i7 CPU vs PS4 AMD Jaguar?

[QUOTE="emgesp"]

[QUOTE="clyde46"]ure they provided input as they are the end users of the product but the hardware system itself is designed by the experts at AMD. Its like a car maker talking to a group of race drivers about what they would like in the next race car. The drivers suggest things then the car maker puts that input into the final design. NFJSupreme

they weren't given a blank check though.  they were to design it within limits which is why the speed isn't that high.  there was a budget they had to meet while accounting for size and heat as well.

Who the F*** cares. I just want to play games.

[QUOTE="faizan_faizan"]

[QUOTE="Darth_Kane"]

Intel's CPUs are generally always better than AMD's

04dcarraher

[QUOTE="emgesp"]

[QUOTE="clyde46"] Err? I thought it was designed by hardware experts not game developers. clyde46

my six core i7> ps4 jaguar. themagicbum9720

[QUOTE="clyde46"][QUOTE="ronvalencia"] Both AMD Piledriver "8 core" and Intel Sandybridge/Ivybridge Quad core has 16 X86 instruction retirement per cycle rates. Larger thread count maximises AMD CPU's X86 instruction retirement rates.ronvalencia

Sandybridge i7-2600K = 4 cores(8 threads) x 4 retirement instructions per cycle per core = 16 retirement instructions per cycle. A thread can have up to 4 retirement instructions per cycle.

Piledriver 8350 = 8 cores(8 threads) x 2 retirement instructions per cycle per core = 16 retirement instructions per cycle. A thread can have up to 2 retirement instructions per cycle. Larger thread count maximises AMD CPU's X86 instruction retirement slots.

AMD Streamroller CPU core would be AMD's first 4 retirement instructions per cycle per core class CPU. AMD Streamroller 8 cores(8 threads) x 4 retirement instructions per cycle per core = 32 retirement instructions per cycle.

I don't think you answered his question as to why Intel performed better.

[QUOTE="themagicbum9720"]my six core i7> ps4 jaguar. ronvalencia

You could fit 3 AMD Jaguar CPU cores in one Intel Haswell CPU core. Having German Tiger tanks doesn't win the war.

On cost basis, AMD Jaguar CPU design was designed against ARM Cortex A15.

What does his six core i7 have anything to do with Haswell or Size ?

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

[QUOTE="clyde46"] On paper, but a 4 core Intel i5 will still duke it out with a 8 core AMD cpu. AMD haven't got an answer for the 1155 i7's let alone the 2011 line. Bebi_vegeta

Sandybridge i7-2600K = 4 cores(8 threads) x 4 retirement instructions per cycle per core = 16 retirement instructions per cycle. A thread can have up to 4 retirement instructions per cycle.

Piledriver 8350 = 8 cores(8 threads) x 2 retirement instructions per cycle per core = 16 retirement instructions per cycle. A thread can have up to 2 retirement instructions per cycle. Larger thread count maximises AMD CPU's X86 instruction retirement slots.

AMD Streamroller CPU core would be AMD's first 4 retirement instructions per cycle per core class CPU. AMD Streamroller 8 cores(8 threads) x 4 retirement instructions per cycle per core = 32 retirement instructions per cycle.

I don't think you answered his question as to why Intel performed better.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

[QUOTE="themagicbum9720"]my six core i7> ps4 jaguar. Bebi_vegeta

You could fit 3 AMD Jaguar CPU cores in one Intel Haswell CPU core. Having German Tiger tanks doesn't win the war.

On cost basis, AMD Jaguar CPU design was designed against ARM Cortex A15.

What does his six core i7 have anything to do with Haswell or Size ?

[QUOTE="Bebi_vegeta"]

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

Sandybridge i7-2600K = 4 cores(8 threads) x 4 retirement instructions per cycle per core = 16 retirement instructions per cycle. A thread can have up to 4 retirement instructions per cycle.

Piledriver 8350 = 8 cores(8 threads) x 2 retirement instructions per cycle per core = 16 retirement instructions per cycle. A thread can have up to 2 retirement instructions per cycle. Larger thread count maximises AMD CPU's X86 instruction retirement slots.

