Rare: We've been battling against the Xbox demographic

Rare was acquired by Microsoft back in 2002 and has been at the heart of the platform holder's internal development, but only now, with the upcoming launch of Natal, does the developer feel it and Microsoft are on the same page.

Speaking to VideoGamer.com about Natal prior to gamescom, Rare design director George Andreas explained just why the motion sensing technology is such a big deal.

"I do feel in many ways that – and I've said this to some people as well – for me this is really the first time that Microsoft and Rare are on a very similar path," said Andreas. "We've obviously been tasked to create experiences that nobody else can create, which explains things like your Kameos and your Piñatas and your Banjos. But obviously the hardware is aimed at a different demographic, and so we've always battled against that.

"Whereas now with Natal, it looks like the roads are on the same path. It's a union of the two philosophies of the different companies, I guess. Natal is supposed to reach out to a broader audience and a broader consumer, and Rare's products are always aiming in that direction as well. So from that perspective the future looks incredibly bright for us really. It's definitely something everyone's enthused about and energised about."

SAUCE

no excuses Rare, it simply means you are not doing your job right, MS bought you guys hoping to expand their demographic.

it all started with perfect dark zero and i know it was microsofts fault the way the game turned out............how can you go from A excellent game like perfect dark then we get the massive garbage called zero...........in all honesty they should have just released the updated verison of perfect dark and never came up with the idea of zero.

To me, just sounds like an excuse from Rare for their recent projects.

To me, just sounds like an excuse from Rare for their recent projects.

Legendaryscmt

Let's all hope then that Natal can save Rares reputation and get them back on track.

it all started with perfect dark zero and i know it was microsofts fault the way the game turned out............how can you go from A excellent game like perfect dark then we get the massive garbage called zero...........in all honesty they should have just released the updated verison of perfect dark and never came up with the idea of zero.

Syn_Valence

I thought Zerom was decent. solid 7.5-8.0. Definitely not what I hoped for itt o be. Especially with the horrible aiming.

Well Rare, you should've made N&B a Platformer (Like B-K & B-T) instead of needlessly changing it for the sake of changing it. That would've appealed to a Demographic.

Who knows, maybe Old fans would've shelled out $340-360 on a Xbox-360 along with a Copy of BK3 (Which would've somewhat helped sales if they would've released BK3 in 2009). Just sayin'.

[QUOTE="Syn_Valence"]

it all started with perfect dark zero and i know it was microsofts fault the way the game turned out............how can you go from A excellent game like perfect dark then we get the massive garbage called zero...........in all honesty they should have just released the updated verison of perfect dark and never came up with the idea of zero.

bigblunt537

I thought Zerom was decent. solid 7.5-8.0. Definitely not what I hoped for itt o be. Especially with the horrible aiming.

[QUOTE="bigblunt537"]

[QUOTE="Syn_Valence"]

it all started with perfect dark zero and i know it was microsofts fault the way the game turned out............how can you go from A excellent game like perfect dark then we get the massive garbage called zero...........in all honesty they should have just released the updated verison of perfect dark and never came up with the idea of zero.

mitu123

I thought Zerom was decent. solid 7.5-8.0. Definitely not what I hoped for itt o be. Especially with the horrible aiming.

I had so much trouble shooting in that game, but yea I'm still puzzled at the 9.0. It's probably because it was the first 360 fps and it was long awaited.

To me, just sounds like an excuse from Rare for their recent projects.

Legendaryscmt

Come back when you've played there recent products. Kameo; Brilliant. Viva Pinata; Unique and brilliant, not seen any game like it. Banjo 3, not to everybodys tastes but still a solid AA game and still brilliant. The crap rare get on here is idiotic. It's like me calling naughty dog rubbish cause uncharted got AA.

But I thought that the Xbox demographic was made up solely of hardcore gamers who care about more than just shooters. I mean, surely the high attach rate PROVES that Xbox fans love buying all games of all varieties, right?

