Jonathan Blow Talks PS4 hardware: equivalent game will run faster than PC

[QUOTE="HaloinventedFPS"]

Fun Fact: PS4's OS uses more ram than Windows 8

Do you have anything of substance to back this up? :?

[QUOTE="tormentos"][QUOTE="04dcarraher"] my $700 2007 gaming says hi , vs the PS3 $500 or $600 modelsclyde46

[QUOTE="RyviusARC"]

[QUOTE="xboxiphoneps3"]

 

fun fact: PS4 doesnt have API overhead or DirectX in the way so they are able to squeeze 2x more performance out a console over a similiarly specced PC

xboxiphoneps3

If that were true then why does an 8600gt perform similar or better than a 360/PS3?

The 8600gt is pretty much similar in power to the 360/PS3 so if what you said were true then those consoles should be performing twice as well.

RAM does not equal processing power.

RAM is used to store textures and asset data.

My point still stands.

Show me the 360/PS3 performing twice as well as an 8600gt.....answer is you can't.

Also an 8600gt can run Gears of War at higher settings than the 360.

Every PC gamer must know and admit that it's not the cpu or gpu that makes a performance difference, it's the speed of the RAM. CPUs and GPUs are just there for asthetic purposes.

[QUOTE="MK-Professor"]

 

 

[QUOTE="xboxiphoneps3"] Ps3, 360 gpu is worse then the x1950... Plus i have no doubt in my mind that if the ps3/360 came with more ram, graphics would look noticeably better then they do now Current gen consoles are extremely limited by the lack of RAMtormentos

The ati x1950pro(248 GFLOPs) is similar(architecture and GFLOPs wise) to the  Xbox GPU(240 GFLOPs). Also more vram equal not more performance, if you have a low-end GPU more vram will not give you more perfoirmace. it is that simpel low-end GPU can use a low amount of vram, high-end GPU can use more vram.

lol NO...

the HD7850 or 650ti meant to have 2GB vram the same way the 8800GT meant to have 512MB vram

8800GT 512MB vs 8800GT 1Gb = 0 performance deference

8800GT 512MB vs 8800GT 256MB = big performance deference

the same goes for the rest...

HD7850 2Gb vs HD7850 4Gb = 0 performance deference

HD7850 2Gb vs HD7850 1Gb = big performance deference

Every PC gamer must know and admit that it's not the cpu or gpu that makes a performance difference, it's the speed of the RAM. CPUs and GPUs are just there for asthetic purposes.

[QUOTE="tormentos"][QUOTE="04dcarraher"] my $700 2007 gaming says hi , vs the PS3 $500 or $600 modelsclyde46

my pc in 2007 had

Athlon X2 6000 @ 3.2 ghz (200mhz OC)

ASUS M2N motherboard

4gb DDR2 800mhz

500gb harddrive

xfx 8800GT alpha dog edition 512mb.

cost $705

[QUOTE="tormentos"][QUOTE="Tessellation"] they will ignore this,every time this is brought up they act like i never happen because it makes them butthurt :cool:Mrmedia01

lol

PS4 $400 to $550 VS $1000 Gaming PC (Not including a monitor)

I will save some money and go PS4. Of course its not going to beat a PC in the long run but I don't want to upgrade a gaming PC very year with a new Video card and CPU. In 10 years if I did that I would end up spending another $3000 probably on my PC.

The sad thing is PC gamers do spend that much in a few years of owning tehre gaming PC, So no thanks, I am content with a powerful console that can be better optimized for and can have the hardware pushed by Devs.

>RAM does not equal processing power.

RAM is used to store textures and asset data.

My point still stands.

Show me the 360/PS3 performing twice as well as an 8600gt.....answer is you can't.

Also an 8600gt can run Gears of War at higher settings than the 360.

RyviusARC

[QUOTE="clyde46"][QUOTE="tormentos"] The PS3 is a 2006 console the 360 2005,hell the PS3 would also be 2005 if it wasn't for a blu-ray diode shortage. And considering how much a liar you are i really doubt it..04dcarraher

my pc in 2007 had

Athlon X2 6000 @ 3.2 ghz (200mhz OC)

ASUS M2N motherboard

4gb DDR2 800mhz

500gb harddrive

xfx 8800GT alpha dog edition 512mb.

cost $705

RAM is used to store textures and asset data.

My point still stands.

Show me the 360/PS3 performing twice as well as an 8600gt.....answer is you can't.

Also an 8600gt can run Gears of War at higher settings than the 360.

[QUOTE="RyviusARC"]>RAM does not equal processing power.

RAM is used to store textures and asset data.

My point still stands.

Show me the 360/PS3 performing twice as well as an 8600gt.....answer is you can't.

