KZ3 MP is the new MW2 ... Possibly Worse

100% agree. They f***** this game straight to hell. Every game comes down to getting the spawn points otherwise you lose. And with a bunch of dumbass kids on your team you cant do s*** on levels where you need to actually use jetpacks to take the spawn points. They completely destroyed the Tactician's radar. You cant even see someone who is 10 feet in front of you, cant see cloaked guys, cant see infiltrators. It is the most useless ability. The spawn camping just adds to the misfortune of losing 7-0.

I am going to play it until SOCOM drops since I have nothing else, but they messed up.

[QUOTE="finalstar2007"]

Really now? i personally am loving Killzone 3 especially the online, much better than Killzone 2

W1NGMAN-

I play the G Warzone ( team deathmatch ) and the Warzone the one that has multiple modes in the same map. love playing with the medic

I'm liking how the people who disagree don't say anything more than "are you serious?" "stop crying".:P

Btw chickenwing, I told Rockman how you are disliking KZ3 MP a lot and he bashed me.:( What's with all of this KZ3 defending?:P

sanim02

Much easier than debunking the criticisms! :P

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

Call of Duty infects just about everything. Thankfully certain franchises (Halo, Battlefield, etc) have remained true to their roots. Sorry to hear about KZ3 being a bit worse for wear due to CoD, though. I hope Guerilla fixes it for the fans.

sSubZerOo

There are some postive things created by the CoD series.. Namely perks and custom load outs.. Outside of that I will tend to agree.. Killstreaks for instance are entirely too powerful..

i thought killzone 2 MP was crap, but im loving killzone 3 online :)

100% agree. They f***** this game straight to hell. Every game comes down to getting the spawn points otherwise you lose. And with a bunch of dumbass kids on your team you cant do s*** on levels where you need to actually use jetpacks to take the spawn points. They completely destroyed the Tactician's radar. You cant even see someone who is 10 feet in front of you, cant see cloaked guys, cant see infiltrators. It is the most useless ability. The spawn camping just adds to the misfortune of losing 7-0.

I am going to play it until SOCOM drops since I have nothing else, but they messed up.

Kahuna_1

[QUOTE="W1NGMAN-"][QUOTE="Zaibach"]

I gotta stop hanging around here, the collective ire for some games actually start ruining them for me, but thanks for your opinion bro. I'm gonna go back to kz3 3 now. I suggest you sell your copy and and stick to kz 2 instead of coming here *****ing about it

DarkLink77

Did you really?

[QUOTE="Kahuna_1"]

100% agree. They f***** this game straight to hell. Every game comes down to getting the spawn points otherwise you lose. And with a bunch of dumbass kids on your team you cant do s*** on levels where you need to actually use jetpacks to take the spawn points. They completely destroyed the Tactician's radar. You cant even see someone who is 10 feet in front of you, cant see cloaked guys, cant see infiltrators. It is the most useless ability. The spawn camping just adds to the misfortune of losing 7-0.

I am going to play it until SOCOM drops since I have nothing else, but they messed up.

BPoole96

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

[QUOTE="W1NGMAN-"] I spent 65 day one on this game, spent months anticipating it so yea as long as there's no sticky preventing me from coming on here and *****ing about something I'm gonna continue to do so whenever I feel necessary, I'm not here to sway anyones view just curious to hear what others think about my point of view and get understanding of theirs ... by the way I put it up on craigslist while I made this thread :PW1NGMAN-

Did you really?

Really, guys, I don't even know what your talking about. Most Warzone matches I've had are 3-4 or vise versa. And I've never had problems with spawn campers either, people are too busy tackling the objectives. But whatever.IppoTenma

Tourbine is the worst, the jetpack tower is RIGHT across from the middle tactical spawn point, on either exit it is extremely easy for the opposite team to shoot and snipe when anyone is coming out, I've been on the giving and receiving end of this multiple times. These spawn points are definitely a step back from KZ2's spawn system.

[QUOTE="sanim02"]I'm liking how the people who disagree don't say anything more than "are you serious?" "stop crying".:PFIipMode

It is disappointing when you write out clearly why the game is inferior all you get as a response is "stop crying" or "you just suck at the game".