[QUOTE="mitu123"][QUOTE="bigblunt537"]

I thought Zerom was decent. solid 7.5-8.0. Definitely not what I hoped for itt o be. Especially with the horrible aiming.

bigblunt537

I had so much trouble shooting in that game, but yea I'm still puzzled at the 9.0. It's probably because it was the first 360 fps and it was long awaited.

[QUOTE="Legendaryscmt"]

To me, just sounds like an excuse from Rare for their recent projects.

gamer620

I've never understood the hate Rare get here. People are hypocrits. The same people who critisise Halo for being the exact same game 3 times in a row are the ones who claim Rare should be making sequels to games in exactly the same way they have done in the past. What's the point in saying you want innovation when by the timeyou're actually given it you just turn up your nose and claim its not a true sequel. The behaviour is stunning.

People need to realize Rare isn't the same developer it was back in the N64 days.

Many key personnel have left since then.They are no longer a top quality developer.You guys need to understand this because people are getting thier hopes up that Rare are going to come out with something awesome and they'll just be disappointed.

Tell me when was the last time they made a great,and I mean great game?

People need to realize Rare isn't the same developer it was back in the N64 days.

Many key personnel have left since then.They are no longer a top quality developer.You guys need to understand this because people are getting thier hopes up that Rare are going to come out with something awesome and they'll just be disappointed.

Tell me when was the last time they made a great,and I mean great game?

stvee101

Viva Pinata. Not only great, but highly original.

Banjo Kazoie: Nuts and Bolts is also not only great, but highly original, and it's because it is original that people hate on it.

You're right, Rare arn't the same developer they were. Now they don't just take something that works and make ten diffrent series out of it, this generation wont allow that, now they have innovation.

so now Rare is looking forward to natal lol epic fail confirmed

[QUOTE="stvee101"]

People need to realize Rare isn't the same developer it was back in the N64 days.

Many key personnel have left since then.They are no longer a top quality developer.You guys need to understand this because people are getting thier hopes up that Rare are going to come out with something awesome and they'll just be disappointed.

Tell me when was the last time they made a great,and I mean great game?

WasntAvailable

Viva Pinata. Not only great, but highly original.

Banjo Kazoie: Nuts and Bolts is also not only great, but highly original, and it's because it is original that people hate on it.

You're right, Rare arn't the same developer they were. Now they don't just take something that works and make ten diffrent series out of it, this generation wont allow that, now they have innovation.

Those two games you mentioned,while original and fun,are not in the same league as Rare's classics on the N64 imo.

They don't seem capable of making another "classic".

Maybe what you said is right,they have to go down another route now and try something different.

[QUOTE="WasntAvailable"]

[QUOTE="stvee101"]

People need to realize Rare isn't the same developer it was back in the N64 days.

Many key personnel have left since then.They are no longer a top quality developer.You guys need to understand this because people are getting thier hopes up that Rare are going to come out with something awesome and they'll just be disappointed.

Tell me when was the last time they made a great,and I mean great game?

stvee101

Viva Pinata. Not only great, but highly original.

Banjo Kazoie: Nuts and Bolts is also not only great, but highly original, and it's because it is original that people hate on it.

You're right, Rare arn't the same developer they were. Now they don't just take something that works and make ten diffrent series out of it, this generation wont allow that, now they have innovation.

Those two games you mentioned,while original and fun,are not in the same league as Rare's classics on the N64 imo.

They don't seem capable of making another "classic".

Maybe what you said is right,they have to go down another route now and try something different.

They do, and so do alot of developers currently going round in circles. I don't think their games are any worse than they ever have been either. Just because something is considered cl-assic dosn't mean it has to be as good as people like to pretend it is. I think there's alot of nostalgia when people talk about Rare, and you have to look past that to see what these games really deliver, which is more than most.

People need to realize Rare isn't the same developer it was back in the N64 days.

Many key personnel have left since then.They are no longer a top quality developer.You guys need to understand this because people are getting thier hopes up that Rare are going to come out with something awesome and they'll just be disappointed.

