The Wii is basically a Gamecube.

The Wii is basically a Gamecube... with the only major differences being that the Wii is actually selling really well, and it has a new, unique controller.

The hardware is pretty much the same, even Miyamoto said that. That's fine, but then why is the Wii so expensive? I like the idea of not focusing on graphics (as it can lead to disasters like Lair, and most other big games this gen are just short lived experiences that fade into obscurity quickly, Ubisoft being the biggest culprit I think) but how about giving consumers good value for their money, Nintendo?

Then we've got the online, which isn't worth mentioning so I won't bother discussing it. The most important thing here is games and once again, Nintendo aren't working to get big 3rd party games on their system. Where is all that money going? To more marketing? Why not get KH3 exclusive? I think that's a game that could work better on Wii than other systems.

Believe it or not, I don't intend to bash the Wii. I just expect more from the top selling console of the generation. It's not good value for money and it doesn't have enough great titles from both 1st/3rd party developers to be the #1 console on the market. Game-wise, it's not doing better than the PS3 and 360 (or PC) and it should be, right?

I think Nintendo have done heapsof things better than Sony and MS this gen, but they're still the same old Nintendo when it comes to 3rd parties. I really think Nintendo needs to send out a message at E3 that they are actively pursuing 3rd parties for big games. What I don't want to see is an E3 centered around another Wiifit. The big guns for the Wii have already been released (SMG, Zelda, MP, SSBB) and Nintendo need to show us that they've still got plenty of fuel.

What do you guys think? Am I being too harsh, or do you also expect a bit more from Nintendo this gen?

The Wii is basically a Gamecube... with the only major differences being that the Wii is actually selling really well, and it has a new, unique controller.

The hardware is pretty much the same, even Miyamoto said that. That's fine, but then why is the Wii so expensive? I like the idea of not focusing on graphics (as it can lead to disasters like Lair, and most other big games this gen are just short lived experiences that fade into obscurity quickly, Ubisoft being the biggest culprit I think) but how about giving consumers good value for their money, Nintendo?

Then we've got the online, which isn't worth mentioning so I won't bother discussing it. The most important thing here is games and once again, Nintendo aren't working to get big 3rd party games on their system. Where is all that money going? To more marketing? Why not get KH3 exclusive? I think that's a game that could work better on Wii than other systems.

Believe it or not, I don't intend to bash the Wii. I just expect more from the top selling console of the generation. It's not good value for money and it doesn't have enough great titles from both 1st/3rd party developers to be the #1 console on the market. Game-wise, it's not doing better than the PS3 and 360 (or PC) and it should be, right?

I think Nintendo have done heapsof things better than Sony and MS this gen, but they're still the same old Nintendo when it comes to 3rd parties. I really think Nintendo needs to send out a message at E3 that they are actively pursuing 3rd parties for big games. What I don't want to see is an E3 centered around another Wiifit. The big guns for the Wii have already been released (SMG, Zelda, MP, SSBB) and Nintendo need to show us that they've still got plenty of fuel.

What do you guys think? Am I being too harsh, or do you also expect a bit more from Nintendo this gen?

the-very-best

i want them to stop making stupid mario remakes like soccer,racing, baskerball or whatever and focuz on dk, kirby, starfox, and the other nintendo characters... and they should really get some exclusive third party games... and just more 3rd party games..

Except The Wii has already outsold the Gamecube and has far better Third Party Support.blitzkid1

[QUOTE="blitzkid1"]Except The Wii has already outsold the Gamecube and has far better Third Party Support.DivergeUnify

not YET.

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The hardware is pretty much the same, even Miyamoto said that. That's fine, but then why is the Wii so expensive? I like the idea of not focusing on graphics (as it can lead to disasters like Lair

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the-very-best

Thats kind of Ironic seeing on how Lair's biggest problem wasnt its graphics but the focus of motion controls.

The PS3 gives you a lot less for your cash, it seems like you're only saying this because the Wii's leading in sales :?

I don't think Ninty will need to announce anything persay at E3. If the DS' history is anything reliable, we'll slowly begin to see more third parties move to the Wii, because of a higher chance of sales as well as cheaper development costs. What third party killer apps were Wii owners looking forward to last year? Not much. This year, there's a lot more -- The Conduit's getting a lot of attention, Madworld is as well, who knows, Spore could be great. I hate to sound like a broken record/cow, but I think in the following years the Wii's library will improve. Again, I'm basing this on the DS' history, and so far the Wii has mimicked its cousin perfectly.