Also an 8600gt can run Gears of War at higher settings than the 360.

tormentos

[QUOTE="RyviusARC"]>RAM does not equal processing power.

RAM is used to store textures and asset data.

My point still stands.

Show me the 360/PS3 performing twice as well as an 8600gt.....answer is you can't.

Also an 8600gt can run Gears of War at higher settings than the 360.

tormentos

You are using a fallacy.

The 2005 GPUs lacked unified shaders. 

There is nothing like that this gen.

Unified shaders gave a huge boost in performance in shader intensive games.

This can easily be seen when you compare non shader intensive games which most early games this gen were.

If you compared games like F.E.A.R. or Oblivion you will find that the high end GPUs of 2005 were much better.

Once the majority of games became shader intensive you could upgrade to an 8800gt for 200USD and have more than 3x the power of any console.

But my original argument was an 8600gt because the 8600gt was basically a 7600gt with unified shaders.

The 8600gt in power is similar to consoles and yet it performs similar as well which debunks the argument about it taking a twice as powerful PC gpu to match consoles.

Once again you forget RAM does not equal processing power.

RAM is used to store data like textures and assets.

If the card is not powerful enough to process that data it means very little.

The only time RAM will matter is if a game is reaching the limit of RAM and vRAM

Using Uncharted for a comparison is null because Uncharted is not on PC so don't be stupid.

If you compare most multiplats the PC will usually be fine with 256mbs of vRAM at console settings.

You will need a bit more system memory (RAM) because PC stores more data for quicker access but RAM is dirt cheap.

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

[QUOTE="clyde46"] He's not a liar. tormentos

my pc in 2007 had

Athlon X2 6000 @ 3.2 ghz (200mhz OC)

ASUS M2N motherboard

4gb DDR2 800mhz

500gb harddrive

xfx 8800GT alpha dog edition 512mb.

cost $705

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"]

[QUOTE="clyde46"] He's not a liar. tormentos

my pc in 2007 had

Athlon X2 6000 @ 3.2 ghz (200mhz OC)

ASUS M2N motherboard

4gb DDR2 800mhz

500gb harddrive

xfx 8800GT alpha dog edition 512mb.

cost $705

My 2007 PC build was similar to his and it cost me around 650USD since I used only 2GB of DDR2 800mhz RAM and upgraded to 3GB later for an addition 15USD.

The 8800gt was a briiliant GPU with power almost like the 8800GTX yet I snagged an 8800gt for 200USD.

[QUOTE="tormentos"][QUOTE="04dcarraher"] :lol: tormenting tormentos is fun

my pc in 2007 had

Athlon X2 6000 @ 3.2 ghz (200mhz OC)

ASUS M2N motherboard

4gb DDR2 800mhz

500gb harddrive

xfx 8800GT alpha dog edition 512mb.

cost $705

RyviusARC

My 2007 PC build was similar to his and it cost me around 650USD since I used only 2GB of DDR2 800mhz RAM and upgraded to 3GB later for an addition 15USD.

The 8800gt was a briiliant GPU with power almost like the 8800GTX yet I snagged an 8800gt for 200USD.

[QUOTE="Cranler"] What difference does it make how much ram pc versions use? Ram is cheap and most gamers already have plenty enough ram to run any game. tormentos

Notice how they are using 4xMSAA which eats vRAM and the higher resolution textures also use up a lot of vRAM.

Also notice how the game is running at much higher than 60fps.

If the game was more demanding you wouldn't notice a difference unless the game was using very high resolution textures.

As long as the game is not reaching the limit of vRAM you won't really notice a difference in performance.

There are plenty of benchmarks comparing 2GB cards to 4Gb cards and 

it will run faster? as in more than 60FPS?

ps4 120FPS confirmed. thank you sony

Notice how they are using 4xMSAA which eats vRAM and the higher resolution textures also use up a lot of vRAM.

Also notice how the game is running at much higher than 60fps.

If the game was more demanding you wouldn't notice a difference unless the game was using very high resolution textures.

As long as the game is not reaching the limit of vRAM you won't really notice a difference in performance.

There are plenty of benchmarks comparing 2GB cards to 4Gb cards and 

RyviusARC

[QUOTE="RyviusARC"]

[QUOTE="tormentos"] The whole $705 alone explain why the delay on your reply you went component shopping...:lol: When did you buy this so call PC.?tormentos

My 2007 PC build was similar to his and it cost me around 650USD since I used only 2GB of DDR2 800mhz RAM and upgraded to 3GB later for an addition 15USD.

The 8800gt was a briiliant GPU with power almost like the 8800GTX yet I snagged an 8800gt for 200USD.

I bought the parts from various websites.

