MGS4 won't have voice over tracks for other languages due to.....DISK SPACE!

[QUOTE="f50p90"][QUOTE="Stevo_the_gamer"]

What a bunch of morons, I wonder if they ever heard of compression? I mean, Halo 3 has more audio than 20 feature films combined, including 39,000 lines of dialogue, 13,000 sound effects and music totalling six hours of continuous play. Mass Effect even has over 20,000 lines of dialouge. Remeber -- DVD9 for Halo 3 and Mass Effect.

ogvampire

They made it a big deal to include UNCOMPRESSED audio for better quality. Why are they morons for making use of what they can?

the difference between uncompressed and compressed audio is very very little. the only people that can tell a difference is if they have surround sound, but even then you can only tell a difference if youre specifically looking for them

eeh.....and no one is using surround sound for games??? Then you are missing out on a lot. Resident Evil 4 had only Pro logic 2, but even that was better in surround. On movies there is a huge difference between DD5.1 and DTS or higher, most games on X360 uses DD5.1.....it's old and bad. HD movies uses PCM, why can't games use it.

Wow, that's interesting...

Guess that kills any hope of MGS IV for 360...

yoshi_64

You actually had hope?! It was never to be.

See, this is why uncompressed audio is just stupid... honestly, I'd rather have more languages than Xtreme-HD audio or whatever.Funkyhamster

So you really play through same game on each language? I call BS.

[QUOTE="aka_aj03"][QUOTE="jlh47"][QUOTE="Mordred19"]

[QUOTE="jlh47"]it'll have about 2hours of gameplay and 20 hours of cutscenes... jlh47

yet snake eater was 15 hours long, not including the cutscenes. 0_o

it tookme 8 hours total to beat it...

i had it on easy. i love those games. not much gameplay though, which i like, cuz to be honest the gameplay isn't it's stronpoint by a mile. when i want good gameplay i play splinter cell, when i want a good story i play mgs.

To be honest I found splinter cell less interactive, less interesting, and a tad pointless. I remember the first SC... does anybody actually know what the story was about? I completed it and still don't know anything more than "stop the war before it begins".

eeh.....and no one is using surround sound for games??? Then you are missing out on a lot. Resident Evil 4 had only Pro logic 2, but even that was better in surround. On movies there is a huge difference between DD5.1 and DTS or higher, most games on X360 uses DD5.1.....it's old and bad. HD movies uses PCM, why can't games use it.

Martin_G_N

I like surround, but I don't much care what compression it is. Most people can't tell the difference between 160 kbps mp3s and cd audio. I can, but I have to look for it so I don't care. I certainly can't tell the difference between CD audio and SACD.

Is it really that big of a benefit? I'm sure it is for some, but how many?

Payton said there was a noticable difference with the audio in this game. huge deal? no. revolutionary? not at all.

but we don't HDTVs either, do we? ;)

The movie click used a dual layer blu ray. Why is it so insane to assume a game famous for FMV sequences won't :?

f50p90

[QUOTE="HuusAsking"][QUOTE="Chutebox"]

[QUOTE="Pro_wrestler"]My God lossless audio is far to overrated. Gameplay > HD audio.Chutebox

No it's not. And why are you putting the two up against each other? What does the HD audio have to do with gameplay?

Gameplay, but where does it say anywhere on the internet that gameplay was effected because of this?

Thats not the point I'm trying to make. They're taking strides to provide lossless audio by cutting things from the overall game, I wouldn't want them cutting anything else from the game because of something so trivial as lossless audio which you will need highend surround sound to take advantage of anyway.

Who knows, maybe someone would like to up the difficulty level by playing in a language that they are not FLUENT in. Crysis did this to a degree. Who knows. Just give me Dolby 5.1 and I'm set, I don't care if I can hear a needle drop 6 miles away while 12 nukes are going off at once; I don't care about hearing every frequencey off sound known to man.

[QUOTE="Velocitas8"]

The hell? Even with tons of full motion video I can't comprehend how they could possibly run out of space.

fuzzysquash

The MGS series has never used fmv.

MGS4 may use some fmv, but very little. From what we know, there may be some in the opening movie. Beyond that, I highly doubt there will be much, if any--in keeping with the series' tradition. Most of the cutscenes will be real-time.

