Nintendo =BEST DEVELOPERs ON THE PLANET AAAE EDITION

Why is it most of Nintendo's games have bad storylines? Have they ever created a good story built game?

Call me up when they make a story that is better than MGS or Bioshock.

kool-aids

you used a melee pic for brawl. fail. JPOBS

lots of games had stories.-most stories today are the same and uninspired (save the world, save somebody, good vs evil).the wiimote is far more immersive (no opinon, proven fact as it's far easier to pick up and play), yet some people are too used to the ancient dual analog controller (though it was much harder to learn those controls, but you forgot)i forgive nintendo for not spending too much time on something as irrelevcant as a story (although they have games with just as great storiesas other games, you generalis) the sound in the wiimote is horrible,i agree. but in some games it;'s a great feature.you are NOT holding the same standards, you are holding the 360 and PS3 standards....anayway, we disagree. i am right and you are wrongAlways-Honest

The odd thing about this list is, Super Mario Galaxy is possibly the best game I've played this generation, but Warioware is one of the worst gaming purchases I've ever made. gingerdivid

It was the game that made me realize to never trust GS alone for purchasing decisions

[QUOTE="Always-Honest"]lots of games had stories.-most stories today are the same and uninspired (save the world, save somebody, good vs evil).the wiimote is far more immersive (no opinon, proven fact as it's far easier to pick up and play), yet some people are too used to the ancient dual analog controller (though it was much harder to learn those controls, but you forgot)i forgive nintendo for not spending too much time on something as irrelevcant as a story (although they have games with just as great storiesas other games, you generalis) the sound in the wiimote is horrible,i agree. but in some games it;'s a great feature.you are NOT holding the same standards, you are holding the 360 and PS3 standards....anayway, we disagree. i am right and you are wrongVandalvideo

u know games can have characters speaking and be story driven , but i dont think it's a necessity to be successful ..this isnt like the movie industry ,we grade games on how fun and entertaining they can be ,not how many dialogue devs can put on a game ...im not against dialogue /story in games ,all im saying is it isnt a must and it doesnt always leads to success

Accessibiility does not equal immersion. Vandalvideo

no, true.. but i do think the wiimote is more immersive in a lot of games.

Of course I'm holding Nintendo to the MS and SONY standards. Like I said, I'm not going to make an exception for them just because they're Nintendo. They failed at making stories, their games are stuck in the pastVandalvideo

why should they be the standard?

and again. stories smories.. not important and wii has games with the same quality of stories as 360 and ps3 (all unoriginal and perhaps some quircky wii games have MORe original stories).

fans are stuck in the past, not consoles. and nintendo is the one innovating.. not sony and microsoft.

good lord how much Mario, pink cutesty, frilly pastel-colored games must Nintendo rely on? I thought Nintendo was about innovation, and yet, their top scoring games all have this colorful fantasy setting and nothing else. Nintendo = Disneyland

why should they be the standard? and again. stories smories.. not important and wii has games with the same quality of stories as 360 and ps3 (all unoriginal and perhaps some quircky wii games have MORe original stories).fans are stuck in the past, not consoles. and nintendo is the one innovating.. not sony and microsoftAlways-Honest

good lord how much Mario, pink cutesty, frilly pastel-colored games must Nintendo rely on? I thought Nintendo was about innovation, and yet, their top scoring games all have this colorful fantasy setting and nothing else. Nintendo = Disneyland

PhoebusFlows

Ok... let me know when everyone else moves past the whole "dark, violent, and/or mature" phase.

I'm referring to: Halo 3, COD 2-4, Rainbow Six Vegas 1-2, Gears of War 1-2, Army of Two, Frontline: Fuel of War, Huxley, Resistance FoM 1-2, Killzone 2, Saints Row 1-2, GTA IV, Bioshock, Oblivion, The Orange Box, Turok, Mass Effect, GRAW 1-2, Fable 2, Lost Odyssey, Condemned 1-2, etc. etc. etc.

