PC Owns all in 2009: Part 2

[QUOTE="789shadow"]

The only person who's opinion is fact is mine.:P

Aljosa23

My opinion rules all lololololol

I'm also biased against Sega!!!:P

Sure you're not. I already know your views on FF, don't even try that...:roll:The fact that you think every review is biased and compares to FF is pure speculation. Or maybe reviewers just love FF more than other jRPGs, and I see. But than again...lets get out the tin hates shall we?Aljosa23

[QUOTE="Aljosa23"]Sure you're not. I already know your views on FF, don't even try that...:roll:The fact that you think every review is biased and compares to FF is pure speculation. Or maybe reviewers just love FF more than other jRPGs, and I see. But than again...lets get out the tin hates shall we?Vandalvideo

There goes my-opinion-is-fact again.:roll:

There goes my-opinion-is-fact again.:roll:789shadow

But it is true. Think back to some of your favorite JRPGs of all time, and think about how much fun you had with them in comparison to Final Fantasy. Some of the greatest JRPGs of all time have been given 6s and 7s because of an unfair environment created since the inception of Final Fantasy. Games which break the mold are being called generic, and scoring downard (suikoden) while the most generic JRPG of all time; Final Fantasy, gets AAA games. I don't think anyone can deny that the JRPG industry is unfairly geared towards Final Fantasy fans. Vandalvideo

And who are you to call FF "generic"? For god's sakes you thought Star Ocean: TLH was better than Tales of Vesperia. :|

[QUOTE="789shadow"]There goes my-opinion-is-fact again.:roll:Vandalvideo

Um, every part of that post was opinion.:|

]Fair enough. FF set a standard in JRPGs and you can't deny that. The fact that every JRPG gets compared to it must mean the games are great and deserve their praise. You can have an opinion sure, but don't start these conspiracy theories. Maybe the reviewers didn't like those games, and thus rated them accordingly.And who are you to call FF "generic"? For god's sakes you thought Star Ocean: TLH was better than Tales of Vesperia. :|Aljosa23

[QUOTE="Aljosa23"]]Fair enough. FF set a standard in JRPGs and you can't deny that. The fact that every JRPG gets compared to it must mean the games are great and deserve their praise. You can have an opinion sure, but don't start these conspiracy theories. Maybe the reviewers didn't like those games, and thus rated them accordingly.And who are you to call FF "generic"? For god's sakes you thought Star Ocean: TLH was better than Tales of Vesperia. :|Vandalvideo

So a game series that sets pretty much the ground rules for a genre is setting a double standard?

Um, every part of that post was opinion.:|789shadow

So a game series that sets pretty much the ground rules for a genre is setting a double standard?789shadow

[QUOTE="789shadow"]Um, every part of that post was opinion.:|Vandalvideo

Opinion again. Prove it had delineating gameplay through facts.

[QUOTE="789shadow"]So a game series that sets pretty much the ground rules for a genre is setting a double standard?Vandalvideo

And since FF was the most popular RPG, it became the standard because people set it up as what RPG's should be.

I agree with your first line; Final Fantasy set a standard. It set a double standard. It is one of the few JRPGs that have been receiving high rankings across its life span. It only very recently, with Final Fantasy 10, started to begin the process of revamping its gameplay. Prior to that, in the playstation era, the games were largely generic. At the same time, games which aren't generic by any stretch of the imagination were getting 6s and 7s. Then Suikoden 3 came along, kowtowed to Final Fantasy pressure, and scorred AAA. IT removed the originality that made Suikoden great in the first place and became a poor Final Fantasy copy. Final Fantasy isn't soo god that it makes some of the best JRPGs of all time A in comparison.Vandalvideo

BUT, the FF games aren't generic in anyway at all, though you can make a case for VII. It's almost as if you hate the series because it overshadowed the lesser JRPGs out there, and that bias doesn't bode well with your argument.

Opinion again. Prove it had delineating gameplay through facts.789shadow

[QUOTE="IronBass"]Nope. DS owns all in 2009. Hell yeah 8) Don't like it? Get a DS. Hell yeah 8)scoobiesnackarf

[QUOTE="789shadow"]Opinion again. Prove it had delineating gameplay through facts.Vandalvideo

You do realize the only way to prove something is through numbers, right? You have failed again.

[QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"][QUOTE="IronBass"]Nope. DS owns all in 2009. Hell yeah 8) Don't like it? Get a DS. Hell yeah 8)Aljosa23

The only game I see that fits your "mold" is Legend of Dragoon and the Suikoden games deserved more, I agree.BUT, the FF games aren't generic in anyway at all, though you can make a case for VII. It's almost as if you hate the series because it overshadowed the lesser JRPGs out there, and that bias doesn't bode well with your argument.Aljosa23

I must defend the PC! Gamespot is trying to bring it down and all of us down! We must defend her to the core!scoobiesnackarf

[QUOTE="Aljosa23"]The only game I see that fits your "mold" is Legend of Dragoon and the Suikoden games deserved more, I agree.BUT, the FF games aren't generic in anyway at all, though you can make a case for VII. It's almost as if you hate the series because it overshadowed the lesser JRPGs out there, and that bias doesn't bode well with your argument.Vandalvideo

According to you.

