@super600: You don't know that. There is absolutely no way of making that claim. The Bone was dead as shit. If market forces had gone their natural route, we'd be looking at a much different console war. One where the international market would hold greater sway over development than it already does.
I hated Microsoft before the Xbox One and I also hate Sony
Microsoft were excellent before the Xbox One.
360 went from amazing to lackluster so nope
For the better part of the 7th generation, the 360 was excellent and without a doubt the best system on the market.
The fact that MS became complacent as time went on is undeniable, though. That complacency basically bled into the beginning of this generation and led to the XB1 reveal/launch fiasco.
For the better part of the 7th generation, the 360 was excellent and without a doubt the best system on the market.
The fact that MS became complacent as time went on is undeniable, though. That complacency basically bled into the beginning of this generation and the XB1 reveal/launch fiasco.
Exactly, I think about it the same way as you :)
Their disrespect of quality first and second party studios and games meant fewer reasons for people to run out and buy a Xbone at launch. Especially when people could buy a console that cost 100 bucks less and ran multiplat games better.
For having a firmware update every month. Jeez, MS, did you learn nothing from the PS3?
But unlike the PS3 it doesn't take 23 hours to update your console.
I can stomach software improvements and updates if the download and install is fast :)
For example Steam is great, and I barely notice my games or steam client being updated. Xbox one is ... fast enough.
That one I'll agree isn't really a major point, I guess it only works when you read it in conjunction with the other points. I just added that on because it bugs me.
@R4gn4r0k said:
Exactly, I think about it the same way as you :)
Their disrespect of quality first and second party studios and games meant fewer reasons for people to run out and buy a Xbone at launch. Especially when people could buy a console that cost 100 bucks less and ran multiplat games better.
Thankfully, it looks like they're doing something about their first party. QB, Scalebound and Crackdown look pretty good (still waiting on more info about Recore before making up my mind on it). Hopefully they'll keep the exclusives coming and make sure they're, you know, exclusive to the system.
That one I'll agree isn't really a major point, I guess it only works when you read it in conjunction with the other points. I just added that on because it bugs me.
Sorry man, I glanced over most points real quick. I was just nitpicking xD
Not that you don't make a strong OP, but I think we see eye to eye on most points anyway.
@khoofia_pika said:
Thankfully, it looks like they're doing something about their first party. QB, Scalebound and Crackdown look pretty good (still waiting on more info about Recore before making up my mind on it). Hopefully they'll keep the exclusives coming and make sure they're, you know, exclusive to the system.
No, but the damage is already done: Bungie is gone, Bizarre is gone, Ensemble is gone, Rare has bled out, ...
Those studios are never coming back. Sure, MS has the IP but they need other studios to create new games in that IP (like what they are doing with Halo and Gears)
They are making exclusivity deals with second party (Remedy) and third party (Scalebound, Halo Wars, Recore) but in the long term... that still means MS has a serious lack of first and second party studios.
They need to start opening new studios. And I mean more than just a studio to create more Halo and a studio to create more Gears of War.
@khoofia_pika: I don't agree with your statement about them being great before the x1. They lost me as a customer over letting Bungie go, closing Ensemble, relegating Rare to making Kinect, and just generally abandoning any expansion of first party studios outside of a few new Kinect studios at the time.
Halfway through last gen, they lost the plot from a first-party perspective and leaned almost entirely on multiplats to buffer the system. I abandoned Xbox after being a proud supporter since 2002 with the og box. I think there's a very strong reason why the PS3 seemingly came back to life and even matched the 360s worldwide sales by the end of the 7th gen. And it was NOT because MS was doing a fine job with the 360 at that point by any means.
Look if they did a complete 180 and offered me what I wanted, i'd get an Xbox one. That goes for any company, just give me what I want there's no emotion there. With that said, I won't forget what they tried to pull.
What I find funny is that the current Xbox one has remnants of its always online / drm beginnings like no offline achievements (clearly as everything was meant to be online, they didn't bother changing how achievements work and you can't even disable the pop ups like on 360 even while offline) and that's also why you have to download disc based 360 games for BC. And in general missing options that I loved on 360. No custom soundtracks, yeah for Sony it's the same thing but that's no excuse for MS to go back on that. And Sony sucks ass as well, they don't have any BC whatsoever and what they pulled with Ps2 classics is scummy so i'm not just picking on the Xbox one.
