OK, so the PS4 is stronger than the XBOX ONE...

[QUOTE="AMD655"][QUOTE="CallOfDutyRulez"]

You really think pop-ins won't be fixed by the time of release?

CallOfDutyRulez

Are you willing to put your accoutn on the line?

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

 

10% reservation is based on a rumour, hence it's in my 50/50 list.

 

Without a secondary GPU, PS4 will be sharing it's GPU with the OS.

 

 

tormentos

No is not..

Caveat: this Xbox One development info was circulated by Microsoft to its partners at the beginning of this year. It may have changed, but based on what we saw this week, probably not in any major way.

1) Running: The game is loaded in memory and is fully running. The game has full access to the reserved system resources, which are six CPU cores, 90 percent of GPU processing power, and 5 GB of memory. The game is rendering full-screen and the user can interact with it.

http://kotaku.com/the-five-possible-states-of-xbox-one-games-are-strangel-509597078

No is not a rumor is a fact and MS hasn't deny this,hell the 2 core reservation had been know for a while.

The PS4 is not running a TV list on the background or Kinect,so yeah any GPU reservation for OS is unconfirmed,and even unhinted,because not a single rumor stated that the PS4 reserves 10% of the GPU for OS and system,so yeah you have no proof i have.

So yeah is 1.18 more or less vs 1.84 not 1.31.

[QUOTE="chikenfriedrice"]The PS3 is more powerful than the 360 ProjectPat187

On basic add/mul FLOPS, PS3 > Xbox 360. Extracting the FLOPS from PS3 has some large caveats.

Basic add/mul FLOPS comparisons wouldn't cover complex math functions or GPU fix function features.

[QUOTE="AMD655"][QUOTE="CallOfDutyRulez"]

You really think pop-ins won't be fixed by the time of release?

CallOfDutyRulez

Are you willing to put your accoutn on the line?

:lol: TLHBO, srs what moron buys a console that's more expensive and weaker? Suppaman100

So, everyone who pre-ordered an XB1 is a "moron"?

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

I disagree. Publishers aren't going to release XB1 games that have a 15 FPS frame rate. I bet that PS4 games will run at 37 and XB1 will run at 30.

Game developers will code, as they always have, to the lowest common denominator. Bestg bet, you will have a few sharper textures every now and again, and PS4 exclusives will have a tiny bit of "you couldn't do this at 30FPS on an XB1!" boasting, but that is about it.

We'll see who is correct here as time goes on.

tormentos

Exactly so to make the games on par the xbox one version most be sub 1080p have lower quality drop AA or a combination of several.

There will be a point where PS4 games that are coming from PC will demand allot,the PS4 will be push to the limit just like Crysis 3 on consoles puched the console to the limits,and several other games.

There is no way around this the xbox one version will suffer for having less resources.

The fact that PC GPU out there are a testament to what will happen says it all,to run crysis on 1080p on the 7770 as fast as the 7850 you need to drop either resolution or details this is a fact.

See, there you go again...

Who says that they have to " sub 1080p have lower quality drop AA or a combination of several"? The PS4 isn't that much more powerful. All the "better" specs of the PS4 will give you is mostlikely a coupe frames per second. You are overstating the hardware advantage.

[QUOTE="Tighaman"]

why is that not happening now? Why the games they are showing dont look noticeably better since its so powerful it should show that out the gate

tormentos

Nothing on xbox one touch Infamous nothing,oh and is open world not like Ryse,in fact the closes games in openess is DR3 and is not even close.

And no launch games hardly ever show anything even if the console is easy and powerful the xbox 360 is a testament to that,most of what you get on launch are rushed games.

And now, rationality leaves Tormentos, in favor of incessant mooing...

[QUOTE="ShoTTyMcNaDeS"]Well, on paper and in theory anyway. So, if Sony's new console is indeed head and shoulders above the X1 is its capabilities, when exactly will we see actual evidence of this supposed "graphical and processing superiority"??dbtbandit67

 fam you can keep making that excuse if you want to and infamous a pop in feast for a game that suppose to show the power right and its not even a launch title 1stQ of 2014? And im sorry but kameo, the first saints row, condemned, and nba 2k looked great on my tv.

Tighaman

:lol:  pop in fest..

At least it doesn't run at 14 FPS like DR3 does,and to think Infamous look CG like...:lol:

All those 360 games were garbage compare to how Gears of war looked...

So was Resistance vs Uncharted 1.

So yeah most of what you will get is rush games.

I'm aware of the kotaku's info. Has MS confirm's kotaku's info?ronvalencia

Have they deny it.? No ...Ok.

Oh and the info from kotaku was given by MS it self,it wasn't leaked.

 

See, there you go again...

Who says that they have to " sub 1080p have lower quality drop AA or a combination of several"? The PS4 isn't that much more powerful. All the "better" specs of the PS4 will give you is mostlikely a coupe frames per second. You are overstating the hardware advantage.

StormyJoe

WTF dude stop ignoring facts.

700Gflops is enough to have 20 FPS advantage on PS4 at the same resolution or more.:?

The 7850 has 1.76 TF the 7770 has 1.28 TF the difference between the 2 is 480 Gflops and look what difference it creates.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/549?vs=536

BF3 the difference is from 15 FPS on 1920x1200 to 18FPS in 1680x1050,look how the 7770 gos from 34 to 43 by just lowering resolution.

Look at Metro 14 PFS more on 1920x1200 but if the resolution is 1680x1050 the 7770 gain 20 FPS more and rise to 44FPS.

That is on a 480 Gflop difference,imagin how much bigger a 700Gflop or even 600 Gflops one will be.

Stop ignoring facts,i say is not night to day,but the difference is very mark and could be as high as 20FPS if not more.

[QUOTE="Tighaman"]

 fam you can keep making that excuse if you want to and infamous a pop in feast for a game that suppose to show the power right and its not even a launch title 1stQ of 2014? And im sorry but kameo, the first saints row, condemned, and nba 2k looked great on my tv.

tormentos

:lol:  pop in fest..

At least it doesn't run at 14 FPS like DR3 does,and to think Infamous look CG like...:lol:

All those 360 games were garbage compare to how Gears of war looked...

So was Resistance vs Uncharted 1.

So yeah most of what you will get is rush games.