[QUOTE="Kahuna_1"]

100% agree. They f***** this game straight to hell. Every game comes down to getting the spawn points otherwise you lose. And with a bunch of dumbass kids on your team you cant do s*** on levels where you need to actually use jetpacks to take the spawn points. They completely destroyed the Tactician's radar. You cant even see someone who is 10 feet in front of you, cant see cloaked guys, cant see infiltrators. It is the most useless ability. The spawn camping just adds to the misfortune of losing 7-0.

I am going to play it until SOCOM drops since I have nothing else, but they messed up.

BPoole96

What really makes it bad is when you lose every spawn point and you are forced either into a narrow corridor with a sniper waiting, or forced into an open area with snipers all over the map.

I am surprised that iI haven't heard much from Killzone 3 since release. Is the singleplayer bad by any means, like those reviews said?

I am surprised that iI haven't heard much from Killzone 3 since release. Is the singleplayer bad by any means, like those reviews said?

Masculus

[QUOTE="BPoole96"]

[QUOTE="Kahuna_1"]

100% agree. They f***** this game straight to hell. Every game comes down to getting the spawn points otherwise you lose. And with a bunch of dumbass kids on your team you cant do s*** on levels where you need to actually use jetpacks to take the spawn points. They completely destroyed the Tactician's radar. You cant even see someone who is 10 feet in front of you, cant see cloaked guys, cant see infiltrators. It is the most useless ability. The spawn camping just adds to the misfortune of losing 7-0.

I am going to play it until SOCOM drops since I have nothing else, but they messed up.

Kahuna_1

What really makes it bad is when you lose every spawn point and you are forced either into a narrow corridor with a sniper waiting, or forced into an open area with snipers all over the map.

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

Call of Duty infects just about everything. Thankfully certain franchises (Halo, Battlefield, etc) have remained true to their roots. Sorry to hear about KZ3 being a bit worse for wear due to CoD, though. I hope Guerilla fixes it for the fans.

sSubZerOo

There are some postive things created by the CoD series.. Namely perks and custom load outs.. Outside of that I will tend to agree.. Killstreaks for instance are entirely too powerful..

"hey you just got 5 kills heres an overpowered advantage over the other players who arent doing so hot"

I respect your opinion, but by your tone, it sounds like you may have been too heavily invested in this video game emotionally anyway. The funny thing I wasnt going to buy this game, as much fun as I had with kz2 I felt like i was always fighting the controls, by the time I pulled the trigger on my shotgun, I could have gone to my kitchen made a cup of tea, take a leak finished m dissertation and the game would still not have registered the command. But then I dled the beta and I was soo happy with it, decided against getting black ops.

every class has its purpose, without spawn points tacticians are useless, and snipers, beleive it or not are supposed to camp, its thier role, thier cloakin ability is not meant for charging the fron lines etc

And as I recall kz2 was rife with spawn camping so I dont know why youre bellyaching but whatever man :P

I will say that I'm enjoying the MP in KZ3, but it isn't as good as 2. I haven't too much trouble with spawn campers, I've only had one of those games so far, guess I've been lucky. I do miss the old squad system and custom match options though. They need to make more operation maps too.

[QUOTE="BPoole96"]

[QUOTE="Kahuna_1"]

100% agree. They f***** this game straight to hell. Every game comes down to getting the spawn points otherwise you lose. And with a bunch of dumbass kids on your team you cant do s*** on levels where you need to actually use jetpacks to take the spawn points. They completely destroyed the Tactician's radar. You cant even see someone who is 10 feet in front of you, cant see cloaked guys, cant see infiltrators. It is the most useless ability. The spawn camping just adds to the misfortune of losing 7-0.

I am going to play it until SOCOM drops since I have nothing else, but they messed up.

Kahuna_1

What really makes it bad is when you lose every spawn point and you are forced either into a narrow corridor with a sniper waiting, or forced into an open area with snipers all over the map.

