Nintendo: Sony and Microsoft face a "significant strategic conundrum".

Watch out for some WTF games for the Wii that came out of nowhere like Gears of War for the 360. I think the biggest part for the Wii to lock up first place is Third Party support, and if they can step their game up and make shock value that the Wii desperately needs, then Nintendo would have a good running.hiphops_savior

What they need is more harcdore games and limit the shovelware, this may backfire soon if they don't get better games that attract a more diverse selection of people. They need to learn what Sony the last 2 gens to kill them.

Bah... I'm starting to get sick of Nintendo and their casual games crap.Sim_genius

It will backfire soon, they need more diverse selection.

I'm glad Ninty has decided to carve out their own niche. It is good for them too, because the market doesn't need 3 consoles directly competing with the same specs and same multiplats.

That said, I'm glad Sony and MS are offering the rest of us that love hardcore technically proficient games and are sick of upgrading our PCs constantly. I love my PS3 and it is only getting better.

bull....Nintendo's hardware sales for the Wii are great---but the software sales are pathetic...Cronaroth

You are aware that it's software sales are near identical to the 360's first year right? Though of course many of those are first party.

Man this guy talks so much crap these days. Basically he admits to selling out to casual gamers and that the other two consoles offer quality games for real/hardcore gamers.

Basically, these Nintendo PR types need to shut the **** up once in a while.

What I really can't stand is the people congratulating them. "Oh congrats guys, you've succesfully betrayed your fanbase to make a quick buck. Also, good job trying to lower standards down to casual levels, great way to try and kill gaming guys! Good job with all the shovelware, good job indeed. It's so awesome playing ports of last-gen games, I mean who needs quality titles when I can play two year old games with a remote instead of a controller. Keep up the good work guys!". It's like you sit here and see them trying to destroy the industry for real gamers, and some of you congratulate them simply because they're making money in the process. Pathetic.

I'm glad Ninty has decided to carve out their own niche. It is good for them too, because the market doesn't need 3 consoles directly competing with the same specs and same multiplats.

excelR83

Yeah, it's definitely good.

But I think Reggie is a little too confident in his words as a lot can happen in this market in a very short time. It's really way too early to be giving the victory speech. I'd rather hear about Nintendo trying to go for all markets evenly because if they do that, then the Wii is definitely going to be looked at as a revolution by the end of this gen.

This reminds me of a Toys R Us ad that came in the newspaper this weekend. It showed a mother and son both holding 360 controllers, and it advertised the 360 "arcade version."

The heading was, and I quote, "Xbox 360 Gaming for the Entire Family!" Gee, I wonder where they got that idea?

Reggie is such a flamebaiter :lol:

:P

Man this guy talks so much crap these days. Basically he admits to selling out to casual gamers and that the other two consoles offer quality games for real/hardcore gamers.

Basically, these Nintendo PR types need to shut the **** up once in a while.

What I really can't stand is the people congratulating them. "Oh congrats guys, you've succesfully betrayed your fanbase to make a quick buck. Also, good job trying to lower standards down to casual levels, great way to try and kill gaming guys! Good job with all the shovelware, good job indeed. It's so awesome playing ports of last-gen games, I mean who needs quality titles when I can play two year old games with a remote instead of a controller. Keep up the good work guys!". It's like you sit here and see them trying to destroy the industry for real gamers, and some of you congratulate them simply because they're making money in the process. Pathetic.

V_Isle

I completely disagree with you. I'm pretty sure that I've spent more time playing the Wii than you have even seeing one.

I only have the Wii this gen.

Why? Because I've been gaming for longer than most people on these forums have been alive, and I was actually around when we were still gaming in 2D, and Super Mario Bros 3 had the most amazing graphics ever..... and in all of that time, I had never experienced a moment where I felt just so uninterested in games because of the lack of progression like I did in the later years of the PS2/GCN/Xbox, especially after the announcements of the specs and abilities of the PS3 and 360.

I don't know why anyone thinks they offer anything special or new. I just don't see it. MS and Sony are trying to sell to the exact same audience that they tried to sell to last generation, which I think is a terrible business model, and it's really an insult to its consumers, because they figure that people will be stupid enough to buy the same thing year after year with a minor polish and an increase in specs.

It's still dual analog. It's still 3D. It's still the same buttons. It's still... the same.