[QUOTE="tormentos"]

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

I disagree. Publishers aren't going to release XB1 games that have a 15 FPS frame rate. I bet that PS4 games will run at 37 and XB1 will run at 30.

Game developers will code, as they always have, to the lowest common denominator. Bestg bet, you will have a few sharper textures every now and again, and PS4 exclusives will have a tiny bit of "you couldn't do this at 30FPS on an XB1!" boasting, but that is about it.

We'll see who is correct here as time goes on.

StormyJoe

Exactly so to make the games on par the xbox one version most be sub 1080p have lower quality drop AA or a combination of several.

There will be a point where PS4 games that are coming from PC will demand allot,the PS4 will be push to the limit just like Crysis 3 on consoles puched the console to the limits,and several other games.

There is no way around this the xbox one version will suffer for having less resources.

The fact that PC GPU out there are a testament to what will happen says it all,to run crysis on 1080p on the 7770 as fast as the 7850 you need to drop either resolution or details this is a fact.

See, there you go again...

Who says that they have to " sub 1080p have lower quality drop AA or a combination of several"? The PS4 isn't that much more powerful. All the "better" specs of the PS4 will give you is mostlikely a coupe frames per second. You are overstating the hardware advantage.

 

And now, rationality leaves Tormentos, in favor of incessant mooing...

 

 

StormyJoe

Compare it to Dead Rising 3 which doesn't look even close as good while it runs at a horrible frame rate with deeps as low as 15FPS.

The only game that look really next gen is Ryse and is a QTE fest with bland environments and fog every where,compare what your beloved DF say about both games..

Infamous they call jaw dropping and CG like,and Ryse...mmmmm not so impressive.

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

See, there you go again...

Who says that they have to " sub 1080p have lower quality drop AA or a combination of several"? The PS4 isn't that much more powerful. All the "better" specs of the PS4 will give you is mostlikely a coupe frames per second. You are overstating the hardware advantage.

tormentos

WTF dude stop ignoring facts.

700Gflops is enough to have 20 FPS advantage on PS4 at the same resolution or more.:?

The 7850 has 1.76 TF the 7770 has 1.28 TF the difference between the 2 is 480 Gflops and look what difference it creates.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/549?vs=536

BF3 the difference is from 15 FPS on 1920x1200 to 18FPS in 1680x1050,look how the 7770 gos from 34 to 43 by just lowering resolution.

Look at Metro 14 PFS more on 1920x1200 but if the resolution is 1680x1050 the 7770 gain 20 FPS more and rise to 44FPS.

That is on a 480 Gflop difference,imagin how much bigger a 700Gflop or even 600 Gflops one will be.

Stop ignoring facts,i say is not night to day,but the difference is very mark and could be as high as 20FPS if not more.

7770 will not reflect X1's GCN configuration i.e. different memory bandwidth and triangle rate.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-can-xbox-one-multi-platform-games-compete-with-ps4

Metro: Last Light, High,

X1: 25 fps

PS4: 30.0 fps

Lesser GCNs has less SRAM based storage and any overspill may fallback to external memory.

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

[QUOTE="ShoTTyMcNaDeS"]Well, on paper and in theory anyway. So, if Sony's new console is indeed head and shoulders above the X1 is its capabilities, when exactly will we see actual evidence of this supposed "graphical and processing superiority"??tormentos

You won't. The PS4 performance advantage over the XB1 is rather small. To see a discernible difference, the PS4 whould have to be multiple times more powerful than XB1, instead of 20-30%.

And yes, it is 20-30%, not 50%, cows...

700Gflosp small.?

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/549?vs=536

A lesser gap in flops is actually capable of delivering this kind of difference.

1.28Tf vs 1.76TF

1.28 TF is actually more than the usable power the xbox one has which is like 1.18,and 1.76TF is actually less power than the PS4 GPU has which is 1.84,how can people pretend is nothing is beyond logic,the PS4 should be faster in all scenarios,that means the more the graphics are push the more likely that the PS4 is able to hold at least 30 FPS while the xbox one will lag behind with like 20 or lower,so in order to keep those 30FPS the xbox one version will have to give up resolution for frames so yeah sub 1080p or drop AA or lower details there is no scaping it.

7770 configuration doesn't match X1 e.g. memory bandwidth difference.

TFLOPS alone doesn't tell the whole story.

 no feast like I said lol and you think infamous game play looked CG? :lol: sometimes I be thinking torm got a little sense then you make a statement like that and erase the little hope I have for you.

Tighaman

At a confirmed 1080p resolution as well, Sucker Punch's latest is the most polished and CGI-like title on display. It looks gorgeous in play.

 

"It takes a seriously impressive game to make jaws drop at Digital Foundry - Sucker Punch's latest was the biggest surprise for us."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-hands-on-with-playstation-4

"There is some promise in Crytek's Ryse, but while impressive in some regards, the five minute demo we played didn't exactly blow us away."

Ryse ^^

"Most of the fun and mischief of the previous games is gone, making Dead Rising 3 feel rather dark and sombre. Its current performance level is very disappointing."

Dead Rising 3 has a few issues with streaming the environmental elements quickly: one particular scene has us driving full-pelt through a zombie-infested cemetery in a hearse, where a gazebo suddenly pops in only a few metres away.

In terms of performance, it's pretty rough game to behold. There's tearing all across the screen, even during menus. Mowing multiple enemies down with a vehicle results in circa 15FPS performance as well - so let's assume the target is 30FPS here. Also, reflections on windows and the checkered floors around cafes update at half the usual frame-rate, which makes the presentation look incredibly choppy

DR3 ^^

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-hands-on-with-xbox-one

Like i already told you most of what you get on launch are rush games,not everything is peaches and cream on xbox land,and the closes game in open ness to Infamous,is DR3 and look worse,has pop in to and runs as low as 15 FPS.

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

[QUOTE="tormentos"]

Exactly so to make the games on par the xbox one version most be sub 1080p have lower quality drop AA or a combination of several.

There will be a point where PS4 games that are coming from PC will demand allot,the PS4 will be push to the limit just like Crysis 3 on consoles puched the console to the limits,and several other games.

There is no way around this the xbox one version will suffer for having less resources.

