@tormentos: So... all those magazine articles are full of crap, and you and your conspiracy theory is correct.
Gotcha... :roll:
You mean the articles that talk about DX12 gains on PC not on xbox one.?
Please man stop you can use that excuse on PC,but the xbox one has a gpu compatible with DX12 since launch.
Looking ahead, we’re stoked about the releases of Xbox One and Windows 8.1! The process that got us to this point will continue to drive our future releases. We are getting excellent feedback from the industry around the areas that are most important for future API development, and that feedback is directly informing our Direct3D development direction. We’re continually innovating in areas of performance, functionality and debug and performance tooling for Xbox One. We’re also working with our ISV and IHV partners on future efforts, including bringing the lightweight runtime and tooling capabilities of the Xbox One Direct3D implementation to Windows, and identifying the next generation of advanced 3D graphics technologies.
Developers creating content for the Xbox One are able to use the same programing constructs across Windows and Xbox, and benefit from all the improvements that have been introduced on Windows. With Xbox One we have also made significant enhancements to the implementation of Direct3D 11, especially in the area of runtime overhead. The result is a very streamlined, “close to metal” level of runtime performance. In conjunction with the third generation PIX performance tool for Xbox One, developers can use Direct3D 11 to unlock the full performance potential of the console.
Before DX12 was even announce.
This ^^ is what DX12 really is the xbox one low level API brought to PC with some other fine tuning that would maybe improve 5% who knows but from there to 100% gain no it would not.
@tormentos: Still waiting on that proof el tormented. Stay butthurt son
I showed all the proof i need it you on the other hand showed just damage control..lol
Really? I didn't see a shred of proof that millions upon millions of 360 sales were rebuys. I didn't have to repurchase a single 360 but I didn't have to purchase multiple PS2's AND PS3s. Again show proof and now some messed up (lack of)logic of yours. BTW I don't need to show proof but YOU do. You made the claim now you have to back it up.
Really? I didn't see a shred of proof that millions upon millions of 360 sales were rebuys. I didn't have to repurchase a single 360 but I didn't have to purchase multiple PS2's AND PS3s. Again show proof and now some messed up (lack of)logic of yours. BTW I don't need to show proof but YOU do. You made the claim now you have to back it up.
Yet you already repurchased the xbox one twice.lol
I am sure you didn't either you didn't own a 360 or your lying as always.
Prove to me that RROD warranty lasted more than 3 years for each platform and you have a point.
Pretending that not a freaking 360 broke once it was fix is a damn joke,many were the stories of people having to re send their units not a month after getting it back,worse Error 74 wasn't even cover by the RROD warranty extension until 2009 so yeah go pretend elsewhere that all damn 360 were send back to MS and fixed.
Really? I didn't see a shred of proof that millions upon millions of 360 sales were rebuys. I didn't have to repurchase a single 360 but I didn't have to purchase multiple PS2's AND PS3s. Again show proof and now some messed up (lack of)logic of yours. BTW I don't need to show proof but YOU do. You made the claim now you have to back it up.
Yet you already repurchased the xbox one twice.lol
I am sure you didn't either you didn't own a 360 or your lying as always.
Prove to me that RROD warranty lasted more than 3 years for each platform and you have a point.
Pretending that not a freaking 360 broke once it was fix is a damn joke,many were the stories of people having to re send their units not a month after getting it back,worse Error 74 wasn't even cover by the RROD warranty extension until 2009 so yeah go pretend elsewhere that all damn 360 were send back to MS and fixed.
I know reading comprehension isn't your strong suit but damn el tormented. No one is THAT bad
Why would I need to prove that? You said millions upon millions of the 360's total sales were from rebuys. Prove it el tormented. We both know you can't
Once again el tormented, prove it.
Prove millions of people ran out and purchased new 360s because of it. Didn't think so el tormented. Not a shred of proof as usual.
Go practice your reading comprehension. It's painfully obvious you need it
I know reading comprehension isn't your strong suit but damn el tormented. No one is THAT bad
Why would I need to prove that? You said millions upon millions of the 360's total sales were from rebuys. Prove it el tormented. We both know you can't
Once again el tormented, prove it.
Prove millions of people ran out and purchased new 360s because of it. Didn't think so el tormented. Not a shred of proof as usual.
Go practice your reading comprehension. It's painfully obvious you need it
Sure i can 55 million xbox 360 sold only 35 million live accounts please explain how it is possible that 20 million xbox 360 were never connected to xbox live,live silver was free and every damn xbox came with 1 free month of xbox live..
lol
I'll tell you how because many of those units were re buys.