I remember at the time BFG tech was having a package deal for an 8800gt and 650watt power supply for 250USD together so I went for it.

Basically it was like getting an 8800gt for 190-200USD because the power supply alone sold for 50-60USD.

And I am happy to say both the 8800gt and power supply work just fine even after almost 6 years have gone by.

The CPU I think I got from FRY'S eletronics and since it had been out since late 2006 the price had gone doen considerably.

I also got my motherboard from FRY's electronics since it was bundled together with my CPU, I think I spent 150USD for both, the motherboard was nothing special but it did the job.

The RAM, DVD drive, computer case, and hard drive were all bought from newegg and I don't remember the individual prices at the moment but if I can remember my old account I believe I could find the purchase data.

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"][QUOTE="tormentos"] And off he goes running..:lol: When did you buy this PC.?tormentos

[QUOTE="tormentos"][QUOTE="RyviusARC"]

 

My 2007 PC build was similar to his and it cost me around 650USD since I used only 2GB of DDR2 800mhz RAM and upgraded to 3GB later for an addition 15USD.

The 8800gt was a briiliant GPU with power almost like the 8800GTX yet I snagged an 8800gt for 200USD.

RyviusARC

I bought the parts from various websites.

I remember at the time BFG tech was having a package deal for an 8800gt and 650watt power supply for 250USD together so I went for it.

Basically it was like getting an 8800gt for 190-200USD because the power supply alone sold for 50-60USD.

And I am happy to say both the 8800gt and power supply work just fine even after almost 6 years have gone by.

The CPU I think I got from FRY'S eletronics and since it had been out since late 2006 the price had gone doen considerably.

I also got my motherboard from FRY's electronics since it was bundled together with my CPU, I think I spent 150USD for both, the motherboard was nothing special but it did the job.

The RAM, DVD drive, computer case, and hard drive were all bought from newegg and I don't remember the individual prices at the moment but if I can remember my old account I believe I could find the purchase data.

[QUOTE="RyviusARC"]Notice how they are using 4xMSAA which eats vRAM and the higher resolution textures also use up a lot of vRAM.

Also notice how the game is running at much higher than 60fps.

If the game was more demanding you wouldn't notice a difference unless the game was using very high resolution textures.

As long as the game is not reaching the limit of vRAM you won't really notice a difference in performance.

There are plenty of benchmarks comparing 2GB cards to 4Gb cards and 

tormentos

Well that will all depend on how much vRAM games will use.

We have no clue how much vRAM will be dedicated to console games so whatever you say will be a guess.

For this gen the jump from 256mb to 512mb was in order to play at higher resolutions and settings compared to consoles.

An 8600gt 256mb will still play games at console settings just fine.

The amount of vRAM used on PC matched closely with the amount used on consoles.

The amount of system memory (RAM) on PC is a lot more though because of what I mentioned before, but RAM is dirt cheap.

My 2007 PC was purchased.............in 2007......

I've said it a hundred times, how can a system that starts its own program first and then Windows be fast? It isn't. I press the button on my console and I start playing. I press the button on my PC, go to the toilet, take two beers out of the fridge, check my email on my Iphone, and when I return, I can begin starting my game. Windows is constantly running on the background, as do 40 to 100 other processes while I game.

[QUOTE="Cranler"] What difference does it make how much ram pc versions use? Ram is cheap and most gamers already have plenty enough ram to run any game. tormentos

can be anywhere between october 29th to december 31st of 2007 take a guess04dcarraher

[QUOTE="RyviusARC"]

[QUOTE="tormentos"] When did you buy your PC..04dcarraher

I bought the parts from various websites.

I remember at the time BFG tech was having a package deal for an 8800gt and 650watt power supply for 250USD together so I went for it.

Basically it was like getting an 8800gt for 190-200USD because the power supply alone sold for 50-60USD.

And I am happy to say both the 8800gt and power supply work just fine even after almost 6 years have gone by.

The CPU I think I got from FRY'S eletronics and since it had been out since late 2006 the price had gone doen considerably.

I also got my motherboard from FRY's electronics since it was bundled together with my CPU, I think I spent 150USD for both, the motherboard was nothing special but it did the job.

The RAM, DVD drive, computer case, and hard drive were all bought from newegg and I don't remember the individual prices at the moment but if I can remember my old account I believe I could find the purchase data.

I lucked out on my 8800gt close to it's release in fall 2007 because of the package deal that BFG tech was doing.

They were also doing an SLI package deal but I decided one was enough at the time.

Too bad BFG tech went out of business........my 8800gt and PSU work just fine so it's not much of a biggie.

My friend lucked out before they went out of business he sent in his 8800gtx to get fixed and they gave him a GTX 280 as a replacement.