I don't have high expectations for it will only lead to disappointement and i don't have low expectations for it will only degrade the quality of things one do and things one make. Balance is essential in everything.

The Wii is my first console (I'm mainly a PC gamer) and i see nothing bad with it and it's even really very great for me. It's the console that hooked me into console gaming. Online is useless as i only like MP when it comes to RTSs. I don't like tradtional controllers very much. I'm not a graphics whore like most stupid and idiotic PS3 and 360 fanboys (PC gaming is not about graphics), etc.

It depends on one person. Also, this gen is far away from over. I suggest you wait til E3 my friend. Only when the gen is over can we really fairly judge on how good or bad the consoles did in their lifetime.

[QUOTE="the-very-best"]

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The hardware is pretty much the same, even Miyamoto said that. That's fine, but then why is the Wii so expensive? I like the idea of not focusing on graphics (as it can lead to disasters like Lair

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opex07

Thats kind of Ironic seeing on how Lair's biggest problem wasnt its graphics but the focus of motion controls.

He means if you focus on graphics then it will lead to disasters like Lair because they obviously spent more time on graphics than gameplay. Hopefully Killzone doesn't repeat.

[QUOTE="the-very-best"]

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The hardware is pretty much the same, even Miyamoto said that. That's fine, but then why is the Wii so expensive? I like the idea of not focusing on graphics (as it can lead to disasters like Lair

cut-

opex07

Thats kind of Ironic seeing on how Lair's biggest problem wasnt its graphics but the focus of motion controls.

yeah and Wii Sports', NMH's, MP3's, SMG's, Z&W's, etc. greatest addition was motion and IR controls.

I actually liked the GC more than the Wii, the Wii is just an expensive GC with a new controller, there are really few games that make it worth a purchase.club-sandwich

Comparing GC and the Wii when GC's lifetime is already over. How illogical. Only when the wii's lifetime is over can we fairly judge the consoles.

[QUOTE="opex07"][QUOTE="the-very-best"]

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The hardware is pretty much the same, even Miyamoto said that. That's fine, but then why is the Wii so expensive? I like the idea of not focusing on graphics (as it can lead to disasters like Lair

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Beastfrog

Thats kind of Ironic seeing on how Lair's biggest problem wasnt its graphics but the focus of motion controls.

He means if you focus on graphics then it will lead to disasters like Lair because they obviously spent more time on graphics than gameplay. Hopefully Killzone doesn't repeat.

Focusing on graphics wasn't what hurt the game it was the focus on controls that made the game almost un-playable.This is why the game was later patched to include a different control scheme.

[QUOTE="opex07"][QUOTE="the-very-best"]

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The hardware is pretty much the same, even Miyamoto said that. That's fine, but then why is the Wii so expensive? I like the idea of not focusing on graphics (as it can lead to disasters like Lair

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lordlors

Thats kind of Ironic seeing on how Lair's biggest problem wasnt its graphics but the focus of motion controls.

yeah and Wii Sports', NMH's, MP3's, SMG's, Z&W's, etc. greatest addition was motion and IR controls.

What does that have to do with lair, and what I said?

The PS3 gives you a lot less for your cash, it seems like you're only saying this because the Wii's leading in sales :?

I don't think Ninty will need to announce anything persay at E3. If the DS' history is anything reliable, we'll slowly begin to see more third parties move to the Wii, because of a higher chance of sales as well as cheaper development costs. What third party killer apps were Wii owners looking forward to last year? Not much. This year, there's a lot more -- The Conduit's getting a lot of attention, Madworld is as well, who knows, Spore could be great. I hate to sound like a broken record/cow, but I think in the following years the Wii's library will improve. Again, I'm basing this on the DS' history, and so far the Wii has mimicked its cousin perfectly.

WAIW

Yeah, but it's not like the DS has any major competition. I mean, PSP owners just don't buy their games like DS owners do so it's pretty obvious where devs are gonna go (which is good for me, cause I own a DS and not a PSP)... but the Wii has a lot more competition and devs are still going to PS3 (despite lack of sales) and 360 disregarding Wii's potential userbase...

My point being that Nintendo need to work harder to garner some big exclusives. I'm sure they could 'persuade' SE to develop KH3 exlusively for the Wii. And that would be a good start for the top selling console of the gen.