That is the most tryhard OP I've ever read. These companies aren't your friends.
Of course they're not my friends. I'm not asking them to send me cards on Christmas. I'm expecting them to make sensible decisions if they want me to pay for their product.
@finalstar2007 said:
Didnt MS tell everyone to stfu and "deal with it" when they tried to bring a DRM focused console? lol forgive them he said, good one TC
Do you just read the title of a thread before responding?
@Shewgenja said:
@khoofia_pika: I don't agree with your statement about them being great before the x1. They lost me as a customer over letting Bungie go, closing Ensemble, relegating Rare to making Kinect, and just generally abandoning any expansion of first party studios outside of a few new Kinect studios at the time.
Halfway through last gen, they lost the plot from a first-party perspective and leaned almost entirely on multiplats to buffer the system. I abandoned Xbox after being a proud supporter since 2002 with the og box. I think there's a very strong reason why the PS3 seemingly came back to life and even matched the 360s worldwide sales by the end of the 7th gen. And it was NOT because MS was doing a fine job with the 360 at that point by any means.
As I said before, MS were strong and the 360 was excellent for a major part of the previous generation. They started veering into complacency in the later years, and that bled into this generation. I'm not disagreeing with you.
Look if they did a complete 180 and offered me what I wanted, i'd get an Xbox one. That goes for any company, just give me what I want there's no emotion there. With that said, I won't forget what they tried to pull.
What I find funny is that the current Xbox one has remnants of its always online / drm beginnings like no offline achievements (clearly as everything was meant to be online, they didn't bother changing how achievements work and you can't even disable the pop ups like on 360 even while offline) and that's also why you have to download disc based 360 games for BC. And in general missing options that I loved on 360. No custom soundtracks, yeah for Sony it's the same thing but that's no excuse for MS to go back on that. And Sony sucks ass as well, they don't have any BC whatsoever and what they pulled with Ps2 classics is scummy so i'm not just picking on the Xbox one.
To be honest, last gen, Sony wouldn't get away with a lot of their practices with the PS4.
Look if they did a complete 180 and offered me what I wanted, i'd get an Xbox one. That goes for any company, just give me what I want there's no emotion there. With that said, I won't forget what they tried to pull.
What I find funny is that the current Xbox one has remnants of its always online / drm beginnings like no offline achievements (clearly as everything was meant to be online, they didn't bother changing how achievements work and you can't even disable the pop ups like on 360 even while offline) and that's also why you have to download disc based 360 games for BC. And in general missing options that I loved on 360. No custom soundtracks, yeah for Sony it's the same thing but that's no excuse for MS to go back on that. And Sony sucks ass as well, they don't have any BC whatsoever and what they pulled with Ps2 classics is scummy so i'm not just picking on the Xbox one.
To be honest, last gen, Sony wouldn't get away with a lot of their practices with the PS4.
Look if they did a complete 180 and offered me what I wanted, i'd get an Xbox one. That goes for any company, just give me what I want there's no emotion there. With that said, I won't forget what they tried to pull.
What I find funny is that the current Xbox one has remnants of its always online / drm beginnings like no offline achievements (clearly as everything was meant to be online, they didn't bother changing how achievements work and you can't even disable the pop ups like on 360 even while offline) and that's also why you have to download disc based 360 games for BC. And in general missing options that I loved on 360. No custom soundtracks, yeah for Sony it's the same thing but that's no excuse for MS to go back on that. And Sony sucks ass as well, they don't have any BC whatsoever and what they pulled with Ps2 classics is scummy so i'm not just picking on the Xbox one.
To be honest, last gen, Sony wouldn't get away with a lot of their practices with the PS4.
Kaz - "All right guys we can be dicks again!" :P
Lol sounds about right. "There are other dicks on the market now, people won't be bothered by us anymore."
To be honest, last gen, Sony wouldn't get away with a lot of their practices with the PS4.
