Gamespot overhauling site and review system. (Now with poll!)

[QUOTE="JPOBS"][QUOTE="Bill_McBlumpkin"]

The numbers really only hold merit in silly fanboy arguments anyway, it's the actual bodies and content within the reviews that matter, not that 90% of System Wars' membership actually reads them.

Two tumbs up? HOW FAR UP?!?!? I SAID HOW FAR UP ARE YOUR FRIGGIN' THUMBS!

Movie that got a thumb 1 1/4 inches up > Movie that got a thumb 1 inch up

FACT

Bill_McBlumpkin

1 1/4 is a larger number than 1 hence its better. fact.

I think Gamespot should change their review system so they rate games to the thousandth, that's right THE THOUSANDTH. Deal with it!

I think I'm right here, am I right here?

then it would make things more precise. Obviously there is a limit to how precise you should get. Personally, I think 100 is right on the mark. I think things like graphics and sound should be part of the review score so that it isnt all oppinion. If a dev puts all the effort into the gameplay and none into the graphics, it should show. If all the effort went into graphics and not into gameplay, it too should show. Every aspect of the game is important. Sure .1 might not make a difference to you, but the review does provide grounds for the reason why it got a .1 difference.

[QUOTE="-Spock-"]

I see this is a good thing to be honest. Firstly, at least we won't be seeing all this pathetic System Wars bickering anymore. I hate it how it's "ownage" if one game scores .1 above the other. :|

As for the new review system, I can see the more simplistic approach being quite beneficial for both casual reviewers and veterans alike. Often when i'm writing a review, i'll grade each component (graphics, sound, gameplay, value and tilt) as honestly as I can, yet the final score isn't really where i'd like it to be. So I then have to start bumping certain bits up or down to get it to the sweet spot I want, which just makes the whole thing dishonest and frustrating. It's probably the reason why, for example, Forza Motorsport 2 got a 9 in graphics, or why Super Paper Mario got an overly generous 10 in tilt.

Aside from giving the writer more choice as far as score goes, the new system also places a better emphasis on tilt. If, as another example, a game gets 7s across the board yet a 10 for tilt, this allows the player to still just give it the overall 9 it deserves. Finally, I much prefer more well rounded scores. All this "9.2" or "8.7" stuff, although accurate, just feels way too cold in my opinion. I don't know how to describe it really... I just like whole number scores much better. I doubt many people will agree though.

-Sora

i agree with you 100%

Im probably the first person to notice this but heres something to ponder:

people often complain that a review is 'just an opinion of a reviewer". Well, with this new system, in truth, it is little more than that at all anymore. now, the Reviews as they have said are nothing but impression. which basically means, they dotn even have the really think about a review anymore, they can just say "hmm..this feels like a 8.5 game" and slap the review up there.

Reviews will now be pretty much entirely based on impression rather than quality. A game with poor technical merits could get the same score as a game with good technical merits essentially.

Reviews have officially become trash on gamespot.

Im probably the first person to notice this but heres something to ponder:

people often complain that a review is 'just an opinion of a reviewer". Well, with this new system, in truth, it is little more than that at all anymore. now, the Reviews as they have said are nothing but impression. which basically means, they dotn even have the really think about a review anymore, they can just say "hmm..this feels like a 8.5 game" and slap the review up there.

Reviews will now be pretty much entirely based on impression rather than quality. A game with poor technical merits good get the same score as a game with good technical merits essentially.

Reviews have officially become trash on gamespot.

JPOBS

I see this is a good thing to be honest. Firstly, at least we won't be seeing all this pathetic System Wars bickering anymore. I hate it how it's "ownage" if one game scores .1 above the other. :|

As for the new review system, I can see the more simplistic approach being quite beneficial for both casual reviewers and veterans alike. Often when i'm writing a review, i'll grade each component (graphics, sound, gameplay, value and tilt) as honestly as I can, yet the final score isn't really where i'd like it to be. So I then have to start bumping certain bits up or down to get it to the sweet spot I want, which just makes the whole thing dishonest and frustrating. It's probably the reason why, for example, Forza Motorsport 2 got a 9 in graphics, or why Super Paper Mario got an overly generous 10 in tilt.