Gaming made very little progress between the PS1/N64 gen and the PS2/GCN/XBOX gen, and it made even less progress with the jump to the PS3 and 360.

Are they entertaining consoles? Yeah. But they don't do enough to advance the industry in order to convince me to fork over my money for it. The fact is, I don't want to be playing games with a dual-analog controller in ten more years, so why should I play with one now, and support the mediocre hardware and input devices that Sony and MS are putting out there?

Settle for better graphics if you think that's the right choice, but I think there is more potential in gaming than dual analog and polygons. I don't think the Wii is the answer, but I think it's a step in the right direction.

Microsoft & Sony focus: Innovation through software(games)


Nintendo focus: Innovation through hardware(wiimote)

RedMarzBoy

But in what way have MS and Sony brought up big innovations in software due to their polygon-pushing powerhouses?

What does Halo 3 bring to the table that couldn't be done on the Xbox? How about RE5? What will that do that couldn't have been done on the Cube or PS2? Even new IPs like Gears of War, what about that game couldn't have been done in the previous generation?

I don't see any software "innovation." I see general improvements to certain gameplay elements that would be made year in and year out regardless of a new platform, and that's it.

Once again another Reggie quote. where does this guy get so much pompous energy from? The Nintendo water?

[QUOTE="ramulux"]so basically they dont care about the people who ahve supported them from the begining... SELL OUTS!InfinityMugen

To be honest I would consider Sony to be the "sellouts." They "abandoned" gamers with an expensive console and very few desired titles. All the consoles have their own faults, then again so do human beings. That doesnt mean we shun either just becase they made a couple of mistakes.

[QUOTE="RedMarzBoy"]Microsoft & Sony focus: Innovation through software(games)


Nintendo focus: Innovation through hardware(wiimote)

i_like_pizza

But in what way have MS and Sony brought up big innovations in software due to their polygon-pushing powerhouses?

What does Halo 3 bring to the table that couldn't be done on the Xbox? How about RE5? What will that do that couldn't have been done on the Cube or PS2? Even new IPs like Gears of War, what about that game couldn't have been done in the previous generation?

I don't see any software "innovation." I see general improvements to certain gameplay elements that would be made year in and year out regardless of a new platform, and that's it.

A better question is what innovations has Nintendo brought to the table?? and please don't say a shoddy motion sensing controller.

[QUOTE="i_like_pizza"]

[QUOTE="RedMarzBoy"]Microsoft & Sony focus: Innovation through software(games)


Nintendo focus: Innovation through hardware(wiimote)

wmc540

But in what way have MS and Sony brought up big innovations in software due to their polygon-pushing powerhouses?

What does Halo 3 bring to the table that couldn't be done on the Xbox? How about RE5? What will that do that couldn't have been done on the Cube or PS2? Even new IPs like Gears of War, what about that game couldn't have been done in the previous generation?

I don't see any software "innovation." I see general improvements to certain gameplay elements that would be made year in and year out regardless of a new platform, and that's it.

A better question is what innovations has Nintendo brought to the table?? and please don't say a shoddy motion sensing controller.

A shoddy motion sensing controller.

In all seriousness, it's more innovation that either Sony or MS's hardware will allow.

Any game that you can design for the 360 or PS3 can be made for the Wii, but it doesn't go the other way around.

The definition of innovation is "the introduction of something new." How does the Wii remote not fit that definition?

I will never say the Wii remote is perfect. It clearly isn't. But it is also very clearly EXTREMELY good at what it was meant to do.

Innovation doesn't always mean that it will be good or likable, it only guarantees that it will bring something new to the table. Could you have played Zack and Wiki without the Wii remote? Could you play MP3 without the Wii remote? Could you play SMG without the Wii remote? You can come up with similar games and design them for dual-analog, but then it's not really the same game.

You didn't pose a better question at all. Nintendo has brought us something that fits the description of "innovation" perfectly. The Wii remote is new, and it's also bringing new opportunities into the software realm, as well.

I only have the Wii this gen.

Why? Because I've been gaming for longer than most people on these forums have been alive WOW, and I was actually around when we were still gaming in 2D, and Super Mario Bros 3 had the most amazing graphics ever..... and in all of that time, I had never experienced a moment where I felt just so uninterested in games because of the lack of progression like I did in the later years of the PS2/GCN/Xbox, especially after the announcements of the specs and abilities of the PS3 and 360. It doesn't matter how long you have been gaming. I know a ton of people that have been gaming since inception and they would prefer to play the ps3 or 360 over anything else. They seem to like how things are progressing in games and they don't need a different control method to justify their purchase.

