How can the Souls games be that good?

I have yet to play either of them, but it seems to me that the games get alot of love here on SW... and, after reading about some of the things in the games, it seems to me that the games walk a very fine line between hard and cheap... I don't know, like I said I have yet to play either of them. But I get the feeling that this is one of the cases of a game jsut getting mroe lvoe than it deserves.

A lot of its flaws are forgiven because its HARDCORE and it appeases the nerds idea that they're a special demographic that gaming should revolve around. Thats why it has nothing but love on the internet ;)

A lot of its flaws are forgiven because its HARDCORE and it appeases the nerds idea that they're a special demographic that gaming should revolve around. Thats why it has nothing but love on the internet ;)

WreckEm711

I'm not saying difficulty is a bad thing, but really some of the things in the game are flat out cheap from what I've seen... And, really, there's a reason that qualitites like that disappeared after a few generations of gaming.

Yeah they aren't that good. Skip them.

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"]

A lot of its flaws are forgiven because its HARDCORE and it appeases the nerds idea that they're a special demographic that gaming should revolve around. Thats why it has nothing but love on the internet ;)

turtlethetaffer

I'm not saying difficulty is a bad thing, but really some of the things in the game are flat out cheap from what I've seen... And, really, there's a reason that qualitites like that disappeared after a few generations of gaming.

it's not cheap, but having to do everything again when you die (more a problem with demon's souls than dark souls) can be frustrating to some. one of my friends gave up on demon's early on. another one (the one i thought would never like that sort of game) is almost beating it, last i checked. so it's not a case of getting more praise than it deserves, it's just that it's a love it or hate it game.BrunoBRS

Ah I see. And it just so happens that most people on this forum love it. IDK it doesn't seem like something I'd like.

[QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"]

A lot of its flaws are forgiven because its HARDCORE and it appeases the nerds idea that they're a special demographic that gaming should revolve around. Thats why it has nothing but love on the internet ;)

BrunoBRS

I'm not saying difficulty is a bad thing, but really some of the things in the game are flat out cheap from what I've seen... And, really, there's a reason that qualitites like that disappeared after a few generations of gaming.

I heard there's a frog type enemy that spits an acid cloud that can... degrade your armor by 50%? I think that was it. I know it had soething to do with permanantly weakening your armor.

[QUOTE="BrunoBRS"][QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

I'm not saying difficulty is a bad thing, but really some of the things in the game are flat out cheap from what I've seen... And, really, there's a reason that qualitites like that disappeared after a few generations of gaming.

turtlethetaffer

I heard there's a frog type enemy that spits an acid cloud that can... degrade your armor by 50%? I think that was it. I know it had soething to do with permanantly weakening your armor.

I stopped reading when you mentioned "cheap". NOTHING is cheap in Demon's Souls or Dark Souls. Difficult yes, but cheap, hell no!! Keep in mind I have a platinum in Demon's Souls and 50% trophies in Dark Souls during 1 playthrough. I know these games..they are not cheap.

[QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

[QUOTE="BrunoBRS"] i never once thought i died a cheap death in demon's souls. (not commenting on dark souls 'cause i'm not far yet, but none so far). it's tough, yes, but using your brains more than your brawn will take you a long way in the game. care to give examples of these "cheap instances" you've heard of?BrunoBRS

I heard there's a frog type enemy that spits an acid cloud that can... degrade your armor by 50%? I think that was it. I know it had soething to do with permanantly weakening your armor.

Maybe I'll check it out some day. for now I have lots of other games to play. I just got Xenoblade.

It's rewarding; something many games fail to deliver these days. I'm not even a big Souls fan, and haven't finished either, but I felt like I'd accomplished something when I progressed through the game. Unfortunately, I though Ornstein's armour looked so cool that I set that as my goal from pretty much the start of the game. When I finally got it I took a break and had a lot of stuff to do outside of gaming and ended up selling it. I don't know if I'll buy it again, but it was definitely an excellent game.

I stopped reading when you mentioned "cheap". NOTHING is cheap in Demon's Souls or Dark Souls. Difficult yes, but cheap, hell no!! Keep in mind I have a platinum in Demon's Souls and 50% trophies in Dark Souls during 1 playthrough. I know these games..they are not cheap.

xOMGITSJASONx

The poison dart dudes in Blight-town were sort of cheap.

[QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

[QUOTE="BrunoBRS"] i never once thought i died a cheap death in demon's souls. (not commenting on dark souls 'cause i'm not far yet, but none so far). it's tough, yes, but using your brains more than your brawn will take you a long way in the game. care to give examples of these "cheap instances" you've heard of?BrunoBRS

I heard there's a frog type enemy that spits an acid cloud that can... degrade your armor by 50%? I think that was it. I know it had soething to do with permanantly weakening your armor.