You do realize the only way to prove something is through numbers, right? You have failed again.789shadow

[QUOTE="scoobiesnackarf"] I must defend the PC! Gamespot is trying to bring it down and all of us down! We must defend her to the core!Aljosa23

Final Fantasy 1 through FInal Fantasy 9 all follow the basic layout of gameplay, with different names for the standard conventions of the games themselves. Whether you're dealing with materia, item inhancements, or other properties, Final Fantasy gameplay is pretty standard. If you played seven, you know what to expect from nine, eight, and six and so forth. Final Fantasy 10, 12, and 13 are beginning to change that, and it is a good change of pace. But prior to these gameplay changes FInal Fantasy has largely been the same game for quite some time with minoir changes. Final Fantasy made other games score lower, there are dozens of games which should have scored higher. Vandalvideo

A generic game is something that steals from other games and being derivative to the point of blatant copy. How can FF steal from itself considering it gave birth to almost all great gameplay styles in jRPGs.

I also fail to see how FF made those other games score less. That must mean they didn't live up to the FF standard. Or are we going to back that "Everything not FF is underrated" conspiracy again?

[QUOTE="789shadow"]You do realize the only way to prove something is through numbers, right? You have failed again.Vandalvideo

Numbers are the only truly un-subjective things out there. For every person who agrees with you, someone else will disagree. Therefore, nothing you say is fact.

I fail to see how that makes the games "Generic".A generic game is something that steals from other games and being derivative to the point of blatant copy. How can FF steal from itself considering it gave birth to almost all great gameplay styles in jRPGs.I also fail to see how FF made those other games score less. That must mean they didn't live up to the FF standard. Or are we going to back that "Everything not FF is underrated" conspiracy again?Aljosa23

Numbers are the only truly un-subjective things out there. For every person who agrees with you, someone else will disagree. Therefore, nothing you say is fact.789shadow

It is generic because the gameplay is derivative from Final Fantasy 1 through 9.Vandalvideo

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"][QUOTE="789shadow"]You do realize the only way to prove something is through numbers, right? You have failed again.789shadow

Numbers are the only truly un-subjective things out there. For every person who agrees with you, someone else will disagree. Therefore, nothing you say is fact.

[QUOTE="789shadow"]Numbers are the only truly un-subjective things out there. For every person who agrees with you, someone else will disagree. Therefore, nothing you say is fact.Vandalvideo

A game is unoriginal if it takes everything from other games outside of it's series. If FF got all of it's ideas from it's own series, that's not being generic. Thats being part of a series.

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] It is generic because the gameplay is derivative from Final Fantasy 1 through 9.IronBass

It is generic because the gameplay is derivative from Final Fantasy 1 through 9. The gameplay, as I highlighted rarely changed, and if it did it was miniscule at best. Final Fantasy, as being derivative, is fairly generic. It didn't change up the pace, and was largely unoriginal. Despite this, the game continually scored high. At the same time, other games were being scored low for being generic, when in all actuallity they were switching up gameplay far more often than Final Fantasy was. Final Fantasy did not give birth to all great game styles in JRPGs. Action and strategy JRPGs were already out prior to Final Fantasy 13 and Final Fantasy Tactics. Final Fantasy isn't some god among JRPGs above all the other games. Vandal Hearts is arguably better than Tactics. Vandalvideo

The games are not derivative, they always have a gameplay element that makes them quite different from the last game, and they have different stories, characters, graphics, the list goes on and on.

A game is unoriginal if it takes everything from other games outside of it's series. If FF got all of it's ideas from it's own series, that's not being generic. Thats being part of a series.789shadow

[QUOTE="789shadow"]

[QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] You don't have to use numbers. This is the problem of identity. They all share these traits which delineated throughout the games. Therefore, they are derivative.out0v0rder

Numbers are the only truly un-subjective things out there. For every person who agrees with you, someone else will disagree. Therefore, nothing you say is fact.

That is not a number, as you know full well. That score is a numeric representation of an opinion. If the sales numbers for Tony Hawk 3 are released, that's fact.

Since the first one was locked due to lack of content, here you go:

1. Empire Total War

2. Dawn of War 2

3. Men of War

4. Starcraft 2- (atleast one part should be released)

5. Sims 3

6. Anno 1404

7. Demigod

8. Zeno Clash

These alone destroy everything on consoles. PC- System of every year! I dare you to prove me wrong.

scoobiesnackarf

[QUOTE="789shadow"]Numbers are the only truly un-subjective things out there. For every person who agrees with you, someone else will disagree. Therefore, nothing you say is fact.Vandalvideo

and it wasn't any more original than other games which were being scored low for being 'unoriginal'.Vandalvideo

[QUOTE="IronBass"][QUOTE="Vandalvideo"] It is generic because the gameplay is derivative from Final Fantasy 1 through 9.Vandalvideo

Because they were copying FF. Why must everything be different in different games in a series?:roll:

Oh I never said it was some God of Gaming or whatever, I was only arguing these ridiculous "facts" that you are claiming. I enjoy quite a large number of jRPGs also, and can name quite a few that rank up with the best FF. And notice I said ALMOST all gameplay styles was copied from FF.The games are not derivative, they always have a gameplay element that makes them quite different from the last game, and they have different stories, characters, graphics, the list goes on and on.Aljosa23

It's so ironic how Vandal is talking about Generic jRPGs when he LOVES the Survival Horror genre. :roll:

There's your double standard.

Because they were copying FF. Why must everything be different in different games in a series?:roll:789shadow

[QUOTE="789shadow"]Because they were copying FF. Why must everything be different in different games in a series?:roll:Vandalvideo

Well, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[QUOTE="IronBass"] And that's when subjectivity plays its role...Vandalvideo

It's so ironic how Vandal is talking about Generic jRPGs when he LOVES the Survival Horror genre. :roll:

There's your double standard.

Aljosa23