Not that those games are bad (I like quite a few of them), but it's not like Nintendo's the only one that's stuck on one type of Game.

[QUOTE="Always-Honest"]lots of games had stories.-most stories today are the same and uninspired (save the world, save somebody, good vs evil).the wiimote is far more immersive (no opinon, proven fact as it's far easier to pick up and play), yet some people are too used to the ancient dual analog controller (though it was much harder to learn those controls, but you forgot)i forgive nintendo for not spending too much time on something as irrelevcant as a story (although they have games with just as great storiesas other games, you generalis) the sound in the wiimote is horrible,i agree. but in some games it;'s a great feature.you are NOT holding the same standards, you are holding the 360 and PS3 standards....anayway, we disagree. i am right and you are wrongVandalvideo

I agree, thier stories are laughible for the most part with a few exceptions. Wii mote only shines in exceptional games that have made with it in mind. Despite all that I still love them for the few gems they bring out. Stories might be BS but the gameplay is AAA imo.

[QUOTE="Always-Honest"]why should they be the standard? and again. stories smories.. not important and wii has games with the same quality of stories as 360 and ps3 (all unoriginal and perhaps some quircky wii games have MORe original stories).fans are stuck in the past, not consoles. and nintendo is the one innovating.. not sony and microsoftVandalvideo

there is room for improvement, i agree. but story is not modernization... online and co-op IS, and i agree they are not very far in that departement, but it works... I would love to have 5.1 or 7.1 surround and games at 720P and 1080P with 4 cores for ultimate physics and shader effects.. but that would make the wii much more expensive. and i wouldn't give a crap about that, i rather have a more expensive Wii that was HD and stuff. but it would not reach as many people that way. I still think they are expanding the gaming industry in a good way and i think they are moving the industry forward much more than MS and Sony are doing.

Hey, remember when Nintendo would not allow Mortal Kombat on the SNES with blood? If things were up to them, we would never have gotten Resident Evil, GTA and the rest of the mature titles we all enjoy.

It took Sony, the PS1 and allowing 3rd party game makers to explore mature content games.

Also, would Final Fantasy be where it is today if it was a Nintendo exclusive?

You are all giving praise to a company that was pretty controlling over what games would hit it's system.

Nintendo is good at expanding it's own IP, but was known for holding back 3rd party IPs. Today, they would not dream of it, but don't forget who they were.

They aren't the "geniuses" you all want them to be.

Remember when Nintendo was trounced by the PS1 in the N64 days? There is your dispute.

And how the PS2 destroyed the Gamecube?

Sure they have the handheld market and the Wii is "winning". But, it is in no way "undisputed".

Demetri_OS

Remember when Nintendo was trounced by the PS1 in the N64 days? There is your dispute.

And how the PS2 destroyed the Gamecube?

Sure they have the handheld market and the Wii is "winning". But, it is in no way "undisputed".

Demetri_OS

I just find it amazing that whenever a good Nintendo game comes out, there is always a huge backlash with all kinds of "So what, it's teh kiddeh Mario" and "bu bu but it's not third party!"

Whatever. If you guys are seriously upset by good video games, then I really don't know what to say.

Hey, remember when Nintendo would not allow Mortal Kombat on the SNES with blood? If things were up to them, we would never have gotten Resident Evil, GTA and the rest of the mature titles we all enjoy.

It took Sony, the PS1 and allowing 3rd party game makers to explore mature content games.

Also, would Final Fantasy be where it is today if it was a Nintendo exclusive?

You are all giving praise to a company that was pretty controlling over what games would hit it's system.

Nintendo is good at expanding it's own IP, but was known for holding back 3rd party IPs. Today, they would not dream of it, but don't forget who they were.

They aren't the "geniuses" you all want them to be.