Aside from giving the writer more choice as far as score goes, the new system also places a better emphasis on tilt. If, as another example, a game gets 7s across the board yet a 10 for tilt, this allows the player to still just give it the overall 9 it deserves. Finally, I much prefer more well rounded scores. All this "9.2" or "8.7" stuff, although accurate, just feels way too cold in my opinion. I don't know how to describe it really... I just like whole number scores much better. I doubt many people will agree though.

-Spock-

[QUOTE="Bill_McBlumpkin"][QUOTE="JPOBS"][QUOTE="Bill_McBlumpkin"]

The numbers really only hold merit in silly fanboy arguments anyway, it's the actual bodies and content within the reviews that matter, not that 90% of System Wars' membership actually reads them.

Two tumbs up? HOW FAR UP?!?!? I SAID HOW FAR UP ARE YOUR FRIGGIN' THUMBS!

Movie that got a thumb 1 1/4 inches up > Movie that got a thumb 1 inch up

FACT

organic_machine

1 1/4 is a larger number than 1 hence its better. fact.

I think Gamespot should change their review system so they rate games to the thousandth, that's right THE THOUSANDTH. Deal with it!

I think I'm right here, am I right here?

then it would make things more precise. Obviously there is a limit to how precise you should get. Personally, I think 100 is right on the mark. I think things like graphics and sound should be part of the review score so that it isnt all oppinion. If a dev puts all the effort into the gameplay and none into the graphics, it should show. If all the effort went into graphics and not into gameplay, it too should show. Every aspect of the game is important. Sure .1 might not make a difference to you, but the review does provide grounds for the reason why it got a .1 difference.

You guys are acting like they don't care about sound or graphics? It's still part of the equation, part of the overall impression. ANd was the old system break down that accurate anyway? Wario Ware, Zelda, and Oblivion all got the same graphic score? See COMPONETS DIDN'T MATTER IN THE OLD SYSTEM THEY DID OVERALL IMPRESSION ANYWAY JUST ON A 100 SCALE.

The last thing i have to say about this is that, as someone from sw.com suggested, they start using 1-5 range far more frequently, so as to give games above 7 more tangibility.

Like i was already saying, make 8 the new 9.

In protest I'm starting a movie and video game review site that works on a 700 star scale. I'm not displaying the numerical score either, after each review there will be seven hundred individual stars displayed in one long string and only a certain number of them will be filled-in depending on the quality of the piece.

In protest I'm starting a movie and video game review site that works on a 700 star scale. I'm not displaying the numerical score either, after each review there will be seven hundred individual stars displayed in one long string and only a certain number of them will be filled-in depending on the quality of the piece.

Bill_McBlumpkin

Like i was already saying, make 8 the new 9. JPOBS

8.5 9 9.5 and 10.

[QUOTE="organic_machine"][QUOTE="Bill_McBlumpkin"][QUOTE="JPOBS"][QUOTE="Bill_McBlumpkin"]

The numbers really only hold merit in silly fanboy arguments anyway, it's the actual bodies and content within the reviews that matter, not that 90% of System Wars' membership actually reads them.

Two tumbs up? HOW FAR UP?!?!? I SAID HOW FAR UP ARE YOUR FRIGGIN' THUMBS!

Movie that got a thumb 1 1/4 inches up > Movie that got a thumb 1 inch up

FACT

NATATO

1 1/4 is a larger number than 1 hence its better. fact.

I think Gamespot should change their review system so they rate games to the thousandth, that's right THE THOUSANDTH. Deal with it!

I think I'm right here, am I right here?

then it would make things more precise. Obviously there is a limit to how precise you should get. Personally, I think 100 is right on the mark. I think things like graphics and sound should be part of the review score so that it isnt all oppinion. If a dev puts all the effort into the gameplay and none into the graphics, it should show. If all the effort went into graphics and not into gameplay, it too should show. Every aspect of the game is important. Sure .1 might not make a difference to you, but the review does provide grounds for the reason why it got a .1 difference.

You guys are acting like they don't care about sound or graphics? It's still part of the equation, part of the overall impression. ANd was the old system break down that accurate anyway? Wario Ware, Zelda, and Oblivion all got the same graphic score? See COMPONETS DIDN'T MATTER IN THE OLD SYSTEM THEY DID OVERALL IMPRESSION ANYWAY JUST ON A 100 SCALE.

700 STARS, PAL!

Im probably the first person to notice this but heres something to ponder:

people often complain that a review is 'just an opinion of a reviewer". Well, with this new system, in truth, it is little more than that at all anymore. now, the Reviews as they have said are nothing but impression. which basically means, they dotn even have the really think about a review anymore, they can just say "hmm..this feels like a 8.5 game" and slap the review up there.

Reviews will now be pretty much entirely based on impression rather than quality. A game with poor technical merits good get the same score as a game with good technical merits essentially.

Reviews have officially become trash on gamespot.

JPOBS

The old system was overall impression too, just on a 100 scale instead. Like hell the componets mattered, they just messed with the componets until it matched their overall impression

I thought that. Just like IGNs reviews. I mentioned it before this thread was even created.Jandurin

[QUOTE="dhjohns"][QUOTE="Ontain"]

what does that mean? what is the score a measure of? the overall game. how the reviewer enjoyed it. his opinion of it. this is a qualitative measure you see. to say that he enjoyed it .1 more than another game is meaning less because there's no real basis for what .1 is. this is why studies on consumer preference doesn't ask you to rate on a scale of 100 how much you liked the service of something. because ppl can't differentiate such opinions on that wide a scale on a consistant basis.

Ontain

I hear what you are stating, but I think you are missing my point. The people on SW are hard core gamers. All of us. Cows, sheeps, lemmings, whatever. I mean we post on a gaming website. We appreciate and in fact, I would say, need the differances. This is not same casual gaming website. Also, the unintentional (or intentional) effects on SW are huge to say the least. Dumb it down if need be, but why drop it by 80%. That is just plain silly.

I expect that it's in SW what they'll see the most complaints. This isn't about casual or not. it's about better representing games. we here on SW are the most guilty of puting too much emphasis on minute differences in score than could be effected by a bad day at the office, fatigue, or any number of factors that would might have caused the reviewer to knock it .1 lower than usual. with the new system this would be less likely to happen and gamers want claim to the heavens that a 9.3 game is better than a 9.2 game. because if you asked me to rate all my meals on a scale of 100 I wouldn't be able to tell the next day if i rated something a 9.3 and 9.2.

You make excellent points. I just think this takes a lot of the fun out of SW, but maybe not. I hope it works out and your points have giving me pause to reevaluate my position.

[QUOTE="Bill_McBlumpkin"]

In protest I'm starting a movie and video game review site that works on a 700 star scale. I'm not displaying the numerical score either, after each review there will be seven hundred individual stars displayed in one long string and only a certain number of them will be filled-in depending on the quality of the piece.

-Sora

I don't need luck, I have a ludicrous amount of stars. YOU need luck.

[QUOTE="JPOBS"][QUOTE="-Sora"]

http://www.gamespot.com/pages/forums/show_msgs.php?topic_id=25720956

thats what general games thinks about the change.

dhjohns

They mainly are in favor of it. I really see on SW veterans having problems with this.

Unsurprisingly, I guess people take SW more serious than I thought.

[QUOTE="JPOBS"] Like i was already saying, make 8 the new 9. Jandurin

8.5 9 9.5 and 10.

Yeah, I think it's a good change. More than often you can't express how you feel about the game with a sum of the factors like graphics, sound etc. I hope this also makes them look less to these factors and just think "how much fun am I having with this game?" and not bother about grading graphics and all. Also a .1 change won't say much to me because it's not like I always have the same opinions about the reviewers. Because of the difference in tastes I think this scoring system says as much about a game as the old system.

On a side note, the written part of reviews has always meant more to me than the scores. There's no telling if you agree with the score, but at least inside the review you can see some more objective things to help make your decision.

I am not sure what to think. Lets say hypothetically that Gran Turismo 5 would score a 9.3 on the old scale and they are right between 9.5 and 9.0 on the new scale. They will probably go down and give it a 9 and that would affect System Wars forever. Forza 2 >>>> GT5 confirmed.

this is the worst idea ever I hate review sites that use the .5 system it is not accurate enough almost as bad as the 5 star system...plus getting rid of

gameplay

graphics

sound

value

tilt

man what are they thinking

[QUOTE="JPOBS"]

Im probably the first person to notice this but heres something to ponder:

people often complain that a review is 'just an opinion of a reviewer". Well, with this new system, in truth, it is little more than that at all anymore. now, the Reviews as they have said are nothing but impression. which basically means, they dotn even have the really think about a review anymore, they can just say "hmm..this feels like a 8.5 game" and slap the review up there.

Reviews will now be pretty much entirely based on impression rather than quality. A game with poor technical merits good get the same score as a game with good technical merits essentially.

Reviews have officially become trash on gamespot.

NATATO

The old system was overall impression too, just on a 100 scale instead. Like hell the componets mattered, they just messed with the componets until it matched their overall impression

I think Gamespot should rate on a .5 scale but extend the maximum to 60.

that's what tilt was for bud.
JPOBS

:P

this is the worst idea ever I hate review sites that use the .5 system it is not accurate enough almost as bad as the 5 star system...plus getting rid of

gameplay

graphics

sound

value

tilt

man what are they thinking

Warrior_Poet

That stuff nevermattered to begin with! THey just messed with the componets until they got the score they wanted. I mean if they took the compnets seriously why would Wario Ware get the same graphic score as Oblvion. No they already rated on overall impression.

Forza 2 >>>> GT5 confirmed.diggyzoom

I am not sure what to think. Lets say hypothetically that Gran Turismo 5 would score a 9.3 on the old scale and they are right between 9.5 and 9.0 on the new scale. They will probably go down and give it a 9 and that would affect System Wars forever. Forza 2 >>>> GT5 confirmed.

diggyzoom

[QUOTE="NATATO"][QUOTE="JPOBS"]

Im probably the first person to notice this but heres something to ponder:

people often complain that a review is 'just an opinion of a reviewer". Well, with this new system, in truth, it is little more than that at all anymore. now, the Reviews as they have said are nothing but impression. which basically means, they dotn even have the really think about a review anymore, they can just say "hmm..this feels like a 8.5 game" and slap the review up there.

Reviews will now be pretty much entirely based on impression rather than quality. A game with poor technical merits good get the same score as a game with good technical merits essentially.

Reviews have officially become trash on gamespot.

JPOBS

The old system was overall impression too, just on a 100 scale instead. Like hell the componets mattered, they just messed with the componets until it matched their overall impression

THe whole thing was tilt, they just messed with the componets until they got the score they wanted. That's the reason they're making it this way, because it better matches how they've already been rating games.

[QUOTE="Warrior_Poet"]

this is the worst idea ever I hate review sites that use the .5 system it is not accurate enough almost as bad as the 5 star system...plus getting rid of

gameplay

graphics

sound

value

tilt

man what are they thinking

NATATO

That stuff nevermattered to begin with! THey just messed with the componets until they got the score they wanted. I mean if they took the compnets seriously why would Wario Ware get the same graphic score as Oblvion. No they already rated on overall impression.

A Wii game doesn't have to look as good as a 360 game to get a high score in graphics, it just has to look good by Wii standards.

Read the score descriptions.

[QUOTE="JPOBS"] that's what tilt was for bud.
Jandurin

:P

Haha.

During the next scene I'll have lip herpes, then the following scene you'll have it, and then the next it'll be passed to someone else.

Yeah, I think it's a good change. More than often you can't express how you feel about the game with a sum of the factors like graphics, sound etc. I hope this also makes them look less to these factors and just think "how much fun am I having with this game?" and not bother about grading graphics and all. Also a .1 change won't say much to me because it's not like I always have the same opinions about the reviewers. Because of the difference in tastes I think this scoring system says as much about a game as the old system.

On a side note, the written part of reviews has always meant more to me than the scores. There's no telling if you agree with the score, but at least inside the review you can see some more objective things to help make your decision.

11Marcel

thats what tilt is meant for just to often they do not put tilt low enough to affect the score IE if the game has good merits in all other aspects and the reviewer just doesn't like the game they never put the tilt lower than 7...if they used tilt more effectively then they wouldn't need to make a change

but I agree with you in if the game interests you read the review and maybe give the game a rent even if it scores low...often times pleople just look at the score

[QUOTE="JPOBS"] that's what tilt was for bud.
Jandurin

:P

[QUOTE="diggyzoom"]

I am not sure what to think. Lets say hypothetically that Gran Turismo 5 would score a 9.3 on the old scale and they are right between 9.5 and 9.0 on the new scale. They will probably go down and give it a 9 and that would affect System Wars forever. Forza 2 >>>> GT5 confirmed.

11Marcel

This is horrible, i loved the .1 increments.


Now there not going to give out 10's, so any game that would have gotten mid-high nines is a 9.5. There will be no ownage (if) Killzone and Halo both get 9.5's, (even if either one was a better game *cough* halo *cough) Now, how do you compare, by what is actually said in the review? Will fanboys be yelling "BUT TEH JEFF SAID THAT THE GRPX IN KILLZONE 2 WAS (X) AND THAT HALO WAS ONLY (X).


I say bad move gamespot.TEH_rankie

I guess whichever game gets more medals/emblems will be considered better.

[QUOTE="11Marcel"]Hold on guys... you people are all not seriously saying you've always been relying on those gamespot scores? Also a .1 difference does not say much about the game, only it mattered in system wars for "teh ownage". Of course, I'm not throwing a party because of this change, but the change isn't too bad. hyruledweller

But its that 0.1 difference thats always been the main reason why i use GS Scores.

You can't seriously review a game using 0.5s , its stupid and less accurate.

Wow, that is the stupidest thing I've heard in a long time. Stupid and less accurate because they're changing the increments from 0.1 to 0.5? Wow. That is amazing. First of all if a simple NUMBER on a webpage directs your life, then you have problems. Secondly, if a NUMBER that varies by 0.1 or 0.2 points varies that aspect as well, you have TONS of problems.

I love this new direction Gamespot is going in. I still think anything beyond a 20 point scale system is pointless. IT got 37/40!! What's that saying? It's saying you should buy the game. 0-5 and 0-10 scales are the best. They simply say whether you buy the game or not.

Besides, what's in a number? The written review should be all that matters. Oh.. but wait. I'm posting on System Wars. I guess all my logic goes out the window right? Maybe I should just say "NUMBERS SHOULD RULE US ALL!"to appease the System Wars posters.

THe whole thing was tilt, they just messed with the componets until they got the score they wanted. That's the reason they're making it this way, because it better matches how they've already been rating games.

NATATO

So to put a long story short, that presentation can be summed up as: "All ur systemwarz R belong to us."

I am really surprised how many people are complaining.

When zelda got 8.8 everyone was like "OMFG the review system is broken!" and all the type people complain that games like WarioWare got 9.1 and now when they're fixing it...people don't want it? :?

So pretty much GS can never win. Nice. :roll:darklord888

its not the systems fault its the reviewers...the system is perfect IMO but they have just not been using it effectively IMO

I think people need to realize that GS wants to rate games on overall impression. I think the old system FORCED them to rate it based on it's componets. When reviewers for GS or even players rate a game they don't rate each componet and then go "Uhp! Theres the score!" NO, they have an overall impression and have a score in mind even before they start using the componets. Like Rainbow 6, sound got a 7. The games sound isn't that bad, the reviewerjust wanted the game to fit 9.1.

THis system allows them to rate it based on how they felt about the game overall. Everyone is pissed because there will be less "Oh this game is better than that game" BS.

Ownages and flops will change. Yes, but everyone already predicting "tons of 9.0 and 8.5s" and "reviewers are guna be lazier!" How bout we wait and see the system in action before we call it a flop.

NATATO

Thats exactly what the component TILT is for...

[QUOTE="Warrior_Poet"]

this is the worst idea ever I hate review sites that use the .5 system it is not accurate enough almost as bad as the 5 star system...plus getting rid of

gameplay

graphics

sound

value

tilt

man what are they thinking

NATATO

That stuff nevermattered to begin with! THey just messed with the componets until they got the score they wanted. I mean if they took the compnets seriously why would Wario Ware get the same graphic score as Oblvion. No they already rated on overall impression.

That's exactly how I feel. Now they can give they score they want without having to mess around with the different categories. Anything worth noting about sound, graphics e.t.c. can be mentioned in the Good and Bad sections (and in the review of course.)

So then Twilight Princess will be rounded up to a 9.0? :DOdsplut

And Gears of War to 10.

........ :|

[QUOTE="11Marcel"][QUOTE="diggyzoom"]

I am not sure what to think. Lets say hypothetically that Gran Turismo 5 would score a 9.3 on the old scale and they are right between 9.5 and 9.0 on the new scale. They will probably go down and give it a 9 and that would affect System Wars forever. Forza 2 >>>> GT5 confirmed.

diggyzoom