Amen brotha. Spoken like a real "Souls" vet! Personally those frogs were a joke. I ran through those sewers in Dark Souls like it was a cake walk. I died once in that section (my first playthrough) but like you said...its all avoidable. People must understand Souls games aren't cheap..they are fair. You provide the skill and preparation and you reap the rewards.

[QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"]

A lot of its flaws are forgiven because its HARDCORE and it appeases the nerds idea that they're a special demographic that gaming should revolve around. Thats why it has nothing but love on the internet ;)

BrunoBRS

I'm not saying difficulty is a bad thing, but really some of the things in the game are flat out cheap from what I've seen... And, really, there's a reason that qualitites like that disappeared after a few generations of gaming.

Dark-fantasy HARDCORE rpg.Skip demon souls and play dark souls,since i'ts bigger and better in every way.

[QUOTE="BrunoBRS"][QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

I'm not saying difficulty is a bad thing, but really some of the things in the game are flat out cheap from what I've seen... And, really, there's a reason that qualitites like that disappeared after a few generations of gaming.

MyopicCanadian

so i wouldn't call it cheap if i avoided it on my first try (though being a demon's souls vet and knowing that a dragon was bound to happen did help).

It's rewarding; something many games fail to deliver these days. I'm not even a big Souls fan, and haven't finished either, but I felt like I'd accomplished something when I progressed through the game. Unfortunately, I though Ornstein's armour looked so cool that I set that as my goal from pretty much the start of the game. When I finally got it I took a break and had a lot of stuff to do outside of gaming and ended up selling it. I don't know if I'll buy it again, but it was definitely an excellent game.

[QUOTE="xOMGITSJASONx"]

I stopped reading when you mentioned "cheap". NOTHING is cheap in Demon's Souls or Dark Souls. Difficult yes, but cheap, hell no!! Keep in mind I have a platinum in Demon's Souls and 50% trophies in Dark Souls during 1 playthrough. I know these games..they are not cheap.

Twin-Blade

The poison dart dudes in Blight-town were sort of cheap.

No. Not to me. Now did I die in Blightown? Yes, a few times. But it wasn't cheap imo. Its cheap if you weren't at a high level and had all the necessary herbs to wipe the curse out like I did. Its all preparation and knowledge. You must farm to get strong in Souls games. The game isn't cheap at all..its just difficult, Especially if your not a Demon's Souls vet.

[...] it seems to me that the games walk a very fine line between hard and cheap... [...]turtlethetaffer

[QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"][...] it seems to me that the games walk a very fine line between hard and cheap... [...]foxhound_fox

Couldn't of said it better myself.

Dark-fantasy HARDCORE rpg.Skip demon souls and play dark souls,since i'ts bigger and better in every way.

reynal1287

[QUOTE="reynal1287"]

Dark-fantasy HARDCORE rpg.Skip demon souls and play dark souls,since i'ts bigger and better in every way.

TomatoDragonPSN

A lot of its flaws are forgivenWreckEm711

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"]A lot of its flaws are forgivenJynxzor

Who knows. They just are that good.

A lot of its flaws are forgiven because its HARDCORE and it appeases the nerds idea that they're a special demographic that gaming should revolve around. Thats why it has nothing but love on the internet ;)

WreckEm711

That's very odd to hear coming from a Mac fanboy ;)

I have yet to play either of them, but it seems to me that the games get alot of love here on SW... and, after reading about some of the things in the games, it seems to me that the games walk a very fine line between hard and cheap... I don't know, like I said I have yet to play either of them. But I get the feeling that this is one of the cases of a game jsut getting mroe lvoe than it deserves.

turtlethetaffer

Dark Souls is the best game i have played, period

They definatly get a lot less than they deserve, because many casual reviewers cant play the game

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"]

A lot of its flaws are forgiven because its HARDCORE and it appeases the nerds idea that they're a special demographic that gaming should revolve around. Thats why it has nothing but love on the internet ;)

N30F3N1X

That's very odd to hear coming from a Mac fanboy ;)

[QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

I have yet to play either of them, but it seems to me that the games get alot of love here on SW... and, after reading about some of the things in the games, it seems to me that the games walk a very fine line between hard and cheap... I don't know, like I said I have yet to play either of them. But I get the feeling that this is one of the cases of a game jsut getting mroe lvoe than it deserves.

loosingENDS

Dark Souls is the best game i have played, period

They definatly get a lot less than they deserve, because many casual reviewers cant play the game

Anyone can memorize where traps are, most people simply have higher standards for games than that.