Demetri_OS

[QUOTE="Kakarot00769"]

i stopped posting links from sites in terms of numbers for consoles sold worldwide ,reason being is that if a fanboys console is getting destroyed by another console ,they will claim foul and call the site unreliable and some poster will defend the console of his favorite and call the site reputable and it will be an on going cycle , so we are not going that route ...theres only 1 solution when it comes to worldwide figures sold .only time will tell the story and by the end of the year and once all 3 console manufacturers announce their worldwide figures ,the nearest competitor to the wii will be behind by @ least 10 million units

heretrix

HOW DO YOU KNOW NINTENDO COUNTS UNITS SOLD TO CUSTOMERS AND NOT SHIPPED TO RETAILERS LIKE EVERYBODY ELSE?

If you are going to post a definitive statement about something, you must expect to be called on it. And your source must be ironclad as to remove any doubt about your statement. This shouldn't be hard unless your source is suspect.

I wouldn't post a damn thing here unless I had proof. I know people get annoyed when asked for proof, but I don't see a problem with it, especially with the amount of suspect data that is casually thrown about in this forum.

My request has nothing to do with me being a fanboy, I am interested in knowing the truth, which is why I asked.

Hey, remember when Nintendo would not allow Mortal Kombat on the SNES with blood? If things were up to them, we would never have gotten Resident Evil, GTA and the rest of the mature titles we all enjoy.

It took Sony, the PS1 and allowing 3rd party game makers to explore mature content games.

Also, would Final Fantasy be where it is today if it was a Nintendo exclusive?

You are all giving praise to a company that was pretty controlling over what games would hit it's system.

Nintendo is good at expanding it's own IP, but was known for holding back 3rd party IPs. Today, they would not dream of it, but don't forget who they were.

They aren't the "geniuses" you all want them to be.

Demetri_OS

[QUOTE="PhoebusFlows"]

good lord how much Mario, pink cutesty, frilly pastel-colored games must Nintendo rely on? I thought Nintendo was about innovation, and yet, their top scoring games all have this colorful fantasy setting and nothing else. Nintendo = Disneyland

--ProtoMan--

Ok... let me know when everyone else moves past the whole "dark, violent, and/or mature" phase.

I'm referring to: Halo 3, COD 2-4, Rainbow Six Vegas 1-2, Gears of War 1-2, Army of Two, Frontline: Fuel of War, Huxley, Resistance FoM 1-2, Killzone 2, Saints Row 1-2, GTA IV, Bioshock, Oblivion, The Orange Box, Turok, Mass Effect, GRAW 1-2, Fable 2, Lost Odyssey, Condemned 1-2, etc. etc. etc.

Not that those games are bad (I like quite a few of them), but it's not like Nintendo's the only one that's stuck on one type of Game.

Oh you mean games that have gritty real life settings and explore adult themes (not saying they all do)?

Out of curiosity if "fun" gameplay is all that matters what seperates a Mario game from games like Peggle? I mean Peggle was fun but it didn't have a story. I for one love a good story and can't get into the stale save the princess boringness. I don't always see gaming as having to be fun (giddy laughter). When I go to see a movie I don't always expect "fun" but I do expect an experience. Color me a non-gamer then I guess because I look for other things besides gameplay.

[QUOTE="--ProtoMan--"][QUOTE="PhoebusFlows"]

good lord how much Mario, pink cutesty, frilly pastel-colored games must Nintendo rely on? I thought Nintendo was about innovation, and yet, their top scoring games all have this colorful fantasy setting and nothing else. Nintendo = Disneyland

Kantroce

Ok... let me know when everyone else moves past the whole "dark, violent, and/or mature" phase.

I'm referring to: Halo 3, COD 2-4, Rainbow Six Vegas 1-2, Gears of War 1-2, Army of Two, Frontline: Fuel of War, Huxley, Resistance FoM 1-2, Killzone 2, Saints Row 1-2, GTA IV, Bioshock, Oblivion, The Orange Box, Turok, Mass Effect, GRAW 1-2, Fable 2, Lost Odyssey, Condemned 1-2, etc. etc. etc.