I don't know why anyone thinks they offer anything special or new. I just don't see it. MS and Sony are trying to sell to the exact same audience that they tried to sell to last generation, which I think is a terrible business model, and it's really an insult to its consumers, because they figure that people will be stupid enough to buy the same thing year after year with a minor polish and an increase in specs. Insult to consumers ? You're insulting a lot of people with those comments.

It's still dual analog. It's still 3D. It's still the same buttons. It's still... the same.

Gaming made very little progress between the PS1/N64 gen and the PS2/GCN/XBOX gen, and it made even less progress with the jump to the PS3 and 360.

Are they entertaining consoles? Yeah. But they don't do enough to advance the industry in order to convince me to fork over my money for it. The fact is, I don't want to be playing games with a dual-analog controller in ten more years, so why should I play with one now, and support the mediocre hardware and input devices that Sony and MS are putting out there?

Settle for better graphics if you think that's the right choice, but I think there is more potential in gaming than dual analog and polygons. I don't think the Wii is the answer, but I think it's a step in the right direction.

i_like_pizza

This is very true and a good topic, and I will add and say I think if anything sony is taking chances to try an make blu ray a factor and a must buy where if they were to win the next gen war, then even with those losses they made from the ps3, they would have achieved there goal and would make that money back and also brang something to the table that could be big for future gaming and movies.

Where as for the xbox 360 they wasted alot of money building a lousy hardware which has problems from what we have seen with the large percentage of faulty systems, and id also like to add, that the hardware brings nothing new to the table and for future gaming. I may like to say it does have good graphics on the positive side and a good game lineup but I dont see the xbox 360 lasting more then 5 years.

I am not trying to be biased about one machine but its the truth that sony's ps3 will be a machine that will be around another 9 years compared to the xbox 360 and like I said the ps3 also is a system that will be a wanted system compared to the xbox 360 in a year or so as everyone starts to move forward to the HD era.

[QUOTE="i_like_pizza"]

[QUOTE="RedMarzBoy"]Microsoft & Sony focus: Innovation through software(games)


Nintendo focus: Innovation through hardware(wiimote)

wmc540

But in what way have MS and Sony brought up big innovations in software due to their polygon-pushing powerhouses?

What does Halo 3 bring to the table that couldn't be done on the Xbox? How about RE5? What will that do that couldn't have been done on the Cube or PS2? Even new IPs like Gears of War, what about that game couldn't have been done in the previous generation?

I don't see any software "innovation." I see general improvements to certain gameplay elements that would be made year in and year out regardless of a new platform, and that's it.

A better question is what innovations has Nintendo brought to the table?? and please don't say a shoddy motion sensing controller.

Find me a console that could play Trauma Center, or Wario Ware: Smooth Moves, or has an FPS with the accuracy and precision of MP3.

traslation = we made the wii mostly for the casuals because it's a cashcow... who cares about the hardcore crowd

before you start... yes obviously sony and ms are in it for the money too...but at least they're not alienation the hardcore, but instead embracing them

again before you go off, yes nintendo has completely alienated the hardcore crowd..but com'n, any fool can see that their least interest is the hardcore crowd...they are very much alienating the ppl who made them what they are today

smg and brawl are the last 2 franchises that will ultimately decide wether i will buy a wii or not this generation

short version: sony and ms aren't milking gamers through console purchases. sux to be them -reggie.

i'm not buying a wii tilenough good games come out. looks like ill be waiting til february...

traslation = we made the wii mostly for the casuals because it's a cashcow... who cares about the hardcore crowd

before you start... yes obviously sony and ms are in it for the money too...but at least they're not alienation the hardcore, but instead embracing them

again before you go off, yes nintendo has completely alienated the hardcore crowd..but com'n, any fool can see that their least interest is the hardcore crowd...they are very much alienating the ppl who made them what they are today

smg and brawl are the last 2 franchises that will ultimately decide wether i will buy a wii or not this generation

Rage010101

Def Jam: icon PS3 is 1152x648p
Marvel: Ultimate Alliance PS3 is 1920x1080p
Transformers PS3 is 960x1080p
pirates of caribbean PS3 is 960x720p

Yes Cows still bragging about Oblivion:lol:

so basically they dont care about the people who ahve supported them from the begining... SELL OUTS!ramulux

those ppl are over 30 now ;)

I think Reggie has a very good point. Sony has abandoned what made them successful the last two gens, and that is appealing to the casual gamers. MS went all in focusing on the hardcore gamers and hasn't been successful in trying to lure the casuals. They tried with Viva Pinata and that didn't do too well.