Tell me when was the last time they made a great,and I mean great game?

stvee101

who then made haze

you dont even have a 360, have you even played any of rare's latest games.

Maybe if their games were better they would sell... Zero was crap, Banjo Kazooie was the most dissapointing thing of this entire generation, Viva pinata was good, so this is the only game imo that they might have a point with, but it was also their fault for not promoting it right, i mean, whats the best way to get a 360 game to sell? MAKE A KIDS CARTOON!? no, that just makes the 360 audience say, oh its a kids game, not interested.. :/

They have. Its not totally bad but your demographic does dictate what you can sell. I think Rare has talent though so I'm interested to see what they bring to the table.

it all started with perfect dark zero and i know it was microsofts fault the way the game turned out............how can you go from A excellent game like perfect dark then we get the massive garbage called zero...........in all honesty they should have just released the updated verison of perfect dark and never came up with the idea of zero.

Syn_Valence

edit:sorry sad n64 meant gamecube.

I like my fair share of Kameo, Viva Pinata and Banjo Kazooie: N&B between all the Halos and Gears of Wars and what not.

If MS cared so much about expanding their demographic then they would put more funds to advertise games like Kameo, Viva Pinata, and Banjo instead of putting all of it into Halo and Gears. I guess MS thinks the word for the family games will get around all by themselves and they'll sell millions. killab2oo5

Sounds like damage control for bad games.

None of their games aside from PD:0have really appealled to the heart of the 360 demographic. Interesting to see if that Perfect Dark Remake on XBLA sells a couple million and if they change their approach. Might see Killer Instinct sooner than later.

None of their games aside from PD:0have really appealled to the heart of the 360 demographic. Interesting to see if that Perfect Dark Remake on XBLA sells a couple million and if they change their approach. Might see Killer Instinct sooner than later.

strudel420

From what I've seen, for the most part Rare has been making decent games that are not selling up to expectations. Why are they not selling? Because they are not the type of games that most people associate with the 360. Face it, the image and demographic of the 360 is the "hardcore mature gamer", your average high school, college, mid-twenties guy that loves playing online with his friends. How well do you think games where you play as a bear, a fairy or cute pinatas are going to do that demographic?

ITT: People saying Rare's recent games are bad when only about 5% of the people here have played all of them. :| SAGE_OF_FIRE

This is SW. Its expected.

To me, just sounds like an excuse from Rare for their recent projects.

Legendaryscmt

but there recent projects have all been amazing :?

If MS cared so much about expanding their demographic then they would put more funds to advertise games like Kameo, Viva Pinata, and Banjo instead of putting all of it into Halo and Gears. I guess MS thinks the word for the family games will get around all by themselves and they'll sell millions. killab2oo5

Didnt Viva have a cartoon?!?

it all started with perfect dark zero and i know it was microsofts fault the way the game turned out............how can you go from A excellent game like perfect dark then we get the massive garbage called zero...........in all honesty they should have just released the updated verison of perfect dark and never came up with the idea of zero.

Syn_Valence

You know what would have helped Rare reach that demographic? Staying with ******* Nintendo.

Oh we will sell out to Microsoft but not change anything we do and still expect to be able to sell to the same type of audience. It doesn't work like that Rare and the only reason they are now in the same mindset as each other is because of Nintendo's success with motion sensing.

Well Rare has made good titles this gen.. (not sure if any of them scored/averaged below an 8.0) However they are targeting pre-teens and young males who live and die by Halo and Madden. I think if M$ made an effort to market those games and target the younger audience, then Rare would be singing a different tune.

ITT: People saying Rare's recent games are bad when only about 5% of the people here have played all of them. :| SAGE_OF_FIRE

I've played all.. save viva pinata. I still think they are bad. I guess I'm that demograph that they are fighting against.