Not that those games are bad (I like quite a few of them), but it's not like Nintendo's the only one that's stuck on one type of Game.

Oh you mean games that have gritty real life settings and explore adult themes (not saying they all do)?

Out of curiosity if "fun" gameplay is all that matters what seperates a Mario game from games like Peggle? I mean Peggle was fun but it didn't have a story. I for one love a good story and can't get into the stale save the princess boringness. I don't always see gaming as having to be fun (giddy laughter). When I go to see a movie I don't always expect "fun" but I do expect an experience. Color me a non-gamer then I guess because I look for other things besides gameplay.

Yay for assumptions!

Dude, color me an idiot or something, but I never said that gameplay is all that matters. But if you're going to shove words in my mouth and stereotype me, I don't see any point in debating with you.

[QUOTE="Kantroce"][QUOTE="--ProtoMan--"][QUOTE="PhoebusFlows"]

good lord how much Mario, pink cutesty, frilly pastel-colored games must Nintendo rely on? I thought Nintendo was about innovation, and yet, their top scoring games all have this colorful fantasy setting and nothing else. Nintendo = Disneyland

--ProtoMan--

Ok... let me know when everyone else moves past the whole "dark, violent, and/or mature" phase.

I'm referring to: Halo 3, COD 2-4, Rainbow Six Vegas 1-2, Gears of War 1-2, Army of Two, Frontline: Fuel of War, Huxley, Resistance FoM 1-2, Killzone 2, Saints Row 1-2, GTA IV, Bioshock, Oblivion, The Orange Box, Turok, Mass Effect, GRAW 1-2, Fable 2, Lost Odyssey, Condemned 1-2, etc. etc. etc.

Not that those games are bad (I like quite a few of them), but it's not like Nintendo's the only one that's stuck on one type of Game.

Oh you mean games that have gritty real life settings and explore adult themes (not saying they all do)?

Out of curiosity if "fun" gameplay is all that matters what seperates a Mario game from games like Peggle? I mean Peggle was fun but it didn't have a story. I for one love a good story and can't get into the stale save the princess boringness. I don't always see gaming as having to be fun (giddy laughter). When I go to see a movie I don't always expect "fun" but I do expect an experience. Color me a non-gamer then I guess because I look for other things besides gameplay.

Dude, color me an idiot or something, but I never said that gameplay is all that matters. But if you're going to shove words in my mouth and stereotype me, I don't see any point in debating with you.

Yay for assumptions!

I addressed your post with the first statement, then made a new paragraph that had nothing to do with your post. Yay for assumptions.

I really don't get what you're saying, especially since you just edited your post twice.

Go ahead and explain to me what I assumed.

Truth be told, i don't think Nintendo games need voicework to be honest.

A Zelda where npc have voices might be nice, but i never want Link to speak. Ever.

It's not Zelda if Link has a voice that's annoying my ears.

Same for Mario and Metroid and Donkey Kong.

Maybe i'm alone in this, but i suspect not.

Too many franchises have been ruined with the supposed "modernization" wave permeating the industry.

And while Zelda tp was disappointing, Mario Galaxy had love coming out the ass.

From the soundtrack, to the optimization of the graphics, to the art design, to the gameplay, top notch.

[QUOTE="PhoebusFlows"]

good lord how much Mario, pink cutesty, frilly pastel-colored games must Nintendo rely on? I thought Nintendo was about innovation, and yet, their top scoring games all have this colorful fantasy setting and nothing else. Nintendo = Disneyland

--ProtoMan--

Ok... let me know when everyone else moves past the whole "dark, violent, and/or mature" phase.

