GS: Donkey Kong Country Returns - Review

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]

For what Retro has done with the IP, this is nothing less than a 9.5 game. It is hands-down the best 2D platforming available. How this gets a 8.5 is beyond me. It is understandable when a review is taken as the reviewer's enjoyment of a game, but GS has always tried to sell their reviews as some kind of "objective analysis."

Captain_Lorelli

Well stated as usual foxhound, I have not played a better 2d sidescrolling platformer in years! To all of those questioning why some of us are upset with the "8.5" score, its not because of the score itself but rather the reasoning. Of course it is only one man's opinion, but when you compare it to the sites standards as a whole, it should make sense. NSMBW recieved and 8.5. I liked it a lot and had a lot of fun with it. Was it innovative,creative,artiscially driven....NO! Did it deserve an 8.5, probably but only for resting on its namesake and laurels. DKC on the other hand took a classic game character and forumla to new heights with amazing level design, great platforming, co-op and some of the best art direction I've ever seen, HD or not. There is no logical way to rate NSMBW(lazy cash in by the worlds greatest 1st party developer) to DKCR(amazing effort by an amazing sub developer).

I'm a nintendo fan but I don't really share much of that perspective. The first issue there is that TP was a really bland Zelda game. Sure in the context of everything else out there it is probably a 9.0 game but in terms of just envoking that Zelda feel, I honestly like Windwaker a lot more.

I also don't believe in innovating the right way. I believe in good design and crappy design. Innovation is ultimately design and if its crap then its not innovation, its just a poorly excuted concept. New concepts aren't ever done in the "right" way, I just think they are either below, at or above par for someone's enjoyment. I also hardly consider nintendo to be amazing innovators. They just bring good and unique design to their games.

ActicEdge

I know, I was generalizing and tbh you're the first supporter of Wii that I would not put in the same box as myself and many others. You don't strike me as a fan of anything, as you said, you belive in "good or bad design" and whatever that means is something very specific and personal to you.

It's not possible to emmulate Wii Sports Resort or Zelda SS and more, with a regular controller. This is by definition, innovation. There are other areas that are debatable whether or not they innovated in, but since it seems like you've already decided I'm not gonna bother.

[QUOTE="Willy105"]So what's the problem here?Sandvichman

It's mostly the fact that it's ANOTHER 8.5 from GS. People would have cared alot less, if it got 7.5 or 8.0. Doesn't have to be 9.0 or above. It's just silly and it proves that the rating system is flawed. They should change back, or just use a 5 star system, no 4.5 or so, just 1,2,3,4,5.

All these recent Wii games that has 8.5 = 4/5 and SMG2 = 5/5. It's much more simple and elegant compared to what we have now, since they don't take it seriously anymore, might aswell make it even more simple.

Personally I prefer the 100 point one and no there is a difference between 9.1 and 9.2, they're not arbritrary at all, and they would have fixed this 8.5-fest easily. But noooo.

[QUOTE="Willy105"]So what's the problem here?Sandvichman

Actually i think there's a pretty interesting debate going on that is taking up most of this thread. From the merits of being familiar with controls to what actually constitutes a game being called "stellar" rather then just "great".

[QUOTE="Captain_Lorelli"]

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]

For what Retro has done with the IP, this is nothing less than a 9.5 game. It is hands-down the best 2D platforming available. How this gets a 8.5 is beyond me. It is understandable when a review is taken as the reviewer's enjoyment of a game, but GS has always tried to sell their reviews as some kind of "objective analysis."

locopatho

Well stated as usual foxhound, I have not played a better 2d sidescrolling platformer in years! To all of those questioning why some of us are upset with the "8.5" score, its not because of the score itself but rather the reasoning. Of course it is only one man's opinion, but when you compare it to the sites standards as a whole, it should make sense. NSMBW recieved and 8.5. I liked it a lot and had a lot of fun with it. Was it innovative,creative,artiscially driven....NO! Did it deserve an 8.5, probably but only for resting on its namesake and laurels. DKC on the other hand took a classic game character and forumla to new heights with amazing level design, great platforming, co-op and some of the best art direction I've ever seen, HD or not. There is no logical way to rate NSMBW(lazy cash in by the worlds greatest 1st party developer) to DKCR(amazing effort by an amazing sub developer).