That just sounds like an excuse for their lackluster projects lately. Seriosly, we haven't seen a new IP from them for quite some time now.clubsammich91

[QUOTE="SAGE_OF_FIRE"]ITT: People saying Rare's recent games are bad when only about 5% of the people here have played all of them. :| Espada12

I've played all.. save viva pinata. I still think they are bad. I guess I'm that demograph that they are fighting against.

That just sounds like an excuse for their lackluster projects lately. Seriosly, we haven't seen a new IP from them for quite some time now.clubsammich91

[QUOTE="clubsammich91"]That just sounds like an excuse for their lackluster projects lately. Seriosly, we haven't seen a new IP from them for quite some time now.strudel420

The difference is that Resistance and Ratchet and Clank are very good and the microsoft avatars, viva pinata, perfect dark zero, nuts and bolts, etc.range form o.k. (viva pinata) to abominations (avatars).

[QUOTE="strudel420"]

[QUOTE="clubsammich91"]That just sounds like an excuse for their lackluster projects lately. Seriosly, we haven't seen a new IP from them for quite some time now.MUSH_IS_PWNs

The difference is that Resistance and Ratchet and Clank are very good and the microsoft avatars, viva pinata, perfect dark zero, nuts and bolts, etc.range form o.k. (viva pinata) to abominations (avatars).

Sounds to me that xbox is trying to ditch the hardcore and focus on kids and casuals....certainly seems that way with the closing down of hardcore game developers Ensemble, FASA , and Aces.... which I am still sour about. Shane Kim said (as memory serves) the reason they killed the studios is because they weren't inline with Microsoft's new Xbox casaul initiative. Is the whole company going down that path? There can't be 2 wii's... If they continue down this road of making very few hardcore games, expect more people defecting to the hardcore games focused PlayStation brand.Midnightshade29

Im sorry but not a single Rare game (with the possible excxeption of Viva PInata Pocket Paradise) is anywhere near at all being close to the point of the casual realm.

[QUOTE="strudel420"]

Rare has created 2 new IPs this generation, released 5 quality console titles and are in charge of Microsoft's Avatars. I'm curious what you and people like you expect from a single developer.

Insomniac gets all the praise in the world for juggling Resistance and Ratchet at the same (3 releases and 1 downloadable chapter) but for some reason Rare doesn't get nearly the same treatment.

MUSH_IS_PWNs

The difference is that Resistance and Ratchet and Clank are very good and the microsoft avatars, viva pinata, perfect dark zero, nuts and bolts, etc.range form o.k. (viva pinata) to abominations (avatars).

Ratchet Future - 89
Ratchet Booty - 76
Resistance - 86
Resistance 2 - 87
84.5%

Insomniac has made 2 less games and only had 1 launch title with Resistance as opposed to Rare launching Kameo and Perfect Dark. Please entertain me with the notion that if Insomniac releases 6 games over that same period of time (3 years) while having to invent the Sony equivalent of Avatars these numbers wouldn't be almost identical.

[QUOTE="MUSH_IS_PWNs"]

[QUOTE="strudel420"]

Rare has created 2 new IPs this generation, released 5 quality console titles and are in charge of Microsoft's Avatars. I'm curious what you and people like you expect from a single developer.

Insomniac gets all the praise in the world for juggling Resistance and Ratchet at the same (3 releases and 1 downloadable chapter) but for some reason Rare doesn't get nearly the same treatment.

strudel420

The difference is that Resistance and Ratchet and Clank are very good and the microsoft avatars, viva pinata, perfect dark zero, nuts and bolts, etc.range form o.k. (viva pinata) to abominations (avatars).

Ratchet Future - 89
Ratchet Booty - 76
Resistance - 86
Resistance 2 - 87
84.5%

Insomniac has made 2 less games and only had1 launch titlewith Resistanceas opposed to Rare launching Kameo and Perfect Dark. Please entertain me with the notion that if Insomniacreleases 6 games over that same period of time (3 years)while having to invent the Sony equivalent of Avatars these numbers wouldn't be almost identical.