 

AMD Streamroller CPU core would be AMD's first 4 retirement instructions per cycle per core class CPU. AMD Streamroller 8 cores(8 threads) x 4 retirement instructions per cycle per core = 32 retirement instructions per cycle.

ronvalencia

I don't think you answered his question as to why Intel performed better.

If both have 16 retirement instuction per cycle, who is going to be faster ?

[QUOTE="Bebi_vegeta"]

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

You could fit 3 AMD Jaguar CPU cores in one Intel Haswell CPU core. Having German Tiger tanks doesn't win the war.

 

 

On cost basis, AMD Jaguar CPU design was designed against ARM Cortex A15.

 

ronvalencia

What does his six core i7 have anything to do with Haswell or Size ?

What is the cost of both ?

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"][QUOTE="Bebi_vegeta"]

What does his six core i7 have anything to do with Haswell or Size ?

Bebi_vegeta

What is the cost of both ?

Smaller chip size is usually equates cheaper BOM cost.

Intel plans to have a quad-core out-of-order Intel Atom (ValleyView") with 22nm process tech i.e. Intel offers it's own AMD Jaguar or ARM Cortex A15 type product.

Against ARM Cortex A15, Intel wouldn't be using Haswell i.e. Intel is not stupid.

Note that AMD's success with X86 IP also benefits Intel.

i7 3960x here...

i7 3960x here...

tionmedon

[QUOTE="tionmedon"]

i7 3960x here...

mitu123

So basically PS4 CPU is more similar to the A15 in my tablet than the one in my PC...

kraken2109

No, ARM Cortex A15 has to beat AMD Bobcat at per clock basis let alone AMD Jaguar.

From http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=samsung_exynos5_dual&num=3

First gen/End of Life Intel Core i3-330M smashes ARM Cortex A15 (Exynos 5, dual core, 1.7Ghz) in performance.

----------------------

AMD Temash A6-1450 (quad core/4 threads) @1.4Ghz vs Intel Core "Sandybridge" i3-2367U (dual core/4 threads) @ 1.4Ghz.

It took me a while to get to the end of the thread but I swam through ronvalencia's semen and I finally made it.

I say PS4's CPU because of the 8GB GDDR5

-Unreal-

That's all you can do? It seems your brain is limit to primal type subjects.

You haven't factored in CPU's IO width and it doesn't natively support 256bit wide IO for proper Intel AVX SIMD processing.

So basically PS4 CPU is more similar to the A15 in my tablet than the one in my PC...

It took me a while to get to the end of the thread but I swam through ronvalencia's semen and I finally made it.

I say PS4's CPU because of the 8GB GDDR5

It took me a while to get to the end of the thread but I swam through ronvalencia's semen and I finally made it.

I say PS4's CPU because of the 8GB GDDR5

-Unreal-

:lol:........:|...............:lol:

the gaming cpu will be faster, i7 is more for multitasking cad work etc.

[QUOTE="Bebi_vegeta"]

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"] Cost. ronvalencia

What is the cost of both ?

Smaller chip size is usually equates cheaper BOM cost.

Intel plans to have a quad-core out-of-order Intel Atom (ValleyView") with 22nm process tech i.e. Intel offers it's own AMD Jaguar or ARM Cortex A15 type product.

Against ARM Cortex A15, Intel wouldn't be using Haswell i.e. Intel is not stupid.

Note that AMD's success with X86 IP also benefits Intel.

It's too bad, I was actually looking for numbers...

[QUOTE="Bebi_vegeta"]

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"] I have answered the question i.e. it's the CPU's ability to allocate X86 instruction cycle slots for a thread.ronvalencia

If both have 16 retirement instuction per cycle, who is going to be faster ?

It depends on the workload type.

From http://www.planet3dnow.de/cgi-bin/newspub/viewnews.cgi?id=1366210905

1. More quad-core AMD Kabini (engineering) @ 2.0 Ghz single and multi-thread benchmarks. PS4 has the 8 core version AMD Kabini/Kyoto.