I'm referring to: Halo 3, COD 2-4, Rainbow Six Vegas 1-2, Gears of War 1-2, Army of Two, Frontline: Fuel of War, Huxley, Resistance FoM 1-2, Killzone 2, Saints Row 1-2, GTA IV, Bioshock, Oblivion, The Orange Box, Turok, Mass Effect, GRAW 1-2, Fable 2, Lost Odyssey, Condemned 1-2, etc. etc. etc.

Not that those games are bad (I like quite a few of them), but it's not like Nintendo's the only one that's stuck on one type of Game.

Nintendo's condition is worse. They have this so-called advantage of innovative controls in their corner, so we should be seeing five times the innovation, and yet their only top-scoring games are restricted to the same narrow palette and roster of characters (Mario and Zelda pretty much) Looking at the OP's pictures was like looking at the candy aisle.

I know Xbox 360 and PS3 have a lot of mature themes, but developers have said they purposefully stay with either a sci-fi theme or a historical war theme like WWII. Because there, you can have a semi-plausible excuse for a player to kill hundreds of enemies. How else is an FPS going to last for hours? It wouldnt make sense in a Chicago setting with humans on streets. There is really no other place for an FPS -- but there are some exceptions. Portal and Bioshock, for instance, which I hope will encourage more risk-taking and new ideas from developers.

If Nintendo is the best developer in the world, it's not stopping the industry from praising games like Mass Effect, Bioshock and Portal. What Nintendo game is being praised the same way Bioshock has for story and setting? How many want to bet Mario Party will go to 10, and there will be another Mario Kart for the next Nintendo system? I made the Disneyland comment as a joke, but the more I think about it, Disney didnt exactly do so well in the end when they had a failed animation divison that lost to the innovative, technology-embracing Pixar. Of course Pixar is owned by Disney but it reminds me of Nintendo and how they stay within the same small boundaries and expect the ever-changing world to conform to their little nest of safe ideas -- more like a refusal to grow up a little. There's only so much people can take of Zelda and Mario's simplistic storylines (save the princess, save the kingdom) before they start to get sick of it.

It's ironic the consoles using old analog controls (PS3 and Xbox 360) have developed more innovative storylines and settings than Nintendo. Nintendo, the one with the innovative controls, have stayed with the same recycled ABC storylines and characters the most. This ungodly inverse proportion should horrify you. Nintendo can be that horrifying sometimes.

Truth be told, i don't think Nintendo games need voicework to be honest.

A Zelda where npc have voices might be nice, but i never want Link to speak. Ever.

It's not Zelda if Link has a voice that's annoying my ears.

Same for Mario and Metroid and Donkey Kong.

Maybe i'm alone in this, but i suspect not.

Too many franchises have been ruined with the supposed "modernization" wave permeating the industry.

And while Zelda tp was disappointing, Mario Galaxy had love coming out the ass.

From the soundtrack, to the optimization of the graphics, to the art design, to the gameplay, top notch.

Seraphimon

See if I were to get a Wii....those would be the only titles I would get. It's first party games are fun and unique but overall it's really the gamecube all over again.

no other company comes close to the contribution nintendo made in this industry

Kakarot00769

Other than Blizzard, Square-Enix, and a few others, that statement is correct.

[QUOTE="Kakarot00769"]

no other company comes close to the contribution nintendo made in this industry

cablemodemx2

Other than Blizzard, Square-Enix, and a few others, that statement is correct.

funny how you mentioned blizzard ,theyre a huge nintendo fanatics , wow is oozing with cookie characters from the nintendo universe

A bit of a bump, but meh.

Nintendo games need modernization, ala voice acting, better quality music and better stories?

I'll agree with the better quality of music bit, but Galaxy already saw to that, as did Metroid Prime last gen.

Voicework isn't a needed part of game development nowadays.

Too many games have the most grating voicework, and it adds nothing but a grimace to the experience.

Grunts, groans and huffs is all i look for, not laughably stilted voices going with laughably stiff animation. Pixar, game developers are not.

Now to the story bit...wtf?