That's the worst on Bilgarsk Boulevard. I always get sniped there a lot

some maps are very poorly designed to emphasize complete domination on the other team, especially in guerrila warfare

the perks themselves are counterintuitive also; for example, the marksman completely negates the tactician's primary ability. 30 yard radar jamming and indefinite invisibility gets incredibly irritating; the sniping degenerates also return, but now with a completely revamped Sniper for Dummies.

the one hit melee is just awful, the shotgun is just plain stupid, and the bullet damage is still completely out of hand.

the only merit the game stands on is its incredible graphics, smooth gameplay and perfected hitbox, everything else just falls flat of the glory that was killzone 2 multiplayer.

some maps are very poorly designed to emphasize complete domination on the other team, especially in guerrila warfare

the perks themselves are counterintuitive also; for example, the marksman completely negates the tactician's primary ability. 30 yard radar jamming and indefinite invisibility gets incredibly irritating; the sniping degenerates also return, but now with a completely revamped Sniper for Dummies.

the one hit melee is just awful, the shotgun is just plain stupid, and the bullet damage is still completely out of hand.

the only merit the game stands on is its incredible graphics, smooth gameplay and perfected hitbox, everything else just falls flat of the glory that was killzone 2 multiplayer.

Call of Duty infects just about everything. Thankfully certain franchises (Halo, Battlefield, etc) have remained true to their roots. Sorry to hear about KZ3 being a bit worse for wear due to CoD, though. I hope Guerilla fixes it for the fans.

DarkLink77

I respect your opinion, but by your tone, it sounds like you may have been too heavily invested in this video game emotionally anyway. The funny thing I wasnt going to buy this game, as much fun as I had with kz2 I felt like i was always fighting the controls, by the time I pulled the trigger on my shotgun, I could have gone to my kitchen made a cup of tea, take a leak finished m dissertation and the game would still not have registered the command. But then I dled the beta and I was soo happy with it, decided against getting black ops.

every class has its purpose, without spawn points tacticians are useless, and snipers, beleive it or not are supposed to camp, its thier role, thier cloakin ability is not meant for charging the fron lines etc

And as I recall kz2 was rife with spawn camping so I dont know why youre bellyaching but whatever man :P

Zaibach

Good for those of you who enjoy KZ3 though. However, I would make the bold statement for these people that if you played KZ2 with KZ3 controls, you would enjoy the MP in KZ2 more than the sequel.RavenLoud

The only reason i dont regret buying this game is because of the socom beta that came with it:D

Which is kind of why I bought Bulletstorm instead.

I respect your opinion, but by your tone, it sounds like you may have been too heavily invested in this video game emotionally anyway. The funny thing I wasnt going to buy this game, as much fun as I had with kz2 I felt like i was always fighting the controls, by the time I pulled the trigger on my shotgun, I could have gone to my kitchen made a cup of tea, take a leak finished m dissertation and the game would still not have registered the command. But then I dled the beta and I was soo happy with it, decided against getting black ops.

every class has its purpose, without spawn points tacticians are useless, and snipers, beleive it or not are supposed to camp, its thier role, thier cloakin ability is not meant for charging the fron lines etc

And as I recall kz2 was rife with spawn camping so I dont know why youre bellyaching but whatever man :P

Zaibach

I didn't really like what I played of it in the beta.

[QUOTE="Zaibach"]

I respect your opinion, but by your tone, it sounds like you may have been too heavily invested in this video game emotionally anyway. The funny thing I wasnt going to buy this game, as much fun as I had with kz2 I felt like i was always fighting the controls, by the time I pulled the trigger on my shotgun, I could have gone to my kitchen made a cup of tea, take a leak finished m dissertation and the game would still not have registered the command. But then I dled the beta and I was soo happy with it, decided against getting black ops.

every class has its purpose, without spawn points tacticians are useless, and snipers, beleive it or not are supposed to camp, its thier role, thier cloakin ability is not meant for charging the fron lines etc

And as I recall kz2 was rife with spawn camping so I dont know why youre bellyaching but whatever man :P

Dead-Memories

The only reason i dont regret buying this game is because of the socom beta that came with it:D

suz437

[QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

Call of Duty infects just about everything. Thankfully certain franchises (Halo, Battlefield, etc) have remained true to their roots. Sorry to hear about KZ3 being a bit worse for wear due to CoD, though. I hope Guerilla fixes it for the fans.