2. Shows Radeon HD 9380 IGP i.e. the existance of Radeon HD 9xx0 models.

3. On single thread, AMD Kabini destorys AMD Ontario (Bobcat).

PS; AMD Kyoto is AMD's high density X86 CPU server product. LOL @ statements which claims AMD Jaguar is only a tablet CPU. Intel also it's own high density X86 CPU server product which is based on enhanced Intel Atom i.e. out-of-order version with 22nm process tech. Both AMD and Intel is going to meet ARM on one-on-one basis.

But intel is better then AMD right ?

the gaming cpu will be faster, i7 is more for multitasking cad work etc.

kickingcarpet

[QUOTE="kickingcarpet"]

the gaming cpu will be faster, i7 is more for multitasking cad work etc.

kraken2109

He needs a "enhanced for gaming" sticker for it to be a """gaming cpu"""

I would place more quotation marks, however gamespot will probably explode from the quantity of quotes. The notion is that ridiculous! 
 

[QUOTE="kraken2109"]

So basically PS4 CPU is more similar to the A15 in my tablet than the one in my PC...

ronvalencia

No, ARM Cortex A15 has to beat AMD Bobcat at per clock basis let alone AMD Jaguar.

From http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=samsung_exynos5_dual&num=3

First gen/End of Life Intel Core i3-330M smashes ARM Cortex A15 (Exynos 5, dual core, 1.7Ghz) in performance.

----------------------

AMD Temash A6-1450 (quad core/4 threads) @1.4Ghz vs Intel Core "Sandybridge" i3-2367U (dual core/4 threads) @ 1.4Ghz.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

[QUOTE="kraken2109"]

So basically PS4 CPU is more similar to the A15 in my tablet than the one in my PC...

Kaszilla

No, ARM Cortex A15 has to beat AMD Bobcat at per clock basis let alone AMD Jaguar.

From http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=samsung_exynos5_dual&num=3

First gen/End of Life Intel Core i3-330M smashes ARM Cortex A15 (Exynos 5, dual core, 1.7Ghz) in performance.

----------------------

AMD Temash A6-1450 (quad core/4 threads) @1.4Ghz vs Intel Core "Sandybridge" i3-2367U (dual core/4 threads) @ 1.4Ghz.

For Exynos 5 Quad Core @ 1.7Ghz, double phoronix's scores.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

[QUOTE="Bebi_vegeta"]

If both have 16 retirement instuction per cycle, who is going to be faster ?

Bebi_vegeta

It depends on the workload type.

From http://www.planet3dnow.de/cgi-bin/newspub/viewnews.cgi?id=1366210905

1. More quad-core AMD Kabini (engineering) @ 2.0 Ghz single and multi-thread benchmarks. PS4 has the 8 core version AMD Kabini/Kyoto.

2. Shows Radeon HD 9380 IGP i.e. the existance of Radeon HD 9xx0 models.

3. On single thread, AMD Kabini destorys AMD Ontario (Bobcat).

PS; AMD Kyoto is AMD's high density X86 CPU server product. LOL @ statements which claims AMD Jaguar is only a tablet CPU. Intel also it's own high density X86 CPU server product which is based on enhanced Intel Atom i.e. out-of-order version with 22nm process tech. Both AMD and Intel is going to meet ARM on one-on-one basis.

But intel is better then AMD right ?

It depends on the SKU and workload type.

For example

Remember, PS4's graphics layers is not like the PCs i.e. PS4 doesn't have Direct3D VM on top of another LLVM (driver side low level virtual machine).

[QUOTE="mitu123"]

[QUOTE="tionmedon"]

i7 3960x here...

tionmedon

the gaming cpu will be faster, i7 is more for multitasking cad work etc.

kickingcarpet

the i7 will probably be better but the graphics are what matter and intel can't make a half decent graphic chip. They are so bad the atom doesn't even have an intel gpu. imprezawrx500

The next out-of-order enabled Intel Atom quad-core has Intel's 7th gen HD graphics (Ivybridge type IEU).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Intel_graphics_processing_units#Seventh_generation

http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/08/new-quad-core-intel-atom-socs-targets-pcs-servers-and-tablets/

Intel will have it's own AMD Temash type APU/SOC.