There is no reading comprehension problem lemming,get a back bone the xbox 360 warranty which you already try to argue as something that never went up until i corrected you wasn't eternal.
Ether you prove that 2005,2006 and 2007 models were not out of warranty by 2009 or you have nothing but damage control.
Also tell me what did you do if an xbox 360 got an Error E74 since that wasn't cover by MS RROD extension until 2009,so tell me what could those who owned a 360 would have done from 2005 to 2009 if MS would not fix their hardware.
1-Sell all your 360 games dirt cheap on gamestop and get a PS3 and re buy your games.
2-Repair your console for a fee get 3 month warranty because the extended warranty didn't apply here,and risc yourself again to see the unit fail.
3-Buy a core 360 which by December 2008 was already $199 slap your old HDD and continue using your games and profile as if nothing happen.
I know reading comprehension isn't your strong suit but damn el tormented. No one is THAT bad
Why would I need to prove that? You said millions upon millions of the 360's total sales were from rebuys. Prove it el tormented. We both know you can't
Once again el tormented, prove it.
Prove millions of people ran out and purchased new 360s because of it. Didn't think so el tormented. Not a shred of proof as usual.
Go practice your reading comprehension. It's painfully obvious you need it
Sure i can 55 million xbox 360 sold only 35 million live accounts please explain how it is possible that 20 million xbox 360 were never connected to xbox live,live silver was free and every damn xbox came with 1 free month of xbox live..
lol
I'll tell you how because many of those units were re buys.
There is no reading comprehension problem lemming,get a back bone the xbox 360 warranty which you already try to argue as something that never went up until i corrected you wasn't eternal.
Ether you prove that 2005,2006 and 2007 models were not out of warranty by 2009 or you have nothing but damage control.
Also tell me what did you do if an xbox 360 got an Error E74 since that wasn't cover by MS RROD extension until 2009,so tell me what could those who owned a 360 would have done from 2005 to 2009 if MS would not fix their hardware.
1-Sell all your 360 games dirt cheap on gamestop and get a PS3 and re buy your games.
2-Repair your console for a fee get 3 month warranty because the extended warranty didn't apply here,and risc yourself again to see the unit fail.
3-Buy a core 360 which by December 2008 was already $199 slap your old HDD and continue using your games and profile as if nothing happen.
So your proof is 55M yet 35M LIVE account so your conclusion is they're rebuys? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL seriously dude hahahaahahahahahaahah Once again prove it el tormented. One has absolutely nothing to do with the other.
Prove it el tormented. Comparing NA sales with LIVE accounts doesn't mean a single thing and is far from proof. Hahahahaahah you're pretty sad
So your solution for failing to provide proof is to change the subject? LOLOLOLOL can you BE anymore pathetic. Prove your claim el tormented
Tell me how what you had to do when your PS3 YLOD? Or when the PS2 DRE'd with NO warranty in site? Did it inflate the sales numbers? Going by your logic or lack thereof, of course it did.
1. MS bundled DX12 narrative with Digital Foundry's Xbox One X narrative e.g. DirectX12 API processing via micro-coding command processor.
2. DX12/Vulkan was heavily pushed by AMD's marketing for their weak CPUs.
3. You have forgotten there's a gap between DirectX11 API calls to GCN's ASM regardless of PC's legacy API overheads, hence why GCN Intrinsic Function access exist in Vulkan API, DirectX11 and DirectX12.
Even with Vulkan API usage, IDsoftware's Doom 2016 used GCN Intrinsic Functions to further reduce latency between the CPU to GPU. GCN Intrinsic Functions are also used in XBO and PS4 for their respective Doom builds.
Xbox One's DirectX11.X API calls are NOT GCN instruction set! DX11 API/Shader Model 5 has existed before GCN. DirectX12 API is needed for XBO's DX12 command processor with microcoding usage.
Microcoding is a specific technical term for instruction translation or instruction decoding.
Microcoding term is use for X86's CISC translation to RISCy instructions hardware as an example.
PS4's lower latency DX11 like API is pretty slow. Read https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-how-the-crew-was-ported-to-playstation-4
Initially, The Crew game was ported to PS4's DX11 like API (aka GNMX API) and it was slow i.e. 10 fps results from PC's 30 fps results.
1-NO and they don't care about DX12 or making a parade about it anymore because they have the strongest console now no need for secret sauce.
2-Again this mean little since Ryzen wasn't the topic.