A story is merely a vehicle to get the gameplay going, or if the gameplay itself is weak, the story is what you suffer through the gameplay for.

Nintendo has from day one, always put the gameplay first and foremost.

Zelda doesn't need an angsty, convoluted story, and neither does Mario or Metroid. Simple stories aren't necessarily BAD stories, tho that seems to be what many people think.

Zelda = Something has changed in hyrule. It must be fixed. Get to it.

Mario = Peach is in danger, save her. Don't be dawdling.

Metroid = The galaxy is threatened by a new danger. Confront it and deal with it.

They work to get the gameplay going, and the gameplay is where Nintendo shines brightest.

Mind you, for the games that are story driven, they do their thing, ie rpgs.

Fire Emblem and Mother are both loved for their great gameplay and engrossing stories, Mother which has one of the best stories in the genre.

Look at the genres that require daunting stories, and see how they shine.

I don't necessarily think Ninty is the best developer in the world, but they're easily top five material, imo.

Dunno if this is directed at me, but i'll bite.

I didn't name a new ip in my post above, but Nintendo has made a few new ips since the start of this gen.

Wii Play, Wii Sports, Nintendogs, and they've got new ones on the way.

Now, if you feel these ips aren't worth your time, then bull for you, but they're new ips.

The problem with the industry as a whole, is the "if it's not aimed at me, it's worthless" mindset. To grow the market, you must bring in different people with different views.

The person who makes the next Mario or GTA could be a female playing Wii sports right now...or later today.

And unless you bring these people to the table, and allow them to taste, and then go and create their own recipes, the market itself will never go beyond a few stalwart concepts.

And not a single one of those is a brand new IP :(Taalon

MGS has been about since the 8-bit era also, that hasn't stopped you from promoting it as the second coming now has it. The fact that Nintendo manages to make their classic franchises feel new after all these years is amazing in itself.

[QUOTE="Kakarot00769"][QUOTE="OhSnapitz"]

:lol:

btw, the 360 announced it was at 17.7 mil (not 17 mil).. And that was last year. Just though I'd add that little fact.

heretrix

shipped = console sold to retailers not gamers

Yes, they do.

[QUOTE="heretrix"][QUOTE="Kakarot00769"][QUOTE="OhSnapitz"]

:lol:

btw, the 360 announced it was at 17.7 mil (not 17 mil).. And that was last year. Just though I'd add that little fact.

Kakarot00769

shipped = console sold to retailers not gamers

nintendo announces numbers that are actually sold to gamers and that makes it 22.26 million sold for wii and the nearest competitor @ 17.37 million and that gap will just keep on widening

No they do not.

Yes, Nintendo and MS count systems sold to retail while Sony counts systems manufactured and in their warehouses.

EG101

No, last year (or earlier this year I think), Sony changed their ways and now measure the consoles sold to retailers...just like MS and Nintendo.

[QUOTE="--ProtoMan--"][QUOTE="PhoebusFlows"]

good lord how much Mario, pink cutesty, frilly pastel-colored games must Nintendo rely on? I thought Nintendo was about innovation, and yet, their top scoring games all have this colorful fantasy setting and nothing else. Nintendo = Disneyland

PhoebusFlows

Ok... let me know when everyone else moves past the whole "dark, violent, and/or mature" phase.

I'm referring to: Halo 3, COD 2-4, Rainbow Six Vegas 1-2, Gears of War 1-2, Army of Two, Frontline: Fuel of War, Huxley, Resistance FoM 1-2, Killzone 2, Saints Row 1-2, GTA IV, Bioshock, Oblivion, The Orange Box, Turok, Mass Effect, GRAW 1-2, Fable 2, Lost Odyssey, Condemned 1-2, etc. etc. etc.

Not that those games are bad (I like quite a few of them), but it's not like Nintendo's the only one that's stuck on one type of Game.