But I like the Wii....SpruceCaboose

Nowhere in my post do I say that I dislike the Wii or GC. I like both.

Except that the GC is great. With great games. I think Nintendo doesn't want third party support, because they know that any game released for the system won't sell as much as another "Wii something", let's just hope that third party needs the Wii because of the sales.Junior_AIN

i rather buy a bad 3rd party game than a good wiidiet game or something... but i wud buy a good zelda or starfox game rather than a good 3rd party game

if i had made this thread it owuld have got locked.

overclocked gamecube lmfao.

That's all fine, but who's not to say a 360 is basically an Xbox bar the superior hardware? I see extremely similar games on both.UKNintendoFreak

Microsoft have worked harder than both Sony and Nintendo this gen to acquire big titles (like GTAIV) for their system on day one, or as a timed exclusive.

Also, this thread isn't about the PS3 or 360. I never said they don't have faults, because they both have a lot.

It's a new gen and Nintendo seems somewhat stuck in the past despite having so much more cash now... I just want them to use it for the right cause.

if i had made this thread it owuld have got locked.

overclocked gamecube lmfao.

JPOBS

I don't get special treatment in SW... my threads have been locked before, too.

I don't see why this would get locked though.

[QUOTE="JPOBS"]

if i had made this thread it owuld have got locked.

overclocked gamecube lmfao.

the-very-best

I don't get special treatment in SW... my threads have been locked before, too.

I don't see why this would get locked though.

if twas me, i'd be way more aggressive and get locked.

The Wii wishes it had the gamecubes games.

(I guess it technically does through BC..)

GameCube was awesome, though, so I would take that as a compliment to the Wii.

Seriously, the Wii is not a GameCube by any stretch of the imagination. It's more powerful than the GameCube, despite not having as big as a step up from PS2 to PS3 or XBox to XBox 360. It can store memory. It has online. You can purchase games off the Virtual Console. It has motion sensing.

The Wii excels at something different than the PS3 and 360 does. I could say that the PS3 and 360 are basically just the PS2 and XBox because all they did was upgrade the power of the systems and add a few other things. Just because Nintendo didn't upgrade the hardware as much as the other two, doesn't mean it's a "GameCube."

Wii does things that the GameCube can't. That's why the Wii basically isn't a GameCube.

the wii is a bit more powerfull than the GC.

Super mario Galaxy Proved this.

Gamecube was more powerful.SpinoRaptor

More powerful than what? Wii?

If that's what you're saying, then stop trolling, please.

I guess you're not being harsh. You're just stating problems with the Wii. But when it comes to 3rd parties, they will and have given us far more than Nintendo this year. NMH, Boom Blox, de Blob, Deadly Creatures, Tales of Symphonia 2, The Conduit, etc. 3rd party support may not be at the levels of the 360 and PS3 but its definetly not the same as previous gens. As for everything the other things, with online all I can do is shrug. It works I suppose :? I'm being optimistic about E3 but I expect it to be disapointing. Nintendo will give us a few great games every year I'm sure but I think its time hardcore gamers turned to the 3rd parties.meetroid8

I actually like the third party games on the Wii more. Laugh if you want, but all I see from the 360 and PS3 are a bunch of sequels with better graphics and a few updates. Mercenaries 2, Doom 4, Final Fantasy XIII, Gears of War 2, Resistance 2, Motorstorm 2, and the like.

the wii is a bit more powerfull than the GC.

Super mario Galaxy Proved this.

Shinobishyguy

I'm not really talking about that. I think it's clear that it's at least similar to the GC in terms of hardware, right? If so, it should be much cheaper since it's been years and I'm sure the development cost has gone down.

My point is that it's a new gen and their still isn't that much effort from Nintendo to correct the GC's mistakes, the major one being issues with 3rd party games.

[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"]

the wii is a bit more powerfull than the GC.

Super mario Galaxy Proved this.

the-very-best

I'm not really talking about that. I think it's clear that it's at least similar to the GC in terms of hardware, right? If so, it should be much cheaper since it's been years and I'm sure the development cost has gone down.

My point is that it's a new gen and their still isn't that much effort from Nintendo to correct the GC's mistakes, the major one being issues with 3rd party games.

Nintendo puts forth their best effort in almost every game they make, and that's all I ask for. I admit that they can work on the online a bit, but that isn't what the Wii is about.