Kaz - "All right guys we can be dicks again!" :P
Lol sounds about right. "There are other dicks on the market now, people won't be bothered by us anymore."
Yeah MS softened up the market a bit for them, it's why Sony charged for onilne after seeing people pay for it, but it's also that success breeds arrogance. Were they behind the Xbox one right now, maybe they would've gave us Ps2 BC.
@brn-dn: 9 yet it never happened tho and you do realise sony was gona do the same drm but pulled it pulled it at the last minute. Go look it up . An recently they tried to trade mark "let's play". Sony are shady as **** if u ask me
@darkrecon: Yes, that's exactly what I stated in my first post.
Sony never announced it so I could care less about rumors, what matters to me is that Microsoft was proud to announce that they were ready to screw over gamers and not give an option. Yet smart gamers found an option in PlayStation.
That trade mark didn't pass and we won't ever know what their intention was to do with it. Is that all you got because that isn't "shady" at all.
@brn-dn: lol are you idiots living in different reality . the x1 didn't launch with drm and how is not anoucing it any different when they would gone through with it . Sony are less honest frankly.
P's here you go and am are you'll make a exuse for sony
lol OP. I used to hold grudges against Sony/etc. For example I was mad at how Dreamcast games were practically being used to hype up the PS2. And then next gen we were laughing at Sony for their E3 conference. (giant enemy crabs etc) And then we were mad at them for saying people should get a second job to afford the PS3. In the long run none of these things matter. PR is ephemeral. It's all just in your head and doesn't affect the quality of the product.
Look at the big three with a clear head and determine what is right/wrong with each product. For me the Wii U gamepad is too big and the Xbox will always be a joke so long as they use assymetrical controllers. For the record I used to knock the Wii U for the fact it uses a power brick but people thought I was nitpicking, lol. I do like that Sony doesn't use a power brick, but it may or may not factor into my decision.
I had no idea Xbox One uses AA batteries, that's crazy.
The Kinect thing does sound bad, I'm sorry for people who got stuck with a Kinect.
No, but the damage is already done: Bungie is gone, Bizarre is gone, Ensemble is gone, Rare has bled out, ...
Those studios are never coming back. Sure, MS has the IP but they need other studios to create new games in that IP (like what they are doing with Halo and Gears)
They are making exclusivity deals with second party (Remedy) and third party (Scalebound, Halo Wars, Recore) but in the long term... that still means MS has a serious lack of first and second party studios.
They need to start opening new studios. And I mean more than just a studio to create more Halo and a studio to create more Gears of War.
Well, yeah, in the long term, I guess MS are somewhat in trouble. They're doing deals, and that's all well and good as far as the immediate future is concerned, but I guess they do need to build up brands and development houses if they want a secure exclusive lineup for a considerable period of time. And not just for the Xbox One, but for future systems too.
No, because they opened the door wide as **** for Sony to charge for online and have it fly under the radar. That shit would have been a far larger ordeal than it was and Sony may have reconsidered if not for the titanic clusterfuck that MS had planned. In the face of that, gamers simply didn't bat an eye at Sony charging for online.
In a way, MS actually degraded competition! They made it easier for the competition demand more and do less than previously expected.
Probably the minority, but I was looking forward to the always online and original vision. Only thing I guess is lack of support with Kinect and sweet deals after launch. In all I'm happy with the game library as its more focused to my genre of gaming (co-op/multiplayer).
I was never in a place where they enraged me to where I need to forgive them, but def. Getting Spencer in and MattRick out looks to have been a huge win.
Forgiveness is such an awful word to use in this context. You're taking this a bit too personal. These companies aren't your friends
No, they're not my friends, but that doesn't give them right to take consumers for granted by enforcing shitty policies and shovelling down our throats. Those terrible choices of MS I've listed above have all made for a terrible follow up to the Xbox 360, which was an excellent system, and the gravity of their mistakes should not be made light of. I'm not taking this personally, I'm just calling them out on their shit. I'm giving them credit where credit is due, they are making attempts to right a lot of their wrongs, but that doesn't change the fact that they got a lot of stuff wrong to begin with, and they did that by taking us for granted.