Sorry, if you like the game thats fine, but if you are going to insult other people and pretend like they are stupid because they dont like it, im going to expose the game for what it is, cheap and medicore.

[QUOTE="loosingENDS"]

[QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

I have yet to play either of them, but it seems to me that the games get alot of love here on SW... and, after reading about some of the things in the games, it seems to me that the games walk a very fine line between hard and cheap... I don't know, like I said I have yet to play either of them. But I get the feeling that this is one of the cases of a game jsut getting mroe lvoe than it deserves.

crimsonman1245

Dark Souls is the best game i have played, period

They definatly get a lot less than they deserve, because many casual reviewers cant play the game

Anyone can memorize where traps are, most people simply have higher standards for games than that.

Sorry, if you like the game thats fine, but if you are going to insult other people and pretend like they are stupid because they dont like it, im going to expose the game for what it is, cheap and medicore.

So, what are those games with the higher gameplay standards ?

If you are going to "expose" the game for beeing mediocre, you must tell us what you use as the highest standard so your post has any meaning

Also dont confuse your own personal opinion with reality, if you dont like the game fine, but it did not get 9.5/10 here for nothing

*sigh*

get tired of trying to relay the depth of Demon's Souls to disbelievers.

I mean Demon's and Dark Souls have entire forums worth of posters who go in the great detail of the complexity and variations of the games universe. Really Demon's is still the over-all best game I've played this generation and Dark Souls is a wonderful fan follow up. Nothing this gen really compares to these games. Regardless of what you see on the surface Souls games have a depth that will blow you away if you are able to grasp the basic gameplay mechanics and exploration of the world.

You can disbelieve all you want but take take this into consideration: Demon's Souls was never even intended to leave japan, but fan praise and response was so great from US gamers who imported the game FOR $80 a pop no less that they literlly forced the developers to make a move.

Now you have me a guy who vocally HATES to spend even $20 on most popular games now a days because I feel they are below my standards of quality, and for me to spend $60 on a game it has to be extra ordinary in my eyes. When I spend my $80 for my import of DS before the reviews (took a chance because of the praise I read from other importers) and finally played that game, I felt like the developers did me a favor just by creating the game...it's that good.

Demon's Souls is in the states now and is only $30 you have to be a fool not to try it...either that or you are not much of a gamer.

The games story blows, in an RPG. RPG being the point, and both Demons and Dark have Mario-level stories in place simply to give you a basic reason for why you're progressing.WreckEm711

[QUOTE="N30F3N1X"]

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"]

A lot of its flaws are forgiven because its HARDCORE and it appeases the nerds idea that they're a special demographic that gaming should revolve around. Thats why it has nothing but love on the internet ;)

WreckEm711

That's very odd to hear coming from a Mac fanboy ;)

Exactly what I mean.

The very same bs you just said regarding the Souls games applies in an almost equal manner to Apple fanboys. All of Apple products' flaws are forgiven because they're hipster and every Apple fanboy thinks he's part of a special demographic ICT should revolve around.

You're an Apple fan, aren't you? It's odd for you to say something like that, unless it was a deliberate act of modesty, which I doubt considering the average personality of worms.

[QUOTE="Jynxzor"][QUOTE="WreckEm711"]A lot of its flaws are forgivenWreckEm711

Simpleton

It's not that it has a mario level story line, it's the fact that you lack the perception to grasp how the story was put into place for the game. In a way I could understand your argument a little for Dark S, but the way the story was implemented in Demon's Souls was magnificent.

Your comments remind me of the people who bash MGS2's story because the lack the perception to understand the genius of how things were put into place and how things were carried out. It's quite easy to have a ready made story and have everythings explained as if you were a child, nothing in Demon's Souls is laid out for you, not even the story. It's a game of exploration, discovery and immersion and that's how it's meant to be played.

Stop comming here with your ignorant coments about a mario level story line because you fail to grasp the impact of how the story is woven into the entire game experience.

It is funny how developers forcing a specific story somehow is considered better than Dark Souls back story first approach

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"]The games story blows, in an RPG. RPG being the point, and both Demons and Dark have Mario-level stories in place simply to give you a basic reason for why you're progressing.foxhound_fox

it's amazing that there is a whole community of gamers were also able to come to similar conclusions about the story of the game.

It's seems the souls games not only have a difficulty level barrier that certain gamers can't pass...they also seem have an intelligence level barrier.