Yes, but there is a mass amount of 3d action games to pool from. Sidescrollers have been basically extinct for a long time. When a game comes along and pushes the limits of its genre and throws everything but the kitchen sink at you in terms of art,imagination and level design, it should be given praise, not rated equally to a lazy uninspired cash in ..NSMBW.

A lot of people who bought the game and think it's AAA are purely basing it on nostalgic reasons.maniacalrooster

not rated equally to a lazy uninspired cash in ..NSMBW.Captain_Lorelli

[QUOTE="maniacalrooster"] A lot of people who bought the game and think it's AAA are purely basing it on nostalgic reasons.foxhound_fox

not rated equally to a lazy uninspired cash in ..NSMBW.Captain_Lorelli

Look, I love NSMBW as much as anyone but it really is uninspired in alot of areas. Granted the gameplay is excellent, the rest is very bland and recycled. Average art design check, average midi music selection check, visuals that are just a tad more impressive than the DS check. I'm not saying its a bad game, (heck I think I gave it a 9+) but I expect better from Nintendo. A few days ago I got something better, DKCR and it scored the same. Just saying.

cant wait to get wii and get this and the mario games

[QUOTE="maniacalrooster"] A lot of people who bought the game and think it's AAA are purely basing it on nostalgic reasons.foxhound_fox

not rated equally to a lazy uninspired cash in ..NSMBW.Captain_Lorelli

granted it is 10x better than it's DS counterpart.

ehh..I wouldn't go that far.

granted it is 10x better than it's DS counterpart.

Shinobishyguy

I pretty much agree with fox. Its not my favourite mario game because it is literally been there done that but as far as polish and design goes, it encompasses the best from all the mario games. Its dragged down by craptastic art, craptastic music and a very familiar feel but it is pretty much 2D mario at its prime.

Its still near the bottom of my list though.

After playing some of DKCR (I am on World 3 now), I have to say...the GameSpot review was right. The motion controls really do hamper the experience and they seem to stop working at the worst possible times, leading to loss of health or untimely deaths. Why Retro decided to go through with shaking the Wii remote as opposed to a simple button input (or even having the option of a button input) is beyond me.

After playing some of DKCR (I am on World 3 now), I have to say...the GameSpot review was right. The motion controls really do hamper the experience and they seem to stop working at the worst possible times, leading to loss of health or untimely deaths. Why Retro decided to go through with shaking the Wii remote as opposed to a simple button input (or even having the option of a button input) is beyond me.

Sky-

[QUOTE="Sky-"]

After playing some of DKCR (I am on World 3 now), I have to say...the GameSpot review was right. The motion controls really do hamper the experience and they seem to stop working at the worst possible times, leading to loss of health or untimely deaths. Why Retro decided to go through with shaking the Wii remote as opposed to a simple button input (or even having the option of a button input) is beyond me.

Shinobishyguy

[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"][QUOTE="Sky-"]

After playing some of DKCR (I am on World 3 now), I have to say...the GameSpot review was right. The motion controls really do hamper the experience and they seem to stop working at the worst possible times, leading to loss of health or untimely deaths. Why Retro decided to go through with shaking the Wii remote as opposed to a simple button input (or even having the option of a button input) is beyond me.

Comduter

Surely it has other things like level design and such

After playing some of DKCR (I am on World 3 now), I have to say...the GameSpot review was right. The motion controls really do hamper the experience and they seem to stop working at the worst possible times, leading to loss of health or untimely deaths. Why Retro decided to go through with shaking the Wii remote as opposed to a simple button input (or even having the option of a button input) is beyond me.

Sky-

Holding the Wiimote sideways is very limiting button-wise :>

In this case, the motion controls aren't BAD or GOOD, they're something DIFFERENT, and for what they do it works very well. You prefer a traditional controller, it's just a matter of opinion.

I for one prefer the motion in games like TP, NSMBW and SMG, that is games that could have been done with a traditional controller.

Just get used to it, give the games 0-5 or 1.0 less in score and you're fine.

However, there are many cases where the motion controlls are just better since you can't play Resort or Zelda SS with a traditional controller, the way they are designed.

Just finished World 4 - my favourite so far, has some really incredible moments! The game just keeps getting better, sort of like Galaxy 2.

As an update to my previous comments on motion: I'm actually finding that the motion gives me absolutely no problems. The K levels are proving to me that i can do the roll on a dime. So far, my loss of life - and many balloons have been popped - has been entirely due to me.