You're focusing on the "forgiveness" part, I'm focusing on their "sins".
So basically, it's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation when it comes to them. If they don't bother to improve, then people will call them out on that. But now they're trying to (and succeeding in) making a turnaround, but then you have people (like you) keeping a grudge over the policies they had in the past.
Let's be for real here. MS is far and away from being the only company that tried to take its consumer base for granted. The difference being they give enough of a shit about said consumer base to try to make things right. I'm not sure what else you want here at this point. The whole notion of "sins" and "forgiveness" when it comes to a piece of plastic is, well, pretty stupid. This isn't Bank of America of Lehman Brothers we're talking about here, whom were companies who committed acts that made people lose their fucking homes. This is a company that made a lousy product on release that they've since improved.
Forgiveness is such an awful word to use in this context. You're taking this a bit too personal. These companies aren't your friends
No, they're not my friends, but that doesn't give them right to take consumers for granted by enforcing shitty policies and shovelling down our throats. Those terrible choices of MS I've listed above have all made for a terrible follow up to the Xbox 360, which was an excellent system, and the gravity of their mistakes should not be made light of. I'm not taking this personally, I'm just calling them out on their shit. I'm giving them credit where credit is due, they are making attempts to right a lot of their wrongs, but that doesn't change the fact that they got a lot of stuff wrong to begin with, and they did that by taking us for granted.
You're focusing on the "forgiveness" part, I'm focusing on their "sins".
So basically, it's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation when it comes to them. If they don't bother to improve, then people will call them out on that. But now they're trying to (and succeeding in) making a turnaround, but then you have people (like you) keeping a grudge over the policies they had in the past.
Let's be for real here. MS is far and away from being the only company that tried to take its consumer base for granted. The difference being they give enough of a shit about said consumer base to try to make things right. I'm not sure what else you want here at this point. The whole notion of "sins" and "forgiveness" when it comes to a piece of plastic is, well, pretty stupid. This isn't Bank of America of Lehman Brothers we're talking about here, whom were companies who committed acts that made people lose their fucking homes. This is a company that made a lousy product on release that they've since improved.
Big whoop. Pick battles worth fighting bro.
Posting on forums isn't fighting a battle, bro, it's speaking my mind. It's not like I'm taking serious steps against them for their actions.
And sure, MS aren't the only ones who take their consumers for granted. Other companies do that too, and I call them out on their shit too.
It's not "forgiveness" about a piece of plastic, it's about a product that we consumers are expected to pay for, and if MS wants me to pay for it, I'll damn well make sure I at least get my money's worth. And it's not like I'm not giving credit where it's due. Several times in this thread, the OP itself included, I've praised MS for trying to turn it around and making an effort to right their wrongs. It's funny how people (like you) are skipping over those parts.
Xbox 360 > Xbox > Xbox One when it comes down to games
Nah, Xbox >>>>> xbox one (even tho I don't own one) >> 360.
360 was nothing but a multiplat box and a Halo/Forza/Gears simulator. At least xbox one has big exclusive AAA IPs like Scalebound and Quantum Break which honestly look better than anything xbox 360 ever offed in the way of exclusive content; and yes I know the devs of Alan Wake are making Quantum Break.
Xbox had more diverse and interesting game content than either xbox 360 or xbox one tho admittedly most did not get high recognition.
@casharmy: For the longest time, series such as Mass Effect, Ninja Gaiden, BioShock, Dead Rising, Lost Planet, Saints Row and Tales were exclusive to the Xbox 360 in the console market, not to mention first party games such as Halo, Gears, Forza and Fable (which was actually good back then). For at least the first half of the previous generation, Xbox 360 was "indisputably" the best system on the market.
I hated Microsoft before the Xbox One and I also hate Sony
Microsoft were excellent before the Xbox One.
Excellent? You must grade on a curve.
Nope, they were excellent by any standard
Low standards. They stop supporting their consoles in new gens. Their diversification in games continually eroded from the first console to the third. They started the practice of paying to play online. Ruined some of the devs they bought up. Don't prioritize new IPs. RRoD. Yeah real excellent.
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