WRONGO! They use stock footage which is FMV. Please try again.

[QUOTE="fuzzysquash"][QUOTE="Velocitas8"]

The hell? Even with tons of full motion video I can't comprehend how they could possibly run out of space.

JiveT

The MGS series has never used fmv.

MGS4 may use some fmv, but very little. From what we know, there may be some in the opening movie. Beyond that, I highly doubt there will be much, if any--in keeping with the series' tradition. Most of the cutscenes will be real-time.

WRONGO! They use stock footage which is FMV. Please try again.

Really? Why would a dev use game assets to create a cutscene, and then put it into an FMV which takes up far more space than a scripted sequence? Is it just for the cleanup (removing aliasing, better effects, etc) that can be done through FMV?

[QUOTE="fuzzysquash"][QUOTE="Velocitas8"]

The hell? Even with tons of full motion video I can't comprehend how they could possibly run out of space.

JiveT

The MGS series has never used fmv.

MGS4 may use some fmv, but very little. From what we know, there may be some in the opening movie. Beyond that, I highly doubt there will be much, if any--in keeping with the series' tradition. Most of the cutscenes will be real-time.

WRONGO! They use stock footage which is FMV. Please try again.

stuff to add atmosphere, yet not consisting of the actions of the characters within the game. they are always portrayed in the polygon demos. that is the point he was making. but you'll split hairs until there's nothing but powder left, so I don't expect much more from you.

guess they could have tried compressing the audio, and not using somthing ridiculous like lossless as you dont even notice it anyway. IMO its a lazy and now the entire game will be in japanese as a result,

the only reason 360 is still going fine with dvd's is because of the amount of compression they use

i guess with the ps3 slow read time alot of the game is going to have to be installed on the HDD.

How much do you install on the HDD? A dual layer 50gb means very slow loading.

[QUOTE="jlh47"]it'll have about 2hours of gameplay and 20 hours of cutscenes... Mordred19

yet snake eater was 15 hours long, not including the cutscenes. 0_o

How much do you install on the HDD? A dual layer 50gb means very slow loading.

PS3_3DO

I'm sure most of it is FMV and lossless audio though, which shouldn't have too much of an effect.

guess they could have tried compressing the audio, and not using somthing ridiculous like lossless as you dont even notice it anyway. IMO its a lazy and now the entire game will be in japanese as a result,

the only reason 360 is still going fine with dvd's is because of the amount of compression they use

i guess with the ps3 slow read time alot of the game is going to have to be installed on the HDD.

sammysalsa

there was a purpose in what they did. the sound quality is noticably better, as stated by Ryan Payton.

the game is English in the English-speaking regions.

I'm confused...what does it matter if people in Europe or North America won't get Japanese voices?forgot_it

It doesn't. It's just staggering that it won't fit on a 50Gb disc.

I'm confused...what does it matter if people in Europe or North America won't get Japanese voices?forgot_it

some people care. to most, it's no big deal. there are those who want to have the "authentic" voice overs, though the delivery of the English lines in MGS4 is said to be on par with the Japanese delivery this time around. it would've been nice to have the option of listening to a seperate voice track, but it just wasn't in the cards.

and I bet the sound wont be as good as crysis nor will the graphics which all fits in 7gbimprezawrx500

HAHAHAHAHAHA.....the sound in MGS4 is gonna be a lot better than Crysis, can't even compare.

[QUOTE="JiveT"][QUOTE="fuzzysquash"][QUOTE="Velocitas8"]

The hell? Even with tons of full motion video I can't comprehend how they could possibly run out of space.

mattbbpl

The MGS series has never used fmv.

MGS4 may use some fmv, but very little. From what we know, there may be some in the opening movie. Beyond that, I highly doubt there will be much, if any--in keeping with the series' tradition. Most of the cutscenes will be real-time.

WRONGO! They use stock footage which is FMV. Please try again.

Really? Why would a dev use game assets to create a cutscene, and then put it into an FMV which takes up far more space than a scripted sequence? Is it just for the cleanup (removing aliasing, better effects, etc) that can be done through FMV?

[QUOTE="michael098"]WTF are they fulling the disk up with? hours and hours of HD video?river_rat3117

Lossless =/= uncompressed

Well, they are trying to fit it all on one disk. But is something like this a big deal? :?