The fact that PC GPU out there are a testament to what will happen says it all,to run crysis on 1080p on the 7770 as fast as the 7850 you need to drop either resolution or details this is a fact.

btk2k2

See, there you go again...

Who says that they have to " sub 1080p have lower quality drop AA or a combination of several"? The PS4 isn't that much more powerful. All the "better" specs of the PS4 will give you is mostlikely a coupe frames per second. You are overstating the hardware advantage.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"] I'm aware of the kotaku's info. Has MS confirm's kotaku's info?tormentos

Have they deny it.? No ...Ok.

Oh and the info from kotaku was given by MS it self,it wasn't leaked.

Have they confirmed it? no ... Ok.

http://kotaku.com/the-five-possible-states-of-xbox-one-games-are-strangel-509597078

 

7770 configuration doesn't match X1 e.g. memory bandwidth difference.

 

TFLOPS alone doesn't tell the whole story.

ronvalencia

Memory bandwidth mean sh** when the xbox one usable power is 1.18 TF actually lower than the 7770,so while you may argue the 7770 doesn't match the memory bandwidth of the xbox one,the xbox one doesn't match the flop performance of the 7770 either.

I have this argument 100 times with you,AMD doesn't gimp their GPU on purpose bandwidth wise they have bandwidth relevant to their performance,and mind you that ATI main market is the PC so no i don't think AMD will cripple performance on their own GPU by giving them not enough bandwidth to work with.

Remember the xbox one bandiwdth is shared,on PC teh CPU has its own bandwidth and the GPU its own as well.

Have they confirmed it? no ... Ok.ronvalencia

Kotaku confirm it and they stated clearly that it came from MS it self...:lol:

I have a link you have nothing i won,be a damn man and admit you loss,the GPU has 10% reservation that on PS4 is non existent by any links.

Caveat: this Xbox One development info was circulated by Microsoft to its partners at the beginning of this year. It may have changed, but based on what we saw this week, probably not in any major way.

You are a very selective reader ...:lol:

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

See, there you go again...

Who says that they have to " sub 1080p have lower quality drop AA or a combination of several"? The PS4 isn't that much more powerful. All the "better" specs of the PS4 will give you is mostlikely a coupe frames per second. You are overstating the hardware advantage.

tormentos

WTF dude stop ignoring facts.

700Gflops is enough to have 20 FPS advantage on PS4 at the same resolution or more.:?

The 7850 has 1.76 TF the 7770 has 1.28 TF the difference between the 2 is 480 Gflops and look what difference it creates.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/549?vs=536

BF3 the difference is from 15 FPS on 1920x1200 to 18FPS in 1680x1050,look how the 7770 gos from 34 to 43 by just lowering resolution.

Look at Metro 14 PFS more on 1920x1200 but if the resolution is 1680x1050 the 7770 gain 20 FPS more and rise to 44FPS.

That is on a 480 Gflop difference,imagin how much bigger a 700Gflop or even 600 Gflops one will be.

Stop ignoring facts,i say is not night to day,but the difference is very mark and could be as high as 20FPS if not more.

I am not ignoring the facts. You are overstating their significance. I work with PCs all the time. One PC being 20% mroe powerful than another, when the number of FLOPS is as high as as they are with the PS4 and XB1, doesn't amount to very much. That's the fact of the matter. If we were talking 480GFLOPS to 900GFLOPS, the difference would be more significant because the percentage increase is a lot higher.

It's the same with everyting else. Is there a big difference between a 140 HP engine and a 200 HP engine? Yes. Is the difference as significant when the same HP difference is applied to a 350HP engine vs a 410HP engine? Not in the least.

You are overstating the performance difference, and contradicting what every single developement studio who is working with both platforms has said.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

7770 configuration doesn't match X1 e.g. memory bandwidth difference.

TFLOPS alone doesn't tell the whole story.

tormentos

Memory bandwidth mean sh**(1) when the xbox one usable power is 1.18 TF actually lower than the 7770,so while you may argue the 7770 doesn't match the memory bandwidth of the xbox one,the xbox one doesn't match the flop performance of the 7770 either.

I have this argument 100 times with you,AMD doesn't gimp their GPU on purpose bandwidth(1) wise they have bandwidth relevant to their performance,and mind you that ATI main market is the PC so no i don't think AMD will cripple performance on their own GPU by giving them not enough bandwidth to work with.

Remember the xbox one bandiwdth is shared,on PC teh CPU has its own bandwidth and the GPU its own as well.

1. ALUs doesn't operate in isolation especially with lesser GCNs with less on-chip SRAM storage. 7790 has comparable FLOPS as 7850 but with less memory bandwidth(96GB/s vs 153.6 GB/s) which this in turn gimps the ROPs, which results less performance scaling.

 

I am not ignoring the facts. You are overstating their significance. I work with PCs all the time. One PC being 20% mroe powerful than another, when the number of FLOPS is as high as as they are with the PS4 and XB1, doesn't amount to very much. That's the fact of the matter. If we were talking 480GFLOPS to 900GFLOPS, the difference would be more significant because the percentage increase is a lot higher.

It's the same with everyting else. Is there a big difference between a 140 HP engine and a 200 HP engine? Yes. Is the difference as significant when the same HP difference is applied to a 350HP engine vs a 410HP engine? Not in the least.

You are overstating the performance difference, and contradicting what every single developement studio who is working with both platforms has said.

 

StormyJoe

Yes you are.

No i am not and i used links with benchmarks shwoing how much performance can impact frames,a 480Gflops is enough to produce a game as big as 20FPS in some games and some resolution,a higher than that difference would show even bigger difference.

That whole car analogy is a joke,the xbox one can run at a top speed of 118 mph,the PS4 at 184 MPH oh the difference would be feel.

Using develping studios is a joke non will come out and say openly this console is more powerful and get flames from sony or MS.

But Ubisoft did talk about how they could not do anything that was to PS4 in special because of the game been multiplatform,so take that as you like because the game would come on PC,PS4 and xbox one,so if any console will suffer from having to run a game made for the PS4 spec it would be the xbox one,since PC GPU can match it and surpass it.

 

1. ALUs doesn't operate in isolation especially with lesser GCNs with less on-chip SRAM storage. 7790 has comparable FLOPS as 7850 but with less memory bandwidth(96GB/s vs 153.6 GB/s) which this in turn gimps the ROPs, which results less performance scaling.