3-Stop your bullshit theories you were proven WRONG as simple as that,you quoted developers religiously trying to spin whatever crap they claim for the xbox one,we know what happen after your Rebellion quotes you banish from the forum for months because you claimed parity was achieve with sniper elite 3,and reality is that the PS4 version was as much as 30FPS faster than the xbox one version there was no freaking parity other than resolution.
Alien isolation is a shitty develop game,and you who love to love the words ""you didn't factor this or that"" it was you who didn't want to FACTOR in that developer screw up,and that games do come broken performance wise and that it is a FACT that many are fixed after launch.
You claimed the PS4 version of The witcher 3 had CPU problems because the xbox one was a few frames faster at 900p while the PS4 version was 1080p,when the game was fix at the end the PS4 ended beating the xbox one version frame wise as well killing yours and many lemmings arguments.
Fact is Alien Isolation ran at 89FPS on a shitty low budget g1820 celeron CPU It was impossible that the Jaguar inside the PS4 or even xbox one would have problems with that game,so rule out that the game was DEMANDING CPU wise in any way,the other option is simple a screw up game.
CPUs with four or more cores need not apply -- Alien: Isolation is seeking an affordable dual-core Core i3 processor but will also accept lowly Celeron, FX or Phenom II chips. Of course, that could change when running either SLI or Crossfire, but throwing that kind of GPU power at Alien: Isolation is a waste.
Techspot analysis of CPU usage on Alien Isolation,more things on screen have many other games that not only look better than AL but also run better,AI was a screw up game and you don't admit it because you are a hard headed moron who can't lose an argument with dignity. Hahahahaa
1. Facts, Microsoft bundled DX12 narrative with X1X's custom command processing improvement.
2. Your topic doesn't mirror the real world.
3.
Intel Celeron G1820 (dual core) is based on Intel Haswell CPU core you stupid clown. Any Intel Haswell core is better than AMD Jaguar core!
Intel Celeron G1820 inherits Haswell's superior IPC, low latency cache and I/O designs.
Don't under estimate "Celeron" name since it could be Intel Kabylake based CPU core.
AMD Piledriver FX at 3.6 Ghz would have it's cache and I/O ports at 3.6 Ghz time slices which is half of Jaguar's 1.6 Ghz time slices which means Piledriver at 3.6Ghz's time latency is less than half when compared to Jaguar at 1.6Ghz. High clock speed has an impact on reducing time latency.
At the same clock speed, Ryzen's latencies are similar to Intel Haswell or Skylake.
Rebellion's tile render overcomes 32 MB eSRAM imposed resolution limitation, but it will NOT overcome CU limitation, hence why I used W5000's example with similar TFLOPS to XBO but without XBO's fast framebuffer size limitation. I debated both positive (e.g. tile render to overcome 32MB framebuffer size resolution bound) and negative (e.g. W5000 examples for 12 CU bound) balance for XBO. You don't know shit and you're a Sony fanboy extremist.
@tormentos: So... all those magazine articles are full of crap, and you and your conspiracy theory is correct.
Gotcha... :roll:
You mean the articles that talk about DX12 gains on PC not on xbox one.?
Please man stop you can use that excuse on PC,but the xbox one has a gpu compatible with DX12 since launch.
Looking ahead, we’re stoked about the releases of Xbox One and Windows 8.1! The process that got us to this point will continue to drive our future releases. We are getting excellent feedback from the industry around the areas that are most important for future API development, and that feedback is directly informing our Direct3D development direction. We’re continually innovating in areas of performance, functionality and debug and performance tooling for Xbox One. We’re also working with our ISV and IHV partners on future efforts, including bringing the lightweight runtime and tooling capabilities of the Xbox One Direct3D implementation to Windows, and identifying the next generation of advanced 3D graphics technologies.
Developers creating content for the Xbox One are able to use the same programing constructs across Windows and Xbox, and benefit from all the improvements that have been introduced on Windows. With Xbox One we have also made significant enhancements to the implementation of Direct3D 11, especially in the area of runtime overhead. The result is a very streamlined, “close to metal” level of runtime performance. In conjunction with the third generation PIX performance tool for Xbox One, developers can use Direct3D 11 to unlock the full performance potential of the console.
Before DX12 was even announce.
This ^^ is what DX12 really is the xbox one low level API brought to PC with some other fine tuning that would maybe improve 5% who knows but from there to 100% gain no it would not.
Meanwhile Doom programmer reveals GCN Intrinsic Functions on game consoles (more than one).
We also know XBO's DX11.X API has incomplete Async compute support over a period of time from XDX leak. Actual XDX information >>> Microsoft marketing.