Animal-Mother

Which is kind of why I bought Bulletstorm instead.

psn8214

[QUOTE="suz437"]

The only reason i dont regret buying this game is because of the socom beta that came with it:D

W1NGMAN-

Wing, I would've laughed if SOCOM4 sucked but after seeing you suffer, I'm only hoping for the best.:P

[QUOTE="psn8214"]

Which is kind of why I bought Bulletstorm instead.

Animal-Mother

I've played the campaign twice, I'm working on my third playthrough, I've been running through the Echoes constantly, and outcIassing fools online in Anarchy. I'm going to say it wasn't a "one and done" for me. :P

[QUOTE="Animal-Mother"][QUOTE="DarkLink77"]

Call of Duty infects just about everything. Thankfully certain franchises (Halo, Battlefield, etc) have remained true to their roots. Sorry to hear about KZ3 being a bit worse for wear due to CoD, though. I hope Guerilla fixes it for the fans.

DarkLink77

I only needed to try the beta to see what was going on. GG had absolutely no confidence in their own game. it now offers nothing of its own.

The reason why KZ3 MP isn't as good at launch as KZ2:

Eric Boltjes, the former lead MP designer is now with Ubisoft. Guerrilla then hired Pandemic's MP designer (forgot his name).

---

I'm looking forward to the next few patches, though.

Edit: They also could have used more time. There were alot of ideas and features they wanted to include, but couldn't due to time contraints. I blame Sony for that.

I only needed to try the beta to see what was going on. GG had absolutely no confidence in their own game. it now offers nothing of its own.

Mordred19

That's not true at all. They had complete confidence in this game. I'd say they had too much confidence, lol. The problem is that they followed the designs of one guy, who changed what made KZ2 such an amazing MP game.

If Guerrilla were allowed (or gave themselves) more time, like until October, the MP would be better. For example, imagine what Reach's MP would be like if it were released in Februrary 2010, instead of September.

Meh, I love it. I feel that it took the good things from CoD multiplayer without the stupid killstreaks and overpowered weapons.

Plus the cloak is really easy to spot, I've pretty much never been killed by a cloaked player (other than a sniper obv)

The biggest problem with KZ3 is that it takes more patience than most shooters. Couple that with the importance of team play. Clans and squads of friends run this game. If you have a Tactician that travels with a buddy or two, you can easily aqcuire TSAs. If you're not communicating, then you won't win. You CAN'T play this game with the absence of team work. I'm not talking 1-2 players; more like 4 or more players who are communicating with each other, constantly. You can either say that's the game's fault, or the players' fault.

If you want to jump in and have fun, play Guerrilla Warfare (team deathmatch). :P Operations and Warzone are very frustrating if you plan on just jumping in and going with the wind, without communication.

[QUOTE="IppoTenma"]Really, guys, I don't even know what your talking about. Most Warzone matches I've had are 3-4 or vise versa. And I've never had problems with spawn campers either, people are too busy tackling the objectives. But whatever.FIipMode

Tourbine is the worst, the jetpack tower is RIGHT across from the middle tactical spawn point, on either exit it is extremely easy for the opposite team to shoot and snipe when anyone is coming out, I've been on the giving and receiving end of this multiple times. These spawn points are definitely a step back from KZ2's spawn system.

[QUOTE="FIipMode"]

[QUOTE="sanim02"]I'm liking how the people who disagree don't say anything more than "are you serious?" "stop crying".:PW1NGMAN-

It is disappointing when you write out clearly why the game is inferior all you get as a response is "stop crying" or "you just suck at the game".

If Killzone 2 had Killzone 3's graphics and controls, it would be the best MP this gen! :P Hell, I already think it is.

[QUOTE="FIipMode"]

[QUOTE="IppoTenma"]Really, guys, I don't even know what your talking about. Most Warzone matches I've had are 3-4 or vise versa. And I've never had problems with spawn campers either, people are too busy tackling the objectives. But whatever.IppoTenma

Tourbine is the worst, the jetpack tower is RIGHT across from the middle tactical spawn point, on either exit it is extremely easy for the opposite team to shoot and snipe when anyone is coming out, I've been on the giving and receiving end of this multiple times. These spawn points are definitely a step back from KZ2's spawn system.

I think it's pretty significant, because of the spawn camping a spawn point close to an objective is now a death sentence, this could easily be solved in Killzone 2 by just tossing a spawn grenade in a secluded location still somewhat close to the objective and then all would be fine, or you could spawn on your squad leader.