Also, we have gotten a fair amount of quality third party titles. How do you know Nintendo isn't trying? Maybe no one is listening? I don't know. I'm just wondering if this is the case, because we don't have information on everything in the gaming industry.

[QUOTE="Shinobishyguy"]

the wii is a bit more powerfull than the GC.

Super mario Galaxy Proved this.

the-very-best

I'm not really talking about that. I think it's clear that it's at least similar to the GC in terms of hardware, right? If so, it should be much cheaper since it's been years and I'm sure the development cost has gone down.

My point is that it's a new gen and their still isn't that much effort from Nintendo to correct the GC's mistakes, the major one being issues with 3rd party games.

I mean does nintendo even need major 3rd party support?

needless to say this upcoming e3 is gonna either make or break the wii for alot of people.

fortunately nintendo's other pillar, the DS doesn't suffer from these problems.

GameCube was awesome, though, so I would take that as a compliment to the Wii.

Seriously, the Wii is not a GameCube by any stretch of the imagination. It's more powerful than the GameCube, despite not having as big as a step up from PS2 to PS3 or XBox to XBox 360. It can store memory. It has online. You can purchase games off the Virtual Console. It has motion sensing.

The Wii excels at something different than the PS3 and 360 does. I could say that the PS3 and 360 are basically just the PS2 and XBox because all they did was upgrade the power of the systems and add a few other things. Just because Nintendo didn't upgrade the hardware as much as the other two, doesn't mean it's a "GameCube."

Wii does things that the GameCube can't. That's why the Wii basically isn't a GameCube.

DeathScape666

None of those are major improvements and when it comes down to what we all think is the most important aspect of gaming, that is the games themselves, Nintendo haven't corrected their mistakes they made on the GC, with the Wii.

Someone said before that it will do well just like the DS, and that's possible, but what would have happened if the PSP was stronger competition? It could have just been another PS1/N64 scenario since Nintendo doesn't seem to enjoy getting big 3rd party games for their systems.

I want them to actually make an effort. If they can improve on their 3rd party support, the Wii will be fantastic. It's already got excellent 1st party games.

Incentive might be an issue here.

I mean does nintendo even need major 3rd party support?

needless to say this upcoming e3 is gonna either make or break the wii for alot of people.

fortunately nintendo's other pillar, the DS doesn't suffer from these problems.

Shinobishyguy

Well, consumers aren't stupid. If people (that includes non-gamers, casuals etc) realise that Wii isn't getting any major games, they will be more wary about purchasing future Nintendo products.

I'm not really expecting Nintendo to drop their price (I wish they would, because I'd probably buy it if it were cheaper) but I am expecting them to start getting major exclusives like KH3. I mean, why not? It's not like they can't afford it...

First off before reading the other posts. I am going to start off buy saying TVB is by no means an arrogant trolling fanboy. So i take this thread not only as a bit surprising, but as something that is more a critical statement, then plain hate

1- I agree that the Wii from a horsepower standpoint is basically like a gamecube. It might be slightly superior. The design strucutre is the same. But there might be more power in there.

2- It is overpriced. Nintendo is making a killing off this system at 250 bucks. Atleast 150 a console I'm guessing

3- Agreed Nintendo needs to make 3rd party a factor in its system. Spend money and start marketing to the hardcore gamer. Everyone can agree Metroid Prime 3 was seriousaly under marketed for the quality game it was. Easily the most polished game top to bottom in 2007.

4- Nintendo 1st party has been on point in certain games.

Metroid Prime 3
Galaxy
Twilight Princess(worse zelda ever, but great game on its own merits)
Brawl
Wii sports(for that audience)
Wario Ware(the best minigame collection ever, but that isn't saying anything)
Wii Fit(for that audience)
Mario Kart Wii(dumbed down more, but all in all great game)
Super Paper Mario- good game

However other games
Endless Ocean- Sucked
Battallion Wars 2- Average
Fire EMblem Radiant Dawn- I liked but the lack of evolution and sheer gamecube feel of it was terrible
Mario Party 8(No ONLINE WTF)
Mario Strikers- average and some issues.

I mean Nintendo itself needs to start spending that money better.

Pikmin 3
Animal Crossing
The next Starfox
Kid Icarus(assuming it is coming)
Monoltih RPG(they will make one)
Disaster Day of Crisis
The next Console Fire Emblem

better all have great marketing and be very well designed.