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"] can be anywhere between october 29th to december 31st of 2007 take a guesstormentos

My PC could perform 3x better than consoles so price to performance ratio my PC wins.

I've said it a hundred times, how can a system that starts its own program first and then Windows be fast? It isn't. I press the button on my console and I start playing. I press the button on my PC, go to the toilet, take two beers out of the fridge, check my email on my Iphone, and when I return, I can begin starting my game. Windows is constantly running on the background, as do 40 to 100 other processes while I game.

zekere

I've said it a hundred times, how can a system that starts its own program first and then Windows be fast? It isn't. I press the button on my console and I start playing. I press the button on my PC, go to the toilet, take two beers out of the fridge, check my email on my Iphone, and when I return, I can begin starting my game. Windows is constantly running on the background, as do 40 to 100 other processes while I game.

zekere

I always leave my PC on because when idle it uses less energy than some light bulbs.

I have all my games on a hard drive so when I want to play a game I just double click the icon and it's loaded.

I don't need to go find the game then insert the disc.

Also a lot of console games have slow load times while my PC loads much faster.

I can also alt+tab out of a game and type something in this forum then quickly alt+tab back into the game without a hitch.

Tormentos has really developed into one of the finest trolls on sw. 

Congratz, mate!:lol:

[QUOTE="04dcarraher"] can be anywhere between october 29th to december 31st of 2007 take a guesstormentos

Tormentos has really developed into one of the finest trolls on sw. 

Congratz, mate!:lol:

gamecubepad

Every PC gamer must know and admit that it's not the cpu or gpu that makes a performance difference, it's the speed of the RAM. CPUs and GPUs are just there for asthetic purposes.

Mystic-G

[QUOTE="RyviusARC"]

[QUOTE="zekere"]

I've said it a hundred times, how can a system that starts its own program first and then Windows be fast? It isn't. I press the button on my console and I start playing. I press the button on my PC, go to the toilet, take two beers out of the fridge, check my email on my Iphone, and when I return, I can begin starting my game. Windows is constantly running on the background, as do 40 to 100 other processes while I game.

xboxiphoneps3

I always leave my PC on because when idle it uses less energy than some light bulbs.

I have all my games on a hard drive so when I want to play a game I just double click the icon and it's loaded.

I don't need to go find the game then insert the disc.

Also a lot of console games have slow load times while my PC loads much faster.

I can also alt+tab out of a game and type something in this forum then quickly alt+tab back into the game without a hitch.

Not sure why you quoted my posts with something irrelvent to what I was discussing but whatever......I'll bite.

The API overhead mainly affects the CPU than other pieces of hardware.

And the CPU on the PS4 is pretty low in power compared to even the 2011 i5 2500k.

You will find that a simialr powered PC gpu will perform similar to consoles.

For example the 8600gt is similar in power and performs similar to consoles.

The 8600gt is basically a 7600gt with unified shaders.

[QUOTE="Cranler"] That cards not designed for 1080p with 4xaa. No one would buy a 1 gb card for anything over 1680x1050. The 2gb version is only $25 more on new egg. Thats not the point anyway. Point is what difference does it make if a pc gpu needs more than 256mb for Uncharted level of graphics? tormentos

[QUOTE="Mystic-G"]

Every PC gamer must know and admit that it's not the cpu or gpu that makes a performance difference, it's the speed of the RAM. CPUs and GPUs are just there for asthetic purposes.

AlexKidd5000

Yah I just remove the heatsinks from my CPU and GPU and use them to cook my eggs and bacon so I can have breakfast while playing some games.

Every PC gamer must know and admit that it's not the cpu or gpu that makes a performance difference, it's the speed of the RAM. CPUs and GPUs are just there for asthetic purposes.

My PC could perform 3x better than consoles so price to performance ratio my PC wins.RyviusARC

WTF..So while i debate with links and try to prove my arguments most of the times with links and info..I am tag as a troll.? tormentos

Oh, don't be coy. Be proud!;)

You make assertions, which are contradicted with evidence. Which you then ignore while you spin off on a different tangent. 

For instance, your 1GB vs 2GB 7850 argument. He clearly said 1GB to 2GB is a jump, but not so much 2GB to 4GB on a card like that at 1080p. He provided proof.

Now you go get the 2GB vs 4GB benchmarks.
 

Then teh optimization. You've been shown the x1950pro that performs better than the hd twins for $200 in 2006. It was easy to beat the hd twins in '06 for $600. Athlon 64 X2 or Pentium D were both at competitive prices back then.

Now you show were x1950pro didn't play the same games at higher settings than the hd twins, even at 1080p.

You back up anything you're saying with actual proof. You can't because PS4 isn't even out.

Like I said...one of the very finest... "Liar, liar!":cry: