MS is the best and worst thing to ever happen to the console market.

Well, your half right.

Well, your half right.

tenaka2

agree.

There is NOTHING positive that MS has done that wouldn't have been done anyway in a much more consumer friendly and respectable way if they had never entered the market, All of the bad treads they introduced however would never have come to light on consoles if MS had never been allowed fester and taint the past respectable traditions of console game producers

I hate to break this to some people but MS is here to stay. They turned a good profit with the 360, Kinect has become a very good success so far and Live is a cash cow. With Nintendo's help they managed to errode Sony's dominant market share and will hopefully learn from their tech issues this generation.

I agree that MS has done a ton of good things but their business practices is really what holds them back from contesting the best Console manufacturers.

1) Over priced controllers, HDD's and other peripherals.

2) The lack of new franchises and abandonment of other well received franchises. Where are the new Franchises? Where are the sequels to Conker, Banjo platformer, Ralli Sport, Perfect Dark, Jet Force Gemini, Phantom Dust, Crimson Sky, Blood Wake, Kung Fu Chaos, etc? Updates to these franchises every 2 0r 3 years would really help MS. MS has the money to invest in these games but its like an accountant went into MGS and told them you are not allowed to make these games because they don't sell over 2 million copies at full price.

[QUOTE="tenaka2"]

Well, your half right.

casharmy

agree.

There is NOTHING positive that MS has done that wouldn't have been done anyway in a much more consumer friendly and respectable way if they had never entered the market, All of the bad treads they introduced however would never have come to light on consoles if MS had never been allowed fester and taint the past respectable traditions of console game producers

[QUOTE="tenaka2"]

Well, your half right.

casharmy

agree.

There is NOTHING positive that MS has done that wouldn't have been done anyway in a much more consumer friendly and respectable way if they had never entered the market, All of the bad treads they introduced however would never have come to light on consoles if MS had never been allowed fester and taint the past respectable traditions of console game producers

I hate to break this to some people but MS is here to stay. They turned a good profit with the 360, Kinect has become a very good success so far and Live is a cash cow. With Nintendo's help they managed to errode Sony's dominant market share and will hopefully learn from their tech issues this generation.

T_0_D

Without Microsoft, who would Sony copy off of? todd2r

Without Microsoft, who would Sony copy off of? todd2r

Nintendo, most likely.

Wow...just wow...whats next are you going to blame Microsoft for satan? Maybe the riots in Vancouver when they didn't win the Stanley? Global warming and the damage to the ozone layer?

I'll explain most of what was wrong with what you posted.
""While i think that XBL price scheme is horrible and put the majority of the xbox 360 users base in a position where they miss a complete part of a game multiplayer if they don't pay,and have bring a new era of over priced peripherals,nickel and dime and even rise of games to $60 which is attribute to the xbox 360 in special in 2005.""

Except its still undeniable the xbox live service is still better than anything offered on the consoles at this point and time anything else and defending the shortcommings of other services is just fanboy goggles and its as simple as that sheer content and intergration keeps XBL ontop andabsolutely notit puts some of the user base in a postion where they knew the online portion cost money if they wanted it free then they should have moved onto the Wii, Ps3 or PC.

thank god you said new era and saved your self because in the past you've made out that Microsoft is the only one that ever charged such high prices for accessories which then was false and even now with you saying new era is false all you have is the wireless adaptor and harddrive otherwise the ps3 controllers are just as expensive and dont offer near the battery life of the often 40-50 dollar 360 wireless controler+play and charge kits, wireless headset, hdmi cables, usb cables...etc...etc all have the same price and parity and all have 3rd party options on the 360 just like the ps3 for cheaper prices please dont act like high priced accessories are new and that Microsoft is alone in charging high prices for them. Because the official stuff for the 360 might be pricey but its only as pricey as its competitors and often better quality too boot.

Really are you actually blaming Microsoft for 60 dollar games? well damn Sony being the generous charity they are were offering all of their ps3 games for 40 right? they weren't....Oh I guess the fact a year before the 360 was even released analysts were predicting rising game development costs and publishing costs would push the games up 10 dollars...but hey remember back in the cartridge days when games were 20 dollars? wait I didn't pay 70 dollars for quite a few snes games?

It seems to me that Sony commits most of the same things high priced games, high prices accessories but to you thats just good buisness sense for sony when its Microsoft its the devil of the corporate world.

I'm mostly a PC gamer but when I think about only having the choice between a Wii or a PS3 for my console, it does shine a bit more of a positive light on the 360 (for me at least).

Xbox 360 is better than the PS3

better online experience

more games

more exclusives

better controller

more affordabe

etc etc etc

This is why 360 is beating the PS3. The consumers see the value is greater for Xbox. Plus they don't wanna get hacked and lose their credit card info on psn.

whatever nutty sw thing youlike to tell yourself in order to hate ms the bottom line is i can't imagine what a terrible gen this would have been without them since the ps3 was a joke for the first 2 years.

had ms never been in the game market you would probably be hyping haze 3 and lair 4 right now.

[QUOTE="todd2r"]Without Microsoft, who would Sony copy off of? waltefmoney

Nintendo, most likely.

without eyetoy... there will never be a kinecthippiesanta

Thank god, Sony is responsible for not one, but two crappy motion controllers.

Xbox 360 is better than the PS3

better online experience

more games

more exclusives

better controller

more affordabe

etc etc etc

This is why 360 is beating the PS3. The consumers see the value is greater for Xbox. Plus they don't wanna get hacked and lose their credit card info on psn.

jimmypsn

While many people would think that MS is the best thing ever that happen to the market there is a ton of people who also thinks is the worst one,i my self don't think MS is good news for the console market or gamers,but at the same time i know that MS is one of the best thing to ever happen to the console market,let me elaborate on why. While i think that XBL price scheme is horrible and put the majority of the xbox 360 users base in a position where they miss a complete part of a game multiplayer if they don't pay,and have bring a new era of over priced peripherals,nickel and dime and even rise of games to $60 which is attribute to the xbox 360 in special in 2005. I also know that without MS sony would have not advance the way they did with the PS3,sign of this can be see when they dare to release a $600 dollar console,even if it was worth it or not,it was way out of the usual $299 price tag that the PS brand started with and was so successful for. Without MS i would not have trophies now which i consider a little better than achievements complete with the leveling thing,PSN has make a huge jump in quality since 2006,where it was painfully slow and sloppy,Home,and a barrage of features the PS3 has get are mainly thanks to MS,not because it was their idea,but because competition is good and keep the market from stagnating in the same place for ages. While i think MS is out to get gamers money,we already see that with Kinect $150 dollar camera,over priced peripherals,and XBL fees,they are a need it bad thing to this industry,i just hope they don't win because if now they are not and people pay $60 for live and ton of cash for over priced peripherals,imagine what they would do if they were the market leaders. MS deserves to be here they just don't deserve to win in my opinion.tormentos

Honestly, I didn't think the Xbox would actually survive. I just didn't think that the market WANTED, let alone needed, a third console. But they are still here, so that has to say something about MS and the Xbox brand. The industry seems to have evolved into something new and different from what it used to be. It is now about so much more than just games, and I think that is why we can now have three consoles survive on the market, since they all have different purposes and strengths. Sony wants to be the game/media machine. MS wants to be the game/online machine. Nintendo wants to be the game/family machine.

However, I don't know if we can say with any certainly things wouldn't have worked out exactly the same if MS was never around. Games had acheivements before MS, they just weren't standard. The xbox made the HD necessary but then MS took it out of the 360 in terms of standard hardware. Nintendo pushed motion control to the forefront, but Sony was developing the "wand" YEARS before Nintendo ever mentioned the Wii. And Sony talked about online gaming for years before they ever got their act together and released the add-on for PS2.

So who knows. Things could have worked out the same in the long run anyway.

You're half-right. Microsoft has done nothing postive for the industry. All they've done is introduced things like nickel-and-diming and they eat up good developers and turn them into something we cannot even recognize. Just look at what they've done to Rare.

I would love for them to leave this industry and for Sega to return.

Without Microsoft, who would Sony copy off of? todd2r

Well there's always Nintendo.

they are the ones that started the GTA 4 snowbal effect so your half right

Okay, I'll go with ye ole half right thing but with a different twist - They are the best thing to happen since without them in the game, Sony would have owned the living-room and we'd all still be saying even at this late date... PS3 has no games. :P

Face it man, without MS, there would be nobody to keep Sony on their toes and don't even try and say "N" would have filled that Need.

Wow...just wow...whats next are you going to blame Microsoft for satan? Maybe the riots in Vancouver when they didn't win the Stanley? Global warming and the damage to the ozone layer?

WilliamRLBaker

MS is neither the best nor the worst thing in the console market and certainly not both.All three companies have been guilty of nickle and diming their customers, I don't give a crap who you think "introduced" it..

It's amazing how sketchy peoples memories of the last 2 generations are. There is a reason Playstation fanboys were called cows.

Wow...just wow...whats next are you going to blame Microsoft for satan? Maybe the riots in Vancouver when they didn't win the Stanley? Global warming and the damage to the ozone layer?

I'll explain most of what was wrong with what you posted.
""While i think that XBL price scheme is horrible and put the majority of the xbox 360 users base in a position where they miss a complete part of a game multiplayer if they don't pay,and have bring a new era of over priced peripherals,nickel and dime and even rise of games to $60 which is attribute to the xbox 360 in special in 2005.""

Except its still undeniable the xbox live service is still better than anything offered on the consoles at this point and time anything else and defending the shortcommings of other services is just fanboy goggles and its as simple as that sheer content and intergration keeps XBL ontop andabsolutely notit puts some of the user base in a postion where they knew the online portion cost money if they wanted it free then they should have moved onto the Wii, Ps3 or PC.

thank god you said new era and saved your self because in the past you've made out that Microsoft is the only one that ever charged such high prices for accessories which then was false and even now with you saying new era is false all you have is the wireless adaptor and harddrive otherwise the ps3 controllers are just as expensive and dont offer near the battery life of the often 40-50 dollar 360 wireless controler+play and charge kits, wireless headset, hdmi cables, usb cables...etc...etc all have the same price and parity and all have 3rd party options on the 360 just like the ps3 for cheaper prices please dont act like high priced accessories are new and that Microsoft is alone in charging high prices for them. Because the official stuff for the 360 might be pricey but its only as pricey as its competitors and often better quality too boot.

Really are you actually blaming Microsoft for 60 dollar games? well damn Sony being the generous charity they are were offering all of their ps3 games for 40 right? they weren't....Oh I guess the fact a year before the 360 was even released analysts were predicting rising game development costs and publishing costs would push the games up 10 dollars...but hey remember back in the cartridge days when games were 20 dollars? wait I didn't pay 70 dollars for quite a few snes games?

It seems to me that Sony commits most of the same things high priced games, high prices accessories but to you thats just good buisness sense for sony when its Microsoft its the devil of the corporate world.

WilliamRLBaker

Competition is good. I know you all have some vendetta against Apple, but if they were to release a home console, it would be great. Would keep Microsoft and Sony on their toes.RR360DD

I give you some credit for at least putting in your opinion in the OP, but blaming it all on MS is a joke.

[QUOTE="RR360DD"]Competition is good. I know you all have some vendetta against Apple, but if they were to release a home console, it would be great. Would keep Microsoft and Sony on their toes.tormentos

I give you some credit for at least putting in your opinion in the OP, but blaming it all on MS is a joke.

KevinnButlerNPK

Xbox 360 is better than the PS3

better online experience

more games

more exclusives

better controller

more affordabe

etc etc etc

This is why 360 is beating the PS3. The consumers see the value is greater for Xbox. Plus they don't wanna get hacked and lose their credit card info on psn.

jimmypsn

How is the Xbox 360 more affordable then the PS3?

The models worth getting are both $299. You can't count the $200 4GB Xbox 360, because there is no way what so ever in this day of time going to make a 4 GB HDD last.To upgrade a Xbox 360 to 250 GB is going to run you $73.99 while I just upgraded my PS3 hard drive not that long ago to a 500GB for $49.99.

Then on top of that your paying $60 a year for a service that's no better then PSN. Don't give the XBL is light years ahead of PSN BS. If any service was light years ahead of anybody it would be Steam.

Sure XBL has Cross Game Chat, the ability to change your gamer tag, ESPN, Last.FM, Interactive Ads, and Live TV, but PSN has Vudu, MLB.TV, NHL Game center, PlayStation Home, Voice Changer, Web Browser, Qriocity, and some kind of HBO app coming soon. Then you look at shared features like Hulu Plus and Netfilx which are both subscription services on Xbox 360 requires Gold to even access it while on PSN a free member can access the application. Then you look at video chat on the XBL you pay just to video chat with one person on PSN everybody can video chat with up to 8 people at once for free. Then let's look at messaging it's does not require a gold member ship, but it does have character limits while PSN does not.

Oh let's not forget you have to pay to play an 8 player P2P game of Gears of War, while I don't have to pay nothing to play to play a 256 player dedicated server on MAG, and seeing how F2P MMORPGs on PC are coming more mainstream it makes the argument more laughable.

Yes, PSN does offer Custom soundtracks and Cross Game Invite. Since PSN did not launch with these features not ever game supports them like on the Xbox 360 since it launched with those feathers, but there big list of games that support those features.

Custum soundtracks: Motorstorm Pacific Rift, Mortorstorm Apocalypse, Warhawk, Dead Nation, Gran Turismo 5, Killzone 2, MLB 10 The Show, Superstar Dust HD, and lot more.

Cross Game Invite: Call of Duty Classic, Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2, Call of Duty Black Ops, Medal of Honor, Battlefield Bad Company 2, PlayStation Home, and a lot more.

Better controller is total subjective, I personally like both the same.

Yes, the Xbox 360 does have a bigger game library, but PS3 does have more exclusives. Games like Gears of War, Vivi Pinata, Shadow Run, Left 4 Dead, and many others don't count, because they are on the PC, and no Microsoft does not own the PC they make an operating system for the PC.

Oh, before anybody nags me about PSN slow download speeds. It does not here's two videos for proof Video 1 and Video 2.
If you are getting slow download speeds it's either one of three answers 1. Running your PS3 through Wifi (Going by a poll I seen in the past most here do) 2. The servers are busy and 3. Your ISP just sucks.

Edit: PSN is a lot more open then XBL this is why the PS3 version of UT3 has Mods, this is why the PS3 version of Portal 2 has Steamworks intergration, this is why ULDK has Xfire intergration, this is why I was able to Play MGS Online while the PSN was down. This is why I can download the map packs for BFBC through a patch while you got to download them from the market place.

So, trophies and that's pretty much it?
I think M$ also started timed exclusives and paying money to block releases on competitive platforms?

So, trophies and that's pretty much it?
I think M$ also started timed exclusives and paying money to block releases on competitive platforms?

KungfuKitten

Sony and Nintendo did that in past generations dont act like Microsoft is the only one to do it.

[QUOTE="tenaka2"]

Well, your half right.

casharmy

agree.

There is NOTHING positive that MS has done that wouldn't have been done anyway in a much more consumer friendly and respectable way if they had never entered the market, All of the bad treads they introduced however would never have come to light on consoles if MS had never been allowed fester and taint the past respectable traditions of console game producers

And who did you think would innovate in MS's place? Sony, the company that has been using the same controller since 1996? Nintendo is a great innovative company but they are way behind MS in terms of online components.

[QUOTE="KungfuKitten"]

So, trophies and that's pretty much it?
I think M$ also started timed exclusives and paying money to block releases on competitive platforms?

KevinnButlerNPK

I agree. Xbox Live was the best thing to happen to console gaming, with the original xbox. Unfortunately it has created some kind of cult like status among some gamers. Anyone that can't see that xbox live is *h** out of control is blind. MS has eased its way into exactly where it wants to be with the service. It really surprises me that people are so willing to throw their money into something which may have a profound effect on the entire gaming industry somewhere down the line.

I agree. Xbox Live was the best thing to happen to console gaming, with the original xbox. Unfortunately it has created some kind of cult like status among some gamers. Anyone that can't see that xbox live is *h** out of control is blind. MS has eased its way into exactly where it wants to be with the service. It really surprises me that people are so willing to throw their money into something which may have a profound effect on the entire gaming industry somewhere down the line.

Heirren

Its because Microsoft made online gaming on consoles poular and now mainstream.

Xbox 360 is better than the PS3

better online experience

more games

more exclusives

better controller

more affordabe

etc etc etc

This is why 360 is beating the PS3. The consumers see the value is greater for Xbox. Plus they don't wanna get hacked and lose their credit card info on psn.

jimmypsn

BTW, "more exclusives" for the 360 isn't really too much of an advantage in comparison, since sony have the better ones.

Okay, I'll go with ye ole half right thing but with a different twist - They are the best thing to happen since without them in the game, Sony would have owned the living-room and we'd all still be saying even at this late date... PS3 has no games. :P

Face it man, without MS, there would be nobody to keep Sony on their toes and don't even try and say "N" would have filled that Need.

SecretPolice

[QUOTE="Heirren"]

I agree. Xbox Live was the best thing to happen to console gaming, with the original xbox. Unfortunately it has created some kind of cult like status among some gamers. Anyone that can't see that xbox live is *h** out of control is blind. MS has eased its way into exactly where it wants to be with the service. It really surprises me that people are so willing to throw their money into something which may have a profound effect on the entire gaming industry somewhere down the line.

jimmypsn

Its because Microsoft made online gaming on consoles poular and now mainstream.