Intel HD 4000 ULV is known to murder the PowerVR solutions in Apple's iPad 4.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6872/the-great-equalizer-apple-android-windows-tablets-compared-using-gldxbenchmark-27

When dealing desktop PC level graphics workloads, all PowerVR solutions is $hit.

The alternative to PS4's AMD Jaguar X8 + Radeon HD "7860" (212 mm^2 chip size) would be Intel Atom/Silvermont X8 + NVIDIA GK106 (214 mm^2 chip size).

Intel Atom/Silvermont includes out-of-order processing.

Both Intel Atom/Silvermont and AMD Jaguar targets high density servers e.g. HP "Moonshot".

Didn't realize how bad the PS4 CPU is.

the core i7 is far and away superior. via technicallity if you could jerry rig three smartphone quad-core cpu's togeather you could out-preform a jaguar.

[QUOTE="razu2444"]There is no proof which is better. Hermits and their arrogance will say i7. 8 cores vs 4 cores. Me thinks ps4 for a few months04dcarraher

:lol:

so much denial

even AMD's flagship 8 core cpu does not beat an intel i7, so why would you think a low TDP based laptop/tablet based cpu at 1.6 ghz going to beat a modern quad core....

he believe in magic that is why :lol:

Hi all, how would one of the latest intel i7 CPU compare against the AMD CPU that is inside the PS4? Isit all just guesswork or do we have a good estimation of the performance of each?CwlHeddwyn

Really ?

I think the AMD can compete as long the developer takes advantage of all cores. The problem with most PC games is that they only take advantage of 2 cores at most. That's why Intel usually win benchmarks but a game that takes advantage of four, or even eight cores (meaning when PS4 power is fully utilized)? AMD can smoke Intel bad. Kjranu

AMD desktop product vs intel in multi-core benchmarks, is definitely closer than less threeaded benchmarks. But intel still wins, even with less cores. 

PS4's laptop grade CPU  vs intel desktop solution.... not even close.

@ronvelancia, @tormentos, or @tessellation <== these are the techies to ask here in order to get the accurate picture

but I think:

Graphics : Jaguar > i7

General computation: i7 > Jaguar

Mystery_Writer

me and bar owner are going to be good friends  after the op putting  up this thread.

[QUOTE="Kjranu"]I think the AMD can compete as long the developer takes advantage of all cores. The problem with most PC games is that they only take advantage of 2 cores at most. That's why Intel usually win benchmarks but a game that takes advantage of four, or even eight cores (meaning when PS4 power is fully utilized)? AMD can smoke Intel bad. Kinthalis

AMD desktop product vs intel in multi-core benchmarks, is definitely closer than less threeaded benchmarks. But intel still wins, even with less cores.

PS4's laptop grade CPU vs intel desktop solution.... not even close.

Note that Intel Haswell core has 4 integer units which is similar to AMD Piledriver module's 4 integer units.

Both AMD Piledriver module and Intel Haswell core supports two threads.

I7 wins with a fatality.

Who really gives a sh!t if an i7 CPU is weaker than a 7850 GPU in the graphics department. If you have an i7 CPU you likely have a graphics card that is far more powerful than a 7850! If you don't why the hell do you have a Haswell chip in the first place?

CPU to CPU, i7 is, by far, more powerful than an AMD Jaguar. There is is no contest.

Hello! I wish to disarm you Intel and AMD fanboys. The Jaguar cores used in the PS4 will have assisted GPGPU x86 processing found similar in the x86 mantle API which is proven to be faster than any CPU. AMD is not competing with Intel anymore and is going into a field all it's own, It doesn't effect Intel products and it doesn't effect AMD computers. However this may greatly effect how we play games in the future, I've always seen Intel as a productivity processor and AMD an entertainment. The SoC quality on an AMD chip is generally a lot better than Intel's, but AMD has slower IPC mainly do to how AMD chips access ram. hUMA and HSA will completely tear x86 platform apart, may even make it a more fun environment for developers. This could hurt AMD or give them huge loads of dosh.

Yes, I'm saying that the Jaguar cores in the PS4 will have GPU aided processing and rendering across eight cores.

should have gone with the 8350

^ lol at console kid trying to talk hardware