[QUOTE="club-sandwich"]I actually liked the GC more than the Wii, the Wii is just an expensive GC with a new controller, there are really few games that make it worth a purchase.lordlors

Comparing GC and the Wii when GC's lifetime is already over. How illogical. Only when the wii's lifetime is over can we fairly judge the consoles.

Illogical? How about we compare the Gamecubes library and the Wii's library from, roughly, the same time difference. Eh, lad?

Unfortuately, both numbers are quite sad, but here we go:

Gamecube (2001-2002) - 67 Games which scored above 69.999 at Gamerankings.

Wii (2006-2007) - 43 Games which scored above 69.999 at Gamerankings.

Whew, it's been real bad to be a Wii gamer.

[QUOTE="meetroid8"]I guess you're not being harsh. You're just stating problems with the Wii. But when it comes to 3rd parties, they will and have given us far more than Nintendo this year. NMH, Boom Blox, de Blob, Deadly Creatures, Tales of Symphonia 2, The Conduit, etc. 3rd party support may not be at the levels of the 360 and PS3 but its definetly not the same as previous gens. As for everything the other things, with online all I can do is shrug. It works I suppose :? I'm being optimistic about E3 but I expect it to be disapointing. Nintendo will give us a few great games every year I'm sure but I think its time hardcore gamers turned to the 3rd parties.DeathScape666

I actually like the third party games on the Wii more. Laugh if you want, but all I see from the 360 and PS3 are a bunch of sequels with better graphics and a few updates. Mercenaries 2, Doom 4, Final Fantasy XIII, Gears of War 2, Resistance 2, Motorstorm 2, and the like.

I think the 360 has more new IPs, I even think Wii has the least.

360: Saints row, Crackdown, Naruto rise of a ninja, kameo, viva pinata, lost odyssey, mass effect, gears, blue dragon, eternal sonata, Dead rising, Assassins Creed, Bioshock, The darkness, dirt, lost planet, dark sector.

PS3: Assassins creed, heavenly sword, motorstorm, resistance, the darkness, dirt, lost planet, uncharted, folklore, dark sector, lair.

Wii: zack and wiki, no more heroes, blast works, boom blox, Wii sports, red steel.

[QUOTE="DeathScape666"]

[QUOTE="meetroid8"]I guess you're not being harsh. You're just stating problems with the Wii. But when it comes to 3rd parties, they will and have given us far more than Nintendo this year. NMH, Boom Blox, de Blob, Deadly Creatures, Tales of Symphonia 2, The Conduit, etc. 3rd party support may not be at the levels of the 360 and PS3 but its definetly not the same as previous gens. As for everything the other things, with online all I can do is shrug. It works I suppose :? I'm being optimistic about E3 but I expect it to be disapointing. Nintendo will give us a few great games every year I'm sure but I think its time hardcore gamers turned to the 3rd parties.opex07

I actually like the third party games on the Wii more. Laugh if you want, but all I see from the 360 and PS3 are a bunch of sequels with better graphics and a few updates. Mercenaries 2, Doom 4, Final Fantasy XIII, Gears of War 2, Resistance 2, Motorstorm 2, and the like.

I think the 360 has more new IPs, I even think Wii has the least.

360: Saints row, Crackdown, Naruto rise of a ninja, kameo, viva pinata, lost odyssey, mass effect, gears, blue dragon, eternal sonata, Dead rising, Assassins Creed, Bioshock, The darkness, dirt, lost planet, dark sector.

PS3: Assassins creed, heavenly sword, motorstorm, resistance, the darkness, dirt, lost planet, uncharted, folklore, dark sector, lair.

Wii: zack and wiki, no more heroes, blast works, boom blox, Wii sports, red steel.

I'm not just talking about new IPs, although I could see how I led you to believe that.

It's just that a lot of these "new IPs" don't offer fresh, original experiences like the Wii does, aside from a few. Heavenly Sword is just another hack 'n' slash that's inferior to God of War. Uncharted is Tomb Raider with a few different things to it. Lair is Rogue Squadron with dragons to it. I could go on, but you get the picture.

Really, Zack and Wiki, No More Heroes, Blast Works, Wii Sports, and a few other Wii games are in a class of its own. I haven't played any other games quite like them before.

Also, you don't need just a neat controller to innovative... There are other ways, too, as X game has shown us.