Fuking XBO DX11.X async compute only has fuking 4 CU enabled! Incomplete low level API bullsh*t from actual DirectX11.X XDX.
Your "but the xbox one has a gpu compatible with DX12 since launch" (year 2013) argument is bullsh*t i.e. 4 CU enabled for aysnc compute is not fully enabling the fuking GPU.
The above XDX leak has year 2014 time period which makes your "but the xbox one has a gpu compatible with DX12 since launch" argument as bullshit.
Digital Foundry: To what extent will DX12 prove useful on Xbox One? Isn't there already a low CPU overhead there in addressing the GPU?
Oles Shishkovstov: No, it's important. All the dependency tracking takes a huge slice of CPU power. And if we are talking about the multi-threaded command buffer chunks generation - the DX11 model was essentially a 'flop', while DX12 should be the right one.
DX11 model was the mistake while DX12 model is the correct design.
Dan Baker also confirms AMD's Mantle API doesn't have GCN Intrinsic function access. Doom 2016 PC build was first GCN Intrinsic function for the PC with GCN GPUs. After AMD's Intrinsic function reveal with Doom 2016, NVIDIA shown their intrinsic functions reveal under NVAPI and has been operating for several years (fuk the NDA).
There's a gap between PC's DirectX12 API and GCN Intrinsic function access.
XBO DirectX12 verses the other APIs i.e. PC DirectX12 and PS4 APIs.
This is from EA DICE with experience on XBO DirectX11.X, XBO DirectX12, PC DirectX11, PC DirectX12, Mantle and PS4 APIs.
---------------------
To be balanced
In 2013, PS4's GCN instruction set is not yet fully exposed to the game programmer.
"One of them is the absolute low-level API, you're talking directly to the hardware. It's used to draw the static RAM buffers and feed them directly to the GPU," Norden shared. "It's much, much lower level than you're used to with DirectX or OpenGL but it's not quite at the driver level. It's very similar if you've programmed PS3 or PS Vita, very similar to those graphics libraries."
AMD/Sony did not give game programmers full control over the hardware e.g. ring 0 kernel level control or ring -1 hypervisor level control.
Game programmers are boxed into a secured sandbox e.g being a 3rd party game programmer for PS4 doesn't give you the ability to install Linux or Windows (needs to overcome USB connected HDD problem) on PS4. Breaking the garden wall, PS4 is a close relative to X86 PC e.g. AMD's open source Radeon HD driver works on it and Steam App store can be installed.
“With the PlayStation 4 and the Xbox One they’re not even remotely scratching the surface for what people can do and there’s still…I mean on the PlayStation 4 and their low-level API, they’re all still very…they’re like written for last-gen but updated for this gen. I wouldn’t say they’re completely native yet, I mean they are native but you know these words all get misused, but this gen’s graphics are still very far behind where they’re going to be.”
If PS4's low level API hasn't satisfied AMD Mantle game programmer then there are unsolved issues.
So Direct X12 turned out to be a developer tool that is now widely used. Who Cares. Microsoft put out the mighty X and graphics don't matter anymore. Carry on...
I'm looking forward to their next gen when they might have a powerhouse set of exclusives with the recent acquisitions.
Next-gen Xbox is going to have killer games, if only to support Game Pass. Off the top of my head potential IPs they have to add are: Kung Fu Chaos, Banjo, Kameo, Viva Pinata, Perfect Dark, Crackdown, PGR, and Fable. MS is going hard acquiring Ninja Theory and building The Initiative.
I'm happy with Game Pass and Play Anywhere/Crossplay. Playing FH4 on X1 and PC using Game Pass and it's freaking awesome. Just need to add some spice to regular Halo/Gears/Forza staples. Hopefully some of the games I listed.
Unusual as it may sound, I am more interested if MS follows Sony's formula of successful first party titles. Then again, it's not like they can't change new Gears and Halo, or spin-offs of those to be more like Sony's Uncharted, GoW, Last of Us, HZD, Spiderman, etc.
All I want are sharks with fricken laser beams coming from their heads, is that too much to ask for?
Oh, and I want the best hardware with the best games, exclusives or not. It's unfortunate that these concepts are completely segregated this gen. Sony has the best games, MS has the best hardware. Have to own both damn consoles. The difference being though, that whichever company has the best hardware, if they also put the effort into having the best games, it would be a solid win, but neither company went full throttle into either. PS4 Pro is gimped at the CPU level, X1X is gimped at the exclusive level.
Sony should make a gamepass and let me play it on the x1x. Problem solved.
Log in to comment