What they did was inch there way into charging for everything, and controlling the prices of DLC. They are definitly in charge and responsible for how we pay for additional content.

[QUOTE="jimmypsn"]

Xbox 360 is better than the PS3

better online experience

more games

more exclusives

better controller

more affordabe

etc etc etc

This is why 360 is beating the PS3. The consumers see the value is greater for Xbox. Plus they don't wanna get hacked and lose their credit card info on psn.

lDeadlyReconI

How is the Xbox 360 more affordable then the PS3?

The models worth getting are both $299. You can't count the $200 4GB Xbox 360, because there is no way what so ever in this day of time going to make a 4 GB HDD last.To upgrade a Xbox 360 to 250 GB is going to run you $73.99 while I just upgraded my PS3 hard drive not that long ago to a 500GB for $49.99.

Then on top of that your paying $60 a year for a service that's no better then PSN. Don't give the XBL is light years ahead of PSN BS. If any service was light years ahead of anybody it would be Steam.

Sure XBL has Cross Game Chat, the ability to change your gamer tag, ESPN, Last.FM, Interactive Ads, and Live TV, but PSN has Vudu, MLB.TV, NHL Game center, PlayStation Home, Voice Changer, Web Browser, Qriocity, and some kind of HBO app coming soon. Then you look at shared features like Hulu Plus and Netfilx which are both subscription services on Xbox 360 requires Gold to even access it while on PSN a free member can access the application. Then you look at video chat on the XBL you pay just to video chat with one person on PSN everybody can video chat with up to 8 people at once for free. Then let's look at messaging it's does not require a gold member ship, but it does have character limits while PSN does not.

Oh let's not forget you have to pay to play an 8 player P2P game of Gears of War, while I don't have to pay nothing to play to play a 256 player dedicated server on MAG, and seeing how F2P MMORPGs on PC are coming more mainstream it makes the argument more laughable.

Yes, PSN does offer Custom soundtracks and Cross Game Invite. Since PSN did not launch with these features not ever game supports them like on the Xbox 360 since it launched with those feathers, but there big list of games that support those features.

Custum soundtracks: Motorstorm Pacific Rift, Mortorstorm Apocalypse, Warhawk, Dead Nation, Gran Turismo 5, Killzone 2, MLB 10 The Show, Superstar Dust HD, and lot more.

Cross Game Invite: Call of Duty Classic, Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2, Call of Duty Black Ops, Medal of Honor, Battlefield Bad Company 2, PlayStation Home, and a lot more.

Better controller is total subjective, I personally like both the same.

Yes, the Xbox 360 does have a bigger game library, but PS3 does have more exclusives. Games like Gears of War, Vivi Pinata, Shadow Run, Left 4 Dead, and many others don't count, because they are on the PC, and no Microsoft does not own the PC they make an operating system for the PC.

Oh, before anybody nags me about PSN slow download speeds. It does not here's two videos for proof Video 1 and Video 2.
If you are getting slow download speeds it's either one of three answers 1. Running your PS3 through Wifi (Going by a poll I seen in the past most here do) 2. The servers are busy and 3. Your ISP just sucks.

Edit: PSN is a lot more open then XBL this is why the PS3 version of UT3 has Mods, this is why the PS3 version of Portal 2 has Steamworks intergration, this is why ULDK has Xfire intergration, this is why I was able to Play MGS Online while the PSN was down. This is why I can download the map packs for BFBC through a patch while you got to download them from the market place.

The competition that MS added with the Xbox 360 is arguably the best thing that ever happened to console gaming. KC_Hokie

The regular nintendo saving the gaming industry is UNARGUABLY the best thing to ever happen to console gaming or gaming period.

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]The competition that MS added with the Xbox 360 is arguably the best thing that ever happened to console gaming. ermacness

The regular nintendo saving the gaming industry is UNARGUABLY the best thing to ever happen to console gaming or gaming period.

The competition that MS added with the Xbox 360 is arguably the best thing that ever happened to console gaming. KC_Hokie

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]The competition that MS added with the Xbox 360 is arguably the best thing that ever happened to console gaming. kuraimen

[QUOTE="kuraimen"][QUOTE="KC_Hokie"]The competition that MS added with the Xbox 360 is arguably the best thing that ever happened to console gaming. KC_Hokie

[QUOTE="KC_Hokie"][QUOTE="kuraimen"]Yeah I think it is the exact oppositekuraimen