Now in KZ3 the only other option is to spawn somewhere far away like at the base, now your running across the map just to to get to the objective, not only does that take up time but you might get killed on the way. This probably wouldn't be such an annoyance if there were more spawn points but there's only like 3 on a map.

[QUOTE="Mordred19"]

I only needed to try the beta to see what was going on. GG had absolutely no confidence in their own game. it now offers nothing of its own.

Episode_Eve

That's not true at all. They had complete confidence in this game. I'd say they had too much confidence, lol. The problem is that they followed the designs of one guy, who changed what made KZ2 such an amazing MP game.

If Guerrilla were allowed (or gave themselves) more time, like until October, the MP would be better. For example, imagine what Reach's MP would be like if there were released in Februrary 2010, instead of September.

I'm sure a larger workload was related, after all, they had to push 3D and Move so Sony could show something off.

but what shows their confidence when they:

take Halo Reach's assassinations idea but leave out the balance and letting players just stab others in the face, even if the attacker was being shot at the time

take out spawn grenades and replace it with capture points. spawn grenade = different, special, unique, very flexible tactics. any issue with it in KZ2 could have been rectified in KZ3, because they had a fresh start with new knowledge, and it is entirely GG's fault if player's didn't know how to use spawn grenades properly in 2 (there were no tips in load screens saying "it spawns you in the opposite direction when you deployed it"

throw in a completely arbitrary ribbon system that gives players extra damage and faster reloads in the middle of a game, with no downsides like recoil or movement speed

have an upgrade system that is all about improving abilities, when those tier 3 abilities are integral enough that all players should have them from the beginning. think about it: engineers that have to buy their turrets? tacticians that need to buy their drones? every player has to buy their sidearm? they pulled something like this in KZ2, and it was a bad idea, this is even worse in 3. I saw the same thing in Bad Company 2, hold back integral skills just to give players more stuff to grind for. "unlock your ammo boxes, your med kits, your repair tool, look! we're just like the COD games now! really!"

a system with each abilitiy having a downside to balance it would have provided perfect variety while meaning that newer players were never screwed over.

developers make mistakes, it happens. some don't go back and change them. there is a tendency for people to just accept the first thing they get without considering the alternative.

The reason why KZ3 MP isn't as good at launch as KZ2:

Eric Boltjes, the former lead MP designer is now with Ubisoft. Guerrilla then hired Pandemic's MP designer (forgot his name).

---

I'm looking forward to the next few patches, though.

Edit: They also could have used more time. There were alot of ideas and features they wanted to include, but couldn't due to time contraints. I blame Sony for that.

Episode_Eve

Here's my short, but sweet conversation with Mr. Boltjes on Facebook :P:

[QUOTE="IppoTenma"][QUOTE="FIipMode"]

Tourbine is the worst, the jetpack tower is RIGHT across from the middle tactical spawn point, on either exit it is extremely easy for the opposite team to shoot and snipe when anyone is coming out, I've been on the giving and receiving end of this multiple times. These spawn points are definitely a step back from KZ2's spawn system.

FIipMode

I think it's pretty significant, because of the spawn camping a spawn point close to an objective is now a death sentence, this could easily be solved in Killzone 2 by just tossing a spawn grenade in a secluded location still somewhat close to the objective and then all would be fine, or you could spawn on your squad leader.

Now in KZ3 the only other option is to spawn somewhere far away like at the base, now your running across the map just to to get to the objective, not only does that take up time but you might get killed on the way. This probably wouldn't be such an annoyance if there were more spawn points but there's only like 3 on a map.

[QUOTE="Episode_Eve"]

The reason why KZ3 MP isn't as good at launch as KZ2:

Eric Boltjes, the former lead MP designer is now with Ubisoft. Guerrilla then hired Pandemic's MP designer (forgot his name).

---

I'm looking forward to the next few patches, though.

Edit: They also could have used more time. There were alot of ideas and features they wanted to include, but couldn't due to time contraints. I blame Sony for that.

TREAL_Since

Here's my short, but sweet conversation with Mr. Boltjes on Facebook :P:

Nice msg there Trigga TREAL!8)