 

ronvalencia

Oh please stop your lame ass arguments,AMD does not gimp their GPU bandwidth wise period that is a fact,unless you want to pretend now to know more about GPU than AMD does.

Bandwidth is relative to performance.

The 7790 has up to 102GB/s and still under performs vs the 7850 while having probably 1.80TF or more,Bonaire doesn't scale that good is the only GPU with more flops yet lesser performance,oh an i am not briging the OC 7850 into account,the OC 7850 has more power yet it has the same bandwidth 153Gb/s.

That 7790 on xbox one is gimped,has lower clock speed and 2 fewer CU anable,so yeah it doesn't even need 96Gb's to begin with and even Anandtech agree with me on this,when they say that the xbox one even if it doesn't match the PS4 bandwidth it woudl not be need it,because it has fewer resources to in the first place,fewer rerources less bandwidth need it,is the reason the 7870 doesn't have 7950 Bandwidth.

 

7770 will not reflect X1's GCN configuration i.e. different memory bandwidth and triangle rate.

 

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-can-xbox-one-multi-platform-games-compete-with-ps4

Metro: Last Light, High,

X1: 25 fps

PS4: 30.0 fps

 

Lesser GCNs has less SRAM based storage and any overspill may fallback to external memory.

ronvalencia

That article was a damn encargo article by MS is a pay job,in fact it was basically dismiss as flame bait in neogaf and basically ignore,DF should not do encargo articles,i take Anandtech words on this matter.

When you prove to me that the xbox one has a dam n Pitcairn inside then you will have a point,else that is a useless article done using under clocked GPU with way higher CU than the actual GPU will use,and completely ignoreing the advantages the PS4 has.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

1. ALUs doesn't operate in isolation especially with lesser GCNs with less on-chip SRAM storage. 7790 has comparable FLOPS as 7850 but with less memory bandwidth(96GB/s vs 153.6 GB/s) which this in turn gimps the ROPs, which results less performance scaling.

tormentos

Oh please stop your lame ass arguments,AMD does not gimp their GPU bandwidth wise period that is a fact,unless you want to pretend now to know more about GPU than AMD does.

Bandwidth is relative to performance.

The 7790 has up to 102GB/s and still under performs vs the 7850 while having probably 1.80TF or more,Bonaire doesn't scale that good is the only GPU with more flops yet lesser performance,oh an i am not briging the OC 7850 into account,the OC 7850 has more power yet it has the same bandwidth 153Gb/s.

That 7790 on xbox one is gimped,has lower clock speed and 2 fewer CU anable,so yeah it doesn't even need 96Gb's to begin with and even Anandtech agree with me on this,when they say that the xbox one even if it doesn't match the PS4 bandwidth it woudl not be need it,because it has fewer resources to in the first place,fewer rerources less bandwidth need it,is the reason the 7870 doesn't have 7950 Bandwidth.

I have already debunked your claims on 7970 being crippled by DDR3 level speeds with a real life results and told you the reasons for it i.e. large on-chip SRAM storage.

"AMD doesn't gimp their GPU on purpose bandwidth(1) wise" doesn't fly with 8870M's update against 7870M i.e. AMD increase the memory speed, renames the model number and call it a day.

You will see current GCN designs will be renamed and updated as part of low-mid Radeon HD 9xxx series e.g. GDDR5-7000.

The lame ass arguments are yours.

ugh, why do you people keep feeding this idiot? he's obviously desperate for the PS4 to be more powerful, which it is, so he's obviously going to spend the next couple of years posting the exact same flop numbers and celebrating every time there's any indication the Xbone is less powerful, there's nothing you can do about it, so just let him indulge in his pointless obsession on his own. He really doesnt need any help.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

7770 will not reflect X1's GCN configuration i.e. different memory bandwidth and triangle rate.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-can-xbox-one-multi-platform-games-compete-with-ps4

Metro: Last Light, High,

X1: 25 fps

PS4: 30.0 fps

Lesser GCNs has less SRAM based storage and any overspill may fallback to external memory.

tormentos

That article was a damn encargo article by MS is a pay job,in fact it was basically dismiss as flame bait in neogaf and basically ignore,DF should not do encargo articles,i take Anandtech words on this matter.

When you prove to me that the xbox one has a dam n Pitcairn inside then you will have a point,else that is a useless article done using under clocked GPU with way higher CU than the actual GPU will use,and completely ignoreing the advantages the PS4 has.

You still looking at this issue as politics not as hardware. Anandtech didn't attempt to match console's memory configurations.

As for MS's paid article claims, any PC owner with DF's mentioned cards can replicate the results.

7870 XT = 24 CU @ 600 Mhz = 1.843 TFLOPS ~= PS4

7850 = 16 CU @ 600Mhz = 1.228 TFLOPS ~= X1 (DF knows X1's ROPS didn't stop at 7790's 96GB/s)

The codenames are immaterial since building blocks are the same.

 

I have already debunked your claims on 7970 being crippled by DDR3 level speeds with a real life results and told you the reasons for it i.e. large on-chip SRAM storage.

"AMD doesn't gimp their GPU on purpose bandwidth(1) wise" doesn't fly with 8870M's update against 7870M i.e. AMD increase the memory speed, renames the model number and call it a day.

You will see current GCN designs will be renamed and updated as part of low-mid Radeon HD 9xxx series e.g. GDDR5-7000.

The lame ass arguments are yours.

 

ronvalencia

No all you did was use irrelevant arguments this are the facts..

7790 = 1.79TF 14 CU 1ghz

xbox one = 1.31 TF 12 CU 853mhz.

This is a FACT not my opinion the xbox one doesn't need as much bandwidth as the 7790 period.

Oh and i forgot to trow away again that is 1.18 usable so yeah that is under 7700 performance which has 72Gb/s bandwidth.

DEAL with it..:cool:

 

You still looking at this issue as politics not as hardware. Anandtech didn't attempt to match console's memory configurations.

As for MS's paid article claims, any PC owner with DF's mentioned cards can replicate the results.