[QUOTE="Jynxzor"][QUOTE="WreckEm711"]A lot of its flaws are forgivenWreckEm711

No they don't. You just haven't put in the effort required to understanding their stories. Both games use unconventional and challenging methods to tell their stories but that hardly makes them bad. The stories themselves arn't too deep but the way they are told is pretty inspired and brilliant. I recommend taking a closer look, you might be surprised.

Only Demon's Souls is

I have yet to play either of them, but it seems to me that the games get alot of love here on SW... and, after reading about some of the things in the games, it seems to me that the games walk a very fine line between hard and cheap... I don't know, like I said I have yet to play either of them. But I get the feeling that this is one of the cases of a game jsut getting mroe lvoe than it deserves.

turtlethetaffer

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"][QUOTE="Jynxzor"] I wasn't aware that it had any massive flaws. Would you care to point them out?casharmy

Simpleton

It's not that it has a mario level story line, it's the fact that you lack the perception to grasp how the story was put into place for the game. In a way I could understand your argument a little for Dark S, but the way the story was implemented in Demon's Souls was magnificent.

Your comments remind me of the people who bash MGS2's story because the lack the perception to understand the genius of how things were put into place and how things were carried out. It's quite easy to have a ready made story and have everythings explained as if you were a child, nothing in Demon's Souls is laid out for you, not even the story. It's a game of exploration, discovery and immersion and that's how it's meant to be played.

Stop comming here with your ignorant coments about a mario level story line because you fail to grasp the impact of how the story is woven into the entire game experience.

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"][QUOTE="N30F3N1X"]

That's very odd to hear coming from a Mac fanboy ;)

N30F3N1X

Exactly what I mean.

The very same bs you just said regarding the Souls games applies in an almost equal manner to Apple fanboys. All of Apple products' flaws are forgiven because they're hipster and every Apple fanboy thinks he's part of a special demographic ICT should revolve around.

You're an Apple fan, aren't you? It's odd for you to say something like that, unless it was a deliberate act of modesty, which I doubt considering the average personality of worms.

[QUOTE="loosingENDS"]

[QUOTE="turtlethetaffer"]

I have yet to play either of them, but it seems to me that the games get alot of love here on SW... and, after reading about some of the things in the games, it seems to me that the games walk a very fine line between hard and cheap... I don't know, like I said I have yet to play either of them. But I get the feeling that this is one of the cases of a game jsut getting mroe lvoe than it deserves.

crimsonman1245

Dark Souls is the best game i have played, period

They definatly get a lot less than they deserve, because many casual reviewers cant play the game

Anyone can memorize where traps are, most people simply have higher standards for games than that.

Sorry, if you like the game thats fine, but if you are going to insult other people and pretend like they are stupid because they dont like it, im going to expose the game for what it is, cheap and medicore.

Yeh the Demon/Dark Soul fans have to stop this elitism... Why can't we all quit the yap and enjoy the games?

if you dont like them you could play other games like ff13 or....

Story sucks, get over it. It's not deep, it's not genius, its ra ridiculously simple framework so progression isn't pointless. As I said, it's flaws are forgiven by nerds because it's TEH HARDCORES AND IT CATES TO MEEE! Your post reeks of this pathetic superiority complexWreckEm711

if you dont like them you could play other games like ff13 or....

metal_zombie

[QUOTE="casharmy"]

[QUOTE="WreckEm711"] I never said massive, did I? The games story blows, in an RPG. RPG being the point, and both Demons and Dark have Mario-level stories in place simply to give you a basic reason for why you're progressing. Music is meh, inventory feels like a cheap 90s game, online is touchy, and omfg the infuriating character-stuck-in-environment that was ultimately the reason I sold Dark Souls.WreckEm711

Simpleton

It's not that it has a mario level story line, it's the fact that you lack the perception to grasp how the story was put into place for the game. In a way I could understand your argument a little for Dark S, but the way the story was implemented in Demon's Souls was magnificent.

Your comments remind me of the people who bash MGS2's story because the lack the perception to understand the genius of how things were put into place and how things were carried out. It's quite easy to have a ready made story and have everythings explained as if you were a child, nothing in Demon's Souls is laid out for you, not even the story. It's a game of exploration, discovery and immersion and that's how it's meant to be played.

Stop comming here with your ignorant coments about a mario level story line because you fail to grasp the impact of how the story is woven into the entire game experience.

like I said there is a whole community of fans who were able to grasp the story...even gamespot was able to understand the depth of how the developers let the story play out...you are but a drop in the ocean, you are easily swept away. No one cares that you have limited preception, but stop posting your opinion as fact.