It's going to be tough for either of them to come back from this situation. Nintendo has just stolen the casual crowd and it's basically theirs to lose. Unless Nintendo does something stupid, don't expect this situation to change.

Zhengi

IMO I rather Sony and MSfocus on hardcore gamers. Nintendo pretty much sold out and screwed all their hardcore gamers by focusing way too much on casuals. Yes there are some games on the Wii that cater to hardcore gamers but compared to PS3 and 360 there isn't much.

In all seriousness if it wasn't for the hardcore gamers Nintendo wouldn't be back this time around and the gamecube would have faileda lot worst then it did.

bull....Nintendo's hardware sales for the Wii are great---but the software sales are pathetic....I have a Wii and I hardly ever buy games for it....since they just have a pathetic library still at the moment. Aside from the Nintendo mainstays....nothing impresses me AT ALLCronaroth

The Wii has almost the same attach ratio the 360 had this far into its first year. And with a bigger userbase, no less.

Nintendo has been correct thus far in their marketing approach, I don't think anyone can argue that as they may surpass Gamecube consoles sales figures with the Wii early next year.

Although Sony and Microsoft are left courting a fairly large chunk of consumers, the bottomline is that 165 Million Consoles sold worldwide last generation, and while Nintendo feels that going after the "boomers" and the "non-gamers" is a bigger market place it simply leaves one less player in the conventional console marketplace for Microsoft and Sony,

But with that said, its hard to question Nintendo's approach this generation.

If I were to question one thing however it would be where do they plan to go now that Zelda, Metroid, Mario, and Smash Bros have all been released or are pending release aside from Mario Kart what is the next "Franchise" title?

This all sounds like a warning more than anything. It's pretty evident that there's some room for expansion from MS and Sony this particular gen.

This definately DOESN'T say Nintendo are neglecting their roots. All it really means is they've got to put a little more effort into a casual approach.

Oh, Big T-Mac, can't you just go to a meat market and dress a large headless chicken with a costume from the party store across the street? :P

I really don't get why nitendo gets so much bs talk when it comes to courting to casuals. the PS2 totally catered to the casual crowd and thus it was such a success. the wii will be the same way. it will have its horrible shovleware (just like the ps2 had extreme amounts of) and it will have a large selection of a-aaa titles.

also just like the ps2 it will have a - aaa hardcore gaming titles that sale millions of copies and it will have its 50 cent bullet proof titless that sale millions of copies. that is just how the most popular systems life cycle goes.

...and Nintendo faces a significant shovelware conundrum, as devs continue to fail to put their best dev teams on Wii projects, opting instead to put them on PC/360/PS3 projects.

As Nintendo continues to put out AAA software in 4-6 month increments, 3rd party devs continue to put out software that can barely be given recognition as "AA", with most probably "A" or below.

So Nintendo needs to figure out how to get out of that "conondrum", where devs clearly don't take the Wii seriously. Nintendo can't be the only developer making good software for their system 2 generations in a row.

The question is... What games does the wii have to show for itself? Up until recently the wii's lineup was average (or below) at best. Most of it's titles are either ports, and or remakes.. Sure it has it's standard Franchises (ie Mario, Zelda ect..) but what else? A Majority of the titles rated on the wii are not tearing up the charts (and this is outside of Gamespot). Reggie seem's like a good guy taking pot shots at his competition simply because they are succesful. The wii IMHO has great potential but I'm not seeing a whole lot of compelling software to make me spend $$$$ on it. Kudos for the wii's sucess but give me a call when you have more than just rehashes, ports and remakes. OhSnapitz

Just Resident Evil 4. And Warioware if that kind of thing appeals to you. Everything else is really hit or miss. And the misses are usually pretty big misses. Hopefully better software will come sooner than later.