 

 

7870 XT = 24 CU @ 600 Mhz = 1.843 TFLOPS ~= PS4

7850 = 16 CU @ 600Mhz = 1.228 TFLOPS ~= X1 (DF knows X1's ROPS didn't stop at 7790's 96GB/s)

 

The codenames are immaterial since building blocks are the same.

ronvalencia

At a confirmed 1080p resolution as well, Sucker Punch's latest is the most polished and CGI-like title on display. It looks gorgeous in play.

 

"It takes a seriously impressive game to make jaws drop at Digital Foundry - Sucker Punch's latest was the biggest surprise for us."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-hands-on-with-playstation-4

"Most of the fun and mischief of the previous games is gone, making Dead Rising 3 feel rather dark and sombre. Its current performance level is very disappointing."

Dead Rising 3 has a few issues with streaming the environmental elements quickly: one particular scene has us driving full-pelt through a zombie-infested cemetery in a hearse, where a gazebo suddenly pops in only a few metres away.

In terms of performance, it's pretty rough game to behold. There's tearing all across the screen, even during menus. Mowing multiple enemies down with a vehicle results in circa 15FPS performance as well - so let's assume the target is 30FPS here. Also, reflections on windows and the checkered floors around cafes update at half the usual frame-rate, which makes the presentation look incredibly choppy

DR3 ^^

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-hands-on-with-xbox-one

While you hold tied to your fantasy land theories this is what really happe,Infamous getting loved by a site that does anti PS4 articles,while Dead Rising is flamed for been a total mess.

Both games open world one look much better and the other is a total let down while looking worst.

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"][QUOTE="btk2k2"]He is not really overstating the advantage. Here are the potential scenarios that will occur for multiplatform games. 1) Game is not taxing and both PS4 and Xbox 1 run at the same locked framerate with the same GFX quality. 2) Game drops frames on Xbox 1 but is rock solid stable on the PS4 3) Game is scaled for each console so the PS4 has a GFX quality advantage, this will vary based on the devs preferences from comparable framerate with a larger GFX disparity to rock solid framerate on PS4 with a smaller GFX disparity. I would say 2 is the most likely outcome for the early multiplatform games with it moving more towards 3 as the generation continues. The question is how will that GFX quality difference manifest? The answer will depend on each dev and could include a number of things, some more noticeable than others. btk2k2

DF has attempt to match the console's shader power via 600Mhz 7870 XT and 7850. DF has negated the triangle rate difference between the two boxes.

7770's 1.28 TFLOPS was based on 10 CUs @ 1Ghz which doesn't match X1's 12 CU@ 853Mhz anyway.

From www.tomshardware.com/reviews/768-shader-pitcairn-review,3196-5.html

12 CU @ 860Mhz 7850/7830 prototype is the closest to X1's 12 CU @ 853Mhz. i.e. matches in register file, L1 cache, local data storage, TMUs/load store, scalar cache, branch units and 'etc'.

My posts are framed with the following dev quotes.

http://www.videogamer.com/news/xbox_one_and_ps4_have_no_advantage_over_the_other_says_redlynx.html

Speaking to VideoGamer.com at E3, Ilvessuo said: " Obviously we have been developing this game for a while and you can see the comparisons. I would say if you know how to use the platform they are both very powerful. I don't see a benefit over the other with any of the consoles."

----

http://www.videogamer.com/xboxone/metal_gear_solid_5_the_phantom_pain/news/ps4_and_xbox_one_power_difference_is_minimal_says_kojima.html

"The difference is small, and I don't really need to worry about it," he said, suggesting versions for Xbox One and PS4 won't be dramatically different.

----

http://gamingbolt.com/ubisoft-explains-the-difference-between-ps4-and-xbox-one-versions-of-watch_dogs

"Of course, the Xbox One isnt to be counted out. We asked Guay how the Xbox One version of Watch_Dogs would be different compared to the PC and PS4 versions of the game, to which he replied that, The Xbox One is a powerful platform, as of now we do not foresee a major difference in on screen result between the PS4 and the Xbox One. Obviously since we are still working on pushing the game on these new consoles, we are still doing R&D."

----

link

"We're still very much in the R&D period, that's what I call it, because the hardware is still new," Guay answered. "It's obvious to us that its going to take a little while before we can get to the full power of those machines and harness everything. But, even now we realise that both of them have comparable power, and for us thats good, but everyday it changes almost. Were pushing it and were going to continue doing that until [Watch Dogs] ship date."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/df-hardware-spec-analysis-durango-vs-orbis

"Other information has also come to light offering up a further Orbis advantage: the Sony hardware has a surprisingly large 32 ROPs (Render Output units) up against 16 on Durango. ROPs translate pixel and texel values into the final image sent to the display: on a very rough level, the more ROPs you have, the higher the resolution you can address (hardware anti-aliasing capability is also tied into the ROPs).16 ROPs is sufficient to maintain 1080p, 32 comes across as overkill, but it could be useful for addressing stereoscopic 1080p for instance, or even 4K. However, our sources suggest that Orbis is designed principally for displays with a maximum 1080p resolution."

http://www.polygon.com/2013/8/1/4580380/carmack-on-next-gen-console-hardware-very-close-very-good

Carmack on next-gen console hardware: 'very close,' 'very good'

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

I have already debunked your claims on 7970 being crippled by DDR3 level speeds with a real life results and told you the reasons for it i.e. large on-chip SRAM storage.

"AMD doesn't gimp their GPU on purpose bandwidth(1) wise" doesn't fly with 8870M's update against 7870M i.e. AMD increase the memory speed, renames the model number and call it a day.

You will see current GCN designs will be renamed and updated as part of low-mid Radeon HD 9xxx series e.g. GDDR5-7000.

The lame ass arguments are yours.

tormentos

No all you did was use irrelevant arguments this are the facts..

7790 = 1.79TF 14 CU 1ghz

xbox one = 1.31 TF 12 CU 853mhz.

This is a FACT not my opinion the xbox one doesn't need as much bandwidth as the 7790 period.

Oh and i forgot to trow away again that is 1.18 usable so yeah that is under 7700 performance which has 72Gb/s bandwidth.

DEAL with it..:cool:

No , you made a claim and it was debunked. Deal with it.

Call me when 7790 has GDDR5-9000 or GDDR6-9000.

At launch, nextsilversix_

DF has attempt to match the console's shader power via 600Mhz 7870 XT and 7850. DF has negated the triangle rate difference between the two boxes.

7770's 1.28 TFLOPS was based on 10 CUs @ 1Ghz which doesn't match X1's 12 CU@ 853Mhz anyway.

From www.tomshardware.com/reviews/768-shader-pitcairn-review,3196-5.html

12 CU @ 860Mhz 7850/7830 prototype is the closest to X1's 12 CU @ 853Mhz.

My posts are framed with the following dev quotes.

http://www.videogamer.com/news/xbox_one_and_ps4_have_no_advantage_over_the_other_says_redlynx.html

Speaking to VideoGamer.com at E3, Ilvessuo said: " Obviously we have been developing this game for a while and you can see the comparisons. I would say if you know how to use the platform they are both very powerful. I don't see a benefit over the other with any of the consoles."

----

http://www.videogamer.com/xboxone/metal_gear_solid_5_the_phantom_pain/news/ps4_and_xbox_one_power_difference_is_minimal_says_kojima.html

"The difference is small, and I don't really need to worry about it," he said, suggesting versions for Xbox One and PS4 won't be dramatically different.

----

http://gamingbolt.com/ubisoft-explains-the-difference-between-ps4-and-xbox-one-versions-of-watch_dogs

"Of course, the Xbox One isnt to be counted out. We asked Guay how the Xbox One version of Watch_Dogs would be different compared to the PC and PS4 versions of the game, to which he replied that, The Xbox One is a powerful platform, as of now we do not foresee a major difference in on screen result between the PS4 and the Xbox One. Obviously since we are still working on pushing the game on these new consoles, we are still doing R&D."

----

link

"We're still very much in the R&D period, that's what I call it, because the hardware is still new," Guay answered. "It's obvious to us that its going to take a little while before we can get to the full power of those machines and harness everything. But, even now we realise that both of them have comparable power, and for us thats good, but everyday it changes almost. Were pushing it and were going to continue doing that until [Watch Dogs] ship date."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/df-hardware-spec-analysis-durango-vs-orbis

"Other information has also come to light offering up a further Orbis advantage: the Sony hardware has a surprisingly large 32 ROPs (Render Output units) up against 16 on Durango. ROPs translate pixel and texel values into the final image sent to the display: on a very rough level, the more ROPs you have, the higher the resolution you can address (hardware anti-aliasing capability is also tied into the ROPs).16 ROPs is sufficient to maintain 1080p, 32 comes across as overkill, but it could be useful for addressing stereoscopic 1080p for instance, or even 4K. However, our sources suggest that Orbis is designed principally for displays with a maximum 1080p resolution."

http://www.polygon.com/2013/8/1/4580380/carmack-on-next-gen-console-hardware-very-close-very-good

Carmack on next-gen console hardware: 'very close,' 'very good'

ronvalencia

 

DF has attempt to match the console's shader power via 600Mhz 7870 XT and 7850. DF has negated the triangle rate difference between the two boxes.

7770's 1.28 TFLOPS was based on 10 CUs @ 1Ghz which doesn't match X1's 12 CU@ 853Mhz anyway.

 

 

 

From www.tomshardware.com/reviews/768-shader-pitcairn-review,3196-5.html

12 CU @ 860Mhz 7850/7830 prototype is the closest to X1's 12 CU @ 853Mhz.

 

 

 

My posts are framed with the following dev quotes.

 

 

 

ronvalencia

And here we go again.

Wait wasn't you the one who claimed the 7850 @ 900 = the PS4 18 CU.?

But now you claim that 10CU at 1ghz doesn't = 12CU at 853mhz.

But wait are you again forgetting the 10% GPU reserve.? Oh yeah you are.. so even if the 12CU at 853 mhz are a tap higher i say a tap because the 7770 is 1280Gflops and the xbox one 1310gflops what are we talking here about 30,000 flops difference which is basically nothing,the xbox one can only use 1180 Gflops,and the 7770 actually has more flops performance in the end.

The xbox one doesn't have a Pitcairn it has a bonairne and every site knows it,the fact that you refuse to admit it says it all,and you still holding on tied to Pitcairn inside the xbox one,you are assuming and like always i want a lint to where it is confirm that the xbox one has a Pitcairn GPU inside.

There is also a pixel fillrate difference to take into account as well so if you shave off some performance of the card in that article and add a bit to the 7850 then you are basically there. -5% to the 768 pitcairn sample and +5% to the 7850 and you get 33 FPS vs 43 FPS in Crysis 2 and you get 44 FPS vs 57 FPS in BF3. A bit less than my predicted difference but close enough considering the amount of known unknowns we have regarding important performance factors on the X1. In the end though it means that games that push the X1 will be prettier and/or smoother on PS4.btk2k2

Ronvalencia will not admit it even if AMD came slap him in the face and tell him that Bonaire is inside the xbox one and not Pitciarn,he also once used to say that the xbox one had a Volcanic Island GPU inside,based all on chips size...:lol:

He want to use Pitcairn because he knows Bonaire doesn't fare as well scalling,it has 1.79TF yet get beaten by the 7850 with 1.76 TF,but Bonaire has 14 CU at 1ghz while Pitcairn has 16 at 860mhz.

So he want to pretend that because there is a samble GPU out there that is 768Sp and 12 CU from pitcairn out there,that it means that Pitcairn most be the xbox one GPU,but he has nothing to back it up but his opinion.

The the most fun part is how he actually use the difference between sample GPU vs the 7850 as gospel,completely ignoring that the PS4 does has a Pitcairn with 18CU and 1.84 TF actually higher than the 7850.

Anything that favor the PS4 he ommits it,but he will bring some theories oh brother,ESRAM and move engines with more bandwidth will actually make the gimped bonaire inside actually match the 7790 and surpass it,some how those components will add 500Fglosp more i don't know from where to close the gap.

 

No , you made a claim and it was debunked. Deal with it.

 

Call me when 7790 has GDDR5-9000 or GDDR6-9000.

ronvalencia

Call me when the xbox one has more than 1.18 TF usable.. As of now is even lower in flops than then 7770..:lol:

But but Bandwidth maybe AMD should contract you,since you have theories on how magical bandwidth can increase flops,but i think it will not serve AMD much since it only works when is done on a MS console,you know since the PS4 has also superior to 7870 bandwidth but some how is theorical and useless in your eyes..:lol:

[QUOTE="btk2k2"][QUOTE="ronvalencia"] His misapplying 7770 on X1.ronvalencia

DF has attempt to match the console's shader power via 600Mhz 7870 XT and 7850. DF has negated the triangle rate difference between the two boxes.

7770's 1.28 TFLOPS was based on 10 CUs @ 1Ghz which doesn't match X1's 12 CU@ 853Mhz anyway.

From www.tomshardware.com/reviews/768-shader-pitcairn-review,3196-5.html

12 CU @ 860Mhz 7850/7830 prototype is the closest to X1's 12 CU @ 853Mhz. i.e. matches in register file, L1 cache, local data storage, TMUs/load store, scalar cache, branch units and 'etc'.

My posts are framed with the following dev quotes.

http://www.videogamer.com/news/xbox_one_and_ps4_have_no_advantage_over_the_other_says_redlynx.html

Speaking to VideoGamer.com at E3, Ilvessuo said: " Obviously we have been developing this game for a while and you can see the comparisons. I would say if you know how to use the platform they are both very powerful. I don't see a benefit over the other with any of the consoles."

----

http://www.videogamer.com/xboxone/metal_gear_solid_5_the_phantom_pain/news/ps4_and_xbox_one_power_difference_is_minimal_says_kojima.html

"The difference is small, and I don't really need to worry about it," he said, suggesting versions for Xbox One and PS4 won't be dramatically different.

----

http://gamingbolt.com/ubisoft-explains-the-difference-between-ps4-and-xbox-one-versions-of-watch_dogs

"Of course, the Xbox One isnt to be counted out. We asked Guay how the Xbox One version of Watch_Dogs would be different compared to the PC and PS4 versions of the game, to which he replied that, The Xbox One is a powerful platform, as of now we do not foresee a major difference in on screen result between the PS4 and the Xbox One. Obviously since we are still working on pushing the game on these new consoles, we are still doing R&D."

----

link

"We're still very much in the R&D period, that's what I call it, because the hardware is still new," Guay answered. "It's obvious to us that its going to take a little while before we can get to the full power of those machines and harness everything. But, even now we realise that both of them have comparable power, and for us thats good, but everyday it changes almost. Were pushing it and were going to continue doing that until [Watch Dogs] ship date."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/df-hardware-spec-analysis-durango-vs-orbis

"Other information has also come to light offering up a further Orbis advantage: the Sony hardware has a surprisingly large 32 ROPs (Render Output units) up against 16 on Durango. ROPs translate pixel and texel values into the final image sent to the display: on a very rough level, the more ROPs you have, the higher the resolution you can address (hardware anti-aliasing capability is also tied into the ROPs).16 ROPs is sufficient to maintain 1080p, 32 comes across as overkill, but it could be useful for addressing stereoscopic 1080p for instance, or even 4K. However, our sources suggest that Orbis is designed principally for displays with a maximum 1080p resolution."

http://www.polygon.com/2013/8/1/4580380/carmack-on-next-gen-console-hardware-very-close-very-good

Carmack on next-gen console hardware: 'very close,' 'very good'

THANK YOU!!!!

I am so sick of Sony fanboys (and I am talking directly at Tormentos right now) talking out of their arses about how "better" PS4 games are going to be than XB1 games because they look at some raw statistics and all of a sudden are expert game developers.

I re-iterate what the real experts say, and cows debate me as arm-chair game developers. :roll:

[QUOTE="ronvalencia"]

No , you made a claim and it was debunked. Deal with it.

Call me when 7790 has GDDR5-9000 or GDDR6-9000.

tormentos

Call me when the xbox one has more than 1.18 TF usable.. As of now is even lower in flops than then 7770..:lol:

But but Bandwidth maybe AMD should contract you,since you have theories on how magical bandwidth can increase flops,but i think it will not serve AMD much since it only works when is done on a MS console,you know since the PS4 has also superior to 7870 bandwidth but some how is theorical and useless in your eyes..:lol:

You're an arm-chair developer, Tormentos. No one in the industry are making the claims you are.

 

 

 

 

 

THANK YOU!!!!

I am so sick of Sony fanboys (and I am talking directly at Tormentos right now) talking out of their arses about how "better" PS4 games are going to be than XB1 games because they look at some raw statistics and all of a sudden are expert game developers.

I re-iterate what the real experts say, and cows debate me as arm-chair game developers. :roll:

StormyJoe

:lol:

Do you see that chart there from Ron post.?

Yeah that is he assuming that because there is a GPU on AMD line that has 12CU and 768SP which was a SAMPLE unit he belive that it is the GPU inside the xbox one,2 preblems with this out of the gate.

1-That GPU on the graph is a Pitcairn GPU family of the 7870 and 7850 which the XBOX ONE DOESN'T HAVE.

The xbox one GPU is a Bonaire GPU is well know and every site that talk about hardware basically say so.

2- Ron also tagged Volcanic Island to the xbox one,based on the size of the chips which is a damn joke,since every one knew the xbox one GPU was GCN not GCN2.

Ron call advantage when the xbox one has higher bandwidth on its weak GPU vs the 7790 which is more powerful than the xbox one GPU,but when the topic is the PS4 has more bandwidth than the 7870 he start to cry therical theorical and refuse to admit that the same advantage apply to the PS4 even more,after all the PS4 is stronger than a 7850 and has more bandwidth,but the xbox one has a weaker GPU than bonaire 7790 while having more bandiwdth.

Is like filling a Hunday Accent with 100 octane gasoline and expect it to perform like a damn Hyunday Elantra...

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

THANK YOU!!!!

I am so sick of Sony fanboys (and I am talking directly at Tormentos right now) talking out of their arses about how "better" PS4 games are going to be than XB1 games because they look at some raw statistics and all of a sudden are expert game developers.

I re-iterate what the real experts say, and cows debate me as arm-chair game developers. :roll:

tormentos

:lol:

Do you see that chart there from Ron post.?

Yeah that is he assuming that because there is a GPU on AMD line that has 12CU and 768SP which was a SAMPLE unit he belive that it is the GPU inside the xbox one,2 preblems with this out of the gate.

1-That GPU on the graph is a Pitcairn GPU family of the 7870 and 7850 which the XBOX ONE DOESN'T HAVE.

The xbox one GPU is a Bonaire GPU is well know and every site that talk about hardware basically say so.

2- Ron also tagged Volcanic Island to the xbox one,based on the size of the chips which is a damn joke,since every one knew the xbox one GPU was GCN not GCN2.

Ron call advantage when the xbox one has higher bandwidth on its weak GPU vs the 7790 which is more powerful than the xbox one GPU,but when the topic is the PS4 has more bandwidth than the 7870 he start to cry therical theorical and refuse to admit that the same advantage apply to the PS4 even more,after all the PS4 is stronger than a 7850 and has more bandwidth,but the xbox one has a weaker GPU than bonaire 7790 while having more bandiwdth.

Is like filling a Hunday Accent with 100 octane gasoline and expect it to perform like a damn Hyunday Elantra...

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah...

Fact is, no developers are saying what you are saying. I haven't even heard comments from Sony 1st party touting some super-hardware superiority. All I hear is arm-chair coder fakes like you act as though you work at Ubisoft. Which, of course, you don't - because the Ubisoft folks are contradicting you.

IDK, I may have to resort to blatent teasing with you at this point. Your conclusions are as fallacious as a political speech.

 

You're an arm-chair developer, Tormentos. No one in the industry are making the claims you are.

StormyJoe

You will not find developer that will put them self in a bad position with either sony or MS,most are neutral.

What you want to claim is that the 7770 and the 7850 are the same GPU and that there will be little difference.

There are 600 to 700 Gflosp of difference on the same line of GPU,that translate into better performance for the Ps4 relative to that gap period.

480Gflops was enough to produce like 20 FPS difference,there is no scaping it the PS4 will be faster under all sircustances.

 

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah...

Fact is, no developers are saying what you are saying. I haven't even heard comments from Sony 1st party touting some super-hardware superiority. All I hear is arm-chair coder fakes like you act as though you work at Ubisoft. Which, of course, you don't - because the Ubisoft folks are contradicting you.

IDK, I may have to resort to blatent teasing with you at this point. Your conclusions are as fallacious as a political speech.

StormyJoe

You will not find developers that do that period unless they are piss with one developer or another.

"The PS4's GPU is very programmable. There's a lot of power in there that we're just not using yet. So what we want to do are some PS4-specific things for our rendering but within reason - it's a cross-platform game so we can't do too much that's PS4-specific," he reveals.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-how-the-crew-was-ported-to-playstation-4

Take that as you will....

Why if the xbox one and PS4 are so close they can't do anything that is too PS4 specific.?

:lol:

The PC version i am sure will be ahead but the xbox one version mmmmmm.... That one could suffer if the PS4 is push.

.

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah...

Fact is, no developers are saying what you are saying. I haven't even heard comments from Sony 1st party touting some super-hardware superiority. All I hear is arm-chair coder fakes like you act as though you work at Ubisoft. Which, of course, you don't - because the Ubisoft folks are contradicting you.

IDK, I may have to resort to blatent teasing with you at this point. Your conclusions are as fallacious as a political speech.

tormentos

You will not find developers that do that period unless they are piss with one developer or another.

"The PS4's GPU is very programmable. There's a lot of power in there that we're just not using yet. So what we want to do are some PS4-specific things for our rendering but within reason - it's a cross-platform game so we can't do too much that's PS4-specific," he reveals.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-how-the-crew-was-ported-to-playstation-4

Take that as you will....

Why if the xbox one and PS4 are so close they can't do anything that is too PS4 specific.?

:lol:

The PC version i am sure will be ahead but the xbox one version mmmmmm.... That one could suffer if the PS4 is push.

So then, since no developer says what you are saying, we should still all believe what you are saying... ya know, since you aren't a game developer and all.

So, if I start spouting some figures about the US economy, can I design you and your family's investment portfolios?

as far as your second post... and if they were making the PC requirements be a low end PC?

 

So then, since no developer says what you are saying, we should still all believe what you are saying... ya know, since you aren't a game developer and all.

So, if I start spouting some figures about the US economy, can I design you and your family's investment portfolios?

as far as your second post... and if they were making the PC requirements be a low end PC?

StormyJoe

No i am not a game developer but i do know that the 700Gflops is a gap wide enough to more than 20FPS.

The PS4 and xbox one are not by any chance the PS3 and xbox 360,they use tech from the same vendor line in both the CPU and GPU,the PS4 one on the GPU side is actually stronger and relative in performance to a OC 7850 or even faster,while the xbox one is slower in practical use even at the full 1.31 TF which are just 30K gflops ahead of the 7770,that if we ignore the 10% GPU reservation.

Trying to imply that the xbox one some how will perform way better than it should why not doing the same thing for the PS4 is a joke,the PS4 still has faster memory and more straigh forward design alone with a more powerful GPU.

[QUOTE="StormyJoe"]

So then, since no developer says what you are saying, we should still all believe what you are saying... ya know, since you aren't a game developer and all.

So, if I start spouting some figures about the US economy, can I design you and your family's investment portfolios?

as far as your second post... and if they were making the PC requirements be a low end PC?

tormentos

No i am not a game developer but i do know that the 700Gflops is a gap wide enough to more than 20FPS.

The PS4 and xbox one are not by any chance the PS3 and xbox 360,they use tech from the same vendor line in both the CPU and GPU,the PS4 one on the GPU side is actually stronger and relative in performance to a OC 7850 or even faster,while the xbox one is slower in practical use even at the full 1.31 TF which are just 30K gflops ahead of the 7770,that if we ignore the 10% GPU reservation.

Trying to imply that the xbox one some how will perform way better than it should why not doing the same thing for the PS4 is a joke,the PS4 still has faster memory and more straigh forward design alone with a more powerful GPU.

Again, no one who is a game developer is saying there is some great performance boost for the PS4. No one is saying it... except cows like you.

So, to put it more bluntly and in a language I believe you can understand:L I think you are full of sh*t. I think that the PS4 has more power, but you and the rest of the cows are making a mountain out of a mole hill to try and make yourselves feel like you made the best call. No developer at any major studio has come out and said "teh PS4 has a significant hardware advantage over the XBox One." No one. None. Nada. Nyet. Only you cows are saying it.

You moo-ers have taken a legitimate talking point and blown it out of proportion to the extent it is become bad comedy.