollars away on PC hardware. Everything on the PC side, makes companies money. The end user is the limiting factor in the PC world. If you can afford a $1,000 gaming beast, then all you need ot do is buy it.

Think about what a high end modern PC can do, what it costs, and what it looks like. Take my rig for example:

• Specs are an i7 920 @ 4 Ghz, 1 TB of space and an SSD, 6 gigs of RAM and an HD 5870.
• It's housed in a nice Antec case with plenty of cooling.
• Costs about $1,000.
• Can max out Crysis at 1080p 2x AA, 16x AF.

Think about that. For a console to achieve the same amount of performance, it would have to be around as big as my full tower antec case, for proper cooling, and Microsoft/Sony would be willing to eat $600 PER machine sold for the forseeable future.

Unless the technology improves by leaps and bounds within the next couple of years, you can expect performance that's much better than what the consoles can do now, but not even up to par to what a modern high end PC can do, nevermind what a high PC can do 3 years from now.

My guess is games on console will look a bit better, but they will run a lot better. 60 fps, at 1080p. In the meantime, PC games will be running at ever higher resolutions, higher fps and look even better :)

theuncharted34

well gee guess what. People said the same thing before the start of this gen and they ate their words :/ it cost microsoft 700+ dollars to make a 360 and 800+ for sony to make a ps3. Guess what? they'll do it again :/ Also since there will be one type of gpu and cpu they can max airflow, and still keep them compact. Anyways graphics are so good now so next gen I think they will be close to the max.

I'd be pretty surprised if any of the console manufacturers next-gen spend more than $400 on hardware prices. Thanks to bulk purchasing, MS and Sony can get the most powerful components for only a third of the price that PC builders pay for them...

[QUOTE="theuncharted34"]

[QUOTE="Kinthalis"]

The issue with consoles is that there are 2 important limits that must be in place:

• Consoles must have a small form factor.
• Consoles must not cost their parent companies TOO much at their launch, and must eventually become profitable.

These two limits do not exist on the PC world. There is no one company on PC that is willing to throw BILLIONS of dollars away on PC hardware. Everything on the PC side, makes companies money. The end user is the limiting factor in the PC world. If you can afford a $1,000 gaming beast, then all you need ot do is buy it.

Think about what a high end modern PC can do, what it costs, and what it looks like. Take my rig for example:

• Specs are an i7 920 @ 4 Ghz, 1 TB of space and an SSD, 6 gigs of RAM and an HD 5870.
• It's housed in a nice Antec case with plenty of cooling.
• Costs about $1,000.
• Can max out Crysis at 1080p 2x AA, 16x AF.

Think about that. For a console to achieve the same amount of performance, it would have to be around as big as my full tower antec case, for proper cooling, and Microsoft/Sony would be willing to eat $600 PER machine sold for the forseeable future.

Unless the technology improves by leaps and bounds within the next couple of years, you can expect performance that's much better than what the consoles can do now, but not even up to par to what a modern high end PC can do, nevermind what a high PC can do 3 years from now.

My guess is games on console will look a bit better, but they will run a lot better. 60 fps, at 1080p. In the meantime, PC games will be running at ever higher resolutions, higher fps and look even better :)

SakusEnvoy

well gee guess what. People said the same thing before the start of this gen and they ate their words :/ it cost microsoft 700+ dollars to make a 360 and 800+ for sony to make a ps3. Guess what? they'll do it again :/ Also since there will be one type of gpu and cpu they can max airflow, and still keep them compact. Anyways graphics are so good now so next gen I think they will be close to the max.

I'd be pretty surprised if any of the console manufacturers next-gen spend more than $400 on hardware prices. Thanks to bulk purchasing, MS and Sony can get the most powerful components for only a third of the price that PC builders pay for them...

wasn't that foolish, look how good ps3's exclusives look. and they can keep gettong better looking according to naughty dog :P

[QUOTE="SakusEnvoy"]

iSuppli estimated the Xbox 360 premium as costing only about $525 at launch. The only reason the PS3 cost $800+ to manufacture at launch was because of the Cell and Blu-ray -- I don't think Sony will make the same type of foolish mistakes in the future now that they've won the format war.

I'd be pretty surprised if any of the console manufacturers next-gen spend more than $400 on hardware prices. Thanks to bulk purchasing, MS and Sony can get the most powerful components for only a third of the price that PC builders pay for them...

theuncharted34

wasn't that foolish, look how good ps3's exclusives look.

consoles cant do 1080p the games are upscaled, console games this gen are only rendered in 720p or below next gen we might see 1080p as a standard but a lack of AA.AiurProtoss

So we can all view them on our 1200p televisons?

davidkamayor

heh yup, its only up to 1080p right now, i don't it going up in definition any time soon, not only that games could only do about 720

Actually the PS2 could do 720p (one game: Van Helsing) and two 1080i titles: GT4 and Tourist Trophy.

1080p probably will be the norm next gen, as well as 2x AA (hopefully). It really comes down to the cost/performance ratio. For many GPUs, z-buffering really holds things back when you scale up resolutions, especially the older ones. Devs next gen migh be trading off 1080p for 720p with upscaling to 1080p (like 99% of 360 and PS3 console games already) for the extra performance advantage. It's also important to note that this kind of performance effects not only GPU needs, but also memory/framebuffer size and bandwidth needs too, so that tends to push costs up. Most likely MS and Sony will avoid 256 bit memory interfaces again for 128 (makes it easier to scale them down with hardware revisions) and go with GDDR5. God the costs could be astronomical, unless there is a new successor to GDDR5 that doesn't quad pump but octo-pumps by the time the next machines roll around. The other solution would be combined CPUs + GPUs on one chip but that could make the chips themselves very high in cost, especially as GPUs tend to be much bigger than CPUs.

[QUOTE="AiurProtoss"]consoles cant do 1080p the games are upscaled, console games this gen are only rendered in 720p or below next gen we might see 1080p as a standard but a lack of AA.ferret-gamer

1080p ill say i still wanna plug my PC into my TV and see what games look like.

1080P w/ 60fps should be the standard, nothing less...

ProjectNatalFan

1080P w/ 60fps should be the standard, nothing less...

It'll be in 1080p. Most games on HD consoles this gen are in sub HD = 720p and the 1080p is not really 1080p.

1200p is a waste of time as not many people play consoles on a monitor. Plus with low end console hardware it will be hard to do .

Would be pretty silly to change the current standard for a measly 120 lines of vertical resolution.