Kind of is amazing, though.

So I guess all the cutscenes are actual HD videos then.

There's no way the voice overs or actual game data could fill up the disc. I'm willing to bet Mass Effect contains as much, if not (much, much) more dialog, and the audio for that game takes up like 1GB, including the music. Even if they're using an uncompressed format like .wav, 1 hour of audio would only take up about 600MB. Even if they were to have used seven channel audio for all the dialog it'd still only be about 2GB per hour. I don't know how you produce audio for games and movies, so perhaps that's not even feasible. But it is the theroetical, hypothetical max I believe. So I mean, unless MGS4 features like ten hours of uncompressed, seven channel audio...

And unless they've modelled the entirety of Earth and put it on the disc, things like models and textures would not be the reason either. For the record I recall some guys from Criterion saying something similar on one of their podcasts.

So I guess all the cutscenes are actual HD videos then.

There's no way the voice overs or actual game data could fill up the disc. I'm willing to bet Mass Effect contains as much, if not (much, much) more dialog, and the audio for that game takes up like 1GB, including the music. Even if they're using an uncompressed format like .wav, 1 hour of audio would only take up about 600MB. Even if they were to have used seven channel audio for all the dialog it'd still only be about 2GB per hour. I don't know how you produce audio for games and movies, so perhaps that's not even feasible. But it is the theroetical, hypothetical max I believe. So I mean, unless MGS4 features like ten hours of uncompressed, seven channel audio...

And unless they've modelled the entirety of Earth and put it on the disc, things like models and textures would not be the reason either. For the record I recall some guys from Criterion saying something similar on one of their podcasts.

InsaneBasura

400 bucks, right. Gets us to another question: How many gamers are there who spend 400,- on their sound system? How many of those are PS3 owners? And how many of those are going to buy MGS4?

It's a very small, 1-digit percentage.

Lothenon

Past a certain point in fidelity, and the metal gear series has been beyond this for some time, it's not a market calculation but an attempt to make the best art they possibly can.

[QUOTE="InsaneBasura"]

So I guess all the cutscenes are actual HD videos then.

There's no way the voice overs or actual game data could fill up the disc. I'm willing to bet Mass Effect contains as much, if not (much, much) more dialog, and the audio for that game takes up like 1GB, including the music. Even if they're using an uncompressed format like .wav, 1 hour of audio would only take up about 600MB. Even if they were to have used seven channel audio for all the dialog it'd still only be about 2GB per hour. I don't know how you produce audio for games and movies, so perhaps that's not even feasible. But it is the theroetical, hypothetical max I believe. So I mean, unless MGS4 features like ten hours of uncompressed, seven channel audio...

And unless they've modelled the entirety of Earth and put it on the disc, things like models and textures would not be the reason either. For the record I recall some guys from Criterion saying something similar on one of their podcasts.

HuusAsking

Audio for cutscenes and music typically have to be recorded in the proper number of channels they intend to use for output, but in-game dialog and sound effects do not as the output channel is based on the position of the source in relation to the player.

15 DISC 360 version coming in 2010! :)

:|That really doesn't affect me much =D

I guess that means we can expect good things if theyve managed to fill that much?

The crazy thing is noone in the world can detect a difference in uncompressed audio and a good lossless codec. Its like there just doing it so Sony can brag about a full 50Gb game.

Also, FMV's take a lot of space - yes. HOWEVER, Animations take almost as much. Animation is the single largest space taker-uper on a disc per usage scenario, and im sure MGS4 has a LOT of animation.

The hell? Even with tons of full motion video I can't comprehend how they could possibly run out of space.

Velocitas8

Audio (and there is LOTS of it in MGS games), and uncompression.

Well...like some people here have kept on saying, they haven't said it was the 50GB version!!! Hideo went out a couple of weeks ago and said they wanted the 50GB BluRay for MGS4, they haven't said anything yet if they got it or not.

I'm not exactly sad about this, but when you think about it a little bit, they will have to have two Sound formats on each language because those who can't use PCM7.1 must use Dolby Digital. That means if they wanted to have japanese and English on one disc they would have to have FOUR sound formats on one disc...get it!!!! So your calculations will be wrong. Mass Effect only uses one sound format, and that's the old and crappy Dolby Digital. At least use DTS, but even that's old, but not that crappy of course.

400 bucks, right. Gets us to another question: How many gamers are there who spend 400,- on their sound system? How many of those are PS3 owners? And how many of those are going to buy MGS4?

It's a very small, 1-digit percentage.

Lothenon

I dont know about other! but my my 7.1 Yamaha is prefect for this game :D

Well...like some people here have kept on saying, they haven't said it was the 50GB version!!! Hideo went out a couple of weeks ago and said they wanted the 50GB BluRay for MGS4, they haven't said anything yet if they got it or not.

I'm not exactly sad about this, but when you think about it a little bit, they will have to have two Sound formats on each language because those who can't use PCM7.1 must use Dolby Digital. That means if they wanted to have japanese and English on one disc they would have to have FOUR sound formats on one disc...get it!!!! So your calculations will be wrong. Mass Effect only uses one sound format, and that's the old and crappy Dolby Digital. At least use DTS, but even that's old, but not that crappy of course.

Martin_G_N

[QUOTE="Martin_G_N"]

Well...like some people here have kept on saying, they haven't said it was the 50GB version!!! Hideo went out a couple of weeks ago and said they wanted the 50GB BluRay for MGS4, they haven't said anything yet if they got it or not.

I'm not exactly sad about this, but when you think about it a little bit, they will have to have two Sound formats on each language because those who can't use PCM7.1 must use Dolby Digital. That means if they wanted to have japanese and English on one disc they would have to have FOUR sound formats on one disc...get it!!!! So your calculations will be wrong. Mass Effect only uses one sound format, and that's the old and crappy Dolby Digital. At least use DTS, but even that's old, but not that crappy of course.

HuusAsking

Yeah, but you don't get PCM surround unless you have a receiver with HDMI!!! Only Stereo PCM, DD and DTS is supported out of the Optical out. So you'll need DD or DTS if you want surround on older receivers.

[QUOTE="HuusAsking"][QUOTE="Martin_G_N"]

Well...like some people here have kept on saying, they haven't said it was the 50GB version!!! Hideo went out a couple of weeks ago and said they wanted the 50GB BluRay for MGS4, they haven't said anything yet if they got it or not.

I'm not exactly sad about this, but when you think about it a little bit, they will have to have two Sound formats on each language because those who can't use PCM7.1 must use Dolby Digital. That means if they wanted to have japanese and English on one disc they would have to have FOUR sound formats on one disc...get it!!!! So your calculations will be wrong. Mass Effect only uses one sound format, and that's the old and crappy Dolby Digital. At least use DTS, but even that's old, but not that crappy of course.

Martin_G_N

Yeah, but you don't get PCM surround unless you have a receiver with HDMI!!! Only Stereo PCM, DD and DTS is supported out of the Optical out. So you'll need DD or DTS if you want surround on older receivers.

Sorry, my mistake. Only stereo PCM downmixing is typically used with a multichannel lossless/PCM source.

[QUOTE="fuzzysquash"][QUOTE="Velocitas8"]

The hell? Even with tons of full motion video I can't comprehend how they could possibly run out of space.

JiveT

The MGS series has never used fmv.

MGS4 may use some fmv, but very little. From what we know, there may be some in the opening movie. Beyond that, I highly doubt there will be much, if any--in keeping with the series' tradition. Most of the cutscenes will be real-time.

WRONGO! They use stock footage which is FMV. Please try again.

whoopty-do. You got me on some minor point. Yeah, the MGS games have used stock footage (which isn't fmv if you really want to get precise--it's movie footage) and the theme song of MGS3 used some CG.

Great, you found a few minutes of stock footage/CG out of tens of hours of cinematics. Pat yourself on the back.

The vast majority of cinematics are rendered in real-time, so the only person who cares about the hair-splitting details here is you...and possibly that rock over there.

whoopty-do. You got me on some minor point. Yeah, the MGS games have used stock footage (which isn't fmv if you really want to get precise--it's movie footage) and the theme song of MGS3 used some CG.

Great, you found a few minutes of stock footage/CG out of tens of hours of cinematics. Pat yourself on the back.

The vast majority of cinematics are rendered in real-time, so the only person who cares about the hair-splitting details here is you...and possibly that rock over there.

fuzzysquash