I didn't realise control issues were the only part of this game.

Surely it has other things like level design and such

Shinobishyguy

[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"]I didn't realise control issues were the only part of this game.

Surely it has other things like level design and such

foxhound_fox

So, is the consensus, among people actually playing the game, that GameSpot under-rated this title?

I'm shocked at the score. I seriously wish Tom would have giving this game a 9.0 to show that a Wii game besides theCOD games can get high scores

So, is the consensus, among people actually playing the game, that GameSpot under-rated this title?

Bigboi500

I don't really believe in the concept of overrating and underrating as it undermines the idea of intellectual freedom in reviews, but I will say that I personally feel this game deserves much more than an 8.5. From what I've played, I think it is easily a 9.5.

After playing some of DKCR (I am on World 3 now), I have to say...the GameSpot review was right. The motion controls really do hamper the experience and they seem to stop working at the worst possible times, leading to loss of health or untimely deaths. Why Retro decided to go through with shaking the Wii remote as opposed to a simple button input (or even having the option of a button input) is beyond me.

Sky-

You should try the Wiimote + Nunchuk control scheme. I haven't had any problems and disagree with the Gamespot review. This game deserves at least a 9.

Well anyway it met it hype and I personally can't wait for the game.

Well anyway it met it hype and I personally can't wait for the game.

[QUOTE="Zanoh"]

[QUOTE="Captain_Lorelli"]

Gamespot drops another notch in the credibility department...

Half-Way

If IGN became 9GN

Gamespot became 8.5spot. XD

I go by Metacritic anyway.

thats only fair

Lol I definately agree with that :P

So, is the consensus, among people actually playing the game, that GameSpot under-rated this title?

Bigboi500

Absolutely. I was expecting just the same old DKC with a shiny new coat, but instead got one of the best 2d platformers I've ever played. Tight controls, great level designs, great boss fights (love the mine cart mole fight), you name it, this game takes the series to an unexpected level of awesome. I never thought of the DKC series as being top tier platformers, but this game definitely separates itself from the pack.

Its not like an 8.5 is a bad score at all, but when viewed in comparison to many games that get a 9 + on this site it does come off as being under-rated. And when viewed in comparison to other offerings in the genre the score just doesnt make sense. The game has more than enough quality to hang with AAA titles and does more than enough new to avoid being docked for "same old, same old.", yet still manages to get outscored by lesser quality games that do next to nothing different from their previous iterations.

I've never been one to really argue a score and for the most part I agree with most of the Ninty 8.5s being handed out. Hell, some of them could have been rated lower IMO. But this game definitely deserved better and its easy to see from peoples reactions.

You will notice that most of the people trying to justify the score just watched a few videos and think this is just a good looking SNES DKC, while everyone who is actually playing the game talks about how it is so much more. Retro could have gotten by simply resting on the shoulders of nostalgia, but that is not the case at all with this game.

I lol'd. NSMBW is a perfection of the 2D Mario formula... almost to the same level as Galaxy is to the 3D formula. In terms of gameplay, it is one of the least "lazy" and "uninspired" games Nintendo has released this gen. They may have not put much effort into the art... but its a Mario game, you play for the platforming and level design, not the art.

foxhound_fox

I'm pretty sure its amazing level design wouldnt be so "overlooked" if nintendo called it Super Mario Bros. 4

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]I lol'd. NSMBW is a perfection of the 2D Mario formula... almost to the same level as Galaxy is to the 3D formula. In terms of gameplay, it is one of the least "lazy" and "uninspired" games Nintendo has released this gen. They may have not put much effort into the art... but its a Mario game, you play for the platforming and level design, not the art.

I'm pretty sure its amazing level design wouldnt be so "overlooked" if nintendo called it Super Mario Bros. 4

[QUOTE="foxhound_fox"]I lol'd. NSMBW is a perfection of the 2D Mario formula... almost to the same level as Galaxy is to the 3D formula. In terms of gameplay, it is one of the least "lazy" and "uninspired" games Nintendo has released this gen. They may have not put much effort into the art... but its a Mario game, you play for the platforming and level design, not the art.

Thunderdrone

I'm pretty sure its amazing level design wouldnt be so "overlooked" if nintendo called it Super Mario Bros. 4