...and Nintendo faces a significant shovelware conundrum, as devs continue to fail to put their best dev teams on Wii projects, opting instead to put them on PC/360/PS3 projects.Dreams-Visions

Balance? :P

[QUOTE="Dreams-Visions"]...and Nintendo faces a significant shovelware conundrum, as devs continue to fail to put their best dev teams on Wii projects, opting instead to put them on PC/360/PS3 projects.Teh_Stevz

Balance? :P

Symmetry ;)

I don't think Nintendo dominance is good for this industry. As a hardcore gamer I'm worried that MS and Sony will try to go after the casual gamer in the future leaving the hardcore gamer behind. Money is the word for these companies unfortunately.Burnsmiesta

Do you seriously beleive that microsoft and sony have not been trying to get ahold of the casual market? They are companies that want everyones money. Of course they want the casuals. Sony last gen had them. This gen Ninty has them. You can beat your left nut Microsoft is pissed they did not get the casual market this gen.

I don't think Nintendo dominance is good for this industry. As a hardcore gamer I'm worried that MS and Sony will try to go after the casual gamer in the future leaving the hardcore gamer behind. Money is the word for these companies unfortunately.Burnsmiesta

If you count the number of hardcore games on the Wii developed by 1st party, and compare it to the number of 1st party games focused on the casual or non-gamer crowd, you'll find that there is nothing to be afraid of.

[QUOTE="0rin"][QUOTE="Zhengi"]

I think Reggie has a very good point. Sony has abandoned what made them successful the last two gens, and that is appealing to the casual gamers. MS went all in focusing on the hardcore gamers and hasn't been successful in trying to lure the casuals. They tried with Viva Pinata and that didn't do too well.

It's going to be tough for either of them to come back from this situation. Nintendo has just stolen the casual crowd and it's basically theirs to lose. Unless Nintendo does something stupid, don't expect this situation to change.

BreakingPoint8

That was then, this is now. The PS3 is cheaper now and the PS3 already has good game out now. Next year the PS3 will start to shine.

Is Nintendo only focusing on casuals? NO, They have released more major "hardcore" titles this last year then in any other time in their history.

Maybe if some of you people would actually give some of these "casual" games a chance, you'd see that the majority of them can/are alot of fun! Yeah you aren't going to sit there for 10 hours straight with them, but in short spurts they can easily be just as, if not more fun then the so-called "hardcore" games. Nintendo isn't the problem here, casuals aren't the problem, the Wii isn't the problem. The problem is you. Gamers are can be so ignorant and lazy. Expand your horizons a bit, there are great games you're missing out on.

Nintendo's right on one thing: Sony and Microsoft lose money when they make a sale, a business concept I can't comprehend. Isn't the point of a sale to make profit on the end of the seller?Video_Game_King

Sony and Microsoft both thought that they could corner the market. MS thought so by releasing and Sony thought so because of their brand name.

The razor-and-razor-blades model does NOT work for video games, unless you have a ridiculously high userbase, like the PS1 and PS2did.

traslation = we made the wii mostly for the casuals because it's a cashcow... who cares about the hardcore crowd

before you start... yes obviously sony and ms are in it for the money too...but at least they're not alienation the hardcore, but instead embracing them

again before you go off, yes nintendo has completely alienated the hardcore crowd..but com'n, any fool can see that their least interest is the hardcore crowd...they are very much alienating the ppl who made them what they are today

smg and brawl are the last 2 franchises that will ultimately decide wether i will buy a wii or not this generation

Rage010101

The ony disaster right now is the Kidtendo Wii Wii

[QUOTE="Zhengi"]

I think Reggie has a very good point. Sony has abandoned what made them successful the last two gens, and that is appealing to the casual gamers. MS went all in focusing on the hardcore gamers and hasn't been successful in trying to lure the casuals. They tried with Viva Pinata and that didn't do too well.

It's going to be tough for either of them to come back from this situation. Nintendo has just stolen the casual crowd and it's basically theirs to lose. Unless Nintendo does something stupid, don't expect this situation to change.

Shadow2k6

IMO I rather Sony and MSfocus on hardcore gamers. Nintendo pretty much sold out and screwed all their hardcore gamers by focusing way too much on casuals. Yes there are some games on the Wii that cater to hardcore gamers but compared to PS3 and 360 there isn't much.

In all seriousness if it wasn't for the hardcore gamers Nintendo wouldn't be back this time around and the gamecube would have faileda lot worst then it did.

Nintendo has released more hardcore games for the Wii than Sony has for the PS3. And since the Wii's launch, Nintendo has released about the same number of hardcore games for the Wii as MS has for the 360.