Nintendo's condition is worse. They have this so-called advantage of innovative controls in their corner, so we should be seeing five times the innovation, and yet their only top-scoring games are restricted to the same narrow palette and roster of characters (Mario and Zelda pretty much) Looking at the OP's pictures was like looking at the candy aisle.

I know Xbox 360 and PS3 have a lot of mature themes, but developers have said they purposefully stay with either a sci-fi theme or a historical war theme like WWII. Because there, you can have a semi-plausible excuse for a player to kill hundreds of enemies. How else is an FPS going to last for hours? It wouldnt make sense in a Chicago setting with humans on streets. There is really no other place for an FPS -- but there are some exceptions. Portal and Bioshock, for instance, which I hope will encourage more risk-taking and new ideas from developers.

If Nintendo is the best developer in the world, it's not stopping the industry from praising games like Mass Effect, Bioshock and Portal. What Nintendo game is being praised the same way Bioshock has for story and setting? How many want to bet Mario Party will go to 10, and there will be another Mario Kart for the next Nintendo system? I made the Disneyland comment as a joke, but the more I think about it, Disney didnt exactly do so well in the end when they had a failed animation divison that lost to the innovative, technology-embracing Pixar. Of course Pixar is owned by Disney but it reminds me of Nintendo and how they stay within the same small boundaries and expect the ever-changing world to conform to their little nest of safe ideas -- more like a refusal to grow up a little. There's only so much people can take of Zelda and Mario's simplistic storylines (save the princess, save the kingdom) before they start to get sick of it.

It's ironic the consoles using old analog controls (PS3 and Xbox 360) have developed more innovative storylines and settings than Nintendo. Nintendo, the one with the innovative controls, have stayed with the same recycled ABC storylines and characters the most. This ungodly inverse proportion should horrify you. Nintendo can be that horrifying sometimes.

I couldn't really find fault with anything you said there, good post.

Blizzard and Valve

Blizzard and Valve

PullTheTricker

^^^ What he said.

But on to topic, I'll explain where I stand. I think the best analogy I can come up with is what I heard some time ago from someone else here.

Nintendo games are fun and great, but the lack of mature themes, stories, and new IP's are their weak point. For example I can still like movies like Shrek, the incredibles, and toy story, but when it comes down to my FAVORITE movies they always involve more adult themes like Good Fellas, Saving private Ryan, Indiana Jones, ect.

Games like Starcraft, Half-Life, Bioshock, Mass Effect, Fallout, System Shock 2, Deus Ex all have great gameplay, yet they delve into deeper topics and have a more mature theme while still retaining great gameplay. If I want a truely GREAT video game experience I want the whole package. Not just a whimsical retold stale story driven game ala Mario. With the exception of Some of the Zelda games (I'm looking at you Majora's Mask), I really haven't played any Nintendo games that truely step out of their original boundries.

Why can't Nintendo make more games like Oot and Majora's Mask which combine some better themes and stories while still retaining great gameplay?

Agreed Nintendo is probebly the most consistant with there AAA franchises they keep 1uping each other each installment.

Bunige and Blizzard deserve notice to.

Edit: and I love how these people are like "Ha ha no new Ips LOLZ sheep!1!!" but then go and hype MGS4 and Fable 2, devil may cray 4, Rainbow six vegas 2 Final fantasy 13, Gears of ware 2, Ut3 :roll:

Best developer of all time? Probably not. Best first-party developer? Yes.

There are better third-party developers.

[QUOTE="Taalon"]And not a single one of those is a brand new IP :(csliney

MGS has been about since the 8-bit era also, that hasn't stopped you from promoting it as the second coming now has it. The fact that Nintendo manages to make their classic franchises feel new after all these years is amazing in itself.

Well, we don't see Solid Snake Party 7 or Dance Dance Revolution: Metal Gear Mix, do we? We don't even see Metal Gear Tennis or Metal Gear Racing... which would both be awesome games, no doubt.

best devs, that would be blizzardnaval

I totally agree. Blizzard is the king.